Honda ATC 110 Weak Spark

[KI4UJO]

This unit is producing a blue spark, but it is very small. I do not currently have a fuel tank hooked up (carb leaks), but I sprayed starter fluid in it
and could not get it to fire. When pulling the plug, I could smell the starter fluid on it and was slightly wet. I cleaned the ground and hot on the coil, but it was not any stronger. Do these motors not like starter fluid, as I thought the spark was big enough to make it run? Is there something I need
to do to get a larger spark? I'm obviously a noob here, but not to mechanics themselves. I have worked with a GY6 before, but do not have much
experience with these.
Thank You

[drivetime]

It could be a few things but I would check the gap on the generator it could have widenend and not be making good enough contact. Is there any bad connections anywhere else in the wiring. also the generator is the little cover that says cdi on it. I would clean that then adjust the contact points and see what that does. I believe the gap should be like .03 or .04

[KI4UJO]

Ok, I will try that tomorrow. By the generator I am assuming you mean the winding underneath the flywheel?

[drivetime]

No. The generator is the little cover about 3in round that says cdi on it. It should be a silver color and 2 wires coming out of it.

[amorgan]

To the best of my knowledge all of them don't say cdi . the early models had points instead of a cdi so the early ones didn't have cdi on it.

[muthey]

OK so first we need more info of your trike it is extremely hard to diagnose without it, year and model which you have already provided model, and anything else you can provide is a big plus. Have you trimmed an 1/8" off of the coil wire going to the spark plug cap? try that as it will give the cap new wire to bite to. have you looked in the world class help section for a manual yet, those are a must. tell us what you have tried so we can help you by ruling those procedures out or help you with known ways to do them. I myself am a yammi guy but I have three hondas as well as grew up on a 1979 atc 70, which had points. If yours does have points have you tried to re-time them? they do wear and get too far away over time or are not timed in right in the first place. 79-80 had points, and 81-85 had the pulse generator. keep us posted and we can try and help you as much as possible. here is a direct link to manuals http://www.oscarmayer.net/atc/manuals/

[KI4UJO]

I believe I have an 81-85, as I have a CDI cover and CDI box. So far, I have cleaned the generator contacts, ground and hot
going to the coil, and tried a CDI box from my parts unit. It also has the wiring harness from the parts unit, as my original
harness contained a lot of wire tape. I don't go back until tomorrow, so I will be working with it some today between keeping warm.

[Jon Boy]

have you tried the simplest thing yet? getting a new plug? might not seem like much but my 70 (points ignition) wouldn't want to start no matter what, just got a new plug for it and it fires in 1-3 pulls now.

[muthey]

ok you can use a manual from a 200s or e or what ever in that range to ohm and spec your stator and alternator. Otherwise I would try a new plug even if that one is new and start looking for a faulty or corroded wire. you might even want to check out the kill switch to see if the corrosion is in there.

[KI4UJO]

I checked the clearance between the generator rotor and the item beside it, and am getting more spark now. However, it still will not fire, and I will be ordering a
carb tonight along with a new plug to see if I can get it to fire. Needless to say, starter fluid is not a good fuel to use.

[ZacH_GrifF]

I would recommend getting a new ignition source coil behind the flywheel they have to work good for anything else to work good. There pretty cheep too.

[KI4UJO]

I got the carb and plug, but still can not get it to fire. Does anyone know what voltage I should be getting to the coil?

[STiForester]

CHECK and CLEAN all grounds and connections.... make sure you dont have vacuum leaks also check for voltage... with a bad ground you will get anything from 0-4 volts maybe... you want around 12-14 i believe

[KI4UJO]

I discovered that the coil ground is crap, so I will try to get that resolved this weekend.

[STiForester]

Yea that happened to my bike and it would spark. I cleaned it and it runs like a raped ape now. Just sand it down and hit it with some steel wool and get a new round connector and crimp it to your wire and re connect it.

[KI4UJO]

I went ahead and did that today, along with snipping a small amount of the coil wire (and succeeded in breaking the plastic screw on piece on the coil, anyone have a spare one?) Anyway, I am getting a good solid spark (for now) , but still no start. Just to ask, how big should this spark be?

[STiForester]

no start but does it sound like it wants to... does exhaust come out of the pipe?? is it all stock set up?

[KI4UJO]

It is completely stock, and it just randomly hits. It has only done that 6 times. A valve adjustment is in the future, since I am concerned about compression. When I pull on it, it just does not feel anywhere close to 60-70 pounds of compression.

[STiForester]

i had a 125 and it pulled easy but ran like new.... no way to tell unless you compression test and check valve clearance.... i hope we can figure this out... its really bothering me

[KI4UJO]

It bothers me too, otherwise I would probably not put this much time into it. What I do know is that the end result of this thing running will answer the question :
"Why was it parted in the first place, when it should have been better than the other unit?"

[fabiodriven]

Is the timing off possibly? Maybe the spark is firing but firing at the wrong time.

I've found that these little buggers are much more sensitive to intake differences than their bigger brothers. I watched my buddy toiling over an ATC70 (Very similar engine) for a long time and he couldn't get it to start. He had been at it for a long time before I got there. He was prepared to rip into the motor and was aggravated as it was freshly rebuilt. There was no air box or anything on the intake side of the carb. I told him "watch this" and covered the intake about 1/3rd of the way with my fingers and it fired right up. He immediately put the air box on and it ran great after that. Most engines run a lot better with the air box because it creates a "dead air" space. If it's been jetted to run without an air box that's a different story.

So are you running an air box? If not, put one on and work from there.

[STiForester]

Yes that was the problem with my Tecate... An also his intake boot is all cracked. He needs a new one asap

[STiForester]

Ypur running super lean as long as that boot leaks my friend...

[KI4UJO]

I'll admit that my 318i has been getting all of the attention, and I have not worked on it any. No, I do not have an airbox mounted, but I have one in my barn from my parts unit. So, maybe tomorrow night.

[KI4UJO]

The airbox does not fit, it is form a newer frame. My intake boot is not cracked, it is aluminum and it has a good seal (even though it is made from form a gasket).
At this point, I need to get a compression tester. There is one at my grandmother's house, but it is in Louisville, KY, 3 hours away. I will have to get it the next time I am up there, which will be on February 18th, to see the opening show of the 2012 Van Halen World Tour! Anyway, I don't expect to have any updates until then.

[tulsamike3434]

I have checked the cdi box I just don't see what im missing?

[tri again]

I've seen a couple with good spark but no fire with start fluid too.
In both, the spark advance plate was stuck in the advanced position so
it simply couldn't fire at the low revs of hand cranking.
Rusty dusty and one had a broken return spring.
Not sure if they use the same advance for both points and cdi
but it's an odd situation that messed me up for weeks.

Got compression?
x2 with nipping the last bit off the coil wire
or just inscrew the spark plug cap and see if there's better spark
direct from the plug wire to the case.

cdi spark seems to be about 1/2 of what a regular points setup generates.

[tulsamike3434]

I've seen a couple with good spark but no fire with start fluid too.
In both, the spark advance plate was stuck in the advanced position so
it simply couldn't fire at the low revs of hand cranking.
Rusty dusty and one had a broken return spring.
Not sure if they use the same advance for both points and cdi
but it's an odd situation that messed me up for weeks.

Got compression?
x2 with nipping the last bit off the coil wire
or just inscrew the spark plug cap and see if there's better spark
direct from the plug wire to the case.

cdi spark seems to be about 1/2 of what a regular points setup generates.

Thank you Ill try that ASAP!

[KI4UJO]

It's been a while since I've got on here, but my ATC still does the same thing. I have a compression tester now, but it is missing the adapter to screw into a 110. However, I did a valve adjustment and found that the intake valve was not closing all of the way. After correcting that, it still does the same thing. Also, the advance plate is working properly. Any more ideas?

[WJG1000W]

is your plug gapped properly
are the jets in your carburetor clean you should be able to see through them
as for the compression test i always use the universal type that they sell for like 20 bucks at car quest they have a rubber tip and fit all plug holes

[KI4UJO]

Do not know on plug gap, but I am questioning carb... is new ebay unit, but plug has never had large amounts of fuel... will tear it down tomorrow night to check jets and etc. On compresion tester, can you give me a link to what you use?

[WJG1000W]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0014DEWWY/ref=sr_1_3_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1334578305&sr=8-3&condition=new i=this one is close to mine but mine doesn't have the ends that remove
check in the manual to see what the plug gap should be
i have one of the new eBay carbs on my 200M it works fine for me

[KI4UJO]

I'm really suprised at this, but I got it to run! Unfortunately, it needs new rings as it smokes really bad. I haven't driven it yet, I need to put the chain back on and install the shifter. As for why it did not run, it ended up being that the red-kote in the tank had broken down and clogged the jets. I got it out, and it finally came to life! Anyway, expect moremupdates and photos in the next few days.

[WJG1000W]

sounds good your lucky somtimes you can spend days upon days looking through electrical problems

[tri again]

This unit is producing a blue spark, but it is very small. I do not currently have a fuel tank hooked up (carb leaks), but I sprayed starter fluid in it
and could not get it to fire. When pulling the plug, I could smell the starter fluid on it and was slightly wet. I cleaned the ground and hot on the coil, but it was not any stronger. Do these motors not like starter fluid, as I thought the spark was big enough to make it run? Is there something I need
to do to get a larger spark? I'm obviously a noob here, but not to mechanics themselves. I have worked with a GY6 before, but do not have much
experience with these.
Thank You

I haven't read the other posts but I'm sure they are good.

I got into the same trouble with one of mine.

The spark advance plate got stuck in the advance position so it
wouldn't start at the slow spin speed.
The advance plate was stuck and one of the springs was broken.