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View Full Version : 1985 250sx vs 1985 200x which would you choose?



TVanHess
06-09-2013, 01:39 PM
Hey guys,

I have a couple of leads on 2 trikes. A 1985 250sx with a broken electric starter. And a 1985 200x with a
Bad front brake caliper. Either one I have no worries about fixing. My real question is which one would everyone prefer to own? This bike would mostly be used by me or my wife. I have enough experience to do all the dumb things, but she is fairly new to riding but is able to get around on my 350x. The 350x seems too big for her. She is 5'5" 130-140lbs. I appreciate any comments or opinions. If anyone had pros and cons of each that would be sweet as well. Thanks a ton!

dougspcs
06-09-2013, 01:43 PM
The SX, to me is one of the most versatile trikes going..with shaft drive, semi-auto, reverse and electric start. Also it's built on a more sporty suspension so you can run with the big guys on their 350x's(for the most part), then hit the mud, trails, even a decent work horse for yard work and the likes. A great hybrid between sport and utility..

A great durable machine for almost every kind of riding..

The hands down winner..

UPNATM
06-09-2013, 01:52 PM
I agree with Doug, the SX is a great all around trike, for all the reasons he stated above.
But then again, I tend to be a little biased.....:D

obijuan
06-09-2013, 02:08 PM
selling my 200x because the 250sx is a more rounded machine.

Ghostv2
06-09-2013, 04:29 PM
I would go with the SX. I own a 200x and love it but the SX would be a lot better for your wife. And just an easier ride for you if you just wanna relax or do some work one day.
Im surprised she let you post her weight to the world wide interweb. :D

Flyingw
06-09-2013, 04:44 PM
Sx gets my vote!!!!

UPNATM
06-09-2013, 07:24 PM
If you do decide on the SX, make sure to post up some pics!:pics::w00t:

TVanHess
06-10-2013, 10:29 PM
171132171133

Went with the 250sx as suggested. Paid $250! Needs plastic, starter and brakes....runs great

sp8twn
06-10-2013, 10:44 PM
SX,,,,Hands down!!

UPNATM
06-10-2013, 11:12 PM
171132171133

Went with the 250sx as suggested. Paid $250! Needs plastic, starter and brakes....runs great

Nice, and looks to be a sweat deal at $250!
I paid $180 for the one I just got last month, and it needs a ton of parts.

jermtoad
06-11-2013, 06:01 AM
Man u stole that thing for 250 the sx was the wise choice i have both but i ride th
e sx ALOT more.

dougspcs
06-11-2013, 07:12 AM
At $250 that thing looks awesome..people pay more than that for non-running parts machines.

I can't believe you let it sit there and queried the group..that is one of those buy it now and ask questions later machines..

Fix your starter and brakes and start riding..the plastic will hold up until you can find some better or leave like it is. There are worse looking riders around..!!

Among the other things, don't forget to drain and replace that differential oil..it'll give you a good chance to judge it's condition.

TVanHess
06-11-2013, 12:15 PM
I can't believe you let it sit there and queried the group..that is one of those buy it now and ask questions later machines..



It seems like no one buys three wheelers in Oregon. Everyone into riding is into Quads almost exclusively.This was on craigslist with pictures. I was his first call two days after posting it for $300. He was gonna scrap it...another one saved from the metal scrapers I guess. What is the going price for running trikes out there?

dougspcs
06-11-2013, 12:39 PM
It seems like no one buys three wheelers in Oregon. Everyone into riding is into Quads almost exclusively.This was on craigslist with pictures. I was his first call two days after posting it for $300. He was gonna scrap it...another one saved from the metal scrapers I guess. What is the going price for running trikes out there?

The BC guys are getting raped when buying trikes, yet in Oregon they are dirt..

So close yet so far..a potential opportunity for someone.!

In the mean time, grab a few cheap trikes..great way to build a pack and get some azztime on some different machines. You'll start to see their differences and get the feel for the ones you like!!

Congrats, a great machine to start on!

That machine here in Ontario may have got you $600-800 depending on the day..$400-600 in lower Michigan I'd guess. I live right on the border, so I occasionally get to take advantage of this difference..built a nice pack over the years.

Lots of guys on here will have the parts you need to fix yours up..just ask around when you have a list of parts. All you need is a paypal account..

obijuan
06-11-2013, 01:35 PM
Sell me that tank! Lol

250rRoostmaster
06-11-2013, 02:05 PM
It seems like no one buys three wheelers in Oregon. Everyone into riding is into Quads almost exclusively.This was on craigslist with pictures. I was his first call two days after posting it for $300. He was gonna scrap it...another one saved from the metal scrapers I guess. What is the going price for running trikes out there?

I'm a dedicated Oregon trike buyer!!!

6speedthumper
06-11-2013, 02:22 PM
Glad to see you went with the SX. Absolute bullet proof, fun machine right there. And for all the reasons everyone else stated; elec start, semi-auto, shaft drive, etc... And, best of all, it has two methods of starting it! Dead battery on the trail? No prob, just whip out the kicker and away you go!

Btw, you can get some damn good power out of those 2 valve engines. FST makes a 310cc big bore kit, and you can even do a stroker by using a trx300fourtrax crank (need cylinder too) and can do an FST 354cc Fourtrax kit, or their 380cc kit. Another avenue is to take the 4v head off a 250x or 300ex (need their piston) and can have a better flowing 4v head. Pretty certain Honda used the same piston between the 250x and 300ex. They only incresed the stroke of the crank to get more displacement, and in doing so they would have had to make the cylinder taller to keep proper deck height, hence why you need the 300 cylinder if using the 300 crank.

So, if your wife ever wants more power, you have quite a few options. We have 3 TRX300fw 4x4s in the family, and I've done a fair amount of mods to my personal one. Big difference over the two stockers we have.

dougspcs
06-11-2013, 03:56 PM
Another avenue is to take the 4v head off a 250x or 300ex (need their piston) and can have a better flowing 4v head. Pretty certain Honda used the same piston between the 250x and 300ex.

This is a direct bolt on to the SX/ES engine? Any other changes needed besides exhaust?

TVanHess
06-11-2013, 05:18 PM
I'm a dedicated Oregon trike buyer!!!

Great now there is two of us. Needless to say the competition isn't huge numbers!

6speedthumper
06-12-2013, 05:06 PM
This is a direct bolt on to the SX/ES engine? Any other changes needed besides exhaust?

Yes and no. It is practically a bolt on, but, you need the cylinder off a 250x for it to work. The reason is this; the 4 studs that hold the head down to the bottom end, have the same bolt pattern (hence why it works), however, the two "auxilary bolts" that bolt the head to the cylinder (they don't go into the crankcase) are in a different location. Not only do you need the 250x cylinder, but, you need the piston as well.

The 250x head will work for sure. I'd have to see if the 300ex head has the same valve layout so they don't hit the piston. Like I said earlier, the bore is the same between the 250 and 300, Honda just increased the stroke. Increasing the stroke means that they would have had to make a new piston to get the correct deck height, OR, they would have to make the cylinder taller to re-use the 250x piston. Again, I'm not too sure about this, which is why I know the 250x top end will work.

So, to sum it all up, you need: 250x cylinder, head, rocker cover w/rockers, 250x gasket kit, and 250x piston. The exhaust should bolt right up still. I've seen 300 4x4s with the ex head before and the exhaust bolts right up. Your timing chain should work fine as well. Although DID has two differnent part numbers for the X and SX, they use the same number of links. IDk what the difference is, other then price, lol. Just saw that the SX/ES/TRX250/250/ and the TRX300 all have the same number of links (110). The TRX300 has the same part number as the 250x, again, IDK. You may find that you have to re-use the cam sprocket from your SX on the 250x cam (it'll bolt on, Honda used the same sprocket design on them all).

Doing the X top end will give you a better flowing head (should help upper RPMs) and you can run a 12:1 Wiseco in either standard up to 0.080" bore sizes. I think Wiseco also makes a 10.25:1 piston for the X as well. You won't have the auto-decomp set up that the X uses, because your 250sx bottom end is not equipped with the cam for the cable to work, so kick starting it will require a little effort. But, it's electric start, so long as the starting system is in working order, it is something you should almost never have to worry about.

One last thing you can do is an oil cooler. There are two methods, and if you up the compression ratio (especially with the 12:1) you will want to do this! One is modding the oil filter cover and attaching lines to it, with one going into the cooler and the other coming out of the cooler. The only thing I have read about this is that you stand a chance of the kicker hitting the fittings in the filter cover, and breaking them off. Being super finiky on what fitting you pick, you should be able to avoid this. The other way is to remove the oil pipe that goes fromt the bottom end to the head, have steel braided lines made with banjo ends on them (eyelets that let fluid through like the pipe) and run the line from the bottom end to the cooler, and the other line from the cooler to the top end. May not cool the oil AS WELL as the filter cover method, but, you know the kicker will never hit it.

Lots of info I threw at ya, I know, but there is a LOT you can do to it. I've always wanted to do it, so I'm living vicarously through you, LMAO!!! Haha

dougspcs
06-12-2013, 06:34 PM
Thanks, Thumper..some great ideas.

I'm gonna save it for my next project..

fcf35
06-12-2013, 09:13 PM
I agree also.sx is like a souped up Cadillac.smooth ride and plenty power.I traded my 87 and I wanna kick myself in the a#$ for doing it.oh well I got a very nice 85 200x,2004 Trx 90 for my son and 500 bucks.l love all 3 wheelers but have a soft spot for clutches and like to control whatever gear I'm in.

ps2fixer
06-13-2013, 03:45 AM
The SX gets my vote too :D.

Major question though.... why not buy BOTH if they are priced cheap :D. You can never have too many 3 wheelers!


@6speedthumper

I knew about the TRX300 upgrade, but not the head swap. Also one thing to point out that I saw a problem with in the past when looking at a 250x quad cyl vs the 250es/sx cyl, the timing chain tensenioner is on the Oppsite side, so the engine actually runs backwards to eachother.

250sx - Front
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HONDA-250SX-ENGINE-MOTOR-250ES-BIG-RED-TRX-250-MOTOR-/140981483759?pt=Motors_ATV_Parts_Accessories&hash=item20d326b8ef&vxp=mtr#ht_940wt_1062

trx250x - Back
http://www.ebay.com/itm/TRX250X-TRX-250X-TRX250-Engine-Motor-/400459601219?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item5d3d409543&nma=true&si=%252F%252FCxPF6XVm5Vny7ClEg8xvsITGc%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557#ht_1743wt_1328

This is going off from the 87-92 trx250x engine design, I'm not sure about newer models.

6speedthumper
06-13-2013, 12:02 PM
The tensioner is just on the back side of the cylinder. My 300 has it the same way as the SX, on the front side. I was pretty sure both engines rotate the same direction. I don't recall Honda having one run in one direction, and the other the opposite direction. I've never done the swap, but, will do some google searches on it.

ps2fixer
06-13-2013, 01:11 PM
Here is some support for my claim. The basics are, Honda would never put the tensioning system on the pull side of the timing chain, that would just be stupid. Instead it is always on the slack slide, so if it is on the opposite side, the actual engine runs backwards.

http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php/126612-250SX-engine-conversion-to-a-350-update?p=982550#post982550

Here is the quote.


Well I hate to bring bad news but there are some things you will need to look at. #1 is the 250sx (and the trx300)motor spins backwards to turn the drive shaft the right way. The 250sx (and the trx300) has the cam chain tensioner in the front of the cylinder to take up the cam chain slack in the way the motor turns. Then the big one,this took me about nine months to get right,and that is building a cam to run backwards from a cam core out of the 300ex or 250x 4 valve head.

IMO it is better to use your 250sx crank and stroke it,use a 300ex or 250x head and do a big valve port and flow job with a big bore piston kit like the one in the pic to make a 380 or 390 out of it. You use your stock cylinder and you have your cam out of the 300ex to match the head and have it welded up and re-ground. The reason we go this way is the 300ex head with big valves will flow almost as good as a 350x,but you don't have to have a heavy big dome piston to get the compression up to run a big cam,infact the 390 piston is lighter the the stock 350x piston. This makes a faster and quicker motor then going the way you talked about.

118011

So in other words, the tensioner needs to be on the same side of the engine, as the OEM cylinder.

Just to clarify, it would work, just the timing chain slides would wear much faster.

6speedthumper
06-13-2013, 01:35 PM
Yeah ps2, I just did a little reading taking a break form the heat, here in the shop. The sport bike's do have engines that rotate the opposite direction when running. I did not know that. But, it can still be done. Here is a thread I found on a google search from hgihlifter. You have to get the cam "reverse ground" to work properly. Always like to learn knew trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro!

http://forum.highlifter.com/tm.aspx?m=1756350&mpage=&print=true

ps2fixer
06-13-2013, 02:03 PM
What about the timing chain slides though? I would think they would wear quicker. Seems like getting a utility based cyl and putting a sport head on it would be the best and simplest way to do it.

JasonB
06-13-2013, 04:13 PM
glad to see you went with the SX, that thing is nice for 250$! I picked up an 87SX for my GF year before last because she wanted a trike. They are great machines all around!

6speedthumper
06-13-2013, 06:23 PM
Once you pointed out the tensioner location, ps2, I started to think about the running direction of those two engines. The timing chain guides shouldn't wear out any faster then normal, so long as they have oil to lube them. My question is this, how do you mount them? On the SX the front guide is the "slipper" guide because the tensioner presses against it, and it is fastened in/to the bottom end with a bolt it pivots off of. The rear guide is stationary, and is held in by a "saddle" down in the bottom end, and gets "sandwiched" between the cylinder and head to hold her in place.

It is the opposite in the 250x. So, I'd like to know how it works.

ps2fixer
06-14-2013, 07:02 AM
That is a good point too, I need more engines to play with! I would think you would need the slides from the bottem end you plan to use, and hopefully it matches up with the cyl. I don't think too many people have attempted this kind of swap much, mainly just the head, so not much info to go off from currently :(. Things like this is exactly why I started my atvinterchange site, just need to finish it up lol.

6speedthumper
06-14-2013, 09:25 PM
Cool. Even if you have the guides from the x/ex (which you need anyway), you still have to secure them to the bottom end. I wonder how it works.