Honda 200M - Overhaul?

[thatguy]

So I brought home a '94 200M today and having trouble getting it going now. Previous owner had it in storage and the battery was dead when I got there. We started it up many times and it would die after about 5-10 seconds of running. We eventually got it to stay running and he adjusted the idle so that it would idle. We rode it up and down the road a few times and it felt strong. I bought a new battery on the way home and put it in and of course now it won't stay running again.

I would like to get it running consistently first, then do a complete overhaul to get it in real good shape. I want to have it for a while, why else would I have bought a 3 wheeler, right?

I know I haven't given much info to you yet, but any ideas on where to start?

Tomorrow or Wednesday I plan to try to get it going again. I am thinking the tank may need to come off and be cleaned inside? Maybe some gas sat in the tank too long in storage..

---Edit: I did post a similar post in the commencement section, it was meant as more of an intro... I was looking more towards the non-starting trike issue with this one. Also, getting my post count up haha

[cap]

Definitely start with the tank. Easy to do, remove the fuel line from the petcock, remove the bolt at the aft and slide tank back. Flush the tank out and inspect it.
Now that the tank is off you might as well pull the carb and clean and inspect it. See the YouTube video on atc carb cleaning if your not sure how to do it.
My carb was missing the idle adjust seal so I ended up buying a new carb (caltric, 21$ with a inline filter). ran great after that.
While your at it put in a new spark plug.

[thatguy]

Thanks for the info cap! Unfortunately I have more questions for you/everyone...

Tank:
In your opinion what is a safe solvent to put in the tank for cleaning besides gas? Some posts online say to use BBs or ball bearings to shake around in it to dislodge the sludge. thoughts?

Carb:
- Replace or rebuild? It looks like it will cost about $20 either way, so I was thinking why not replace? Not sure if its stock or not. I would kind of like to rebuild a carb as I have never done it, but at the same time I would just like to get the thing running for now...
- Do I need to buy one of those jet adjuster tool things? Looks like it has many different gauge wires sticking out to set the right size of jets (i think thats how they work)
- Are there performance carbs for these? Figured if I decide to replace that might as well get a good one that might put out more power? Or maybe thats all in the jets.. or maybe that won't help at all...

Thanks for the help so far guys, in this thread and my other one!

[Ghostv2]

Thanks for the info cap! Unfortunately I have more questions for you/everyone...

Tank:
In your opinion what is a safe solvent to put in the tank for cleaning besides gas? Some posts online say to use BBs or ball bearings to shake around in it to dislodge the sludge. thoughts?

Carb:
- Replace or rebuild? It looks like it will cost about $20 either way, so I was thinking why not replace? Not sure if its stock or not. I would kind of like to rebuild a carb as I have never done it, but at the same time I would just like to get the thing running for now...
- Do I need to buy one of those jet adjuster tool things? Looks like it has many different gauge wires sticking out to set the right size of jets (i think thats how they work)
- Are there performance carbs for these? Figured if I decide to replace that might as well get a good one that might put out more power? Or maybe thats all in the jets.. or maybe that won't help at all...

Thanks for the help so far guys, in this thread and my other one!

I heard a lot of people say apple cider vinegar works good, i think you let it sit for a day, give it a shake now and then, see how it is and let it sit more if needed. Then you just use baking soda to neutralize it. As far as the carb, i would rebuilt it. My personal opinion because i like OEM even though i heard the chinese alternatives work good.

As far as the jets (I have never messed with them so excuse me if its wrong) but the jets will have the size (number) on it. You cant adjust them by a turn or something, you buy different sizes and they just screw in. So the tool your describing might just to be to check the size of jets?

[kb0nly]

Most likely cause of what your experiencing is a blocked fuel supply that lets it run til the carb bowl is empty then it slowly refills again. When you flush the tank take apart the petcock and clean it out good, also put an inline fuel filter on it, that will help as well!

With the cost of the carbs being about the same as the rebuild kits i usually replace rather then repair unless the carb is in good shape, if its grungy inside or the slide is loose from wear i just junk them.

[cap]

Work on getting it running before you spend money on performance.
Might look at a 200xif you want more performance. The M and Big Reds are more trail/ work bikes.

[thatguy]

awesome guys thanks for the info!

i want to start on it now, wish i had a heated garage.. 30F is cold for GA, we arent used to this!

[Ghostv2]

awesome guys thanks for the info!

i want to start on it now, wish i had a heated garage.. 30F is cold for GA, we arent used to this!

Yea i know, it was 20's and i was out working on the 200s. But pulling a recoil repeatedly gets your blood pumping and keeps you warm. I eventually gave up though. :p

[redsox]

you'll have alot of fun rebuilding the m. its not rocket science. be careful though, its addictive and they will multiply. i highly recommend getting a clymer manual (ebay). or, if you like the computer, there are online versions. (i like having the book) take things slow and utilize the search bar up in the top right corner. this site is loaded with geniuses. they know it all. myself excluded. welcome aboard, keep at it, don't be afraid to ask questions. you can do almost everything on that machine with the basic tools. don't go buying anything yet. get her to run.

[thatguy]

ok so i bolded the cold and syphened (sp?) the gas out which looked clear but yellow like piss, not sure the color of gas these days..

i took some pics inside the tank.. im not sure if its bad or normal.

As for that thing sticking up inside the tank, is it part of the petcock and would a new petcock come with this? My petcock was rally bad, the o ring inside it is chewed up and both ends of the fuel line after the petcock are as well so I wonder if I was losing gas slowly here or maybe pressure (of some sort?) keeping gas from entering carb...

Do you guys know if I can buy the fuel line that connects petcock to carb? and if so do I just cut it to put a fuel filter between? The petcocks for sale dont come with the fuel line, but some carbs do. Since I'm not going to do the carb just yet I would like to just get this fuel line to get clean gas into the carb and see what happens. I appreciate all of your help fellas!

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j210/dash14251/IMG_20140212_174547_960-1.jpg (http://s81.photobucket.com/user/dash14251/media/IMG_20140212_174547_960-1.jpg.html)
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j210/dash14251/IMG_20140212_174612_669.jpg (http://s81.photobucket.com/user/dash14251/media/IMG_20140212_174612_669.jpg.html)
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j210/dash14251/IMG_20140212_174631_757-1.jpg (http://s81.photobucket.com/user/dash14251/media/IMG_20140212_174631_757-1.jpg.html)

[thatguy]

So I have ordered online:
-aftermarket petcock with the small tube that runs up inside the tank $20
-3' fuel line to replace line from petcock to carb, then as drain from carb, etc. (5/16 OD, 3/16 ID, hope that's right!) $7
-small simple fuel filter, only one I could find to fit this small tubing $3
-cheap air filter as mine looks chewed up bad

I plan to pick up a new plug locally and clean out the tank. I will update yall once she roars to life again! I know you are all in suspense right now

[kb0nly]

That tank isnt bad at all, will clean up really easy, a little Apple Cider Vinegar soak will do it, but its not so bad that i would spend the time soaking the whole tank. Get a small long brush and clean it best you can and flush it out with some acetone or fresh fuel. The fuel filter will prevent future issues.

Yes the petcock comes with the filter tube. Yes 3/16" ID fuel line is correct.

Sounds good will be waiting for an update!

[thatguy]

so i finally got all the parts on tuesday and got some time this afternoon while the girl was away so i could "play" in the garage. the tiny fuel filter they sent was way bigger than 3/16 so i couldnt fit it but just went without for now. got new petcock in, new clear fuel line to carb, new air filter. the cider vinegar soaked for 48 hrs, i flushed it out using spare change, nuts, and bolts to scrape the rust out, neutralized it with water/baking soda for a while. Then I put a small amount of 2 cycle mix and shook it around to "coat" the inside of the tank, then dumped it out and put the top on until i could get to it. today it had flash rusted where the cider vinegar sat... i flushed with baking soda 2-3 times but iguess it wasnt enough. anyway i flushed it twice with real gas then stuck it on ready to go.

it started right up with only pumping the throttle slightly but would not idle, i kept having to stay on the throttle to keep her alive. The choke didnt do anything (i did make sure the cable worked), but since it started up i didnt figure i needed it. i turned the idle adjust screw on the carb forward a little until i got it to idle. i rode it around the yard and up and down the street a couple times to run it through all the gears and it seems to run pretty good.

after it was good and warm i topped off the engine oil, then played with the idle adjust screw thingie trying to get it as low as i could where it would still stay alive.

should i play with the screw thing on the bottom of the carb? i mean, turn the bottom thing one way until i hear the engine ping, then the other way til i hear it ping, then set it exactly in the middle? the engine sounds like it might have a ping to it now, but i dont know for sure... should i do that before setting the idle adjust screw?

also, i have read not to use the idle adjust thing to compensate for something else not working properly. i didnt turn it very much but im sure its been messed with in the past so how do i know where the proper setting is for this screw?

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EDIT: info added:
one other thing, i let it die out once before riding it and then ignition would not turn on or neutral light. i checked fuse and it had blown. i couldnt for the life of me find the same fuse in advance auto so after a few searches on google and no help from the owners manual or shop manual i just bought a pack of 15amp and 25 amp. i put in a 15a and it started right up.

do any of you know the proper fuse to run in the 84 200m? i hope i dont cause longterm damage to starter or whatever else if im using the wrong one..

[kb0nly]

The screw on the bottom of the carb is just the drain screw, the screw on the side, your mixture screw, is the only one you need to worry about adjusting. As you said stalling either way and set in the middle is a good start. I like to adjust it until it sounds like its running pretty good and the throttle response is good, then i ride it a while on a fresh plug and then read the plug and see where i am at for fuel mix.

As for pinging, you might be hearing valve noise, the 200's like to rattle like a sewing machine, thats perfectly normal... I haven't heard a quite one yet, but check your valve adjustments just to be sure they aren't too far off.

As for the fuse, that fuse is the supply to the ignition switch, which in turn supplies power to the lights and the starter solenoid when starting with the electric start. So if you blow that fuse its either in the lighting or electric start circuits. I think the stock was a 10a fuse, at least thats what i put in them. But 15 amp shouldn't hurt nothing, worst case whatever is shorting out will smoke and you can follow the smoke to the problem!! LOL... Hey i do it all the time.