WTF Gas Prices! This is INSANE

[kb0nly]

The beginning of the week i was paying $3.69, then it went to $3.99 overnight on Weds, and now this morning it jumped to $4.29... Another $.30 increase in 24 hours... WTF!!

This is some insane price gouging bullshit. And its every town around here, its not an isolated small town or two, even the larger cities are climbing fast. The local station operator here told me that he about about choked at his $40k gas delivery bill this morning and the driver told him it will be more next week with the increase they are seeing on the supply side. He said 24 hours is going to make or break some stations, as much as $5k difference per delivery per day!!

169649

[tri again]

I thought I was dreaming.
I only buy gas once a month except for mowing season and now I have to fill
one truck tank I borrowed from and 5 gas cans, hopefully with non ethanol fuel.

Funny thing is that I just applied last week for a commercial fuel account and they only raise prices
when they refill their dedicated stations, not overnight because of some storm or oil leak
in the arctic.

yeah, got numb to the state of the universe and filed an LLC for 50 bucks which got me
over 10 grand in credit cards and ability to buy stuff wholesale, NAPA cash account, this new fuel account and the dummies think I'm cool, but it's still silly me, just with a 50$ LLC.

All I gotta do now is file a church or figure out the 'allodial title' and file back to the origional land grant. (VERY interesting concept btw)
I luckily was able to buy a couple acres adjacent and it's paid off.
there is nothing on it and part of it floods but I just got a property tax bill for 1990.00$
with a prop tax forclosure notice surely on the way.
We could have religious ceremonies once a year and be property tax free.

Another indicator that we can never really 'own' anything.

See what the gas prices did to MY delicate psyche?
Heaven help us all.

[Jason125m]

You should come to canada. It is 1.30$ a LITRE. 1.30x3.78 ( gallon ) $4.91 per gallon

Harsh on the wallet

[JasonB]

trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro that hurts. I have to run 93 octane in my 03 Lightning and I just stopped looking at prices and totals. I just fill it up and cry on the drive home

[Lord Letto 20]

You should come to canada. It is 1.30$ a LITRE. 1.30x3.78 ( gallon ) $4.91 per gallon

Harsh on the wallet

4.91 Canadian Dollar equals
4.77 US Dollar
Just to convert from Canadian to US.

[tri again]

Not that it matters but I wonder what kind of mileage our trikes get.
I'm thinking a gallon per hour on my 250es.
let's see x2 = cheaper than marriage counselling.

[fire1]

I paid 3.09 this morning.

[hatc200x1]

Gas was 30 cents more expensive then diesel today...

[ps2fixer]

Gas was 30 cents more expensive then diesel today...

Crazyness ^^

If the trikes are driven easy we should see 50mpg fairly easy, motorcycles will get better just for the fact they are lighter and have a smaller foot print though the air (frontal area for anyone into areo). Check out ecomodder.com if you want to really fight the system and ditch the every day driving the truck and pickup a beater little car for work and random small things. My corolla gets 40-45mpg driving it super easy to most people's standards, slower than the average traffic, and the car pays for its self about every year in money saved vs driving my old Camry (30mpg). If you drive a truck/van, 12-18mpg vs 30 is like $1500 per year saved in fuel for the "average" distance people drive in a year. The added insurance cost shouldn't be a problem :).

I'd say do the match, review what you drive, why you drive it, and can you drive something that gets better mpg for everyday use. Example of someone that did this was a guy that lived next door for a while, he had a chevy pickup with the 4.3L and he does cement work for a living, so he has to hull around his tools and such. Well he got a good deal on a Geo ($300 I think it was), and he said he got around 50mpg and drove 45mph everywhere. He showed me how his tools fit in the car.... back hatch to front windshield lol.

Just to note, instead of driving 5-10mph over the speed limit, try driving the speed limit for a month, you might be surprized at the mpg change, then work on coasting to stops, taking off a bit easier (too much makes it worse mpg, fine line). There are more "extreme" mods that can be done... but yea..... they are quite extreme... but 60-70mpg isn't impossible out of the right car and mods.

http://www.aerocivic.com/

[Dirtcrasher]

GAS? I got some cat food and a bird feeder at Walmart, picked up 13 gallons of gas on the way home and stopped at the grocery store for just a few items. All and all, this was a near 400$ day. No wonder everyone is broke.....

[bkm]

My truck was on 1/4 tank and cost me $100 to fill it up today. FML!

[rjs89ia]

3.23 here. its been bouncing around a bit but steadily dropping. cheapeast i paid a while back was i believe 2.87 wish it was still like that.

[samuraiguys]

Gas prices are going up because a few refineries are shut down for "repairs" saw something in my local paper about it. I think these oil companies are doing this on purpose to line their pockets

[tri again]

simply love all the comments.
Costs me more to stay home fuelwise, than it does to go anywhere.
At least the only traffic I need to stop for is wild turkeys,
sssssh deer momma and babies, and the nesting doves
and other birds.
I swear, the swallows or whatever they are, follow my brush hog like seagulls
behind a freakin' tuna boat.

I even tried to catch a video 'cause I knew youse guys wouldn't
believe it.

Plus, out 'there' I can't hear the phone and if people do show up and wave wildly to get my attention,

I just wave back, readjust my earmuffs and pretend the rest of the whirld doesn't
matter.

Life is good and all my trikes will start if I even look at them crosseyed.

Happy springtime everyone.

[tri again]

GAS? I got some cat food and a bird feeder at Walmart, picked up 13 gallons of gas on the way home and stopped at the grocery store for just a few items. All and all, this was a near 400$ day. No wonder everyone is broke.....
ps
I clicked 'dislike this post' only because I truly feel your sadness.
Wouldn't it be nice if things could Not get worse?

[Mosh]

I paid 3.09 this morning.I imagine the closer you are to Washington DC the cheaper it is..

[yamaha225dr]

Yea and my stupid self own nothing but gas guzzlers! An Expedition, F150,Mustang and a K5 Blazer! The Mustang Dows get 26mpg cruising at 70mph so it's my fuel saver. :lol:

[kb0nly]

At least i'm feeling better hearing others are experiencing the same, but thats only a small comfort isn't it?? LOL

I dumped $62 into the tank yesterday, was down to nearly E when i filled up, normally i don't let it get below 1/4 tank as a rule but i had to wait for a check to clear so i could afford gas, it used to be just put gas in, now its budget for it and set aside a paycheck... FML

I have a 2003 3.7L Jeep Liberty, it averages around 18-19mpg depending on how much stuff i have with me for the day, pulling my trailer for other projects i normally average around 16. Could i get a more fuel efficient vehicle? Maybe... Problem is i can't get use an econobox, has to be tow capable up to 3500 at least, i sometimes i pull heavier also but not much over that. A little geo or some crap like that couldn't pull my trailer thats the simple hard facts. I do at least have the ability to stay close to home when the gas prices are this high, but stop and go across town and back multiple times doesn't help the gas mileage either.

I saw a 2004 CRD Jeep Liberty, i wouldn't mind having a diesel for the higher mileage and slightly lower fuel cost but to be honest i just can't afford a vehicle change at this point in my life. The Jeep i have now is bought and paid for as of last year, was nice not having a car payment for a year, and now the gas is eating up those savings!

[ps2fixer]

For city driving, typically the lightest car/load is what gets the best mpg, highway is normally the highest gear / correct (smallish) sized engine and AREO makes huge differences. Trucks are a brick in the air lol. Sounds like you need a mid size pickup such as a Ford Ranger (4cyl 2wd model, 2.3L even though I'm not a fan of that engine), a Chevy S-10/15 with the 4 banger, Toyota pickup with the 22R/E engine, Mazda with the 2.0 or 2.2L depending on age. All of the trucks get around 25-30mpg empty taking a easy on them. The older ford rangers were lighter and had like a 2.0L that got slightly better mpg, I think I have seen figures around 30-33ish. As always with a smaller engine you will NEED a manual transmission, automatic looses around 10% power and FE (fuel econ) due to the losses to make it automatic at least for take offs and slower driving.

I'm personally watching out for a Toyota pickup with the 2.2L and 5 speed stick 2wd or a Mazda 2.2L 5 speed stick, or a VW Caddy Diesel 5 speed (its a pickup based on the Golf/Rabbit car, 45-50mpg for "normal" driving, I can get 55-65 probably).

Here is a great read on how to make a full size truck get around 20-35mpg http://ecomodder.com/blog/aerocaps-for-pick-up-trucks/

[kb0nly]

I used to have a S10, 4cyl manual trans, it was a gutless wonder. It could barely haul itself, let alone all my gear, pulling a trailer wasn't even an option. You would need 2-3 guys in the back to get out and push on the hills... LOL!!!

As for Ford... Won't go there ever again. I had enough problems with Ford's to last a lifetime..

I just added a larger fuel surcharge to every invoice, pass the buck, thats the american way.. HA!

[oldskool83]

i heard a report gas is only at 90 a barrel was was gonna go down. personly im not hurting because of fuel. It's 3.30 a gal here and has been for awhile now. In fact im after a sweet ram with a hemi down the road forsale. Its life, take it or leave it. cant aford stuff then sell stuff. wanna play you gotta pay. I stop bitching years ago. buy a small car to go work with or somthing lol.

[maxdallasfan]

Funny how the media doesn't say a peep about gas prices anymore. It was all the rage when gas went near $3

[oldskool83]

Its also funny how the cost of V8 trucks are crazy exspensive wen before no one wanted them. We've adjusted. is what it is.

[Eric250R]

Awww, and just in time for trikefest.

[kb0nly]

i heard a report gas is only at 90 a barrel was was gonna go down. personly im not hurting because of fuel. It's 3.30 a gal here and has been for awhile now. In fact im after a sweet ram with a hemi down the road forsale. Its life, take it or leave it. cant aford stuff then sell stuff. wanna play you gotta pay. I stop bitching years ago. buy a small car to go work with or somthing lol.

$3.30 a gallon?? Wow.. Thats damn cheap. Never said i cant afford stuff, no stuff to even sell that i could part with. Play? This isn't about playing for most of us here suffering from these prices, its about trying to make a living and keep food on the table. With these gas prices food stamps are going to be the next step to keep my kids fed. Do i hate to go there? Yes... Do i want to limit food so that i can keep making a paycheck? No... So thats that.

Small car wouldn't do any good for me, cant pull a trailer with a small car, or haul the amount of gear i need to on a daily basis. Trust me i tried. I burned out the trans on a small car a few years ago trying to use it for work, and that wasn't even hauling the normal amount of gear. Now you will say, don't haul all that stuff, and i will reply have to. If you don't think i have to your not a mobile service tech.

I wish all i did was drive to work and back, i would get an econo box. I used to have a 90's Dodge Neon years ago, what a crappy little car, but the darn thing got 30's for gas mileage. Although i had to put a couple hundred into it every month to fix something else!

169698

[ps2fixer]

$3.30 a gallon?? Wow.. Thats damn cheap. Never said i cant afford stuff, no stuff to even sell that i could part with. Play? This isn't about playing for most of us here suffering from these prices, its about trying to make a living and keep food on the table. With these gas prices food stamps are going to be the next step to keep my kids fed. Do i hate to go there? Yes... Do i want to limit food so that i can keep making a paycheck? No... So thats that.

Small car wouldn't do any good for me, cant pull a trailer with a small car, or haul the amount of gear i need to on a daily basis. Trust me i tried. I burned out the trans on a small car a few years ago trying to use it for work, and that wasn't even hauling the normal amount of gear. Now you will say, don't haul all that stuff, and i will reply have to. If you don't think i have to your not a mobile service tech.

I wish all i did was drive to work and back, i would get an econo box. I used to have a 90's Dodge Neon years ago, what a crappy little car, but the darn thing got 30's for gas mileage. Although i had to put a couple hundred into it every month to fix something else!

169698

And that is why I bought a Toyota Corolla instead of a Dodge.... Bought it, fixed it up (major city beater crappy car). ZERO problems in 30k miles that I have had it now, total of 253k miles.

Now I'll wait for the Dodge fans to pop in to flame me, and my answer will be look up Dodge in the dictionary... names have a lot of meaning you know :).

[kb0nly]

Oh i got nothing against Toyota or Dodge, but a small car just wouldn't cut it for me. Technically my Jeep is a Dodge, has the same 3.7L that they put in the Dakota, Durango, and a few others... I have had zero issues with my Liberty other than normal wear and tear, new brakes, new tires, new serpentine belt and tensioner, but nothing else that i would call troubles.

I know a guy here that has a Toyota pickup, i forget which model it is, but its small. He uses it for work, hes a brick mason and does chimneys. That thing is always dragging in the rear from his gear. He put air bags on it a couple weeks ago, that helped level it a bit, but he is lucky to get 20mpg with it due to the added weight. So i don't think i am doing too bad.. LOL

[ps2fixer]

20mpg while hulling that much stuff with a tiny engine seems good to me. My dad uses his 89 Mazda 2.6L 4x4 like that with hulling scrap etc, 0 problems and around 15mpg, empty it can get upto 20mpg, but it is 4x4 and has the larger 4 cyl in it. He refuses to mod the truck to make it get better mpg so he won't be able to change much, if it was mine there is a lot of bad areo stuff about it that wouldn't take much to fix, but would make the truck a bit ugly I guess.

[tri again]

For city driving, typically the lightest car/load is what gets the best mpg, highway is normally the highest gear / correct (smallish) sized engine and AREO makes huge differences. Trucks are a brick in the air lol. Sounds like you need a mid size pickup such as a Ford Ranger (4cyl 2wd model, 2.3L even though I'm not a fan of that engine), a Chevy S-10/15 with the 4 banger, Toyota pickup with the 22R/E engine, Mazda with the 2.0 or 2.2L depending on age. All of the trucks get around 25-30mpg empty taking a easy on them. The older ford rangers were lighter and had like a 2.0L that got slightly better mpg, I think I have seen figures around 30-33ish. As always with a smaller engine you will NEED a manual transmission, automatic looses around 10% power and FE (fuel econ) due to the losses to make it automatic at least for take offs and slower driving.

I'm personally watching out for a Toyota pickup with the 2.2L and 5 speed stick 2wd or a Mazda 2.2L 5 speed stick, or a VW Caddy Diesel 5 speed (its a pickup based on the Golf/Rabbit car, 45-50mpg for "normal" driving, I can get 55-65 probably).

Here is a great read on how to make a full size truck get around 20-35mpg http://ecomodder.com/blog/aerocaps-for-pick-up-trucks/

Pretty interesting for sure.
Thanks
Mythbusters did an episode with trucks and tailgates on and off but I forget
the result.
My 351 windsor gets 8 mpg, MAYbe 11 on a good day but I only go to 'town'
2x a month...about 3 miles round trip.
I'll tell ya though, filling 5 gas cans was a shocker.
I use trikes for farm work whenever I can so at least get some enjoyment
burning fuel.
Had water injection on my old saab and remember great performance and mileage over 30.
Might have to look back into that again.
Keeps the engine as clean as a blown head gasket to boot.

[ColtonGG33]

Up here gas is 3.85 and its been that price for a couple weeks I hope it doesn't go up anymore, especially in our little town, their are alot of people that don't have much money and that's just another thing that's gonna hurt people. If I had to pay 4.77 a gallon I would probably cry :) so I'm definitely not moving to Canada, no offense Jason125m

[ps2fixer]

General rule of thumb for tail gates... up is better, ecomodder is plasted with research on it and simulations etc, basically the air from the roof line falls sooner than the tail gate, so it crates a bubble of air to push over the rest of the air so it is a little bit cleaner flow. With the tail gate down, the bubble can't form, so you have a bit more cd (coefficent drag). Putting one of the bed tops on is better, toppers are generally pretty bad, but if one is made well in an areo way (lower back), it is even better. I saw one ford ranger on ecomodder with the topper setup and he got nearly 60mpg.

3 miles round trip is really short, the engine don't heat up fully etc, so you are always running rich in the warm up mode. I would say every so often take it out on the express way and run it a bit hard to clear out the engine, and get her warmed up well every so often, makes sure no water gets in the oil too. Just to compair, at around 1.5 miles into my trip my car hits 30mpg average at the stop for the trip, about half of that is coasting. If I'm in a hurry to work, normally it is under 20mpg and the only real difference is my take off rate is faster than ideal and faster travel speed (55-60mph vs 45mph on a cold engine that will not shift into overdrive or lockup till it is 130F coolant temp). So going off your numbers and mine, you are not doing super bad, guessing on a long trip you can get probably around 12-13mpg under similar diving situations. I haven't dont a lot of research on water injection, but it is a known way to clean your engine out and people on ecomodder have done it for their own reasons. I have seen a video of a VW engine that had 2 cyl for gas, and the exhaust went into the other 2 cyls with a water mist spray @ TDC to use up the exhaust heat and get a little more power out of the same gas. Not sure if it works in real world or not, but is a cool theory (youtube videos are a bad source of "proof").

One thing I should point out about MPG is that it is a really bad measure standard. Take a truck that gets 15mpg for example, and you increase it 15mpg, sounds pretty good, 30mpg out of a truck, which is a 100% gain, now take a car that gets 30mpg, and increase 15mpg, 45mpg sounds just as impressive, but it is only 50% better, to get the same results the 30mpg car would have to get 60mpg, which is a lot of modding. Take a geo that gets 45mpg and now you have to get 90mpg to get the same % increase. There is another standard that isn't used much in the usa, Gallons per 100 miles, which is much better visual way to see it, 15mpg = 6.66 g/100m and 30mpg = 3.33 g/100m, and 45mpg = 2.22 g/100m, you can clearly see 6.66 to 3.33 is a bigger jump than 3.33 to 2.22. This is the standard overseas, and maybe in Canada, but in km.

[Mosh]

And that sums it up right there. 10 bucks on a Friday night put gas in your car , paid for 2 meals, and even maybe a movie ticket or two for you and your girl..Ten bucks dont buy two bucks today. Most movies aint worth a 2 dollar ticket , a back seat aint big enough to make out in , and you get a ticket from the po-po for loitering in a parking lot.

[oldskool83]

I spend 20 maybe 30 a week in fuel. 04 civic, im anal on manintance as I am with everything. ya know the fuel injector clearner stuff really works and so do all them new air filters and jaz. Funny how 6 gallons of fuel can get 300 miles at least a week. take care ya autos, even my big as lifted dodge on 35s with a 318 got 12mpg and its all done up. take care ya motors. im sure 75% of them are not and thats why everyone bitches about gas prices. we are addicted to fuel. and i love the ill buy a streetbike to save fuel. waste of more money. lol. just adapt. love or hate it i say it how it is. funny the single moms working at turkey hill can manage to adapt, im sure most of us with 10 V8s and lots of toys can also. just saying....

[Eric250R]

And that sums it up right there. 10 bucks on a Friday night put gas in your car , paid for 2 meals, and even maybe a movie ticket or two for you and your girl..Ten bucks dont buy two bucks today. Most movies aint worth a 2 dollar ticket , a back seat aint big enough to make out in , and you get a ticket from the po-po for loitering in a parking lot.

Amen........

[kb0nly]

I do regular maintenance on my Jeep, sometimes more then required because it works for a living, and without it i don't work, so kinda have to keep up on the stuff. I put new plugs and wires on it, about all you can do on these modern ignition systems, but the wires were factory and ten years old so why not spruce it up with some fresh OEM wires. Didn't see much mileage gain if any but now i feel better for doing it.

Air filter is new, thats one thing i always have a spare of, if its getting dirty when i check it, which i do almost weekly depending on if i am driving down a lot of gravel roads, and those gimmick filters and special cold air intakes don't do jack for me at least. The Liberty pulls its intake from a scoop that goes up to where the hood meets the upper rad cross member, it pulls in outside air from between the hood and the grill, pretty neat actually how they engineered it. I know guys on the Jeep forums that tried K&N setups and actually got worst mileage, although a bit more horsepower that only a dyno could prove. So not worth making changes there.

Fuel injectors are all fairly new, i forget if it was one or two years, it started having a stumble in the idle due to a leaky injector they all got replaced. At that time it took me from an average of 17mpg to just over 19mpg, so it helped.

All i can say is having a mortgage and three kids makes the gas prices ever present in your mind. And even worst it hit now when school is out.. Why does that matter? When they are in school they eat breakfast and lunch at school, meaning five days a week i only had to make supper.. Now i have to provide all three meals all week. And boy oh boy i tell ya, groceries aren't getting cheaper either. I budget, i plan, all the meals get planned on a calendar, heck i even clip some coupons now... But you can only stretch that money so far!! LOL

[ps2fixer]

Regarding the coupons, there are people out there that know how to work the system, get shopping carts full of food etc for like $0.17, I saw it with my own eyes.

Sounds like your Jeep's factory setup is a cold air intake, even though most factory intakes are fairly restrictive which only really effects things in the high rpm range. You would increase mpg slightly by running what ecomodder members call a hot air intake, take air off the exhaust. Depending how your computer is programmed in the jeep, hotter is better to an extent. Theory behind it is reduced pumping losses, but at the same time you loose HP, which in this case gives better MPG due to the engine being more efficent as an air pump. This same theory is the claim as to why Diesel engines get good mpg vs gas besides there being a slight bit more power in the actual fuel. Diesel = wide open throttle, only thing that changes is how much fuel is dumped. In a diesel case, colder the air intake, the better, since it is more air/o2 and there isn't a fuel mixure required like with gas.

If money is truely tight there are places to ask for help. Some places help with heating costs, others with food, etc.

[Lord Letto 20]

Regarding the coupons, there are people out there that know how to work the system, get shopping carts full of food etc for like $0.17, I saw it with my own eyes.
Extreme Couponing, It's a TV Show, Look it up.

[kb0nly]

Yeah i know all about the show, i also know its rigged...

They did an episode up in St Paul a year ago, a friend of mine up there is an assistant manager for the store. The store was asked if in return for publicity if they would do things they normally dont... Stack coupons, stacking means using more than one copy of the same coupon per item or items even if it clearly says one per customer, doubling coupons on top of store specials, most stores won't do that either.

Trust me i know firsthand that show is total bunk. I have tried very hard to coupon the heck out of a shopping trip, very frustrating when you get to the checkout and they start handing back coupons they cant take more than one of per purchase or double.. Sure you can also sleezeball it and separate your cart into like ten different purchases to work the system also, but some stores are starting to tell you to take a hike on that too because of the increased time this delays processing at the checkout. They are all about moving fast. I got rude comments one time for separating my cart into three purchases, and it was only because there was food, non-food, and then some stuff for a friend that sent money with me since i was stopping there anyway. They don't seem to like that practice either.

My last grocery trip, with big envelope of coupons in hand, the total was $234 after the coupons were scanned it was $322... I saved a whole $14 by cutting coupons for two hours... Yeah me... LOL Thats not even a 1/4 tank of gas now..

A friend of mine lost his job about a month ago, decided to take some schooling to get into a new job, he applied for support on his expenses, mainly gas driving. They credit him $.15 per mile.... His car gets about 25 mpg, so he is getting $3.75 per gallon for support. I guess thats not bad, but it doesn't cover the cost either.

[Tri-Z 250]

.....and you thought Bush was an Oil guy. What you thought we were going to pay for Obama care just through taxes? I predict that as the price of a gallon goes up to $4.10reg over the Holiday. The price will only drop back to $3.85 and remain and never drop from that point. As the squeeze to the working poor becomes greater remember...Obama phone, and WIC recipients buying porter house steaks who already get free health care in the ER for the flu. Why work when you can live a better life on the system. Gas prices don't effect you because you ride the bus on a semi supported bus pass. Why get married and claim your child as a dependent...Baby mama's get full free ticket births, food stamps and housing assistance. Best part is white America is now following the 4th generation experts who have laid out the ground work for this entire mess. Gas has been a molested commodity as soon as they let it on the exchange...welcome to the ride you have no say in the matter, deal with it. E85 and the corn ethanol mixed fuels cost more and work less...Sound familiar?

[kb0nly]

E85 has been coming up here a lot since the price spiked... Problem is, its about efficiency and E85 isn't that efficient.. I know plenty of people here that have E85 vehicles, and all of them tell me they get at least 25% less mileage, some as high as 30-35%...

So they save a little at the pump, but they burn more to get the same mileage... So how much do they save? Not a lot...

Oh i was on the phone when someone else walked in, looked at my last post mentioning the coupon fraud and suggested a link showing how the whole thing worked and how it broke out to the press.

http://www.jillcataldo.com/node/16258

They were using the coupons in a fraudulent way, and the system was fixed in the last year or so with a new barcode system, now they can't use the coupons on other products by the same manufacturer using the family code. Interesting! The biggest of the "savers" on that show was recently charged in court as well and is facing a huge amount of restitution, which with our court system won't mean a whole lot but still...

[ps2fixer]

I remember reading on Ecomodder about E85, the basic energy in the fuel is like 20% less, then the fact the engine is more designed for gas, so E85 does not burn properly, so the inefficiency of it can range a lot depending on design. Long story short, E85 costs more in the long run, unless you have a car designed 100% for E85 and not "E10" as our standard pump gas now. You can't buy straight gas any more. Remember long ago that a little VW could get 50mpg easy while beating the snot out of it, today your are lucky to get 40-45 out of it on this "new" gas.

[kb0nly]

Yep such is life... But then i haven't had straight gas here for something like 15 years? Just a guess, i know its been at least ten since before my oldest son was born, and i know it was some time before that also.

I have blender pumps here, E10, E15, E20, E30 and E85 are the common mixes available. If you need your carb cleaned out run a higher mix, E20 does wonders cleaning out the crud of the fuel system on lawnmowers, i know i have done it many times. Its just basically more alcohol, same as adding fuel system cleaner to the tank. If you really want to clean it out run a half tank of E85 through it as you start mowing the lawn, then refill with regular E10. Its like taking the carb apart and cleaning it... LOL

[ps2fixer]

Lol might have to try that some time. I know E85 will attack different rubber parts if they are soaked in it, running for an hour to two shouldn't hurt them though. If I remember correctly, to run E85 you need like 20% larger jets to run correctly and no rubber parts in the touchable fuel system, but that is for running it all the time.

[kb0nly]

Actually the newer FFV vehicles still have rubber in the fuel system, its just that rubber made in the last like ten years or so can take it, the older stuff wasn't formulated to withstand the higher alcohol content. I have taken brand new rubber hose from the local auto parts store and soaked it in a cup of E85 for a week and it wasn't harmed, but then i have also taken an old chunk of fuel line that has been around for a while, i think it came off a 110 i worked on, and put that into a cup of E85 and the fuel took on a weird color overnight and after a few days the rubber hose went from age hardened to softer but then went to like gooey, it smeared in your hand if you tried to grab it.

Yes you would need larger jets though, you need to flow a lot more fuel. The E85 conversion kits for fuel injected vehicles plug inline with the fuel injectors and vary the pulse length to add more fuel per cycle, so for the carb vehicles or trikes you would have to do the same, increase fuel flow. I have ran a trike on E85 to prove a point, i got bet that it wouldn't even run on it, let alone be able to move. It was a ATC200M, drained the tank and carb bowl, filled with E85 and then set the mixture screw a bit richer, it definitely had less top end but it idled and drove around just fine up until almost full throttle where it would stumble and you could tell it was lean, but bigger jets i could definitely get it to take a full time diet of E85.

[Worden18]

Some day Big Oil is going to crash permanently; it won't be in my lifetime, but I sure would like to see them bastards go down the tubes....

[ps2fixer]

Some day Big Oil is going to crash permanently; it won't be in my lifetime, but I sure would like to see them bastards go down the tubes....

Sadly it seems like they are doing pretty good money wise :(, my cousin works for a oil well drilling company, 12 hours a day, something like $16 per hour and overtime pay over 8 hours, $75 per day he works because he works away from home, and works 7 days a week, I guess he don't really get off days, except around hollidays some times. Sounds to me he is making a lot of money, and I don't understand why that couldn't hire 2 people at a fair rate and make the work a little less draining, like 8 hours a day 6 days a week or something. Of my understanding, he is basiclly working this job with "no life" to build up enough cash to outright buy a house.

[poolieZerUK]

You guys are lucky it works out at $9.58/gallon here diesel is more as its better mpg so they get you there. Engine sizes are creeping up all the time back in the day a 3000cc v6 ford was big engine now regularly see 5400-6200cc motors as cars too big because of supposed safety features, dont know where people get the cash, utility bills about $2800/year fu*"ing council tax double that national insurance, paye, vat blah blah blah its never ending, and all the twats with money are paying F@#K all tax as too many loop holes if you can afford top accountant. WAN*ERS
Looking out of my window can see oil rigs being built but you cant get a job on them cause its all closed club

[ps2fixer]

I assume utility bills include heat? If so that is about the average cost over here unless you just have a huge house.

Every time I see videos based in the UK most of the cars are tiny like mini coopers and such. I drive a Toyota Corolla with a 1.8L that actually gets better mpg (epa based) than the 1.6L setup (lower geared). You can find cars with smaller engines if you do your research first. If you stick with American made, good luck finding anything smaller than like 2.3L (ford ranger). If you don't hull much but need a truck, keep an eye out for a 80-83 VW caddy pickup, they get around 45-50mpg with a 1.6L diesel, turbo it and add a cold air intake and you *should* get better mpg if you don't abuse the extra power.

[Scootertrash]

Sadly it seems like they are doing pretty good money wise :(, my cousin works for a oil well drilling company, 12 hours a day, something like $16 per hour and overtime pay over 8 hours, $75 per day he works because he works away from home, and works 7 days a week, I guess he don't really get off days, except around hollidays some times. Sounds to me he is making a lot of money, and I don't understand why that couldn't hire 2 people at a fair rate and make the work a little less draining, like 8 hours a day 6 days a week or something. Of my understanding, he is basiclly working this job with "no life" to build up enough cash to outright buy a house.

16.00 an hour isn't a fair rate? plus overtime? + 75.00 per diem? Is he in North Dakota? What is he doing? Is he a roughneck?

Sounds like he chooses to work those long hours to get ahead and buy a house for cash or mostly cash. If he is a roughneck or lease hand
he is at the bottom of the ladder for oil rig workers and can only go up from there. Everybody in NoDak is working long hours. EVERYBODY. I've been out there several times over the last couple of years.

If I was 30 years younger I'd head west to NoDak, but I would be driving truck or building houses, NOT working on an oil rig.


While I agree that 4.50 a gallon is ridiculous, Before you throw all the blame on the oil companies, you may want to take a look at how much TAXES are paid to our government. Not just the taxes paid at the pump (.40-.60 cents per gallon), there are many other taxes paid before the fuel even makes it to the pump.

Bottom line, the oil companies do what they do to make as much money as possible, just like any other business large or small. Just like you would if you were running a business of your own. Problem is when you run a business, it seems like no matter how cheap you price your product people still b!tch because it costs too much. Funny part is you never see them start up their own business to give their product away at 2% over cost.

If it was easy to run a business and be a millionaire there would be 300 million of them in this country and no one would be whining

You can also blame the Government and the tree huggers for not allowing companies to build more refineries.

[ps2fixer]

I have no clue, I havn't talked to him since he started working there. I think he don't have a choice on the hours, and they move him every so often. I think right now he is in Texas or somewhere southern usa.

$16 seems pretty fair to me for an inexperienced worker in that field and I think he has been there for like a year now. He has a felony on his record as well, so I bet that effects his pay as well. Either way he makes more money than me even if you cut his hours down to 40 per week and my job requires a 2 year degree in computers.

[Scootertrash]

My nephew has been out in NoDak for I think 3 years now. He drives a truck and has HAZMAT and tanker certification (or something like that)and other misc duties related to fracking. He makes around 25.00/hour. I think he made $90,000 last year. That means roughly $30,000 of that goes to Uncle Sam. He works very long, odd hours and is working for 2 weeks on and then off for 4-6 days.

[gus]

gas here is 3.23 im seriously considetring getting my R street legal i have a titan now that's a gas guzzler a womping 13 mpgs :mad:

[Tri-Z 250]

If you don't have drugs in your system, a bad record, some or little experance in the drilling pipe line field, a CDL or Cert to weld....Ohio is starting pay $25per hr with benifits plus 401k and profit share, manual labor on the rig...Cert welder starts out around $35-up dependig on Cert...Heck the pipe haulers just driving get over $18 plus extras. They can find NO one and are looking far and wide for any experanced help...They have Job fairs in the area 1000 people show less than 100 pass the pee test....10 of those only make the grade because of past history with police/jail. You can live a real nice life on 50k in Southern Ohio land/tax is cheaper and schools aren't half bad considering the number of students is smaller compaired to Suburbia. If I was coming out of HighSchool I'd take a community class given by the Oil Co....and forget going to college for 4yrs. Trust me you'll be futher along without huge debt hanging over your head looking for a position that pays in your degree.

[ps2fixer]

gas here is 3.23 im seriously considetring getting my R street legal i have a titan now that's a gas guzzler a womping 13 mpgs :mad:

2 strokes normally don't get the best mileage, go buy a 350x and get it legal or something that is smaller :). I want a street legal 350x ^.^, probably get around 50mpg with it :D. I would suspect a 250r would get like 35 lol.

[hatc200x1]

Better idea, get a 350x, and put a kawasaki ninja 500 or 600 engine in it, those get like 75 mpg dont they? Gas keeps going up here btw,

[kb0nly]

I'm going to reset the trip odometer the next time i top off my 200ES and see what i am getting for MPG. Granted sometimes i do pull a small trailer, but still i want to see the average mpg from it.

On another note.. I have family working up in ND's oil fields, they told me its not as simple as showing up and asking for a job. After it got over publicized on the news and such they said the companies clamped down. He sees it daily at the office, guys come in to apply, the first question is do you have a place there to live? And it must be permanent, a camper in a rented camping spot is sufficient, but it cant be a van in the WalMart parking lot. There was a ton of guys living out of their cars at one time, and there was a whole tent city until the weather got too cold over the winter and most of them either moved to permanent housing or gave up and went home.

He said no living arrangements no job.. The companies did this because of the public outrage of the people who live up there and were getting sick of people camping out everywhere. There was a WalMart he said that had a couple dozen people camped out in vehicles and campers in the parking lot, using WalMart for a bathroom and a nearby truck stop for a shower. Stuff like that was just stressing the local systems, over 200 guys a day filing through the pay showers, sure the place was making money, but they could no longer serve the people who it was intended for. And when it got cold guys would pack into bars and restaurants and nurse a drink or meal for an entire afternoon or even most of a day to stay somewhere warm. They were just over populated.

He said now they turn away over 80% of anyone coming in looking for a job. The hiring boom is over. He told me general labor is getting harder to get hired in, but if your a truck driver with the right endorsements you can almost write your own paycheck yet because thats one area they are still demanding.

[ps2fixer]

Better idea, get a 350x, and put a kawasaki ninja 500 or 600 engine in it, those get like 75 mpg dont they? Gas keeps going up here btw,

It isn't the engine or transmission that makes something get 75mpg, it is driving habbits, vehical weight, areodymanics, how well the engine is tuned and how efficent it is at converting fuel into movement, oh and gearing can make a huge difference too.

Quick example, Toyota Corolla has several different setups for engine + transmissions. The BEST seems to be the 1.8L with the 5 speed manual, while the worst is the 1.6L with an automatic with no over drive or lock up converter. Mind you this is the same car, so no change on areo, and I'm going off EPA ratings, so how it is driven is standardized.

Most likely, the 350x would get the best mpg if the final gearing is similar to the 500/600 cc kawasaki engine, unless your really pushing the engine (over 80% max output @ given rpm). Main reason is the kawasaki engine is nearly double the size and the 350x is a great torque engine which = mpg in most cases.

Here is an artical about a user of ecomodder that got 116mpg out of his ninja 250cc bike, there are people with them 49cc mopeds that can do 50+ top speed and get near 200mpg with a similar setup.

http://ecomodder.com/blog/interview-with-alan-smith-accomplished-motorcycle-hypermiler-vetter-competitor/

@KB

My cousin is still paying for rent in a house he don't live in because he got moved and the contract isn't up yet. Him and 3 guys were paying $600 each for a HUGE house I guess.

[Scootertrash]

It isn't the engine or transmission that makes something get 75mpg, it is driving habbits, vehical weight, areodymanics, how well the engine is tuned and how efficent it is at converting fuel into movement, oh and gearing can make a huge difference too.

Quick example, Toyota Corolla has several different setups for engine + transmissions. The BEST seems to be the 1.8L with the 5 speed manual, while the worst is the 1.6L with an automatic with no over drive or lock up converter. Mind you this is the same car, so no change on areo, and I'm going off EPA ratings, so how it is driven is standardized.

You're contradicting yourself a bit with your statements. First you say it's not the engine or transmission that makes a difference, then you say it is, based on EPA ratings with standardized driving habits. ;)

And here's a link from the ecomodder home page:
http://ecomodder.com/blog/engines-transmission-world-difference/

As far as ecomodder.com goes, it looks like you can spend A LOT of money and time for a potential minimal increase in mileage.

Some people need a large vehicle for their work, so "adapting" as some here have put it doesn't work. Do I find a new job so I can drive one of those little matchbox cars? Do I charge customers more to compensate for the increase in fuel costs? Yup! Just like every other business that uses fuel to get to your jobsite, or haul materials to your jobsite, or mow your lawn, etc, etc, etc.

You may be saving a little money by dumping a ton of money into your vehicle to save a few pennies, but you are still paying more for everything you buy when fuel prices rise (including all of the little gadgets and gizmos you bolt to your Gremlin to get better mileage). The majority of goods we use are hauled by rail and/or trucked all over the U.S. When fuel prices rise so does the cost of your goods and services. The pinch you feel in your pocketbook when you fill your tank is just a drop in the bucket.

[oldskool83]

This is somewhat off topic but then again its sorta on topic. I just want to point out per old days taxes and debs not paid with in 7 years were abolished...it's stright out of the bible. Not saying we need to go that route but its just somthing to think about. I would like to see more US oil, then foreign. They want us to buy their oil but yet they hate us and want to blow us all up.

[sweetip2000]

We were at 3.69 2 days ago now today 3.90. 30 miles due north of NYC. I will tell you how to jack these sk00mbags, Standard Oil which is Mobil Exxon is owned by Rockerfeller. You never buy from Mobil Exxon. Next Shell. Owned by Queen Beatrice of the Netherlands.
Its always these royal inbred satanic pedophile d00shbagz that own these oil companies.
Next BP. never buy from them. Look what they did to the gulf of mexico. Its still freakin leaking oil. These mutants need to be hung upside down by their ballz.

[ps2fixer]

We were at 3.69 2 days ago now today 3.90. 30 miles due north of NYC. I will tell you how to jack these sk00mbags, Standard Oil which is Mobil Exxon is owned by Rockerfeller. You never buy from Mobil Exxon. Next Shell. Owned by Queen Beatrice of the Netherlands.
Its always these royal inbred satanic pedophile d00shbagz that own these oil companies.
Next BP. never buy from them. Look what they did to the gulf of mexico. Its still freakin leaking oil. These mutants need to be hung upside down by their ballz.

How about clark? That is where I normally buy from since they are more local and the gas seems to be a tiny bit better quality (i get better mpg with their gas).

[Tri-Z 250]

You guys are lucky it works out at $9.58/gallon here diesel is more as its better mpg so they get you there. Engine sizes are creeping up all the time back in the day a 3000cc v6 ford was big engine now regularly see 5400-6200cc motors as cars too big because of supposed safety features, dont know where people get the cash, utility bills about $2800/year fu*"ing council tax double that national insurance, paye, vat blah blah blah its never ending, and all the twats with money are paying F@#K all tax as too many loop holes if you can afford top accountant. WAN*ERS
Looking out of my window can see oil rigs being built but you cant get a job on them cause its all closed club

This is a Perfect example of why we do NOT want our HealthCare system based on surtaxes that pile on an already inflated products. 9-9-9 Herman Cain! Flat tax no matter what, it comes down to SPENDING, and that's what Government does best. Gas Price today intercity Cleveland Reg up to $4.03 a gal(must want to keep the hoodies in the hood this weekend). Oldskool Ohio imports NO foreign Oil it's All Domestic, Gulf or Canada or adjacent Statelined local crewed...Unfortunately the Federal Reserve(over beloved Gov) buys 80% of it's supply from the Arabic/Saudi Nations...Why? I said this for years, the UAW has been cranking out the same motor for over 30yrs. to make them more efficient they went form solid steel to cast aluminum. Take away weight wa-la better mpg. Since the early 70's the conversion to a Natural Gas burning vehicles was developed. Ohio has over 400yrs of Natural gas under 10,000' of soil and the only way to get it is to Frack or drill. Chevy announced the Suburban will be available in a stock ready to use 100%Natural Gas burning machine this year....The waiting list to get one 2yrs long, because regulation say there isn't enough dealers to supply the fuel to the prosective buyers nation wide. You see the cost to run your Natural gas Suburban 400miles takes $12.00 to fill. The Feds and States have set the taxes on the product low due to most consumers need the product for Heat. My argument is 400yrs worth below our feet burn it all and keep it CHEAP...In 400yrs you don't think we won't come up with an alternate fuel like hydrogen, please. This is an immediate solution to saying goodbye to The Foreign market today. Everyone could run a V8 Suburban around and spend less than a Puris-yota, and have money in their pocket to get this Nation back on top financially. I looked into converting my truck and the price was really steep, do to EPA, and Federal regulations, simply put TAX. The people against drilling are the same misinformed people who think 2strokes pollute more than 4strokes. These are also the people who want to create Green space and Natural preserves that the public has no rights to use.

[tri again]

Not to cause trouble, but why does the usa EXport oil
when we are always needing more?

Years ago, prob discovery channel, showed hydrogen tnaks filled with some sort of
gritty litter that held the H2 so it would bleed out slowly.

They shot a propane tank and it blew big like in the movies but the
hydrogen tank just hissed and leaked out slowly so seems safer than
gas.

There just has to be a better way.

I was thinking about making alcohol tractor fuel out of extra apples and farm stuff
but then realized I could eliminate all that and just get a horse.

[hatc200x1]

Gas is down to 3.99 now, 9 cents more then diesel, it dropped 20 or so cents now

[kb0nly]

Yep its finally below $4 here as well again.

I would be interested in a conversion to propane or natural gas if it was afforable enough to do so. I have seen warehouses with LNG powered forklifts and dock trucks and they have a filling station that just pulls off the local supply line like the line coming to your house for your furnace, etc.

Would be neat for sure, but here is how i look at it. Demand is enough on LNG and Propane here in the midwest in the winter time for heat, heck when the crops come out if its a wet year there is huge shortages from the suppliers because of the grain dryers running night and day to bring the crop in. Couple that with a cold winter and watch the prices go up, its still supply and demand, and if there is more demand due to vehicles using it as a fuel source then the supply suffers and the prices go up anyway. I remember wet years when it was hard to get a tank exchange for the BBQ because the demand was so high here.

[ps2fixer]

Yep its finally below $4 here as well again.

I would be interested in a conversion to propane or natural gas if it was afforable enough to do so. I have seen warehouses with LNG powered forklifts and dock trucks and they have a filling station that just pulls off the local supply line like the line coming to your house for your furnace, etc.

Would be neat for sure, but here is how i look at it. Demand is enough on LNG and Propane here in the midwest in the winter time for heat, heck when the crops come out if its a wet year there is huge shortages from the suppliers because of the grain dryers running night and day to bring the crop in. Couple that with a cold winter and watch the prices go up, its still supply and demand, and if there is more demand due to vehicles using it as a fuel source then the supply suffers and the prices go up anyway. I remember wet years when it was hard to get a tank exchange for the BBQ because the demand was so high here.

That is crazy, we never have problems getting LP here, and not far south is a ton of farm land, super windy area too with no trees.

[oldskool83]

I payed 3.47 today, drove 120 miles today used a little over 3 gallons. Keep your speed under 60 helps too. Me and the 04 civic are going everyware lol. And for the person who recomends an VW truck deisel...they are about the biggest heaps of crap by now, you would spend more in repairs and harder time finding parts then cutting the back of a 10yo car off and welding in a back window for a new school car/truck. Oil knows we like Big autos, so do the auto makers...why do you think new school muscle cars are back. I also love it when people whine about somthing guzzeling fuel...well you bought it lol. Ive hauled more crap in a 2 door civic then I know people with trucks every hauled.

[ps2fixer]

I payed 3.47 today, drove 120 miles today used a little over 3 gallons. Keep your speed under 60 helps too. Me and the 04 civic are going everyware lol. And for the person who recomends an VW truck deisel...they are about the biggest heaps of crap by now, you would spend more in repairs and harder time finding parts then cutting the back of a 10yo car off and welding in a back window for a new school car/truck. Oil knows we like Big autos, so do the auto makers...why do you think new school muscle cars are back. I also love it when people whine about somthing guzzeling fuel...well you bought it lol. Ive hauled more crap in a 2 door civic then I know people with trucks every hauled.

You clearly never met my dad :D, of course he only gets like 18mpg with his pickup :(. The VW Diesel truck is exactly the same front end and engine as the VW Golf/Rabbit, they just put a truck bed in the back, so there are more parts than you would thing. The rabbit cars are cheap to buy in running shape, the trucks are hard to find, so just get one with a good body, buy a car that drives, and swap parts if needed.

I drive 45mph, which gets me 45mpg with a car that *should* average 26mpg.


Here is a pic of my dad's last wood load, smaller than normal because they ran out of sun light, he normally has another row on the tail gate too. .... Yes that is a OLD Mazda, 1989 B2600i Pickup. He bought a parts truck for $500 and has bearly needed any parts, mainly clutch fan and the belt tension system was rigged on his truck when he bought it.

[atc007]

^^^^^^^:wondering:naughty::lol: WTF,,HOLY SH!T.. I am the one known around here for pulling that type of stuff. But,not in a million years would I consistently pull off a deal like that!! That is NUTS ! Please tell me he stays on private land and isn't out on a public road with families coming towards him !! That is off the hook :rolleyes:

[Scootertrash]

That is waaay overloaded and unsafe on any main road. He doesn't actually drive around others like that does he?





Ive hauled more crap in a 2 door civic then I know people with trucks every hauled. :rolleyes:

[kb0nly]

That thing must be crazy as hell to drive loaded like that, no weight on the front end. I have had to drive with too much rear end weight before, it sucks, feels like your going to crash every time you make a turn.

[ps2fixer]

I believe he is on his 4th season of wood with that pickup and basically every load like that. He has a trailer too :D. When he is loaded he don't travel all that fast. It kind of runs in the family, if you look in the last photo carefully you can see his brother's load, but he has a bigger truck too :). Yes... they have broken leaf springs in the past... back in the 90s my dad built a truck more or less from the ground up, rear leafs counted to either 14 or 18, don't remember for sure. 4x4 truck that weighed in something like 7800 pounds 4x4 and got like 18mpg with an old olds v8. Oh did I say the cab was a 70s Chevy station wagon which means he has a 4x4 station wagon that hulled scrap.

Anyway, we should probably keep this thread a bit more on gas related stuff :).


EDIT:

I should say also the load wasn't secured as well as he normally does, it was a short trip and fairly late at night. All roads were empty, probably saw 1 other person on the roads. We live around 20-25 miles from any major city.

[250r'en +TCB]

Hydrogen will NEVER replace oil derived fuels!

Yes hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe, but it is already bonded with some other atom! 2 hydrogen's and an oxygen make water for instance. And at the end of the day it takes X amount of energy to separate those hydrogen atoms, that will never change as it is a law of physics.

Long story short, it takes more energy to attain pure hydrogen than you can possibly get from using it as a fuel. No matter how much technology improves this fact will NEVER change, it is a mathematical certainty!

[ps2fixer]

Not sure where the Hydrogen talk came from, but if you think about it, it is a possible fuel source... for cars at least.. Power plans are fairly efficient at making power and fairly "cheap". If you were able to extract Hydrogen from water at say 80% efficiency, it might be cost effective to use as a fuel source vs $4 per gal of gas. Of course the power plants need a fuel source to start with so at the end of the day we are still burning oil, coal, nuclear, or w\e is in your area.