Quantum physics

[fabiodriven]

This is a subject I have become very interested in over the last year or so. A year ago at this time I was in the throes of crippling anxiety and depression. In the past I had briefly touched on the subject of quantum physics but without direction and I didn't know what quantum physics was at that time. I was interested nonetheless, although I didn't have a label for what it was I was interested in. It was a feeling in my head, something that I couldn't see with my eyes, probably similar to religion I might imagine. It's something that's been inside of me my entire life, as long as I can remember, only over this past year did I realize part of my brain thinks in quantum physics.

Very rarely do I tell people that because they usually look at me as if I'm crazy for one reason or another. Sometimes people want to quiz you and "see just how smart you are" or attempt to "take you down a peg", however even if I could express myself clearly enough they lack the perception to understand what it is I'm saying. This makes it near impossible to prove to anyone who doesn't understand quantum physics anything about my personal beliefs.

My beliefs are rooted in quantum physics and always have been. Once I figured out what quantum physics is I realized how long it had been inside of me. Quantum physics is all about truth, facts, and it is a science, a fact based science. If you think about all of the religions in the world and all of the interpretations of each one, it's to each their own as to which religion they choose to believe, which parts of their chosen religion they adhere to (or don't), and how they represent themselves as a member of their chosen faith. One of the many big problems I have with religion is that they all claim that each one themselves is "the one" so to speak. Thousands of religions out there, yet each one is the one and only true religion. Mormons, Jews, Catholics, Islam, you name it. Each one claims to be the one and only and each is more adamant than the next about how right they are. Well as you all have guessed by this point, they can't all be right. So which one is? How do you determine which is correct and the one and only true religion? By followers? By actions? Those could both be taken into account. One really good way of finding out which is right, bloodshed. I feel it is absolutely appropriate and representative of religion to have been the motive for so many wars in history. If you follow religion, you are well aware of how violent religion is. This is a fact in most cases. I'm given the impression that religion is supposed to promote peace and make life on this planet better or enhanced, however every day people are killed in the name of Allah or god, or Vishnu or whatever. People are not killed in the name of quantum physics.

I like facts and I like true stories, but I'd rather get my made up stories while watching a movie rather than being read them while I should be sleeping on Sunday morning. I enjoy movies, I don't enjoy church, and they both tell me stories. Movies it is. If you truly believe the stories in the bible and find they may be true to an extent, then think about this. If you've ever played the "telephone" game, you know that sharing a story with 5 people in succession is enough to change that story quite a bit. If you watch a movie that is "based on actual events", you know damn well that most times the story has been elaborated and embellished to a point that it's almost silly if you're familiar with the original event. If you compare those two timelines, the telephone game involving 5 people and the dolling-up of a story to make it fit for public consumption in a movie, with the timeline involved with ancient religious writing, you might imagine that a story from thousands of years ago that has been interpreted and reinterpreted over and over again might not be that accurate. OK, maybe YOU don't think those stories might not be that accurate, but I don't think they are. I choose to think with rationality, and rationally you can almost be certain these stories are incredibly inaccurate at best, and it is my belief that most if not all are made up. I mean, if you look at the chances of these stories being true from a rational standpoint it's just plain obvious. Let's say there are 1000 religions on this planet. Now all of those religions claim to be the one and only. At best one of those 1000 religions can be correct. Simple math will tell you that each one of those 1000 religions has 0.1% chance of being correct. That is an extremely low number. Again, simple math will tell you that with a percentage that low it is actually more likely that none of them are correct.

Beliefs do not change facts. Facts, if you're rational, should change your beliefs. I cannot stress enough how important that statement is. If you think about it for a minute, with religion you are forced (if you're doing it "right") to believe without question, you are asked for your faith and punished if you do what someone else deems wrong. You believe without question, but why? Why is it "right" for someone else's imposed beliefs to be what's right and best for me? I don't force my will on anyone else, I know what's best for me and not them. I'm certainly not going to take into account unwelcome and imposed programs to make me behave the way someone else thinks I should. No sex before marriage? HAHAHAHAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Who adheres to that? That is just utterly stupid and insane. Marriage is an unnatural act first of all, man was never designed to be monogamous. It's actually unhealthy. I have never been married and I'll tell you right now I lose my mind if I don't dip my wick here and there. People were put on this earth for four things- to eat, sleep, shite, and trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro. So I'm supposed to listen to the commandments of people from thousands of years ago, mere mortals, over mother nature, the universe, and all that is natural? Simple question- What happens just about every single time man interjects himself with mother nature? If these people did in fact make these rules thousands of years ago for us all to abide by, obviously ancient man had no concept or perception of this modern world in which we live now. Religion has always been under this protective umbrella of being "untouchable" or a subject that must be handled with care or skirted around as not to offend anyone. What I say to that is bullshit. Stories written thousands of years ago by ancient man who had not the comprehension of a modern day 8 year old, and these are taken as sacred then analyzed and interpreted over and over again, and now I'm supposed to model my life around these words? Yeah, no thanks. Your organization is supposed to tell me how to live my life the "correct" way after millions of people have died in the name of god? The crusades, the witch trials, thousands of years of death and killing all in the name of god. All over whose story was better or "true", or whose beacon of love, life, and peace was worth more bloodshed.

The fundamentals of quantum physics are truth and fact, not distorted stories. If you were completely unbiased, if you hadn't been raised literally from the time of your birth as most of us are to believe that religion is good and something you need in your life, if you had a clean slate from the time you were a child until you became an adult and were given a choice, if society hadn't attempted to force religion of one form or another down your throat and you were asked to believe only one of the following; That bcredneck's great grand pappy made a steam powered three wheeler made from wooden bed frames in the late 1800's but there is no evidence of such a claim, or that I have pictures of Raffa on the podium after a race, which would you believe happened? As unlikely as it is that Raffa would be on the podium, if I have a story and picture to back it up would you believe that one more because there is proof or would you believe the story without any evidence whatsoever? If you believe the one with no proof, why? Because we've been raised that way or because that's the "right" way? We have enough knowledge and technology to explain many aspects of life that were previously questions that couldn't be answered. Facts are fact, proof is proof, there is no "interpretation" or "how you take it" or any of that. With religion you can believe it or not, but with quantum physics you don't have a choice. You have to believe it because it is fact once proven. If you don't believe in facts then I really just don't know what to tell you.

I was disparaged and insulted by someone religious recently. He was attempting to force his religious beliefs on myself as well as other innocent people. We were having a discussion that had nothing to do with religion but he insisted on interjecting himself and subjecting us to his points of view that had nothing to do with the topic at hand and in no time flat killed our conversation. Our conversation made no reference to his religious beliefs in any way prior to him bringing it up and it was much to his chagrin that our conversation got derailed. He was glad to have caused a negative outcome in the lives of other people simply for having a belief that was different than his. This is what religion teaches people, that thoughts unlike your own are bad. He reveled in his spite and got enjoyment from our frustration, which is something I would never do to my fellow man. I don't need some dude riding a cloud to tell me that. I have good morals, ethics, values, and respect. Spite is not something I partake in as the last thing I need to attract back to me is any sort of negative vibes, spite or otherwise. If you think that stuff doesn't come back to you then wait a little while. I'm sick of every religious person thinking that they're automatically right or good because they're on god's team or that we can't talk about that subject or offend them, trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro them. Why is it OK for my beliefs to be laughed at? My beliefs are real, not pie in the sky stories from ancient people who didn't have the first concept of the world around them. Yes those stories are great when you don't have knowledge and facts, but we have knowledge and facts now! Beliefs don't change facts, facts if you're rational, should change your beliefs! This same person was projecting bad vibes on people and predicting unfortunate events. When I pointed that out there was an attempt to ridicule me as if thinking those thoughts ahead of time wouldn't affect the outcome of what happens. Why would projecting bad thoughts not cause them to occur? If you're thinking "I'm going to get into an accident, I'm going to get into an accident", what do you think is going to happen? If you suggest something happening it makes it much, much more likely to occur. This is the law of attraction and I know I've said this before but it is a law of nature and whether or not you believe it doesn't matter, it is a law. If you don't believe it, basically you're just ignorant. That's not because "you're stupid and I'm smart" or "my story from ancient man is better than yours", it's because it is a fact. If you choose not to accept that fact you're just ignorant, plain and simple. I can reject stories from ancient people because there is no proof they are true, as a matter of fact it's highly unlikely that they are. That's my choice to make whether or not I want to believe that stuff but if you don't want to accept fact for fact then that's your hang up. Maybe you can find some old text that tells you it's OK to stop breathing and give that a shot, let me know how it works out. I'll tell you that you need to breathe, but if facts don't matter just listen to the book.

I will continue to study the material I find interesting and I will continue to do good in this world. By good I don't mean my selfish view of what's good for other people whether they like it or not, I mean genuine good. Like towing a broken down motorcyclist 5 miles to the dealer, or riding up the road and picking up a throttle cable for another broken down biker, or driving a woman's car across town for her after she popped a brake line in front of my house, or pulling a stuck tractor trailer out of the ditch. I project a smile and much more often now that's what I get in return. I don't live in fear of what god's going to do to me or what he or anyone thinks, I do what's right and keep myself happy. I know "god" better than any religious person, oh yes I just said that. I know whatever made me or might be watching me is proud as trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro and smiles at the things I do and I know that someday if I get a chance to "review the play" I'll be happy with a very high percentage of my decisions and actions. I know that thinking negatively draws exactly that in or predicting unfortunate circumstances makes them much, much more likely to occur. I know that I am made of atoms and that every single atom in my body is controlled by my brain, and thus I can influence my entire being to my will and in turn affect my reality and make things happen, not just stand by and watch or follow the rules of some paper weight. I can basque in the sun and be happy when others might be down and find the positive side of everything, thus bringing more positives my way. I don't have rules other than what the law says, and I live the way I see fit, not the way Ezekiel says I should. I don't hang my head in shame or owe anyone an explanation. If someone up there is watching me I can rest assured they're impressed.

Where did we come from? You ever wonder that? Well, god made Adam and Eve and then the evil snake came and raped Smurfette... Yeah, how about no. That never happened. We have evolved from other existing lifeforms on this planet. That's a fact so you can take it or go back to reading your boring comic book. You can be like a lot of people now and "Just take some of it with a grain of salt" or "Oh I believe this but not that" which is stupid. You either buy religion or you don't. It is your choice after all. However it is not your choice whether or not we evolved from other lifeforms on this planet. This is a fact that has been proven by science yet religion still refutes. It is a fact, you can't refute it! It's been proven! Ok so Adam and Eve are bullshit. Moses was real though! He really parted the sea! And Noah! He's real as well! Just not Adam and Eve. How about they're all fake. Sorry to burst your bubble folks. Basically what a lot of it comes down to is intelligence. Am I saying you're stupid for believing in religion? Yes, yes I am. (Grammar is a huge indicator of intelligence) When there are facts that prove otherwise in my opinion it is stupid to believe something else which is not even close to being fact based, which is hearsay at best, which causes wars, divides us further as human beings, fills us with fear, and clouds our judgement. Maybe you "need" it to do things that don't get you in trouble or keep you out of it. Maybe you just don't think highly enough about yourself to do what's right for you in order to succeed at life or excel. Maybe you have to do it for someone else because your will isn't strong enough. Maybe you have to bow to someone else because society has put you in that position and it is society that has made you accustomed to groveling, fearing, and penalties for your actions. I will smile and think for myself and continue to reap the benefits of what the universe has to offer me, as the universe is the be-all end-all and has the final say. The universe creates and destroys and it also tells us which way to go. I have learned to read the signs, but that's a lecture for another day. I need to get to sleep now and god willing the sun will rise again tomorrow if he see's us fit to be blessed with another day! :lol:

I welcome any and all replies or debate from one side or the other, all I ask is care be taken to respect one another. I am declaring myself the winner of this debate on the first post because there is no argument, facts versus fairy tales. It's been done many, many times before by people much, much smarter than myself. You can tell me how much it means to you whether or not it's "real" or "true", that it has an uplifting quality to it or that it "makes you a better person". I got news for you; YOU make you a better person, no one else. It's YOUR choice what you want to do in life and the print you want to leave. I've been studying enough to know a little but I need to know more. The more facts I learn the more I want to learn the less time I have.

“If we wish to draw philosophical conclusions about our own existence, our significance, and the significance of the universe itself, our conclusions should be based on empirical knowledge. A truly open mind means forcing our imaginations to conform to the evidence of reality, and not vice versa, whether or not we like the implications.”
― Lawrence M. Krauss

“The amazing thing is that every atom in your body came from a star that exploded. And, the atoms in your left hand probably came from a different star than your right hand. It really is the most poetic thing I know about physics: You are all stardust. You couldn’t be here if stars hadn’t exploded, because the elements - the carbon, nitrogen, oxygen, iron, all the things that matter for evolution - weren’t created at the beginning of time. They were created in the nuclear furnaces of stars, and the only way they could get into your body is if those stars were kind enough to explode. So, forget Jesus. The stars died so that you could be here today.”
― Lawrence M. Krauss

If any of this interests you or if you desire to learn more, here are some links to point you in the right direction. I can say that quantum physics has unequivocally had a huge positive impact on my life and would highly recommend it to anyone else. Lawrence Krauss is one of my favorite physicists. I watched my first video from him (link below) on YouTube and just kept jumping from lecture to lecture. I have watched many of them now and continue to watch.

Lawrence Krauss-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIJXGQ4H0GQ.

Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson-
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL2051CDC8CC6AE32E

"What the Bleep do we Know"
-https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0U1fTNB9X4

There is so much modern, accurate, factual information out there. Man has come a long way. Why limit yourself? We are evolving and the next step of our evolution is going to be a big one. If you look at how man has progressed over the last 100 years it is an exponential progression by very definition of the word! We're at the motocross and there's a modern 450 conversion and an ATC110 for you to choose from. Take your pick.

[Airmapper]

I just read all that....really I did.

If we ever get a solid understanding of quantum mechanics, look out. I suspect it will be the key that opens up the universe to humans.

Two things you should watch if you have not already, and both were on Netflix if you have access to that.

The Secret. Some of it I kind of rolled my eyes at, but while I thought it was kind of hokus pokus at first, it kinda made some sense when I really pondered on it. Enough I have to say "I don't know" and keep an open mind.

Cosmos, Excellent 13 episode series with the same Mr. Tyson you linked above. (A updated version of Carl Sagans version in the 80's) All about the universe. It's pretty basic at times, but even thought I am a science buff and knew a lot of the information to some extent, it was very entertaining and tied a lot of concepts together.

[fabiodriven]

Thank you Airmapper, and I agree with you completely. "The Secret" is a very good eye opener, although I've not seen it in years. Certainly a good place to start, it doesn't get too overwhelming.

[clmeue37]

That was a pretty good read there Fabio. I am not a religious individual however I do believe in God and his son Jesus. You stated that people who believe in religion are stupid and I can't say that I really disagree with you. To be honest, i find it hard to differentiate a religion from a "cult." Religion is extremely hard for me to swallow however my own beliefs are rooted in a higher power, that being God, our creator. The stories we read in the Bible may be just that. Stories. These stories may just be exaggerated situations that have been romanticized to get a point across and teach a lesson. I believe them though. Does that make me stupid? A bad person? Unintelligent? I invite you to answer those questions for me if you so please.

I feel as if you have thrown all religious people into a cardboard box, folded the flaps closed, taped it up real tight, and slapped a label on the side reading "STUPID, IGNORANT, IRRATIONAL, HATEFUL SAVAGES." Is that what you think of people who believe in God? Do you believe as though you are a superior human being who is better than us all because you study quantum physics? That was my interpretation of your opinion and I apologize if I have misunderstood. There are good people everywhere, both believers in God as well as non believers. Quantum physics works for you and that is awesome (I truly mean that). Prayer and the Bible work for me. Do I have irrefutable facts that prove God exists? Nope, I have faith.

Now since I'm not sitting here trying to force my opinion down anyone's throat, I'm not going to go into detail about my beliefs. I know what's right and what's wrong. It's not hard to figure out and I don't need the church to tell me. Our churches, government, schools, and media have their own agenda and I know it's not mine and I don't think it's yours either is it Fabio. I don't think we're that different.

I'm not here to argue. I'm not here to fight. Heck I'm not even here to debate. I would absolutely love to know more about quantum physics. Really I would. It seems as though some of the mindset you have adopted would be beneficial to me as well. I don't see quantum physics as a religion but a way of thinking.

[M.Pargiello]

I am only posting to say I didn't have time to read all of this, but I am very interested in your viewpoint as I have looked into this subject alot recently. After I get home this is for sure on my to do list :) I forsee a long conversation in the river on an early June morning in Indiana. Thank you for bringing this up, I think it can lead to great insight from other members

[thestud25]

Johnny you and I are bros, but I have to voice my $.02 here. Religion is nuts. I believe the only function of religion is to provide an avenue for like-minded believers to get together. Religion is dangerous and beneficial. It all depends on how, when , where, and to whom it is applied.

As clmeue37 put it he chooses to believe in God, by faith. Until proven otherwise there is a God. The "Big-Bang" has not been proven, and there are way too many inconsistencies and flaws to say that evolution is the "creator".

A wise man said "It is better to live a life believing in God and his teachings, and be proven wrong, then to live a life believing there is no God, and be proven wrong."

I get where you are coming from on this, and we all know I am far far far from the role model christian here, but those are my $.02.

[rdonald1979]

You should all start reading from the web sit bibliotecapleyades.net to get the old cranium activated. Some fare fetched stuff in there, but is it so fare fetched? Thanks for starting this discussion. There is a movement around the world right now that is getting stronger, the TRUTH movement.

[fabiodriven]

The stories we read in the Bible may be just that. Stories. These stories may just be exaggerated situations that have been romanticized to get a point across and teach a lesson. I believe them though. Does that make me stupid? A bad person? Unintelligent? I invite you to answer those questions for me if you so please.

No, no, and no. I don't blame anyone for their choice of what their personal beliefs are. We are all free to believe what we wish and far be it for me to suggest to anyone else what they should and shouldn't believe in. We'll leave that to the bible thumpers. I'm not saying if you believe in God or Jesus you are stupid. What I am saying is if someone refutes facts or chooses to deny facts because the facts ruin their "story" or prove that events written about eons ago by people who had no grasp of how the world around them worked, those people are ignorant. If you watch some of Dr. Lawrence Krauss' debates (which I don't expect everyone to do) you will see the kind of ignorance it is to which I refer. These are men who are the highest educated in their fields, one a quantum physicist and the other a religious expert, and every time it's irrefutable who comes out on top at the end of the debate. The religious men grasp at straws and squirm and resort to cheap shots and "points" which are irrelevant and silly. For me personally religion has always left me asking questions, but conversely, quantum physics has a lot of answers. From the time I was a child I was baffled by religion. It didn't explain anything to me. I was a CCD dropout, haha. I never got confirmed. Quantum physics asks plenty of questions, but then the answer is sought after and proven. To argue against proof and facts with fairy tales is just plain irrational in my eyes. Now, I understand how these stories and gods help people in their day to day life so you could argue that's what's so great about religion, however it will hamper you in the process by setting guidelines, restrictions, and make you fear repercussions. It instructs men and women to commit unnatural acts (marriage, celibacy, fasting, all created by man) and teaches poor values (spite, vengeance, shunning, being judgmental, fear, and hate). Some may see this as a low blow but I will state a fact here and it is just that, a cold, hard fact. The church has committed the atrocity of disgusting sexual acts on minors and in most cases homosexual acts, which the fact that these acts are mostly homosexual is irrelevant next to the fact that they've taken advantage of minors, however in their own eyes, in their own views, homosexuality is A SIN. It is against the "rules" of the church to even have such a thought, never mind bring those thoughts to fruition and actually commit something so foul and taint an innocent life for the rest of its existence on this planet. I know some people who were touched as kids, in particular a very close relationship I once had. What some adult human being did to completely destroy an otherwise wonderful person makes me sick and the thought crosses my mind a lot. This poor person is so messed up in the head but so sweet when they're in the right place. Get them in the wrong place however and you are shown blackness that I'm just not capable of and it's clear where it came from. That person's life will forever be in the shadow of that incident(s) because someone felt the need to satisfy themselves in a forbidden (in any circle) way. There is a special place for these people, of this I am certain. There has never been a rash of underage homosexual incidents within the quantum physics community. Nor do we suicide bomb, or behead, or crusade, or hang, or burn. Which brings me to my next point.

In an attempt to steer away from religion (not to end that topic, speak freely trikers) this next point has to do with some of the "powers" of quantum physics. My next point is, you get back what you put out. It's such a simple concept and I'm sure most of you now are thinking "Well duh...", however if you pay attention in your day to day life the things you say and do and apply these concepts, you might be surprised at the kinds of habits you have. If you are an angry person and like confrontation then surely that is what you will attract. If you define yourself as unfortunate, unlucky, or down and out, you will undoubtedly attract these bouts of "unluckiness" in droves, as you get back what you put out. If you walk with your head down looking at the ground (many of you would be surprised at how often you do this!) then your thoughts go down, no bullshit. This is what's known as the "loser's limp". Walk with your head up, shoulders back, and chest out. Think about the future and what it is you want and desire and be happy knowing what's coming to you, all the while being excited at the surprises you don't even know about. This is a very, very abridged explanation on how to ascertain anything it is you desire out of life and manifest objects, desires, and situations that you want more than anything else. You get what you think about most of the time, and that doesn't mean most of the time you get what you think about. That means whatever you think about most that makes you smile and gives you chills, something that makes you feel good and would undoubtedly improve your life, if you think about that more than anything else and picture it as if you already have it or it's already happened and be excited in anticipation of your desire's arrival it will be drawn to you and you can manifest whatever "it" is out of thin air. I have done this more times in my life to even remember all of the occasions. Here are two examples-

The XR650L trike conversion. I watched Bob build that on here, I was one of the few guys following that thread. I saw it go up for sale for stupid money and waited. I think about two years had passed when it popped up on Ebay and I messaged the owner about a cash price. He said what he wanted and I had about a fifth of that money on me. I told him I'd be over in two days. There was a guy coming to my house the following day to look at my 82 XL500R that I had listed for months. I'd had multiple people come by and check it out but nobody wanted to commit. After finding out that two days from that point I could have that XL gone in favor of the XR trike I made a decision I was going to turn one into the other. I knew the night before the guy came for the XL it was going to sell this time, there was no doubt in my mind. Two days from the time I saw the ad on Ebay I was pulling the XR trike into my garage. I found out the price, knew it was right, and made it happen. Now this may not seem magical or extraordinary to the lovely people reading this, but this is no ordinary machine. It's a street legal three wheeler. This machine is as important to me as a woman would be (if I had one), and it made its way into my hands. I wasn't working steady at that point and was right on the cusp of cresting my shite wave and getting over it. The last thing I needed to do was spend money as I had been selling some of my belongings at that point, hence the XL having been posted for months prior. I already knew I was through the shite storm though and I knew it was all down hill from there. Because I knew it, then it was true. As a quick interruption, there is another point here. If you "know" something ahead of time, why is it surprising if it comes to fruition? If your truck falls off the jack when you're changing a tire and you say "I knew it" then guess whose fault it is the truck fell? Yours! If you know something is going to happen, it's much more likely it will because you are already thinking that and putting that vibe out. Many people have such a tough time with this but I promise it is true. You can absolutely effect the outcome of any given event, whether that be a positive or a negative event, using your thoughts ahead of time. Sound like magic? It's not. It's the law of attraction which as stated before is a law of nature, not a theory or a fable. The mere suggestion of a particular event is enough to bring it to life, so why would you focus on the negative when you can make good things happen? You go into the grocery store, "Oh this is gonna take forever". You go to work in the morning, "Oh today is going to suck". You hit traffic "I knew this was going to happen". I've got news for you- Yes it now will take forever, today will now suck for certain, and the traffic is there because you knew it would be. Don't take my word for it though, do some learning, research, and then come to your own conclusions. I'd highly suggest some material to steer you in the right direction if interested as I can only portray so much of this in a mere thread. I'm smart and educated to a degree, but there are those who know more than I do and know how to teach. Try saying "I'm curious what will occur in order to get me through this quickly", already suggesting you're going to breeze through the task. If you go to work in the morning and let's just go with worst case scenario here, you woke up on the wrong side of bed. Now instead of saying "This is gonna suck" try something like "I'm curious and excited to see what the universe has in store for me today". More often then not you'll be pleasantly surprised as to what the universe has for you. Start paying attention when these things make you smile and take into account how often it happens. Don't hold on to your shitty mood, let the smile that's breaking through run free! Once you've smiled take note how good it feels and remember what it is that made you feel that way, now let it consume you and show others your smile. Hand it off to them. Have a nice conversation, tell a joke, do a favor for someone, even complete strangers. It comes right back to you and it can change your life if you allow it to. Even if your life isn't bad, if you're happy as a pig in shite, this can only serve to improve your situation regardless of how good or bad you are already doing. There is no way you can lose.

Now, the other example I referred to... It's no secret that a year and a half ago my girl at the time and I broke up leaving me a hot mess and the fact that I already suffered from PTSD did not serve to help that situation. Well I didn't want her to go. I initially broke up with her then had a change of heart so at the end I did not want her gone. It was too late though. So then the depression and anxiety, the crazy downward spiral of my life, left my job, lost weight, stopped paying bills, no direction in life and didn't care... I made her something she never was in my mind. Well, she was that person actually, only half the time though. For a year I never stopped thinking of her and shame on me for doing so. She has been on my mind for 15 years though, so that's fairly engrained. For a year we didn't have contact at all, not once. Then, at the strike of a year, she came back to me. I never stopped thinking of her over that year. I dreamt of her and thought about her all the time, and then one day she came back. I had attracted her back to me by putting that vibration out at such a powerful frequency that the universe made it so, it brought her back to me. It was no coincidence that happened shortly after I had manifested the XR. At that time I had really started to get involved with quantum physics and hone my thoughts and skills. I was surprised to see her come back but at the same time I wasn't. Early last summer was the pinnacle edition Fabio, best condition of his life mentally, and this is why things such as these were falling in my lap. Not because I moped around kicking rocks or asked someone to do it for me if he/she saw me fit, because I really trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro wanted these things to happen and happen they did. Which brings me to my next point.

If this kind of material interests you, it is of the utmost importance that you learn to read the signs the universe is giving you. The universe knows the way which will best suit you and lead you to that which it is you desire, all you have to do is see the signs and follow them. Two very important fundamentals, YOU MUST REMEMBER THESE, there is no such thing as coincidence and everything happens for a reason, everything. If you go day to day always keeping in mind that there is no such thing as coincidence you will be amazed at the signs the universe gives you. If something happens to you that seems to be a "coincidence", the situation needs to be analyzed and you need to heighten your senses and see what you see, or see what is suggested to you. A "coincidence" is a clear sign the universe is trying to tell you something. Another sign the universe is speaking to you, deja vu. Whenever I have deja vu now I get excited (being excited for the future helps to assure that good things are coming!) because I know something has just happened to steer my future in one way or the other. Call me crazy if you want, but I know what I know and I know that things happen in my life after I have deja vu. Some days I have multiple occasions of deja vu. Signs can come in absolutely any manner, shape, or form though. Sometimes it may be so simple that it would be easy to miss, but the timing is just too perfect to ignore. I wish I had more examples to reference. This kind of stuff happens to me so often and some of it might seem so vague, but it's all in the perception. Some of it I might not even be able to explain. Anyhow, on my second go-around with my most recent ex, the universe gave me very clear red lights and told me very clearly that this (dating her again) was a bad idea and not my path. This was the first and hopefully only time that I ignored the universe and arrogantly thought that I could use my newly found "powers" to fight the universe and steer my destiny in the direction I wanted it to go, which included her in my future. Long story short, she was worse than the first time we dated, it didn't last long, it was probably just a waste of time, and now I'm left to wonder what I have in store after wasting a couple of months with her. Did I alter my destiny by not adhering to the signs? Does the universe have a backup plan or was this part of the plan all along? Not only did the universe tell me to stay away from her, but it also told me I had done the right thing once I got rid of her again. This kept a smile on my face which is foremost and number one, always find a reason to smile, always. I was smiling not long after it happened and what do you think happens from there? If I started with a smile, do you think those smiles are going to lessen? Do you think I'll be frowning soon? No and no. I will only smile more thereby attracting more reasons to smile thereby smiling more... You see where this is going?


Do you believe as though you are a superior human being who is better than us all because you study quantum physics? That was my interpretation of your opinion and I apologize if I have misunderstood.

Absolutely not. I wish you all studied it. I do feel as though I have a "leg up" on those who do not understand what I do, but if you don't know what you're missing then you don't even know you're missing anything. We are all superior beings, just not many of us know it. Society is set up to keep us poor, sick, docile, and addicted to drugs. Those who choose to live with these tethers are free to do so and those who would rather play with Twitter and Facebook or listen to the rules imposed on them by society (church included) can live within their made up world and completely miss the real world going on in front of their face. I feel as though becoming aware of your existence, of learning what it is that's going on all around you and inside of you can enrich anyone's life to a degree that it's silly for me to imagine someone not wanting to do so. Distractions, distractions, rules, distractions. We were not put on this earth to be subjected to such things but society has made it extremely difficult to get by without partaking at least to some extent.

Your apology is accepted, which brings us to the next subject- Never apologize when an apology is not due. It is commonplace now for people to apologize entirely too much in every day life. You are sorry for what? For speaking your mind and attempting to get your point across? For having a counter point to my point which is what I invited the community to do? If you speak as though you're sorry, you will make yourself subservient. Any person who knows this (I'm not the only one) will pick up on this instantly and the wrong person can have an advantage over you in many situations, all the while you didn't even know you had said "I'm sorry" because you're so used to saying it. Even in regular conversation, let's say you're telling someone a story about your friend's car that had a pallet fall from a crane on it essentially totaling the vehicle. You say to the person "I'm sorry but he just shouldn't have parked there." Why are you sorry? He's the one who parked there. Seriously though, no apologies necessary.


Now since I'm not sitting here trying to force my opinion down anyone's throat, I'm not going to go into detail about my beliefs.

The old me who jumped to conclusions would have thought this might be in reference to me, but I know enough now to never assume anything, ever.


I am only posting to say I didn't have time to read all of this, but I am very interested in your viewpoint as I have looked into this subject alot recently. After I get home this is for sure on my to do list :) I forsee a long conversation in the river on an early June morning in Indiana. Thank you for bringing this up, I think it can lead to great insight from other members

Consider it a date!


The "Big-Bang" has not been proven

Jon I'm going to look into that. This is something I should know for as long as I've been studying. One of the problems I've run into is the sheer volume of information being tough to digest. All of the information I get is reviewed over and over, provided it's audio or video. What I need to do is read more. I had that book that you saw me with at Trikefest, but that got left at my ex's before I could finish it. I need to get another copy. However, the series hosted by Dr Neil deGrasse Tyson I have watched and listened to at least two dozen times, and I watch all of my material over and over. I am determined to learn as much as I possibly can, and every time I watch or listen to this material I learn something else, which means I have to watch it again, and so on.

I feel as though you may be incorrect, but I will hold off on making that statement until I have proof. This thread is great in the sense that I can now discuss these things as well as find new information or punctuate information I already had in order to retain it. I will find an answer for this, thank you.


and there are way too many inconsistencies and flaws to say that evolution is the "creator".

This is unequivocally incorrect and if I need to find proof for this as well I will. I cannot quote anyone in particular at this time or link the proof, but I can assure you that statement is wrong. Quantum physics is about facts, truth, and proof, and if I say you're wrong I will back that up or eat my words so we shall revisit this.

Thank you all for the replies as I truly enjoy discussing this subject. I literally have nobody to discuss this with and I am really digging the wheels that are getting up to speed in my head again as I took a bit of a foray whilst with my ex to (attempt to) enjoy the gift god has graced us with known as "women". I was happier when it was quantum physics and myself, so a woman who fits into this particular lifestyle will be a necessity or she won't be at all. I know the latter is an impossibility though. Some of you might want to know how I know this. Simple. I already know the universe has a woman for me, that much I know, so it shall be.

I thought I was done but I just reminded myself of another point. Never ask "how". Your wheel falls off your truck that has 250k on it and is on its last leg. You wanted to get a new truck in a year or so, but this one ain't gonna make it. You need a new truck now. "How am I ever going to get a new truck?" "How will I pay for this truck with my meager salary?" "How am I ever going to get ahead?". If you stop asking how you will find out in short order that things just seem to fall into place. Sure, it's not without effort from you, but if you worry about things all the time then you will constantly be stressed and you will inevitably once again draw towards you what it is you least desire. "Frig, I gotta go to the dentist next Tuesday. I hate the dentist!" So from now until next Tuesday you'll worry about that and dread it. You think about it and scowl knowing you have that appointment coming. A week and a half go by before you know it and you've been all bent out of shape in the meantime, and now you've drawn all sorts of shite situations your way with your obsessing over downtrodden thoughts and situations. Yes we all have bad times to deal with, but don't define yourself by that. Deal with it when you can and move on when it's over. Don't dwell on the past, forgive and forget and pay attention to what's in front of you because it is YOU who is steering this life. Only you know where you want this life to go and only you can steer it that way. The universe will tell you when it's time to make a turn.

And also, never, ever hate anyone or anything. Lose that word from your vocabulary altogether. Nobody wants to be hated, and guess what you're attracting every time you use that word? I don't use the word, plain and simple. This may not seem like much, but if you think about everything I've suggested none of them do. However add them all up, and now you've got something. You've got a foundation onto which you can build a house, any house you choose.

So once again thank you all and I hope at least some of you are picking down what I'm putting up. I do realize it's a tough subject to follow and some concepts may sound a bit wacky, but you can't argue with results. That's what it took for me anyways.

[thestud25]

There is in fact proven mutations, but there are just that. In fact devolution of species has not only been noted but proven. To believe in evolution unequivocally is just as big of a stretch as belie in "God" or a single creator. Science has proven at least up to this point that you cannot create matter, you can only change it. Since the big bang has not been proven one must have the same faith in that and evolution as someone else has in God. I will post some links to devolution when I'm back at a pc and not my phone.

[fabiodriven]

Yes thank you Jon, I'd like to find out more about this. I've not heard of the term "devolution" prior to this.

[clmeue37]

My comment referring to the shoving of beliefs down people's throats was definitely not aimed at you Fabio. I wanted to be sure you knew that was not my intention. I also know that it's not your intention to try and force quantum physics down our throats either. I read your post knowing that I wasn't going to agree with everything you had written but I was curious.

Man you like to write! I can tell that you're very passionate about this topic. I made one observation while I was reading the "second chapter" that is post #9 of this thread. Each time you referred to "the universe" I took a moment and replaced it in my head with "God". I think we're on a similar path, I just happen to attribute the signs and the events to God.

[Mosh]

The problem with actual true religous facts is that man has twisted trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro around for so long that 99.999% is all wrong and decieving. And the biggest mistake is letting someone else stand there and read a book to you that is jumping from page to page while interjecting thier own ideas to it..

Not having control over ones life existence or ultimate ending, is a thought many people cant grasp and it down right frightens them.. Most sane People are all resistent to dying, or afraid of the unkown, so they either cling to a savior or idea of savior, or a belief in science, to procure some type of future existence or gain some type of comfort knowing there is things that are just not controllable... or even unexplainable.
I see people that try to interject their beliefs just as hard as the bible thumpers.

Religous/idealists/evolutionists and theorists people, only bother me when they start thumping the book they believe in and shove it down my throat..Wheter it be a book of theories/ man made studies, or biblical stories...man kind has made it for thousands of years much better off back then with limited man made info, than mankind is doing now with every stinking expert having a self injected opinion and 10 million places to write about it. Look at how fast things have changed just since the invention of the printing press. It was mere seconds ago in the time line of all of human existence....


A man convinced against his will is of his own opinion still..

[thestud25]

Yes thank you Jon, I'd like to find out more about this. I've not heard of the term "devolution" prior to this.

This term is used across many things unfortunately. It even refers to political turnarounds etc. It can also be referred to as "Reverse Evolution" "Evolution Reversal" "Backwards Evolution" etc.

One could say that "Devolution" is merely evolution taking a different course to suit the best environmental survival. However, one can surmise that when a species reverts back to a ancestral form that it is in fact reversing evolution or devolving. Here are a few articles and a research paper that cover these points and bring to light that not all species are "going forward" in terms of evolution.

http://www.usdbiology.com/porter/PDF%27s/portertree03.pdf

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1461236/pdf/10978293.pdf

[Mickey Dunlap]

There is such a war that goes on in me, my will VS. Gods will. I didn't want to go to Washington state when my Dad died a month ago on the 24th. My Dad hated me talking about Jesus, he would tell me to shut the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad: That's a very hurtful thing to hear from your own Dad when you are only trying to show him the greatest love in all the world. I didn't go out there very often just because I had to tip toe around him because he had so much hate towards God. There was a big war between me and God to go out there this time too, but I gave in because He wouldn't give me any peace about not going, and I knew something big was going to happen out there. I didn't know if he was going to move me back out there to take care of my Mom or what, but I told my wife I had to go and something big is going to happen so be ready for it and pray about it before I got on the plane.

When I first got there it was peace full for the first time between the whole family, a relief in away that he died. That's a sad thing to think about, but that's the truth. I went to the assisted living place to talk to the people that were around him at the end. The main lady wasn't there that day so I came back the next day to talk to her. She said about what I thought she would say, she said he scared the hell out of her at first, he was just not very nice, but in the end something changed. I had prayed when he was put into this place that someone would touch his harden heart and show him the love of Christ. Turns out this lady was a born again Christian. I had wrote my Dad a letter about a year ago since I could never get the whole truth out to him in words face to face. I know I got the truth to him and by faith I believe his heart was changed before he past. Something had changed in him. My youngest sister would never go see him with out my Mom going with her, in the last month she seen the change in him I never got to see, but she said he was so nice to be around like she had never seen before, and for the first time they had the best time she had ever had with him!:cool:

This same sister paid for me to go out there, she said "I need my big brother out here!" That's the way God works, He provides all your needs! I didn't want to go, but I needed to. One night we were all at a soccer game watching all the grand kids play, at the end of the night my same sister asked if we could get together and pray because she didn't know how to. It shocked me a little as I seen tears in her eyes. :cry: So she came over to my Moms on the 31st about noon. I thought she just wanted to pray about Dad because we didn't have a service for him because he donated his body to the university of Seattle. She said something was missing in her life and it had been bugging her for over a year. I ended up sharing The Good News of Christ with her and ask her if she wanted to pray to except Christ into her heart, she started crying and said YES!:w00t::w00t: That's what it's all about!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Nothing more then God working on someone's heart, not pushing it on anyone just letting God do His thing, but she knew I had the answer and she wanted to know the TRUTH!:) After we kneeled down with my Mom too and prayed we were all crying and rejoicing. :cry::D:w00t: Then I told her that she should pick a VS. in the bible of this date so she would always remember this day, then it hit me, it was Halloween! :lol: Take that satan! I told her she just put the Happy in Halloween!:w00t:

I have the same war go on each day inside me, some days it with God wanting me to do something like today writing this (because I don't want to) and other days it's a war with satan because I did do the will of God. No one want's to come on here and get bashed, disliked and put down, but sometime we have to do things that are against our own flesh.

This is really all there is to say. After 22 years of praying for my family I seen some thing happen because I was willing to be put down by my own family. So I am also willing to take all the crap on here too.

This is the facts and the only truth that you will ever read that matters. It is the most important thing you will ever hear.


**The first step to salvation is to realize that we are all sinners:

Romans 3:10 (KJV)

As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:23 (KJV)

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;



**Next, you must know that because of sin there must be a price paid:

Romans 6:23 (KJV)

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.



**This price can be paid by you with an eternity in Hell, or you can accept the price that Jesus paid for your sin:

Romans 5:8 (KJV)

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.



**To accept Jesus’ payment for your sin simply call on His name and ask Him to forgive your sins and save you:

Romans 10:9-13 (KJV)

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. [10] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. [11] For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. [12] For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. [13] For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.



*****If you are ready to accept Jesus Christ as your personal Savior, take time right now to pray, confessing your sin and asking Him to come into your heart and save you.



When you accept Jesus, He is faithful to do what He said He would - He forgives you and saves you.

1 John 5:13 (KJV)

These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

[fabiodriven]

Jonathon, I was boning up on the whole "big bang" thing last night but I fell asleep. Not because I was bored mind you, just a long day. Many days I fall asleep to lectures of this sort. I think I will have some interesting information for you when I have the time to research more, tomorrow is Thanksgiving. Happy Thanksgiving everyone! I don't have time to look at the devolution stuff right now either but I will and thank you again.

Mickey my condolences on the loss of your father. I hope you're handling it as best as can be expected.


There is such a war that goes on in me, my will VS. Gods will.


There was a big war between me and God


My Dad hated me talking about Jesus,


I didn't go out there very often just because I had to tip toe around him because he had so much hate towards God.


There was a big war between me and God to go out there this time too,


I have the same war go on each day inside me,


and other days it's a war with satan because I did do the will of God.

Boy you sure have a lot of battles going on inside of you. You are mentally prepared for combat at all times. Being prepared for combat is great if you're planning on fighting, but life does not need to be that hard. Five mentions of war and two of hate in a post that's about a third of the size of just one of my two big posts. So that leaves you dwelling on seven different points of negativity (at least) and me with none. That's a very strong seven times the anger in a post 1/6th the size of what I've written.

I don't have battles inside of me, I have smiles and love. I have excitement for what's to come and life is my canvas to paint how I see fit. I'm not sure how anyone wouldn't recognize how much war circles around religion. You can attempt to explain it away about how "It's not like that" or whatever, but the reality is there are wars going on in this particular instance. I don't know how it could be any more clear. I'd suggest replacing all these wars with good will from your heart, not Jesus's heart or whatever. Be happy and do what's right and have some tolerance for the other people on the planet. How someone can be so overwhelmingly intolerant of another person yet push their own personal agenda so very forcefully down everyone's throats is beyond me. That's like being one-way times two. I don't know how you'd do it, but if you could possibly be more one-way it's been figured out. Apologies if I sound a bit suggestive there, I really don't aim to convert anyone. I know plenty of religious people and it is what it is, doesn't matter. My closest friend in this whole new education I've been working on, the only person I talk to about this stuff, is a religious man and he goes to church. He's not into the quantum physics whatsoever, but we're both really big on the power of positive thinking and the art of manifestation. We study the same material in that realm, but I have quantum physics and he has religion. He's a very close and good friend.


some days it with God wanting me to do something like today writing this (because I don't want to)

If you didn't want to write that then why did you? Are you not proud of your words? Do you foresee a battle? Why make a fight with your imaginary friend? If I had someone I made up in my head you can bet we'd never fight. I'm about the easiest person you could find to get along with so long as you're honest and your intentions good. I'm aces in both of those departments so my imaginary friend either would be as well or he'd be gone. Why keep someone around who isn't great company? If you guys are going at it so much, what good is he to have around? This is no BS, I'm smiling right now as I have been for quite some time regardless of what is going on around me. I cried last week at Roy's wake, but it was good to see Steve and Big Mike and to also be there for Roy's widow Nicole. There really isn't a whole lot of positive you can focus on in a situation such as that, but it is still there. I'm not crazy about my job right now, I'm not rich, no women, but there are no battles going on in my life whatsoever. I much prefer things that way, but that's just me. To each their own.


My Dad hated me talking about Jesus, he would tell me to shut the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad:

This is something that needs to be said. When you constantly try to force your beliefs down other peoples' throats in the manner that you do Mickey, you must go into that conversation expecting people to react that way. When I talk to people regardless of what it is we're discussing, if it gets to the point I'm offending them I stop if I'm aware I'm doing so. You just won't shut the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro up with the Jesus stuff and it gets really, really old really, really fast. If people don't want to hear it and you continue, you are offending them. It is not OK to offend other people in the name of god or a religion. It is silly and unfair that religion gets the special sort of tolerance it gets and is allowed special privileges when discussed. For example- In the thread about medical Marijuana we got completely spammed by your Jesus bomb and it's ludicrous that no action was taken against you for doing so. Do you know why no action was taken? Because it was in the name of Jesus and the powers that be on here either agree with your view or were to fearful to take action on a topic having to do with religion. If you had done exactly the same thing and written all of those off topic posts about cheeseburgers or lawnmowers they would have been deleted and you may have gotten time off for it, but because it's about religion you can get away with it. Why? Because religion is good? Because God is great? Or because we're all too scared to step on each others toes? Take your pic, doesn't matter really. My point is for someone who's supposed to be so selfless and peaceful you seem to exude war, hate, spite, favoritism, and entitlement. Not to mention you enjoy offending your fellow man even after you're asked nicely to please stop. The reason why you deal with so many people getting on your case for your religion is because you are the one bringing it to the table all the time, so you have no one to blame for the reactions you get but yourself. If Joe Blow from down the block likes talking about Jesus then give him a call and have a blast. If you can't tell it's too much BEFORE the point someone asks you to stop, then your skills of perception could probably use some honing and to be safe, only if you decide you no longer want to offend everyone, shut the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro up about Jesus.

As stated, I am not interested in converting anyone nor am I looking for recruits. I'm more sharing information with those who may be interested and attempting to have a discussion for the benefit of all. I need to discuss this subject more and have far too few outlets. As always, if anyone is interested in the subject of which I speak, I'll gladly share any and all info I have. I don't intend on this entire thread being about religion but it is obviously a part of it. As I said Jon, I'm going to look at your links and some other material before I post again on that subject. Thank you.

[clmeue37]

it`s so perfect and we`re here for such short time enjoy it while you can !

You hit the nail on the head with that one glamy! :) I just turned 28 a few weeks ago and I got to realizing that time isn't going to stand still. I'm going to make my life here on earth as amazing as I can and enjoy every single minute.

[fabiodriven]

The first step to salvation is to realize that we are all sinners:

Romans 3:10 (KJV)

As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Romans 3:23 (KJV)

For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Speak for yourself. I'm not speaking for you so don't try to speak for me. I'm a genuinely good person that always has good intentions. You're not going to tell me I'm a sinner so keep that to yourself. Name calling is actually against the rules of the forum.


**Next, you must know that because of sin there must be a price paid:

Romans 6:23 (KJV)

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Bullshit. I haven't done anything wrong and I'm not repenting for having done nothing other than good. You sound like a woman now. You can go grovel and cry about all the messed up stuff you're doing, but I'll just keep doing good things and improve upon this world and smile while I do it. I don't owe anybody any apologies right now and I won't be made to feel as though I do for no reason. Such an archaic way of thinking, so simple and silly.


**This price can be paid by you with an eternity in Hell, or you can accept the price that Jesus paid for your sin:

Romans 5:8 (KJV)

But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

This part I understand. It's called threats and extortion. "Play by my rules or else" is essentially what that says. Conform to my rules and bow down. I have a response for that. How's trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro you sound?

[Mickey Dunlap]

Happy Thanks giving!:w00t: http://www.intouch.org/broadcast/today-on-radio

[briano]

Good read Fabio, I have to sit and read through a bit better when I have time but I usually enjoy your exceptionally long posts. I could never type that much without forgetting what I was trying to say. Lol

Mickey, take your God and start a religious forum. I'm quite sure that many people are tired of God showing up in all of your posts lately. I appreciate your opinion but it is getting to be like a church sermon here. Also sorry about your dad but you should know that's what god wanted, and your brother suffering, god wants that too. So there's something to think about. Also, why does god make a grown man rape and kill young Children, what kind of person would want that.

[Billy Golightly]

I believe in God for the simple reason that I know I'm too dumb to be able to learn and understand anything and everything that goes on, and for the reasons which it does.

Doesn't stop me from trying to, but the shear complexity of many different things in life, and the relative insignificance we are in the grand scheme of things is so mind boggling, I just dont personally see chance or randomness creating that, no matter how much time was involved. There will always be more knowledge than we can understand and questions that we cannot answer. For everything that we "solve", we produce more unknowns. We solved gravity and learned about atomics. We "solved" atomic physics, but we learned about quantum physics in the process. When we solve quantum physics, something else will be unknown from that. Knowledge is not a finite resource, and infinity is a sign of God (to me, anyways).


I've been a close follower of Ayn Rand's objectivist philosophy for about 5 years now - and while she was an adamant athiest I think she got that part wrong. One thing that I do agree with on that line is that collectivism in organized religion (and anywhere else!!) is a terrible terrible thing. The individual and our ability to accomplish, our creativity, autonomy, our freedom to make either poor or good decision, when it was written in the Bible that man was created in God's image - these are things that i recognize as being necessary to create us and our environment but that we also posses to a lesser degree in ourselves. So I guess you could call me a Christian-Objectivist, which the masses on either side of those names would scream bloody murder blasphemy at them being hyphenated in the same sentence, but it works for me.


2
: emphasis on collective rather than individual action or identity

The most evil that there is, right there ^^^^


Thanks for sharing John.



tldr; Knowledge is infinite, infinity is by definition unmeasurable. God = unmeasurable.

[Mickey Dunlap]

That's great Bill, you are go in the right direction. Matthew 7:7 Ask, and it shall be given you, seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be open unto you:

7:8 For everyone that asketh receiveth; and he the seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

Prverbs 3:5 Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 3:6 In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

Proverbs 1:7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.

205217

[sledcrazyinCT]

Thanks for the link to Krause....I appreciate you sharing that Fabio...only thing I would find reason to respond for debate is I believe the main reason any species is on earth is to procreate.
Not sure why marriage is an unnatural act? Many species adopt a family structure.....humans call it marriage or civil union or whatever but people are meant to interact and not isolate themselves from one other.

I edited my comments as they had nothing to do with quantum physics and religion is a POV that has some relevance in this discussion

[ironchop]

I`m not wise enough to claim I know anything as fact so I must let my observations serve me. I don`t claim to be an atheist or a believer. I am just Man looking to find Peace and his way through this plane of existence

I`ve seen The Secret twice thanks to my wife. We don`t have a dream board but we try to employ some of the ideas. A lot of good points in there. I also loosely follow Wayne Dyer on PBS talks. I`ve also read the Bible. Many excellent lessons and teachings there as well.

my OBSERVATIONS:

1) Religion has a place in modern society because a whole lot of people cannot seem to be empathetic, courteous, honorable, peaceful, loving, or respectful without being threatened with burning in Hell for Eternity. On the other hand, its (religion) useful deployment is frequently derailed and used as an excuse to maim, kill, enslave, disrespect, and rape other people. Any passage of any book can be interpreted any number of ways to suit the ideology of the reader. The Bible has been no exception

2) I don`t understand why many Christians don`t believe in Evolution, Alien life forms, or dinosaurs in some cases. Seems Blasphemous to me or at least arrogant in the least to think that, You mortal Man, knows a damn thing about the capabilities or intentions of The Creator and that he/she didn`t intend for species to evolve in order to adapt to changing circumstances. The best explanation I have heard from "believers" is that "god would have told us about all that in The Book"........I beg to differ. The Bible lays out many lessons and instructions for Mankind. Mankind can`t seem to master the art of being a good Christian as described in the confines of the good book and therefore isn`t ready for True Knowledge. The New Testament basically describes the act of Unconditional Love as being the Salvation of our species and yet, our sinful, envious, and jealous selves cannot comprehend true unconditional love for mankind. Why in the hell would they be trusted with higher knowledge of things when they can`t process or outright fail to implement the instructions they were provided initially? To say God didn`t create Evolution and other such inconceivable things is very dangerous for people who think they know Him enough to dare to assume they know the scope or the motives of such a magnificent creator. And yet, I hear this arrogance and self-righteousness quite regularly lately. Just because you read God`s Cliff notes as recorded by second and third hand authors does not an expert on God make you. You need to check yourself if you honestly think you know much of anything about an Entity whom is so much more advanced, skilled, and omnipotent than anything a mere mortal can comprehend. Anyone who claims otherwise is bound for Hell by the rules of their own religion. IMO God, as described in the OT, is just as capable of making perfect beings as he is of making things that he decides to "tweak" later in Man`s Timeline

3) I have observed the Laws of Attraction in action and almost failsafe for many decades. In other words, Like attracts like. Negativity begats negativity and Positivity attracts the same. Miserable people tend to always have miserable and tragic things happen to them. Charlie Brown and his shadow raincloud being a fine allegorical example of this. How many assholes do you know whom practice the Art of Assholery and are ultimately successful and happy? I believe there are cosmic forces in action that are interconnected with our actions and even our feelings. I seem to be very adept at manipulating my own world into whatever mood I happen to be in on any given day and I do it subconsciously.

4) where the Bible and I part ways is where punishing Sin is something left for the Afterlife as opposed to the notion of Kharma which is that you receive punishment and therefore, life lessons, much earlier than after your physical demise. I see a lot of people get their "comeuppance" for past transgressions much more so that I witness people whom never have to pay for their actions. I also disagree with much dogma. What can you expect though from books that have been "translated" and "interpreted" by millions of "expert Christians" for thousands of years coupled with the fact that alliteration, metaphor, and literalism are all three often misunderstood or completely ignored altogether?

5) I know what I know and I don`t pretend to know what I can`t understand. I don`t need the promise that Christ will return for me or threats of Hellfire and Damnation to keep me on the right path for humanity. I love, I forgive, I try not to judge, I don`t kill, I don`t steal, I try to do no harm to anyone lest they try and harm myself or my family. I was born knowing right from wrong and I try and live righteous without religion. It works for me regardless of the opinions of the "experts". Most of all, I don`t attack as wrong the beliefs of others because , again, it insinuates that I`m a self-righteous and arrogant prick who dares think that I am the epitomy of righteous behavior. I can`t go wrong as long as I pursue HUMILITY as well as the other virtues of being a good citizen.

6) Nobody has proven nor disproven anything. Merely telling me to believe for any reason....Science, Religion, Metaphysics, Philosophy,etc.....doesn`t fly with me as I can name examples of MANY wrongs and misinterpretations by ALL the aforementioned. I go with what I know and with what my gut (conscience) tells me. I don`t believe in "authority". Of all the missteps Mankind has taken, I can`t fathom why humans still pretend to know something they can`t possibly know.

7) Human Enlightenment is currently impossible until our species stops de-evolving, hones our critical thinking skills, learns to embrace ideas we have been told to shun, and stops being entertained or distracted by the most petty and worthless stimuli. We aren`t ready for Real Knowledge and I hazard a guess that we are still 1000 years away. Our collective IQ isn`t enough to comprehend The Big Bang, String Theory, and other complex explanations of Quantum theories. We would rather have a couple MIT nerds hash that out, take their word for it, and continue watching people give each other concussions, backstab for Survival, plot to get laid, have a dance-off for a disco ball, and engage in the most primal of human behaviors....no need for higher thinking and enlightenment when you have a bigger penis and a fantasy football team to entertain you.

I like my path. Mine isn`t for everyone and I`m not going to pretend to think it`s even the right path. All I do know is that I try and live like a loving and compassionate being and teach my children to do the same. I guess I`m saying that my beliefs are kind of an amalgam of many different systems and the doctrines that overlap from each of these systems are the doctrines I try to focus on. Most religions share the same beliefs and it`s the dogma that has confused and confounded.

Otherwise, I fully respect the beliefs of others as their own personal life journey and don`t pretend to know who`s righteous and who is bound for Hell

[fabiodriven]

The "Big-Bang" has not been proven,

I did some research on this which brought me back to some things I had learned about previously and reminded me about research I had seen. I was reminded of "quarks", "the god particle", "the Higgs particle", and the research being conducted to attempt to prove the big bang theory. After this discussion began, I watched this first-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_MFhAoUUmQ

This video might lead one to believe scientists are well on their way to proving the big bang theory correct or may have in fact already done it, however after being left with some questions I decided to look into things a bit more. This is what I found-

http://creation.com/has-the-big-bang-been-proved

This discusses the exact subject addressed in the video posted above, however it has a very different conclusion. It is basically saying nothing has been proven as of yet and the experiments taking place in order to prove the big bang theory are being advertised as being more successful than they actually are/were. The long and short is you would appear to be correct, the big bang theory has not yet been proven.

In regards to "reverse evolution", I read your link having to do with that. From what I can gather, reverse evolution only seems to shore up the walls of the evolution argument. Put very simply, reverse evolution has to do with the phenomenon of species that "devolve" by influence of their environment. In other words, a species of fish who have moved deeper and deeper into a cave over generations and in turn no longer needs eyes or pigment on its skin. What happens is the species "devolves", or loses those features it no longer needs but at the same time can have other features that would be more useful strengthen or increase in size. I'm not sure what your position was one way or the other on this subject Jonny, but to me that just proves that evolution is indeed able to shape creatures the way we are shaped without the assistance of some divine institution. If someone or something were to have interjected in the making of "us", my answer to that would be aliens far before a god. They would be the gods, so to speak.


Good read Fabio, I have to sit and read through a bit better when I have time but I usually enjoy your exceptionally long posts. I could never type that much without forgetting what I was trying to say. Lol

Mickey, take your God and start a religious forum. I'm quite sure that many people are tired of God showing up in all of your posts lately. I appreciate your opinion but it is getting to be like a church sermon here. Also sorry about your dad but you should know that's what god wanted, and your brother suffering, god wants that too. So there's something to think about. Also, why does god make a grown man rape and kill young Children, what kind of person would want that.

Thank you for posting and thanks for the compliments. Mickey is OK to post what he chooses. I brought up the subject of religion and someone who is into religion surely would have a lot to say after reading my posts and they are free to do so. However I would agree the religious stuff he posts outside of this thread can be very annoying.


Thanks for the link to Krause....I appreciate you sharing that Fabio...only thing I would find reason to respond for debate is I believe the main reason any species is on earth is to procreate.
Not sure why marriage is an unnatural act? Many species adopt a family structure.....humans call it marriage or civil union or whatever but people are meant to interact and not isolate themselves from one other.

I edited my comments as they had nothing to do with quantum physics and religion is a POV that has some relevance in this discussion

Thanks for the reply. I might agree with you on the marriage and procreation thing. I was thinking about that not long after I had posted initially and I feel as though I wouldn't mind being married which made me think about what I wrote. What I meant is, man is programmed to procreate with as many mates as possible, that's just how we're geared. However, there are plenty of species other than man that mate for life and have long term relationships and families. If it occurs in nature, that's enough for me. Another thing that occurs naturally in species outside of human beings, long term homosexual relationships. Think about that one, haha.

I'm glad you changed your comment sledcrazy, I was going to say something about that. :-)

[trike savior]

keep in mind Fabio as you are going through all the information. there are not really any facts or proven things in science. only theories with proof and that is the beautiful thing about science, that anything is always up for debate. there are many theories that are widely accepted by the scientific community, so you could call it facts, but if any evidence came forth to disprove a theory, it is reviewed and changes made accordingly. keep in mind there are some widely accepted theories that some scientists do not accept. Heck, there are still some scientists trying to disprove climate change.

"what the bleep do we know" was one of my favorites when a friend showed it to me a few years ago. an eye opener for sure. anyone that has not watched it should give it a serious look.

as I stated during our last conversation that was closed, I am not religious but know the bible cover to cover. K-8 in a Lutheran school I got into science and mainly history in high school and college. So, I agree with most of everything you have to say. I never got to respond to some of the rants of a fellow member so I will use this chance to respond.

I said there have been more people killed in the name of religion than religion it has ever helped. an estimated 3,000,000 people died during the crusades. not to mention the countless other attempted forced conversions that led to entire civilizations being wiped out. the thirty years war killed an estimated 11,500,000. and that's just 2 wars in the name of Christ. (those are the high side estimates) When you start looking at wars of other religions it makes these numbers miniscule. the amount of people that have died fighting for the holy land, across the tries of all the various religions, are incalculable.

lets also not forget the catholic church killed and threatened death to many scientists who had new and bright ideas.

most religions are a good bunch of morals and rules to live your life by. nothing wrong with that until you try to oppress the thoughts and beliefs of others, which many religions do. this is my main problem with religion. anytime you involve man, who is imperfect and inherently greedy, in something that has the hearts and minds of so many people, they will bend the truth to serve their own agenda. that being my problem with popes, cardinals, pastors and so on. Not to mention the fact that the bible itself was written by man, Jesus was a man during his time on earth.

anyone remember how the catholic church raised funds by inventing purgatory? A place you go before the afterlife and the living could shorten the time the dead spent there with donations to the church.

All this being said I do believe in a "creator". God is the English term for the deity of a culture so if that's what you want to call it, fine. I believe the big bang created our universe and others. Evolution got the human race to where we are today. But no one can answer where matter came from or the universe's that pre-date our own. I basically mean there is no explanation of how it all started, why there is a place for the "Big Bang" to take place.

I do believe in an after life. for one reason that some may find ridiculous. My Father's mother was not the church going type or preachy, though she did beg for "the good lord" to just take her after my grandfather died and things got rough near the end. my father is also not religious but asked his mother near the end for a sign "IF" there was an afterlife. I never knew this until later but even I saw the sign. At the family summer home they purchased, there were 3 trees down by the lake that completely blocked our view of the lake from the house. as long as I can remember, she said she hated those trees and wanted them gone but could not afford to have them removed. Grandma died in the fall after we had closed up the house. when we went up to open in the spring, those 3 trees were laying on the ground without doing any damage to anything. Yes they were taken out by a storm but I like to think it was her taking care of business and giving us a sign.

so I do have some beliefs, but none of them having to do with any certain book. I feel I am free-er than those who are bound by the rules of a deity. I am free to do as I please and believe what I choose without fear of eternal damnation. when I "pray" for something it is not to the father of Jesus Christ, or Allah, or the Buddah, but to the force that is responsible for all that we encounter in this short life.

[6speedthumper]

We all exist in the computer programmed world, known as, The Matrix. There, problem solved.

[Billy Golightly]

This nicely sums up what I was trying to get across in my post with words better than I could at that moment.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

[El Camexican]

Also, why does god make a grown man rape and kill young Children, what kind of person would want that.

I have yet to read all these great posts and toss my own controversial $0.02 in, but for the moment this one sentence is, well I'm just going to say I don't like it. To say that anyone's version of a divine being would permit those acts is no different than saying trikes hurt and kill people. If Mr. Dunlop, or anyone else wants to add their beliefs to a post who are any of us to say it's wrong? Just skip over it and move on or argue them if you want, but not with a comment like this. Beliefs are as individual as we are and both should be tolerated and respected.

Great post Fab, lets hope everyone can behave well enough that it doesn't get closed.

[Mickey Dunlap]

I have yet to read all these great posts and toss my own controversial $0.02 in, but for the moment this one sentence is, well I'm just going to say I don't like it. To say that anyone's version of a divine being would permit those acts is no different than saying trikes hurt and kill people. If Mr. Dunlop, or anyone else wants to add their beliefs to a post who are any of us to say it's wrong? Just skip over it and move on or argue them if you want, but not with a comment like this. Beliefs are as individual as we are and both should be tolerated and respected.

Great post Fab, lets hope everyone can behave well enough that it doesn't get closed.


That's what I always wonder, why people get so mad if they don't believe in Jesus?:wondering If it's all just a fairy tail why would you get made about it?:wondering

I don't see anyone getting mad about Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny, which are fairy tails masking the real meaning of the holidays.

Why does the name "Jesus" bug people so much that they can't just pass over it?

[fabiodriven]

That's what I always wonder, why people get so mad if they don't believe in Jesus?:wondering If it's all just a fairy tail why would you get made about it?:wondering

I don't see anyone getting mad about Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny, which are fairy tails masking the real meaning of the holidays.

Why does the name "Jesus" bug people so much that they can't just pass over it?

It wouldn't matter if his name were Jim or Paul. When you hear it enough it gets old.

[clmeue37]

Also, why does god make a grown man rape and kill young Children, what kind of person would want that.

That's not what God wants and He isn't the one making it happen. I believe that satan is the root of the evil in this world. God gave us free will and when satan tempts us we can choose how to react to that temptation. It's far easier for people these days to blame God and deny Him than it is to admit that they made the decision to commit such a sickening act. I believe Fabio referred to free will in one of his posts as well. It's a wonderful and dangerous thing.

[kaymo]

i only read the first post and a few of the posts on the first page, but i have to say:

Fabio, i used to think you were a complete asshole. now i think while you MIGHT still be an asshole, you seem to be a pretty smart one that has many of my same likes, thoughts, and opinions. We have had negative words for each other in the past and i regret that because i think we would get along quite well, as i am an asshole too :D

I can definitely relate to the crippling anxiety and depression brother, some people dont understand how it can literally be crippling. they say stupid things like "you have to pull yourself up by your bootstraps" (have you ever tried this? its physically impossible) or "just dont think that way, just dont feel that way" when its not a choice to think or feel anxiety and depression. if it were then nobody would choose it. One's personal decisions certainly will effect our anxiety and depression and positive thinking is definitely a good start to working your way out of it, but it takes good people good friends and family that understand that will support you and stand behind or even better beside you thru your darker days.


anyway, im glad you posted this, im glad i read it, and i hope our past childish arguments stay in the past and we can have some good positive discussions in the future.

[Mickey Dunlap]

It wouldn't matter if his name were Jim or Paul. When you hear it enough it gets old.

Really! I don't see anyone ever saying anything about any other name.:wondering:wondering

Stop talking about "Jim", if you want to talk about him take it somewhere else!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad: :lol::lol::lol::lol:

[Mickey Dunlap]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7t-uAozvQ8&noredirect=1

[Mr. Clean]

What difference does it make

-------------->205255

[kaymo]

for those of us in the south that dont believe in jesus, we have heard it far too often from far too many people. "you need jesus" is a common insult. atheists or agnostics are often labeled as DEVIL WORSHIPERS even though we do not believe in heaven nor hell, let alone the devil. I grew up being harassed and attacked by so called "christians" that have no true idea of what it really means to follow the "teachings of christ" which are generally, DONT BE AN ASSHOLE, and the only reason they arent worse is they fear eternal damnation, hell, and satan.

if you need to be scared of the devil (or fear god) to be a good person, then you probably arent one. just be a good person and see what happens. any god i would worship would respect that and reward me for that anyway. any god that requires me to devote myself, my money, or my sunday morning sleepy time to him or it, is gonna be waiting for a long time. aint nobody got time fo dat, and if you do then you arent doing enough!

[fabiodriven]

I've been looking into evolution here and there over the last few days and from what I can gather, both Jon and I are correct. I have yet to come across irrefutable evidence in either direction. What I did find out is rather than present evidence or facts in either direction, the Wikipedia answer to whether or not evolution is fact or not appears to be an exercise in the art of distraction. If I'm missing something I'd gladly like to be enlightened, but it is my observation that the question of the definition of the word "fact" is taking precedence over the actual question asked, which is "is evolution a fact". That article left me asking more questions at the end and to be honest I feel it may be an intentional misdirection. I was watching a lecture yesterday but I didn't get to finish. Up until that point nothing had really struck me as overwhelming anyways. I am going to continue to learn though and see what I can figure out.


I can definitely relate to the crippling anxiety and depression brother, some people dont understand how it can literally be crippling. they say stupid things like "you have to pull yourself up by your bootstraps" (have you ever tried this? its physically impossible) or "just dont think that way, just dont feel that way" when its not a choice to think or feel anxiety and depression. if it were then nobody would choose it. One's personal decisions certainly will effect our anxiety and depression and positive thinking is definitely a good start to working your way out of it, but it takes good people good friends and family that understand that will support you and stand behind or even better beside you thru your darker days.

This is a subject that I have gone over and over again, yet I cannot get the footing to have a solid stance on it. When I was anxious and depressed, it did feel as though there was nothing I could do to escape it. It felt like I couldn't control it. When I was down and out, I knew the kinds of information and activities it would take to get me back on top yet I chose to wallow in my misery. I was caught up in it, overwhelmed, and I just didn't care about anything. Something changed one day though. I decided I was going to fix everything and although I had no idea how, that didn't matter, I knew I could. I made one big conscious decision that I was done dragging my feet around all day and looking at the ground. The rest was a series of smaller decisions, always the right ones though. I have been as low as low gets, I don't need to think about it. I made the decision to "pull myself up by my bootstraps", and I did it. I learned some very amazing things about the human mind and body and quantum physics is a big part of that. It's not everything though. The art of manifestation, the power of positive thinking, and the law of attraction all go hand in hand. I literally submerged myself in information of these sorts, but I went even further with it. Not only was I flooding myself with the information I wanted, but I was also eliminating outside sources of unwanted information such as commercials. I don't have cable so I don't get any commercials there. When in my personal pickup I listen to my iPod, so no commercials there. At work I've recently started listening to a morning show but I still shut the radio off when the commercials come on. For months all I would watch were educational documentaries and lectures and I'd usually fall asleep listening to either that, audio material I have, or something I'm trying to memorize. Having consciously made the decision to pull myself up and then doing so pretty much from the point I made the decision, I can tell you that it is not only feasible to "pull yourself up from your bootstraps", it is very possible. I have done it.

Having said that, I then ask myself if it were my decision to make, why then did I not make that decision months earlier? Why did I wallow for months and rot? This is what reminds me that maybe it's not always as simple as I had it that time. Was it the material I study? I would say the material, exercise, a work routine, and marijuana are all to thank, but it was my decision that was made before there was any plan. It was just a conscious decision to change how I felt as I saw no need to continue living life in such a downtrodden way.


We have had negative words for each other in the past and i regret that because i think we would get along quite well, as i am an asshole too :D

anyway, im glad you posted this, im glad i read it, and i hope our past childish arguments stay in the past and we can have some good positive discussions in the future.

A lot of people mistake my honesty for me being an asshole. In this day and age where "everyone gets a trophy", people no longer have the humility to accept honesty without an unwarranted counter attack. I have no recollection of an encounter with you or whether or not this would be the case with our past communications, just merely explaining a position I take which is often misunderstood. I don't have regrets as I'm confident my words were (more than likely) misconstrued or taken the wrong way. Living in the past and regrets are two loads I didn't leave room for in my pack. I've seen my name brought up before in reference to having had words with you, but I chose to be the bigger man and continue to leave it dead, as it was so dead to me I didn't even (and still don't) know what it is nor did/do I care. A true forgive and forget or past is past or whatever you want to call it means it's gone.


if you need to be scared of the devil (or fear god) to be a good person, then you probably arent one. just be a good person and see what happens. any god i would worship would respect that and reward me for that anyway. any god that requires me to devote myself, my money, or my sunday morning sleepy time to him or it, is gonna be waiting for a long time. aint nobody got time fo dat, and if you do then you arent doing enough!

This is where we strongly agree.

Thanks for writing Kaymo!

[El Camexican]

Finally made it all the way through your first post without interruption. Great read, but I’d like to throw a couple things out there for you to ponder.

You’ve found some inner peace within the beliefs you’ve expressed and that’s great, but is it really that different that the peace that some get from their religious beliefs? Say what you will about organized religion, but without it I suspect the world would be even more messed up than it is.

The foundation of every first world country is in part founded on the principals of some sort of organized religion. Without this uniting belief I doubt there would even be a single paved road in the USA, let alone an Internet. Mankind needs structure and rules, without it we are just a bunch of hairless apes.

A few million years back we believed that if we scratched an image of a deer on the wall we’d have a good hunt. A few thousand years ago we believed that if we sacrificed a virgin we get a good crop in that summer and 500 years ago many believed that the world was flat and that anyone who said otherwise should suffer the same fate as the virgins.

Today we look deep into space and see images of our beginnings. Those of us that chose to embrace these findings and accept that most of what we were taught about our origin in Sunday school was not true have opened up our minds to the a great unknown world that exists beyond our Earth.

Does this make those who follow Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism or Buddha “wrong”? Not the way I see it. I see them as either unwilling or unable to comprehend that things are not always what we’ve been taught, but this should not mean that they be ridiculed, taunted or persecuted. That is to say up to the point that their beliefs harm anyone. Interjecting and promoting their beliefs into conversation is part of their religious conviction. As long as they don’t behead anyone or pull the plug on the Hubble space scope I say we leave them be and be happy they stopped sacrificing perfectly good virgins.

So what do I belief? I don’t have a clue! It changes as I age. The Bible seems to do a pretty good job of trying to explain a lot of things that would have been incomprehensible to the average guy a few thousand years ago. Add in things lost or added in translation and it really gets interesting.

The Bible says God made Eve out of one of Adam’s ribs. Crazy talk, right? Until you consider it was written a few thousand years before scientists made Dolly the sheep. How could Moses have know of cloning?

The apple tree of knowledge? Pretty good way to try and explain why we are so different than all other species in and a great way to blame women for all our problems and keep kids from playing with snakes.

The Ten Commandments? If everyone followed them it would end most every problem on the planet (keep in mind that the only sex they prohibit is with your neighbor’s wife). The problem is that as soon as one person deviates the rest of us are screwed.

Noah? Have to explain that crazy colored arch in the sky after it rains right? It also warns us that God isn’t afraid to clean house if we piss him off. It’s better to be feared than loved.

Jews being God’s “chosen people”? Moses really put the bull’s-eye on the back over every Jew with that claim. He’d have been a lot more credible today if he’d have added a chapter on dinosaurs.

The one fact we do know about Christianity is that is all but died on the cross with Jesus, but about 300 years later the populace of Armenia needed pacifying and the King decided that it was the least harmful of the upstart religions of the time and let them prosper. Was its God’s will that Christianity got the green light? We have no way to know, but 1,700 years later it seems to be holding up pretty well.

Evolution? Yes and no. My kid looked like a reptile in the ultrasounds leading up to her birth. There are many mammal embryos that are almost indistinguishable from each other in the early stages. Coincidence? I think not, but where is the missing link? How do we explain what has happened to our brains over the past 50,000 years? Why didn’t the other apes come down from the trees, make spears, grow a crop and brew beer?

Something is missing in the evolutionary explanation. We don’t fit on this planet. We are missing hair, we think differently, we walk on two legs, need laws to live in harmony, deal in currencies, kill each other for greed and wear clothing.

Where are skeletons of humans with long, medium and short tails? If we evolved over time it should have come off one bone at a time over millions of years, not all at once. If that was how it worked we’d have dropped our little toe a long time ago. We can find dozens of t-rex skeletons, but not a single half evolved human?

Something is amiss with our history books. How did 400 ton stones get moved around thousands of years ago? Why are math formulas thought to have been conceived a few hundred years ago carved in rocks that date back thousands of years? Why were we so fascinated with star systems we couldn’t even see until the Hubble telescope found them for seemingly the second time? No, I’m not unequivocally saying “It was aliens”, but it sure would explain a few things.

The Big Bang? Sure why not, explain everything with an explosion that can’t be explained, but what was there before that happened? Who made the dark matter? It makes the most sense with what we have for information today, but it seems the more we learn the more questions there are and what about the theories that say there are many, many other dimensions running parallel with ours?

God? I don’t know. Somebody had to kick this party off. I doubt he (or it) has a favorite religion, but I often wonder if “God” isn’t just a kid in another dimension who left a petri dish from a failed science project in his school locker a few billion years ago. If so let’s hope he never cleans that locker out.

The Devil? If God exists he has to as well. Without evil how can there be good? Without light there can be no dark.

Not everyone wants to try and comprehend scientific advances, or even cares about them. Think about it, understanding the existence of a Higgs boson doesn’t put food on the table and telling a kid to pray to star dust when she needs reassurance that her daddy will come back safe and sound from a war doesn’t work.

Much of society still needs religion to cope with the crazy work we live in. This is changing with the almost unrestricted global sharing of knowledge, but lets leave those who cling to harmless religion in peace. Live and let live.

Mickey, that goes for you too. I grew up with a born again mother. We get along much better now that she’s accepted that I’m content to take my chances as a fence sitter. I have no issue with your faith, but please respect that this is not a dedicated Christian website. Maybe consider started a thread on Christianity rather than inject it into others threads. I understand it has helped you deal with some personal demons, but it’s not for everyone. If someone needs saving they can PM you.

To finish this off I’d like to say that as convinced as I am that we still have no idea how we came to be, or why we exist it’s still nice to know that in times of despair we can always talk to the invisible man in the sky as we go into a blind off camber downhill curve with the brake fluid boiling over.:)

[86T3]

Thank you camexican I can for writing what I started and deleted 5 times because I couldn't form it into clear thoughts

[Mickey Dunlap]

I know you guys keep getting on me for Hoosier Daddy but how would you feel about me if I didn't care about you guys and what you think, if I just left you alone to your own thinking and didn't even try to tell you the truth? Some body really does care about you. This whole thread is a searching for the truth though facts, I challenge you to watch this video and then give your honest opinion. You may just want to watch it for 15min. at a time because it's a hour long. Just listen to the facts and then tell me if I'm wrong for trying to tell you the truth, OK! Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRemWMIy2IY

[ironchop]

Thank you camexican I can for writing what I started and deleted 5 times because I couldn't form it into clear thoughts

my sentiments exactly and on every point he listed above.

I would also like to add "Mining" to the list.....sure is amazing some backward humans knew all about mining for ore and then an astounding amount of metalurgy for a species that had only just discovered The Wheel. I call BS on most written theories of human history as well and maintain I believe we are millennia older than previously thought.

I also firmly believe we are coming up on an extinction event of our own doing and I also believe this isn`t the first one on Earth.

Just imagine how quickly knowledge would be lost for thousands of years if our new-fanged "digital" libraries were wiped out and how it would appear to archaeologists thousands of years later who deduce that we never knew anything.

El, you took the paragraphs right out of my mouth, Sir.

If y`all really want a historical Mind Fck, just lookup how Corn was created.....yes, created.... from a type of grass with ears the size of mini corn...Next time you cuss a Mexican, just keep in mind that they (indigenous tribes in Central America 10,000-5500 BC) genetically modified the Corn Grass to feed billions and Russia has been attempting to do the same with a wheat strain for 35 years with no success and all the technology. While your ancestors were perfecting a clay pot, those folks were pounding out the very first GMO.....debate that.

[Billy Golightly]

It is amazing, when you look back at some of the accomplishments in history that we still can't understand. Everything from Stonehenge, to some of Nikola Tesla's experiments (He was trying to smash atoms with electricity and there are claims he did, which obliterates Einstein's theory of relativity if you want to get into some REALLY interesting stuff!), to the pyramids (I watched a documentary one time they hypothesized they were a type of ancient power plant that reflected light rays to burn things and boil water which I found interesting). The underwater carved blocks underwater in the sea near the tongue of the ocean, there is just all sort of things that we with our superior technology can't figure out and that makes them all the more intriguing, for sure.


I've mentioned it before, but for anyone that really wants some amazing reading, look up Nikola Tesla. I think Glen Beck has a new book on him also (Dreamers and Deceivers) about the struggle between him and Edison, but Tesla's autobiography, and either of the two period correct biographies are just completely fascinating with his thought process and the things he did...


Like I said, I know just enough to know that I don't know a trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotr ailpro thing infact :D

[El Camexican]

I know you guys keep getting on me for Hoosier Daddy but how would you feel about me if I didn't care about you guys and what you think, if I just left you alone to your own thinking and didn't even try to tell you the truth? Some body really does care about you. This whole thread is a searching for the truth though facts, I challenge you to watch this video and then give your honest opinion. You may just want to watch it for 15min. at a time because it's a hour long. Just listen to the facts and then tell me if I'm wrong for trying to tell you the truth, OK! Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRemWMIy2IY

Ok, you got my 15 minutes plus 15 more. The first 2 were wasted watching how they take tickets from the people at the show. The next 28 minutes told me nothing I didn't know already. The non-canonical gospels said a lot of things that conflict with what was left in the Bible. Men wrote the Bible, men translated it and men corrupted the original philosophy's of Christianity. Look no further than the Vatican bank for the proof.

The muratorian canon is said to be written over a hundred years aver Christ lived and the beginning and end are said to be missing and THIS is what we are supposed to blindly follow? I'll pass, thanks.

I have spent the better part of my adult life politely conversing with my mother about every aspect of Christianity. I kid you not, she has the bible MEMORIZED and is a heck of a debater. If she can't get through to me no one can, but I will say this, she is the most content, peaceful and kind person you will ever meet. She has a radiant inner peace I don't see conveyed in your posts. I don't know why this is, but I hope you too can find that peace in yourself and still enjoy your time on here with us unrepentant sinners.

[thestud25]

John, I am not trying to demean or disrespect, but in the academic community Wikipedia is not a credible source as the content is added un-sourced or cited by users and is not immediately peer reviewed. With that said, the information you are reading in either direction may or may not be factual/credible. Check the link below.

http://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k70847&pageid=icb.page346376

[fabiodriven]

Bravo on multiple accounts Mexinadian. I appreciate you taking the time to lay words like that out in this thread.

At some point, I've just read a lot of posts, my thoughts on quantum physics were compared to a religion. Honestly the thought had crossed my mind a long time ago, it's not something I hadn't thought about. I suppose the ends are there but the means differ so vastly. What I have come to realize is that what I believe in is viewed by others as just as crazy or odd as religion is to me. There are so many ways to look at it and if someone is happy there really isn't much to argue about. I started this thread to educate others and also to further educate myself in the process, and this thread has taught me how others could compare my beliefs to religion. Not to disparage religion, but I am interested in quantum physics because I like facts. You would all think I were crazy if I tried to explain the things I can manifest. I've tried to explain it to people before and very rarely do people get it. I have one friend who knows but he studies a lot of the same material I do. Another friend of mine was really down and out and it hurt me to see him that way. Without forcing anything on him (Mickey) I suggested things on a couple of occasions that he could try to improve his mood. I used myself as proof as he's been through thick and thin with me, he's seen me at my lowest. One night in particular I told him I was going to show him what I could do. Early in the evening I told him I'd prove it that night. We were at a crowded race track on a holiday at a big thrill show. Demolition derbies, spectator (street legal) racing, fireworks, etc... On a regular race night the place draws a small crowd. Where they make their money is on the holidays, and the place gets mobbed. As I was wading my way through a thick crowd of people, the most beautiful woman I had ever seen was walking straight towards me. We made eye contact and kept it and both smiled and turned as we passed each other. If I had thought she were a bit older I would have spun right around. My friend saw the encounter and we continued on our way. Quite a while later I brought her up to my friend as we were once again wading through the crowd. It was his belief I wouldn't see her again as there were thousands of people at the track and I told him that's what his problem is. If you think you won't see her, and worse yet, if you vocalize that thought, you are making it come true. I corrected him as soon as he said it and with his typical pessimistic attitude he said to me "OK, you're so good at making things happen, here's your shot. Show me where she is now." No word of a lie, no bullshit, we were still walking along and I turned my head to to right, I swear my arm was already moving to point before I had even seen her, and there she was. Thousands of people, and as the words left his mouth we were walking right past her seat. I know what most of you are thinking; coincidence. Those of you who have been paying attention know what I'm going to say next. There is no such thing as coincidence. If you can accept that fact the universe becomes a really, really interesting place. These are some of the signs you need to read, interpret how it fits you personally, and follow.

I will give two examples of things that happened to me today. Keep in mind, today is just a regular work day, not going out of my way to think too much about anything. When you're just minding your own business and things start happening without you even thinking about it, that's what's known as subconscious confidence. They may just be little things, but they are things happening regardless.

The first thing- We left the job today in a convoy of four trucks, me being the last one. We were through about half of the ride back to the shop, so we still had ten or fifteen miles to go. I had been debating on which way I was going back to the shop because I don't have to stay with the other trucks. They took a turn at one point and I kept going straight. Even before they had turned off I pictured us meeting up at a particular intersection at least ten miles away. This is ten miles of lefts, rights, stop lights, train crossings, stop signs, etc... It wasn't two parallel highways. There are so many variables there, but I knew the whole time right where I would see them. Surer 'n shite as I pulled up to Rt 14 and Washington St there goes the crane right through the intersection in front of me. I could feel it coming before I even saw it (that's what she said).

Then on the way home from work a George Thorogood song came on that reminded me of my buddy. It's a song I hear a lot, but for whatever reason it prompted me to call my friend today. This guy is my ex's uncle that I used to work with and hang out at the family parties with. Someone I talk to once, maybe twice a year. No more than that. He said to me on the phone it was amazing I called him as he had just driven by my house today and was thinking of me. "What a coincidence!" he said. I wasn't surprised but I do get excited every time this stuff happens. I do realize how menial these instances sound but remember I'm not even trying right now. When the bases are loaded I concentrate and I have hit it out of the park on many occasions.

[fabiodriven]

John, I am not trying to demean or disrespect, but in the academic community Wikipedia is not a credible source as the content is added un-sourced or cited by users and is not immediately peer reviewed. With that said, the information you are reading in either direction may or may not be factual/credible. Check the link below.

http://isites.harvard.edu/icb/icb.do?keyword=k70847&pageid=icb.page346376



I am well aware how Wikipedia works Jon, thank you. I very rarely use it but decided to take a peek at that because I had already come up with some pretty conflicting information on both sides. I have taken into account how recent the material is that I was looking at as well. There seem to be so many advances in science so fast, so fast that it seems sometimes the "results" you hear may not even be credible.

[El Camexican]

I gotta say I love this "Open Forum" thing. I go on a couple other sites for information and they are so black and white and lifeless. Get on, get your answer and get out. Its like screwing a pail of warm water. This site lives and breathes! Politics, religion, UFO's, laws of attraction, Big Foot, ghosts and any whatever else, bring it on! Ya'll are a great bunch to hang with. Unfortunately I found out on Thursday that Trikefest 2015 is not happening for me, my own fault, I didn't read the calendar right and told the wife to buy non-refundable tickets for the TF weekend:(, so face to face discussions will have to wait till 2016, which has officially been booked:Bounce!

[tripledog]

^^^ You can always find another wife, but there is only going to be one 2015 Trike Fest.

[fabiodriven]

Since it's been brought up, a lot of what was said about "the missing link" so to speak piqued my interest. Why we're hairless, where's the tail, etc... My personal belief is that there has been an "interjection" of sorts from other worldly, or more likely inter dimensional beings. To me it's really the only answer that makes sense for a whole host of reasons.

[El Camexican]

Since it's been brought up, a lot of what was said about "the missing link" so to speak piqued my interest. Why we're hairless, where's the tail, etc... My personal belief is that there has been an "interjection" of sorts from other worldly, or more likely inter dimensional beings. To me it's really the only answer that makes sense for a whole host of reasons.

Yes! and what a topic this is! I saw on a program recently that the original language Torah referred to "God" in the plural!?!? If true that turns the New Testament Bible upside down. Laugh all you want folks, but like the Fabster, evolutionary intervention is the only thing that makes sense to me at this time. Lets face it, many of us can't cope with everything this hyper evolution is throwing at us. Is that natural? No! Ever see an animal commit suicide? We seem to be designed (as a collective) to exceed the limits of our ability to cope with change mentally, not all, but many, why? What made us like this?

Bring back to life a man who died in 1914 and drop him back into society today, do you think he could cope? $10 bucks says he jumps from the nearest cliff in less than a week if left to survive on his own. Do the same thing with a rabbit, or a dog and there should be no issue, but not us, no, we are destined to keep evolving at a rate that no other mammal comes close to and it's hard to keep up at times.

What about kids? Why are human kids so frail and weak for so long when other mammals hit the ground crawling or walking? Who messed with us and why?

Too many questions, not enough answers.

[6speedthumper]

I know you guys keep getting on me for Hoosier Daddy but how would you feel about me if I didn't care about you guys and what you think, if I just left you alone to your own thinking and didn't even try to tell you the truth? Some body really does care about you. This whole thread is a searching for the truth though facts, I challenge you to watch this video and then give your honest opinion. You may just want to watch it for 15min. at a time because it's a hour long. Just listen to the facts and then tell me if I'm wrong for trying to tell you the truth, OK! Thank you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRemWMIy2IY


"Just because your truth isn't a true truth doesn't mean it's not true, Ruth" (I love that movie, lol)

Mickey, your beliefs are true... to YOU. They are because that is what you believe in. To say that it is THE truth, is stretching it a might. No different then a Scientologist claiming that evolution, the stars, planets and the cosmos, is THE truth. Not that I have a problem with that. If it makes you happy in life, great. Just wanted to remind everyone there is a red pill and a blue pill, one of those will take you down the "rabbit hole". The pill you take is your choice, and whether or not it takes you down any "rabbit hole" is yet to be seen.


I have not read but MAYBE 3 posts in this whole thread (didn't read Fabio's opening "novel" and really don't care to). However, I really like what El had to say on the previous page. Lots of really good points, opinions, thoughts, what-ifs, head scratchers, and so on, in those words. I especially liked the parts about human evolution, and how we don't really "fit" on this planet. That right there reminds me of Mission to Mars with Gary Senise. For all we know (and don't know) that could very well be how we ended up here.

Another interesting tid-bit from that post of El's that I liked was the "interpretation" of the bible, or, perhaps, the reason why it was written. It has been a common discussion my mother and I have had (went to a Catholic school growing up, and all kinds of church functions when she was younger) that the bible was written for people of that time to understand or make sense of things that were beyond their comprehension, like El said. Again, it's entirely possible. I think most of us can agree, or at the least be open minded, that people of that time were in no way mentally equipped, or ready, to even begin to understand many things that they were witness to.


Lastly, what about all of those "half evolved" human fossils that El brought up? You would think that if evolution did happen, there would have been hundreds, thousands, or perhaps millions, of these fossilized remains popping up in stone quarries and mines. So yeah, there are gaps, in EVERYTHING. Closest they've come is Peking Man. What's the closest they've physically come to God's and/or Jesus's presence? And, I'm not talking about the world that God "created", it's creatures, plants and the like. I'm talking about actual hands on, physical proof that he/she/they existed. Anyone find Jesus's retainer? How about his lucky condom wrapper? Maybe his favorite lamb's wool socks and matching tunic? Until such a time that either of these two things are proven to have truly happened/existed all of us here will be long gone.

I'll leave everyone with this quote from my all time favorite movie, "I don't know if mama was right, or if it's Lt. Dan. I don't know if we each have a destiny, or if we're all just floating around accidental like on a breeze. But, I think, maybe it's both; maybe both is happening at the same time."

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Since it's been brought up, a lot of what was said about "the missing link" so to speak piqued my interest. Why we're hairless, where's the tail, etc... My personal belief is that there has been an "interjection" of sorts from other worldly, or more likely inter dimensional beings. To me it's really the only answer that makes sense for a whole host of reasons.


That theory kind of lends itself to the idea of a God by a different name doesn't it John? Not trying to be a smartarse at all.. It just always seem to ultimately boil down to some grain of faith in something unknown or unseen.

Been reading this thread and have found it very interesting. Whether one is a creationist or believes in the big bang theory, both require a measure of faith to explain that which cannot be explained by the mortal mind. I don't claim to be a wise enough man to say that I "know" this or "know" that... I do believe in God myself, I feel he has worked in my life on a personal level. And I just don't see something springing from nothing without being set in motion by a higher power. I guess you could say that I kind of think it just may be a mix of the 2 competing opinions.. Maybe God set the whole big bang in motion??

I don't know... VERY heavy topic that I have been content to just sit back and see what my friends have to say on it... But there you have it, my take on it silly as it may seem..

Carry on gents. :)

[ironchop]

I used to say that I thought God was the ruler of an alien planet with unimaginable technological ability and that he posited us here on Earth to repopulate this Solar System. After a few thousand years, we lost our way as a people so Capt. Jesus was sent back to lead us back into the light once again....it made perfect sense biblically and scientifically to me when I was a teenager but more than one Baptist minister like to have died when they heard me utter such notions. We usually dissolved into a debate as to wether the Bible was to always be translated literally or figuratively on certain passages.

I don`t mind if Mickey preaches to me. I do appreciate the effort. I know MANY good hearted, kind, and considerate Christian folks who have done nothing but good for myself and others. There are hypocrits, yes, but generally I had good experiences with people of Faith. people of Faith raised me in a loving and kind way and taught me how to be a person of Integrity, Honesty, Compassion, and Responsibility......that can`t be a bad thing for sure.... I`m gonna get Mr. Dunlap a bumper sticker that says "Trikin` For Jesus"

On something else mentioned above that bears repeating, I also REALLY dig the Open Forum here. I know sometimes I get aggravated about moderation but honestly its because this place feels like friends and family. Too many other forums struggle to always stay on topic and shun such discussion...especially political in nature...because debate sometimes turns into nasty conflict (so I understand the reasoning) but we don`t all do trikes 24/7/365. Sometimes debates get heated and out of hand but I still think it healthy for our critical thinking skills to be presented with many different opinions on different things. We all have many-faceted lives and many interests and I think it`s cool as hell to have such a subforum and all the discussions it fosters between us. BRAVO!

Anyone else read Graham Hancock, Erich Von Danniken, etc?

[ironchop]

I've mentioned it before, but for anyone that really wants some amazing reading, look up Nikola Tesla. I think Glen Beck has a new book on him also (Dreamers and Deceivers) about the struggle between him and Edison, but Tesla's autobiography, and either of the two period correct biographies are just completely fascinating with his thought process and the things he did...

\

Amen! I`m a huge Tesla Fan....both Nikola and the band

that man was "otherworldly" in his grasp of electricity and the things he built and designed were HUNDREDS of years ahead of their time.

If you are familiar with HAARP, it`s merely a gradeschool-level research program called a 'continuation of Tesla`s work'. The EMP machine he built on Long Island (location?) as a means to transmit free electricity through the air was mind-blowingly groundbreaking and we haven`t had such incredible breakthroughs since (arguably). Edison was a hack IMO who rode the coattails of the genius in Tesla. They say his Wardeclyffe Tower could start earthquakes among other things.

[Mickey Dunlap]

It comes so easy to say I know the truth now, with Christ living in me, but I have been where every one of you are too. For those that have ears to hear, let them hear is my prayer. I feel for you from the bottom of my heart, yet I am glad for each one also because you are seeking, even if it's the wrong way you still have to go that way to find out the next thing, and the next thing after that. Because I know the truth and it has set me free I want to help so bad, but I have to let God do it his way just like he did with me. It took 33 years of seeing God work in my life before I really set out to find the truth, and I found it. Not just the truth for me , but the truth for the whole world. But it's also sad that not many will ever make it to the point I did mostly because of a harden heart.:cry: I'll leave you with this today.

Isaiah 55:8-9King James Version (KJV)

8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the Lord.

9 For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

That hit's the nail on the head!:cool:

PS I look forwards to my bumper sticker!:D

[El Camexican]

Maybe God set the whole big bang in motion??

I would be surprised if "He", or "It" didn't. I have no doubt that there is a force out there that tries to guide and protect us. If there isn't then I am one lucky SOB.

If and when we should ever be deemed worthy of knowing the truth about everything instead of just being told to accept things as "God's will" or fate I suspect the whole Universe will make perfect sense to everyone of every faith and belief and why wouldn't it? Everything else in the World around is literally perfect.. except us.;)

[Billy Golightly]

I would be surprised if "He", or "It" didn't. I have no doubt that there is a force out there that tries to guide and protect us. If there isn't then I am one lucky SOB.

If and when we should ever be deemed worthy of knowing the truth about everything instead of just being told to accept things as "God's will" or fate I suspect the whole Universe will make perfect sense to everyone of every faith and belief and why wouldn't it? Everything else in the World around is literally perfect.. except us.;)

Thats pretty much the way I feel and think...There are all sorts of rules and logic setup all around us, so much so infact that some sort of a superior being had to have set it up. Shits too complicated to have happened by per chance.


I mean, seen any tornados assemble any 757's lately? Thats about the same odds :lol:

[El Camexican]

Shits too complicated to have happened by per chance.

You got that right. Any time I've ever been debating with someone over whether or not life just happened by chance VS some sort of a master plan I like to use water as an example of a master plan. It has different properties that any other known liquid. If it didn't we likely couldn't exist. It is the only liquid that expands when it cools beyond +4C. This why ice is on top of the lake and not on the bottom. It also made up if two highly volatile components that render it harmless to us and given enough time it can erode and dissolve almost anything. Amazing stuff this water we are 70 something % made of.

If the Big Bang is really where we came from it was designed by something a heck of a lot smarter than we can ever comprehend in this life.

Think about it, the Universe is perpetually changing and at the same time perfecting itself. Comets left over from explosions and galactic crashes are seeding the Universe with life dust while stars like our Sun that give us life for the moment are cooling and expanding to swallow up garbage like the Earth we are toxifying with nukes and pollution. If we smarten up and learn to get along and build space ships we get to live elsewhere and start with a clean slate. If not the Sun swallows us up and the rest of the Universe doesn't have to deal with our cr*p.

It's a perfect system in which all our nukes, carbon and sewage will one day become pieces of someonelse's pristine home once the Sun implodes. I just hope they treat it better than we did.:lol:

[thestud25]

Fabio/Camexican, If you have the time this is an interesting read. Long, but interesting.

http://www.krcconline.com/ticket-to-heaven/creation-vs-evolution

[El Camexican]

Fabio/Camexican, If you have the time this is an interesting read. Long, but interesting.

http://www.krcconline.com/ticket-to-heaven/creation-vs-evolution

Read it, great points, all of it, thanks Stud! I think I will now go watch the all Matrix movies and give my noodle a break.:lol:

[thestud25]

Read it, great points, all of it, thanks Stud! I think I will now go watch the all Matrix movies and give my noodle a break.:lol:

Lol, it is truly remarkable but we do not know. It requires faith to believe either way.

[YTZ drew]

I'm not (usually) nearly as deep as some thoughts posted here by others, but definitely a very interesting thread. Here's something I think of now and then...

http://youtu.be/AkFkMjGRg5E

[greenhuman]

The human brain is like an enormous fish. It's flat and slimy and has gills through which in can see. If one of these gills fails to open, the brain does not receive any messages transmitted by the lungs.
Monty Python

[ironchop]

some of my favorite haunts:

http://s8int.com/

http://ancient-wisdom.co.uk/ooparts.htm

https://www.forbiddenhistory.info/?q=node/20

http://www.ancient-origins.net/forbidden-history

Disclaimer: I don`t claim any of the information provided in the above links to be irrefutable and neither do they. I look at it for purposes of reflection, Grey matter stimulation, and some entertainment.

[fabiodriven]

All I know is if DOHC weren't banned right now we'd be all set. He's got the answer to everything.

[fabiodriven]

I have not read but MAYBE 3 posts in this whole thread (didn't read Fabio's opening "novel" and really don't care to).

I didn't read the rest of your post. To each their own, but I personally find it ignorant to have such a reply in a thread you admittedly know nothing about. Nobody is making you read my novels, I personally don't care who does or doesn't read my words. I'm sure it can be a strain for some to be able to read and digest that much. I can't control how you post on this site, but I will ask you to read and understand my words before you reply in one of my threads.

If I start quoting everyone I agree with, it's going to be a post full of quotes to say "I agree with this". Joe, I'm really glad to see you post and I agree very much with a lot of what you had to say! I was hoping I hadn't offended you! Canucksican, I agree with everything you have to say! Keep it up! Doug, I'll be checking out those links when I have time!


but I have been where every one of you are too.

Like hell you have! You don't know the first thing about me! All due respect to an elder, but you've been where you've been, which is facked up on either drugs or alcohol as you've previously eluded to, and wronged a lot of people! I didn't do that, you did! Go ahead and repent sinner! You surer 'n shite haven't been to a combat zone or driven a tractor trailer in Boston, but I digress before I can't stop.


even if it's the wrong way you still have to go that way to find out the next thing,

The wrong way to you isn't necessarily the wrong way for someone else, and you're going to tell people you don't know the first thing about what's good for them and what isn't? Get the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro outta here.


Not just the truth for me , but the truth for the whole world.

Wrong! Wrong! Wrong! This is the truth FOR YOU, not for those who disagree! If you insist on pushing your beliefs so hard how can you be surprised when people start moving away? It's that exact kind of closed minded narrow thinking that starts wars. It's completely pig-headed and self serving to assume that YOU know what's better for someone than themselves. It's downright disturbing to me that you feel you can impose your will on other people. And you can't figure out why people can't take you? How would you like someone else's will imposed upon you? What if every time I saw you I pushed my beliefs on you non stop, like a broken record?

Personally I need to catch up with a bit more of the subject at hand and for those of you posting (non religious) links, I greatly appreciate it! It's tough to find time these days, but keeping busy is a good thing. Thou shalt shutteth the fuckis uppis.

[clmeue37]

Hey Fabio...mind if I quote that last sentence in my signature? Lol I love it!
Not really going to do it but I have to agree that if one is going to respond to a particular topic they probably should at least read the first post.

[6speedthumper]

I didn't read the rest of your post. To each their own, but I personally find it ignorant to have such a reply in a thread you admittedly know nothing about. Nobody is making you read my novels, I personally don't care who does or doesn't read my words. I'm sure it can be a strain for some to be able to read and digest that much. I can't control how you post on this site, but I will ask you to read and understand my words before you reply in one of my threads.

If I start quoting everyone I agree with, it's going to be a post full of quotes to say "I agree with this". Joe, I'm really glad to see you post and I agree very much with a lot of what you had to say! I was hoping I hadn't offended you! Canucksican, I agree with everything you have to say! Keep it up! Doug, I'll be checking out those links when I have time!



Like hell you have! You don't know the first thing about me! All due respect to an elder, but you've been where you've been, which is facked up on either drugs or alcohol as you've previously eluded to, and wronged a lot of people! I didn't do that, you did! Go ahead and repent sinner! You surer 'n shite haven't been to a combat zone or driven a tractor trailer in Boston, but I digress before I can't stop.



The wrong way to you isn't necessarily the wrong way for someone else, and you're going to tell people you don't know the first thing about what's good for them and what isn't? Get the trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro outta here.



Wrong! Wrong! Wrong! This is the truth FOR YOU, not for those who disagree! If you insist on pushing your beliefs so hard how can you be surprised when people start moving away? It's that exact kind of closed minded narrow thinking that starts wars. It's completely pig-headed and self serving to assume that YOU know what's better for someone than themselves. It's downright disturbing to me that you feel you can impose your will on other people. And you can't figure out why people can't take you? How would you like someone else's will imposed upon you? What if every time I saw you I pushed my beliefs on you non stop, like a broken record?

Personally I need to catch up with a bit more of the subject at hand and for those of you posting (non religious) links, I greatly appreciate it! It's tough to find time these days, but keeping busy is a good thing. Thou shalt shutteth the fuckis uppis.

Well ignorance loves company. Like you and Mickey having your little pis$ing matches (which can be entertaining, but usually isn't). Not like your words are absent of ignorance. We all are guilty of it.

Just because someone doesn't read a person's opening post doesn't mean they didn't peruse it, or read other posts of theirs to figure out the discussion. Besides, what I had posted wasn't off base for this thread. A few even liked it.

[El Camexican]

Is it just me or...
205459

[Mickey Dunlap]

fabiodriven, when I say I have been where all of you are, I mean spiritually!

Question: "What does it mean to be spiritually dead?"

Answer: To be spiritually dead is to be separated from God. When Adam sinned in Genesis 3:6, he ushered in death for all humanity. God’s command to Adam and Eve was that they could not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. It came with the warning that disobedience would result in death: “And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, ‘You may surely eat of every tree of the garden, but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.’” The phrase “you shall surely die” could be literally translated “dying you shall die.” This signifies a continuous state of death that began with spiritual death, continues throughout life as a gradual degradation of the body, and culminates in physical death. The immediate spiritual death resulted in Adam’s separation from God. His act of hiding from God (Genesis 3:8) demonstrates this separation, as does his attempt to shift blame for the sin to the woman (Genesis 3:12).

Unfortunately, this spiritual – and eventual physical – death was not confined to Adam and Eve. As the representative of the human race, Adam carried all of humanity into his sin. Paul makes this clear in Romans 5:12, telling us that sin and death entered the world and spread to all men through Adam’s sin. Additionally, Romans 6:23 says that the wages of sin is death; sinners must die, because sin separates us from God. Any separation from the Source of Life is, naturally, death for us.

But it is not just inherited sin that causes spiritual death; our own sinfulness contributes. Ephesians 2 teaches that, before salvation, we are “dead” in trespasses and sins (verse 1). This must speak of spiritual death, because we were still “alive” physically before salvation. While we were in that spiritually “dead” condition, God saved us (verse 5; see also Romans 5:8). Colossians 2:13 reiterates this truth: “And you, who were dead in your trespasses . . . God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses.”

Since we are dead in sin, we are completely unable to trust God or His Word. Jesus repeatedly claims that we are powerless without Him (John 15:5) and that we cannot come to Him without God’s enabling (John 6:44). Paul teaches in Romans 8 that our natural minds cannot submit to God, nor please Him (verses 7-8). In our fallen state, we are incapable of even understanding the things of God (1 Corinthians 2:14).

The act of God whereby He makes us alive from spiritual death is called regeneration. Regeneration is accomplished only by the Holy Spirit, through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. When we are regenerated, we are made alive together with Christ (Ephesians 2:5) and renewed by the Holy Spirit (Titus 3:5). It is like being born a second time, as Jesus taught Nicodemus in John 3:3, 7. Having been made alive by God, we will never truly die – we have eternal life. Jesus said often that to believe in Him is to have eternal life (John 3:16, 36; 17:3).

Sin leads to death. The only way to escape that death is to come to Jesus through faith, drawn by the Holy Spirit. Faith in Christ leads to spiritual life, and ultimately to eternal life.

[6speedthumper]

Is it just me or...
205459


Or

http://cdn.screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/X-Men-Days-of-Future-Past-Prof.-X-and-Magneto.jpg

[Mickey Dunlap]

http://www.intouch.org/broadcast/today-on-radio

Same thing that was on today.

[fabiodriven]

Well ignorance loves company. Like you and Mickey having your little pis$ing matches (which can be entertaining, but usually isn't). Not like your words are absent of ignorance. We all are guilty of it.

Just because someone doesn't read a person's opening post doesn't mean they didn't peruse it, or read other posts of theirs to figure out the discussion. Besides, what I had posted wasn't off base for this thread. A few even liked it.

Say what you want after this, this will be the end of this discussion. Your words are almost beneath replying to in this thread. You admitted you didn't read the first post in this thread, which having written it I can tell you that there's no way you know what's going on in this discussion without having kept up with everything.


I have not read but MAYBE 3 posts in this whole thread (didn't read Fabio's opening "novel" and really don't care to).

"Lacking knowledge or awareness in general" This is the definition of the word "ignorance". You are lacking in knowledge or awareness in general right now by your own words, thus rendering you ignorant by definition and by your own choice. I merely pointed this out, so I'm confused by your negative thoughts towards me. I didn't ask for your approval or disapproval of anything, we're just talking about some very interesting stuff. If you don't like it, you don't have to read it (as you know very well) but feel free to keep unwarranted snide comments clear of this discussion thank you. You have attempted to bring negativity into this thread and I'm not going to have it. You can start your own thread if you'd like to having to do with backhanded comments, but this is about quantum physics.:)

[El Camexican]

Mickey at the risk of a one way ticket to hell I am going to remind you that they once fed Christians to the lions.

If sin leads to eternal death then why did God allow us the temptation to become sinners? Why does God get to kill people in anger, but not us? Where did all the flood water go? Why is there a heaven for child molesters and murderers that repent just before death, but the kind old lady at the end of the street that made cookies for all the kids on the block and never hurt a fly can't go to heaven is she isn't born again? Why are unicorns mentioned in the Bible, but not dinosaurs? Please don't answer with scripture telling me that me that I'm not smart enough to understand the answers. My God made us in his image and gave us brains to use, please allow us that.

Be a Christian, most are great people, but please keep an open mind to the rest of your fathers creations and your fellow man.

[6speedthumper]

[QUOTE=fabiodriven;1342718]Say what you want after this, this will be the end of this discussion. Your words are almost beneath replying to in this thread. You admitted you didn't read the first post in this thread, which having written it I can tell you that there's no way you know what's going on in this discussion without having kept up with everything.


QUOTE]



"What's going on in this discussion", you mean other then knowing full well that what you wrote would draw Mickey in; and thus leading to another head butting competition between you and what your practices are (which is fine btw, and I like several points you made in that first post) and Mickey and his practices? We all knew it was going to happen. You could have used something else as an example to compare quantum physics to, and maybe Mickey wouldn't have felt this thread post worthy. You had thrown something he is passionate about under the bus, and he of course went to it's rescue.

I tried to read this thread, really I did. But, there is too much of the "same old same old" that has been said, discussed, argued, debated or hinted upon in past threads, for me to be totally enamored with it. There were a few posts that I really liked. El's was one of them, and I had the want to express myself, which was not "out in left field" for this thread, at that stage. I also responded to a post of Mickey's in that same post of mine, and it too was "on target" for the stage this thread was at during that particular time.

Had I not been honest (I do believe honesty is best) and said that I had not read your opening post (at that time) and that I did not care to (which doesn't mean that I had refused to) then no one would have been the wiser, and all would have thought me a quiet bystander until I posted. And, in that alternate universe, you and I wouldn't even be going back and forth. Maybe my honesty struck a nerve, but I'm happy with myself for my honesty, and to quote you, "I know that someday if I get a chance to "review the play" I'll be happy with a very high percentage of my decisions and actions." That decision/action will be one of mine. So really there was a problem with my being honest in that sentence, and not the subject matter of that post. Again, which a few people liked. I'll admit when I stand a chance at being ignorant. That's precisely what I had done. I suppose that's why there are times when people start off a sentence with, "Call me ignorant."

If I've pis$ed negativity into your quantum corn flakes, then I'm sorry, and I will try to have better aim next time. :D

[RIDE-RED 250r]

John, I am in no way offended by those who take positions and beliefs that differ from mine. Open, honest, respectful, and free discussion is a good thing... no, actually it's a GREAT thing! We are all individual human beings with individual consciences and belief structures that our individual life paths have led us to.

We are fortunate to live in a country where we can have debates like this without fear of persecution or prosecution. I will take respectful disagreement rather than fearful silence any old day of the week...

[Mosh]

I am a religous man. More than most would think.
The holidays are all a farce..they are lies and fake. Made up by traditions of MEN that choose to defile themselves and belittle thier own intelligence by following some standard because everyone else does.
The Bible states that learn not the ways of the heathens and follow in idol worship yet every dang religous book thumper is always breaking the very 1st commandment of The Lord with man made idol worship. That is why you get these bible slammers acting the way they do. They think they have found peace in what they read but continue to make themselves miserable 6 days a week then go ask for forgiveness every Sunday...Which is the wrong sabbath day too..
But dang , this beligerant random regurgitation of verses is what TURNS people off from even seeking the truth.
I said it back on page one that ramming ones belief down anothers throat is never going to change thier mind. Much the way they broadcast christmas bullshit everywhere you go..I dont believe in it and the more I heard it at first, the more I hated it. But the more I heard as I got older just reinforced my helief in why I dont do it. Spewing religion to people that choose to be agnostic for lack of better terms, is like me convincing a marathon runner to start smoking.
If you want to convince someone of the Bible then you need to tempt a persons curiosity and slamming down lines and verses does not spark ones curiosity. It comes off as over aurhtority to most This " have you found Jesus" stuff is what turns people off.
People didnt even know Jesus was lost nor do they think the should be looking for him. And the thought of such a great being being lost is rediculous..
The book also says " no man can come to me lest he be called" so these people that believe they have been saved and touched by the Son of The Lord are being lied to.

You may want to read into the Living Church Of God and see how decieved all the religions are. And if you really want some lessons of true biblical deceptions made by men, Dial up some Herbert W Armstrong teachings.
Many accused him of being cult because he preached so hard and proved 99.9% of religions were lying and still are.

I agree with Billy on the tornado building a plane..
There is too much in nature to think that things just happen and I believe it took a much greater mind to create me and I refuse to believe we evolved from some dust mite under a rock or quit dragging our knuckles and shed our fur as we began to walk upright. It is insulting to what we are and have as human potential.
The big bang stuff...I never really got into. There is some science on " matter" and how it can not be created nor destroyed so that kind of throws that explosion of nothing to what we see now theory out the window..

[ironchop]

..There is too much in nature to think that things just happen and I believe it took a much greater mind to create me and I refuse to believe we evolved from some dust mite under a rock or quit dragging our knuckles and shed our fur as we began to walk upright. It is insulting to what we are and have as human potential.
..

or that fish sprouted legs and walked on land "when the seas dried up".........well as a kid, I lived on a farm and we played in Koots Creek almost everyday. I noticed that in Indiana when the stream dried up, the fckin fish DIED. No sprouting legs. No walking up the creek bank. Dead. I was trapped between what Rev Bowing was preaching to me every Sunday and what I KNEW to be reality....and they didn`t jive. That's what started to pull me away from the church. Churches tend to forget to be relevant and that causes emigration from Christianity.

I always laughed about that whole "sprang from apes" crap......really? so one group of ape was apparently light years beyond all the other in terms of evolutionary capabilities......while all the other apes, monkeys, gorillas, etc got the evolutionary "short end of the stick".

All I know is the older I get, the more I subscribe to a Creationist theory of everything. I just think that religion tries to dumb it down and I feel insulted that somebody thinks I will jump on board with this without question. If you choose to patronize me because you are religious, you`ve already lost me and everything you say after the fact is ignored. With the kind of knowledge and understanding a lot of people have today, it doesn`t sound as far reaching as it all once did and the magnitude and complexity of the whole damn ecosystem convinces me that we are NOT a product of Probability or Chance or of any of today`s many versions of a "God" but rather the answer is probably much more scientific and tangible. It`s just taken thousands of years or us all to realize that maybe miracles are nothing more than previous knowledge that has been lost and/or the result of advanced technological capabilities that we couldn`t even begin to fathom a thousand years ago and thus appear to be a "miracle".........imagine going back in time and merely lighting a zippo in front of a marauding band of Visigoth warriors.....you`d be considered an instant God.....fire in the palm of one`s hand now seems primitive to us whereas a thousand years ago a fire took alot more work to achieve...technological advances make it seem trivial at best nowadays and I think the same can be said of Creationism. They can basically design a living thing through genetic engineering and grow that living thing in a petri dish or the Lab fridge and we say "who cares? Did you see Iggy Izalea`s glorious ass?".......but a thousand years ago, such an act would have dropped people to their knees in fear and awe of the "power" of the "gods" who achieved such things.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Mickey at the risk of a one way ticket to hell I am going to remind you that they once fed Christians to the lions.

If sin leads to eternal death then why did God allow us the temptation to become sinners? Why does God get to kill people in anger, but not us? Where did all the flood water go? Why is there a heaven for child molesters and murderers that repent just before death, but the kind old lady at the end of the street that made cookies for all the kids on the block and never hurt a fly can't go to heaven is she isn't born again? Why are unicorns mentioned in the Bible, but not dinosaurs? Please don't answer with scripture telling me that me that I'm not smart enough to understand the answers. My God made us in his image and gave us brains to use, please allow us that.

Be a Christian, most are great people, but please keep an open mind to the rest of your fathers creations and your fellow man.

If it would help you to understand I will answer all your questions, but I my self have no answers other then Gods word, it's the only thing you can trust, and in is all by Grace.

http://www.intouch.org/broadcast/today-on-radio

I don't think you have read the Bible because it does talk about dinosaurs. I think if half the time that was spent on this thread was to just think about todays radio broadcast on Grace and really hear what is being said everyone would gain way more info about the most important thing in life you will be the better for it. Everyone wants to put the horse before the cart.

[atc007]

I must confess to not reading this from the beginning. I will share my thoughts only because I care. Highly respect a lot of the guys posting. I am a Christian,perhaps on my OWN terms. Dont go to church. My unfortunate personal experience with that is people who are not good people 6 days a week,go to church on Sunday to "shower" their sins away,And all is good. Call me stupid,,,I disagree with their theories :).. I "know" my life. I am 44. I KNOW,,going into ANY big job,,no matter the planning, the preparation ,the work,blood sweat and tears... Anything that can go wrong DOES go wrong,EVERYTHING I touch...However,,,I also know,,,the end result will be fine. At the end of the day week,whatever. The job will turn out just fine and there will be lots of crap to reminice about. Call it what you will, Bit it is a very solid outlook. I do not and cannot pretend things are rosy. They arent. But I Know with 100% Confidence,there are powers at work FOR me. That I very much appreciate. Wish I could form words better :) El,,,,I;m with you about 100% .. Its scary.Lol.. Its been said in many posts before how scary it is the intelligence there is on this ol 3 wheeler site. I don't find that surprising at all. But here we are again with some extremely insightful thoughts :). Carry on Gentleman!

[fabiodriven]

There is some excellent posting going on here and I thank you all. This is exactly what I had in mind when starting this thread. I've gotten points of views, theories, explanations, and more links to review than I can shake a stick at. We truly do have a community of strong minds here and I now have more material to explore than I even have time for right this moment, but I will be going back and looking at every (non-religious) article, video, or site posted here so far. The few I've gotten to check out have been great and thank you all again. Last week during the Thanksgiving break I had time off and was able to immerse myself in some quantum physics, hence the starting of this thread in the first place. Unfortunately I don't have enough time to do that as much as I'd like to, but I will always continue to learn. As I go along and look at the various links posted, that will send me down different paths to different sites, books, videos, etc, and I'll branch off into all different kinds of interesting stuff. That's how it usually goes. I'm surprised at at how much of the religious stuff does indeed have its place in life, at least in my opinion, as when I started this thread I saw it as useless for me, which for the most part it still is, but I can see why it may be so important to others now. I always respect others beliefs, but now I have a little more reason and understanding to respect them. I've also learned how poisonous religion can be to certain people, and how it can have a drastic effect on those around them. It lets you peek through the doorway of how some of the most vile and unfathomable acts of murder, mass suicide, rape, etc, can be done in the name of a god or gods. You can see the seed being planted.


Fabio/Camexican, If you have the time this is an interesting read. Long, but interesting.

http://www.krcconline.com/ticket-to-heaven/creation-vs-evolution

Jon I started this earlier but then fell asleep. I've been burning the candle at both ends. It's certainly been a great read so far though and I will be finishing that article as soon as I have time. That is precisely what I was looking for when I was trying to do some research on evolution the other night. Thank you again for posting these very helpful links!


I'm sorry

Apology accepted.

[El Camexican]

If it would help you to understand I will answer all your questions, but I my self have no answers other then Gods word, it's the only thing you can trust, and in is all by Grace.

http://www.intouch.org/broadcast/today-on-radio

I don't think you have read the Bible because it does talk about dinosaurs. I think if half the time that was spent on this thread was to just think about todays radio broadcast on Grace and really hear what is being said everyone would gain way more info about the most important thing in life you will be the better for it. Everyone wants to put the horse before the cart.

No Mickey I have not read the entire Bible cover to cover. I haven't even cracked one open since I debated becoming a Pentecostal preacher about 30 years ago (it was a very short lived scheme and had something to do with the drop dead, smokin hot girls in the church choir)

When you refer to dinosaurs in the Bible I assume you mean the ones that breathed fire?

“His sneezings flash forth light, and his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning. Out of his mouth go burning lights; sparks of fire shoot out. Smoke goes out of his nostrils, as from a boiling pot and burning rushes. His breath kindles coals, and a flame goes out of his mouth.”


Sounds more like he's describing an A fuel Dragster than an animal, no?:wondering

Most Christians try to down play things like this and unicorns, but when it comes to something thus far undisputable it becomes "God's word" and to dispute or question it is considered blasphemous.

A few more things to ponder: Why if Adam bit into the apple of knowledge are we told not to pursue it (knowledge) beyond the word of the Bible? Think about it, we took knowledge, we were dealt punishment for it and told it would last for as long as we were trapped in our flesh bodies, but then we are told as I believe you quoted somewhere in here not to seek information outside of the Bible. That makes no sense to me.

And what about owning slaves? According to the Bible its all good. There are dozens of rules and regulations in the Bible about them, but no mention of it in the Ten Commandments and none say it's wrong to own a man or woman.

I could go on and on and on, but I don't want to. I feel like a playground jerk tossing this stuff at you. I respect your beliefs and don't want to trash them any more that I want anyone to trash mine. It was never my intention to try and convince anyone to give up their faith. All I want to do is expand on the original post and provoke constructive thought amongst friends.

I will end this by saying that you are welcome to the last word on this exert of the post, I won't reply as I do not wish to appear any more disrespectful to your convictions than I already have.

That said I have only one more thing to say about Christianity and that is:

Guys (Fabio) don't pass up on learning a little about the Christian perspective when seeking truth. It has some fascinating insights and seemingly impossible knowledge to offer. Same goes for other religions. To ignore them completely would be as foolish as believing in them blindly.

[El Camexican]

I must confess to not reading this from the beginning. Who can blame you? It's already longer that the old Testament!:lol:

Seriously, you should at least read Fabio's first post and the Stud's link.

[Mickey Dunlap]

El Camexican, I was thinking more about "Leviathan" in Job, or maybe Behemoth. I don't think anyone has said anything that disrespected me, or I don't take it personal anyway. I simply try to put out there what God would have people to understand. I don't know where you come up with God doesn't want us to seek more knowledge, unless it goes against his word. How would I build faster motors if I didn't grow in knowledge about motors. Nothing wrong with that.

[El Camexican]

Pr(o)verbs 3:5 Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.

This is one example. There are others I can't recall at the moment, I'll need to ask my Mother for help.:)

I believe that was Leviathan, Job 41

[ironchop]

........ since I debated becoming a Pentecostal preacher about 30 years ago........


for some reason, knowing your internet persona thus far, THIS is the funniest damn thing you have posted this week.

[Mickey Dunlap]

This is one example. There are others I can't recall at the moment, I'll need to ask my Mother for help.:)

I believe that was Leviathan, Job 41


That's right, as I seek knowledge he guilds me, but I have to do and trust Him in all my ways. My own understand would have left me out there thinking I was OK, that some how I was good enough to go to Heaven, which I did. I thought just like a lot of people, deep down I was good enough and God was a loving God and I was OK. WRONG!!!!!!!!! God says there are none that are good, no not one, for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. So where are you? It is so simple, God has took all that everyone of us need and gave it to us as a free gift by hanging Jesus on the cross to bore our sins, and all you have to do is believe that by faith and ask God to forgive you and to come into you your heart, even a 5 year old can do that. But the older we get, the more we think we know, the harder our hearts get the harder it is to believe that God loves you so much and made it so easy that a little kid can believe but we just Mock and rebel against Him and what he did for you if you were the only person on earth. It's OK to seek knowledge and wisdom. And like I said it's good that everyone is seeking new things, God wants you to seek,and to find because he will lead you to him. I have told you the truth, but some are not ready to hear it, I just pray that the seed has been planted! That's why I don't take everything people say at me, it's not me they are rejecting, it's what God say through me that they don't like. If they met me at trike fest or at the races heck we would have a blast, and if not that's OK too. We don't have to like everyone one, but I do love everyone, that's why I tell them the truth, shouldn't hate me for it. If your house was on fire would you want me to rush in and tell you so you don't burn to death? Or should I just walk by and say I hope they wake up! I'm here saying wake up and some are saying shut up, leave me to burn in hell, and I just can't do that and no one in their right mind would!

[kaymo]

fabio- just now getting to read your reply

it was a long long time ago in a galaxy far far away lol. I was posting about some custom work i was planning on doing and asking for some info on swappable parts and you didnt seem to appreciate what i was going to try to build lol. i came off sounding like a noob and got attacked like one (not just by you) so i took my toys elsewhere to play lol. but despite all that im back here hopefully to share some three wheeler info and builds and whatnot.

the bootstraps thing- still think its impossible. if not post a vid of yourself doing this lol. yeah i was referring to the actual physical act, not the metaphorical one. i totally get the metaphorical one and you are very accurate in your assessments of the stages of anxiety and have felt those same things myself, fell into not doing anything and wallowing in ones own self pity. its amazing how much a difference of NOT letting negative crap in your life INCLUDING advertising and politics will have on your outlook and feelings about life in general.

any time i watch the news or politics, i lose faith in humanity. I love my dogs for a reason. My german shepherd ive had for 9 years has congestive heart failure and i doubt will make it thru the holidays. she is the sweetest smartest most loyal animal ive ever had and anyone ive ever talked to has met, she is trained off leash, obeys commands even if in the middle of fighting or defending herself against another dog if i call her out she stops. recently i had some 6ft 4 shaved head harley biker asshole try to intimidate me... she was with me and jumped in between us and growled without a single command given, she knew what was up. I have a feeling her passing will have a huge negative effect on my life and i hope i can keep myself from slipping back into a funk.

i wish i could believe it was all part of some divine plan for the greater good but im not buying it. nothing is to plan, its life and its random and it happens. you can either accept it and ride the waves or spend your time battling the rapids that you will never tame.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Forgot todays message. http://www.intouch.org/broadcast/today-on-radio

[Mosh]

Do you believe in xmas Mickey?
Do you know if Jesus was born on the 25th of December ?
Can you tell me what Jermiah 10 says?
Should a newborn or young child be baptised?

Can you tell me who Ephriam and Manassa are and what they were in biblical history and even current events?

[fabiodriven]

That's right, as I seek knowledge he guilds me, but I have to do and trust Him in all my ways. My own understand would have left me out there thinking I was OK, that some how I was good enough to go to Heaven, which I did. I thought just like a lot of people, deep down I was good enough and God was a loving God and I was OK. WRONG!!!!!!!!! God says there are none that are good, no not one, for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. So where are you? It is so simple, God has took all that everyone of us need and gave it to us as a free gift by hanging Jesus on the cross to bore our sins, and all you have to do is believe that by faith and ask God to forgive you and to come into you your heart, even a 5 year old can do that. But the older we get, the more we think we know, the harder our hearts get the harder it is to believe that God loves you so much and made it so easy that a little kid can believe but we just Mock and rebel against Him and what he did for you if you were the only person on earth. It's OK to seek knowledge and wisdom. And like I said it's good that everyone is seeking new things, God wants you to seek,and to find because he will lead you to him. I have told you the truth, but some are not ready to hear it, I just pray that the seed has been planted! That's why I don't take everything people say at me, it's not me they are rejecting, it's what God say through me that they don't like. If they met me at trike fest or at the races heck we would have a blast, and if not that's OK too. We don't have to like everyone one, but I do love everyone, that's why I tell them the truth, shouldn't hate me for it. If your house was on fire would you want me to rush in and tell you so you don't burn to death? Or should I just walk by and say I hope they wake up! I'm here saying wake up and some are saying shut up, leave me to burn in hell, and I just can't do that and no one in their right mind would!

Alright I'm being one hundred percent honest here. I was just relaxing by my wood stove after work and catching up with what's been written today when I encountered this. This post, what you have written, is just plain scary to me for more than one reason. My honest reaction, I started with a smile which turned into a much more solemn look as I began to be offended that you are telling me, in your roundabout way, that I am not a good person and I am a sinner. Both are untrue and incorrect by the way. Then I began to cringe as I pictured a man having his own son crucified and then calling me a sinner when he's done. Then I literally gasped out loud once I had really put that all together. You sir, have a lot going on with war, death, hell, for trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro's sake man, it's really not good for you or anyone around you to be thinking that way. There is a whole planet we're lucky enough to have the time we do on, and there is so much to enjoy in such a short span. If you want to walk around talking about crucifixions, wars, death, hell, and constantly being in fear, that is completely up to you man. But why must you insist on attempting to force what you believe down every else's throats to the point of offending them? Forgive me if it seems as though I'm projecting here as this is not my intent, I wish no ill will towards anyone, but I feel as though you may end up with these beliefs being one of the few friends you have as time goes by. Again, being completely honest, if you pretend I'd never met you on these boards and just say you and I met at a race or a ride somewhere for the first time in person. If you started with this talk to me face to face, I would avoid you like the plague after that and also be conscious that there's an avid religious enthusiast amongst us. I'm not telling you this to tell you I dislike you and my aim isn't to insult, this is just my personal opinion. I also would like you to know that a good portion of the people I know would feel the same way. Just so it's known, I do realize there are other parts of this country that are far, far more religious than where I live. I'm just saying, me and most of the people I know would find you to be someone to avoid. And that takes a lot, I try to be accepting of all people regardless of what they believe.

I'm a good person, this much I know.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Do you believe in xmas Mickey?
Do you know if Jesus was born on the 25th of December ?
Can you tell me what Jermiah 10 says?
Should a newborn or young child be baptised?

Can you tell me who Ephriam and Manassa are and what they were in biblical history and even current events?

Do I believe in xmas the way the world does, no, do I believe in Easter the way the world does, no!

LOL No Jesus wasn't even born in the winter, it's just a day our government picked as a day to celebrate Christmas, but it's so far away from what it should be it's sickning. Everyday is a day to celebrate the birth of Christ, and Easter even more so.

Jermiah 10 is about emptiness of false gods and religions and we should worship the omnipotent Lord and King!


No it does nothing for a newborn to be baptized. All small children that die go to heaven, there is a age to when they are accountable but we don't know what it is. Baptizing is for believers as a commandment after they get save as a sign of what they believe.

As for the last one can I'm not sure what you are wanting to know other then who they are and to go through all the history to why they are an important part of Israel and the end times today would take for ever for me to wright.

Is this what you wanted?:wondering

[Mickey Dunlap]

Alright I'm being one hundred percent honest here. I was just relaxing by my wood stove after work and catching up with what's been written today when I encountered this. This post, what you have written, is just plain scary to me for more than one reason. My honest reaction, I started with a smile which turned into a much more solemn look as I began to be offended that you are telling me, in your roundabout way, that I am not a good person and I am a sinner. Both are untrue and incorrect by the way. Then I began to cringe as I pictured a man having his own son crucified and then calling me a sinner when he's done. Then I literally gasped out loud once I had really put that all together. You sir, have a lot going on with war, death, hell, for trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro's sake man, it's really not good for you or anyone around you to be thinking that way. There is a whole planet we're lucky enough to have the time we do on, and there is so much to enjoy in such a short span. If you want to walk around talking about crucifixions, wars, death, hell, and constantly being in fear, that is completely up to you man. But why must you insist on attempting to force what you believe down every else's throats to the point of offending them? Forgive me if it seems as though I'm projecting here as this is not my intent, I wish no ill will towards anyone, but I feel as though you may end up with these beliefs being one of the few friends you have as time goes by. Again, being completely honest, if you pretend I'd never met you on these boards and just say you and I met at a race or a ride somewhere for the first time in person. If you started with this talk to me face to face, I would avoid you like the plague after that and also be conscious that there's an avid religious enthusiast amongst us. I'm not telling you this to tell you I dislike you and my aim isn't to insult, this is just my personal opinion. I also would like you to know that a good portion of the people I know would feel the same way. Just so it's known, I do realize there are other parts of this country that are far, far more religious than where I live. I'm just saying, me and most of the people I know would find you to be someone to avoid. And that takes a lot, I try to be accepting of all people regardless of what they believe.

I'm a good person, this much I know.


By what measure do you use to say that you are a good person?

[Mosh]

Do I believe in xmas the way the world does, no, do I believe in Easter the way the world does, no!

LOL No Jesus wasn't even born in the winter, it's just a day our government picked as a day to celebrate Christmas, but it's so far away from what it should be it's sickning. Everyday is a day to celebrate the birth of Christ, and Easter even more so.

Jermiah 10 is about emptiness of false gods and religions and we should worship the omnipotent Lord and King!


No it does nothing for a newborn to be baptized. All small children that die go to heaven, there is a age to when they are accountable but we don't know what it is. Baptizing is for believers as a commandment after they get save as a sign of what they believe.

As for the last one can I'm not sure what you are wanting to know other then who they are and to go through all the history to why they are an important part of Israel and the end times today would take for ever for me to wright.

Is this what you wanted?:wondering
Well you are warmer than I thought you would be.
For the record our govt never moved any dates.

Just all the preaching and verse quoting you are doing, had me wondering what level of faith your congregation served.
That is where I feel religions really turn people off. When they throw out these :::: I have been saved, born again, rants backed up with vague exerpts from scripture, telling people they are sinners but not telling them what they are doing wrong.

It really creates a confusion/rift in peoples stock in religion, and that is why so many get upset or turn their backs to anything to do with religion.
What is sin?...transgression of the law..
What is the law? The 10 commandments.

Its really that simple from the biblical context .There is more to the 10 commandments than many congregations preach.


It wont be all good.. repentance is a lifes work that is never done no matter how much a guy claims he has been saved or born again.That is why baptism has to be done later in an adult life to wash away sins.But tru churches decide when an adult is worthy of baptism.

And people have been lied to so much when a guy preach es on them, it just ticks em off.
There is a fine line of preaching and passing judgment which is what many people get offended by.

So what I was asking was, does a guy drop off a engine at your house this month and roll up to christmas lights and trees..

Like I said before I am religous but even many religous people get offended with preaching when its not done by a real preacher doing the real works of the Lord.

What I am getting at is that people believe what they believe. Its not your job or my job to ram it down their throats. If a guy wants to believe in big bang theories, ufo's or evoloutionism, then let him at it.
When he ASKS me or you about the bible then maybe lay some scripture on them.
I am politely telling you that nobody on here or in most places wants religion rammed down their throats from you or me especially if it comes off as judgmental.

[fabiodriven]

By what measure do you use to say that you are a good person?

You're directing that question at the one person who can't answer it for you. Ask anyone else who knows me.


We have evolved from other existing lifeforms on this planet. That's a fact

This is in fact wrong. I'm not positive where I got that from but I shouldn't have written it.


Am I saying you're stupid for believing in religion? Yes, yes I am.

I would like to retract this statement.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Well you are warmer than I thought you would be.
For the record our govt never moved any dates.

Just all the preaching and verse quoting you are doing, had me wondering what level of faith your congregation served.
That is where I feel religions really turn people off. When they throw out these :::: I have been saved, born again, rants backed up with vague exerpts from scripture, telling people they are sinners but not telling them what they are doing wrong.

It really creates a confusion/rift in peoples stock in religion, and that is why so many get upset or turn their backs to anything to do with religion.
What is sin?...transgression of the law..
What is the law? The 10 commandments.

Its really that simple from the biblical context .There is more to the 10 commandments than many congregations preach.


It wont be all good.. repentance is a lifes work that is never done no matter how much a guy claims he has been saved or born again.That is why baptism has to be done later in an adult life to wash away sins.But tru churches decide when an adult is worthy of baptism.

And people have been lied to so much when a guy preach es on them, it just ticks em off.
There is a fine line of preaching and passing judgment which is what many people get offended by.

So what I was asking was, does a guy drop off a engine at your house this month and roll up to christmas lights and trees..

Like I said before I am religous but even many religous people get offended with preaching when its not done by a real preacher doing the real works of the Lord.

What I am getting at is that people believe what they believe. Its not your job or my job to ram it down their throats. If a guy wants to believe in big bang theories, ufo's or evoloutionism, then let him at it.
When he ASKS me or you about the bible then maybe lay some scripture on them.
I am politely telling you that nobody on here or in most places wants religion rammed down their throats from you or me especially if it comes off as judgmental.

I don't know who said we are going to have this holiday this day or that, I just know Christ wasn't bone that day and we don't know what day but we do know about when.

The reason to use the Word of God when you are talking to people is because there is power to change people in His word, nothing I say on my own has any power. So to win someone to Christ it is important to use the word.

The 10 commandment were given to show man he can't keep live up to them. And Jesus only gave us 2 commandments! What are they?

Baptism does not wash away your sins, it only a picture of what has happen to you, the death, burial and resurrection. That why you don't get sprinkled on, you go down under the water and come back up. That's the picture of being baptized into Christ. The ONLY thing to wash away your sins is nothing but the blood of Jesus.

Jesus said to GO into the whole world and preach the gospel. He didn't say sit and wait here to see if someone will ask you how to be saved.

Is it easy no, is it all good no. Is it what he said, yes. Is the gospel offensive, yes it is and everyone will claim you are shoving it down their throats. I know all that already and that is why I started out in my first post that there is a war that goes on, but that's just part of doing Gods will or sitting back and do my will.

[Mickey Dunlap]

[QUOTE=fabiodriven;1342911]You're directing that question at the one person who can't answer it for you. Ask anyone else who knows me.



You are the one that said you are a good person, so if you make a statement you should be able to tell us by what measure you make that statement by. That's a pretty simple question, isn't it?

[Mosh]

I don't know who said we are going to have this holiday this day or that, I just know Christ wasn't bone that day and we don't know what day but we do know about when.

The reason to use the Word of God when you are talking to people is because there is power to change people in His word, nothing I say on my own has any power. So to win someone to Christ it is important to use the word.

The 10 commandment were given to show man he can't keep live up to them. And Jesus only gave us 2 commandments! What are they?

Baptism does not wash away your sins, it only a picture of what has happen to you, the death, burial and resurrection. That why you don't get sprinkled on, you go down under the water and come back up. That's the picture of being baptized into Christ. The ONLY thing to wash away your sins is nothing but the blood of Jesus.

Jesus said to GO into the whole world and preach the gospel. He didn't say sit and wait here to see if someone will ask you how to be saved.

Is it easy no, is it all good no. Is it what he said, yes. Is the gospel offensive, yes it is and everyone will claim you are shoving it down their throats. I know all that already and that is why I started out in my first post that there is a war that goes on, but that's just part of doing Gods will or sitting back and do my will.
And conversely Mickey much more harm has been done by improper preaching and worshiping false doctrines set forth by man for recruitment than good. If you cant look around and see that then something is wrong.
I wish you good will.

[ironchop]

God says there are none that are good, no not one, for all have sinned and come short of the glory of God. So where are you? It is so simple, God has took all that everyone of us need and gave it to us as a free gift by hanging Jesus on the cross to bore our sins, and all you have to do is believe that by faith and ask God to forgive you and to come into you your heart, even a 5 year old can do that.


ya know, I was fine with you trying to save us all until I read this part.

So by your own definition, I am a sinner and you are a sinner. Everyone is a sinner.

Do you NOT see the hypocrisy in this statement?......So a sinner (you) is going to call me a sinner too and I`m just supposed to listen to the guy (you) who is, by Biblical definition, no better than me and I am supposed to blindly follow the man whom is just as blind as I am? Because a sinner knows all about how I too can become what? A righteous sinner?

The biggest problem I have with today`s drive-thru version of Christianity is that someone, who claims to be no better than I am in the eyes of God, is hellbent on telling me how how to be a better piece of crap. Do you fail to see why that`s a load of malarkey to me? You are expecting that I should be smart enough to figure out that we are all just mindless apes whom would eat their own feces and fornicate wildly if not for the glory of God and his promise of everlasting salvation IF I choose to worship him wholeheartedly and "give myself" to his son.....whom I might add he crucified in order for us to continue being mindless apes but without that pesky retribution for our irresponsible behavior.

He allowed his own son to be murdered by the local Roman death squad to what? Prove a point to humanity? "My son had to die because you are all fkups. So get your act together or face hell in eternity".....yeah because murdering someone else always makes me tow the line.

I get so ticked off every time I hear some "well-meaning" person tell me that all the Evil in the world, all the tragedies, all the senselessness is just "part of His Plan"......or my personal favorite "God is testing you to see if you are worthy and if your faith is strong" as that person`s child dies of a brain tumor or from being hit by a drunk driver.

I`m not Abraham. If God asked me to kill my son to prove my loyalty I would tell him to get @#$%%#......and I would NOT feel a bit bad about loving my own son enough to not murder him so that someone else respect my faith.......You can`t possibly hope to gain any followers with this stuff.

Point is Mickey, folks like you have an image problem.....the image you put forth is one of Defeatism (because we are damned sinners by default). Why would I even want to do anything good at all when it doesn't matter ultimately? What apparently matters to people like you is that after I commit heinous crimes and acts against humanity all I need to do is repent and worship......God expected me to be an ass so I can go whole hog because allowing him to control me (even though you claim he already does control everything but somehow bad people have free will whereas good Christians gave up their free will in exchange for eternity in paradise)

What is the point of Hell, then ? By your own words, it`s merely where non-believers go.....doesn`t matter if they weren`t all that bad just matters if they worshipped God. No God, No Heaven.....this guy over here? Oh he killed seven kids with an axe but ya know what? He found God while in prison so he`s welcome in the kingdom.....doesn`t sound like any kingdom I want to be a part of. You can have it.

Now I know these are all generalizations and we both know that this is NOT the message that was intended from the Bible but for some reason people who claim God guides them still want to interpret that book however it suits them for whatever the circumstance and frankly I am tired of it. BTW there are more than ten Commandments just like there were several books that were purged from the Bible as we know it today. So apparently Christianity today picks and chooses and doesn`t follow any real proscribed doctrine all except for that "make sure you worship me or else" part. On the other hand, God expects complete obedience doesn`t he? So why don`t any of you who are proselytizing preach the whole word? Why not preach the whole truth?

You freely admit that you don`t agree with the dates for Christian holidays or the manner in which they are celebrated. So what does the Bible say about those who turn a blind eye to Blasphemy? You know damn well what it says. Are you patrolling the mean streets and getting the word out that we are all hellbound unless we repent immediately? No, you have bills to pay just like us. Does God give a damn if you have bills to pay? Nope. You can make excuses to us but we both know God doesn`t accept excuses, does he? So this makes you really just a part-time believer just like all the rest....but secretly Mickey, I`ll bet you believe that since you are saved it`s ok with God for you to be a part-time righteous person because God only concerns himself with the condemnation of Unbelievers

No, that isn`t what was written as the word of God and that`s not what was intended. That sure is what is being broadcast though, isn`t it?

The fact that you even implied that I am nothing but Hell fodder in the eyes of God because I don`t show up and idol worship in some building that raises money for an entity that doesn`t even need money, on the wrong friggin Sabbath day, while paying homage to a martyr by eating crackers and grape juice like it somehow represents the atrocity I witnessed while watching Passion of Christ, all while you tell me nevermind all the inconvenient inconsistencies, half truths, outright lies, and abominations?......well It`s not me that looks crazy, is it?....the fact that Christians outright adopted pagan holidays should have incurred God`s wrath a long time ago.

When you cheat at a basketball game there are punishments levied against you but I guess it`s just OK to cheat at being Christian, right? You don`t have to follow the rules in The Good Book to a "T",just be completely obedient in your worship and ask forgiveness for being such a flawed creature from the person whom CREATED these flawed creatures......Ironic. You are boiling it down to sound as if in a cruel twist of irony, God knows he created little monsters but his whole point was for you to just REALIZE you are a little monster and be sorry for being a monster even though you have no control over how you were designed......that's crap, buddy and I don`t care if that makes anyone mad. If only Frankenstein had realized his sinfulness and repented for being to blame for his own creation by the good Doctor Frankenstein then the townsfolk would have put away the pitchforks and torches and lived happily ever after......this just sounds insane to me

Remember Matthew 12:12? It`s ok for people to sell cross jewelry, though and I always have been amazed at how many people are wearing idols around their necks in church. In modern times instead of flipping over tables in the Temple and running people out for selling religious trinkets and sacrificial animals all Jesus would have to do is walk through Any Church USA and rip the necklaces off of people. Now you`ve tried hard to stay as far away from Golden Cow as you could by adopting a wooden cross but does that really change the definition of Idolatry? Does that not redirect your worship of God into more a worship of the act of Christ`s killing?

My point is Mickey, THIS is what you come off sounding like. Now it may float your boat but it raises alarm bells for me all the way around.

I live my life trying to love unconditionally. I don`t steal, cheat, maim, kill, adulterate, bear false witness or any number of things. I do covet my trike collection so sue me. I try to live with Honor and Integrity. I was born with a kind heart and I was taught right from wrong by wonderful people. Implying that I`m not as decent as I think I am because I`m not decent by God`s standard is arrogant and baseless. The difference between you and I is that I try to be good because to be otherwise is rude, selfish, mean, and inconsiderate whereas you try to be good because you fear a wrathful God and a loss of his grace....So which of us is selfless and which one is looking out merely for his own salvation and nothing more?

[El Camexican]

for some reason, knowing your internet persona thus far, THIS is the funniest damn thing you have posted this week.

In hindsight I doubt I'd have made it past the first screening:naughty:

[Mickey Dunlap]

And conversely Mickey much more harm has been done by improper preaching and worshiping false doctrines set forth by man for recruitment than good. If you cant look around and see that then something is wrong.
I wish you good will.

Only God know, I can only do what he says.

You didn't answer my question about the 2 commandments. What are they?

[RIDE-RED 250r]

And conversely Mickey much more harm has been done by improper preaching and worshiping false doctrines set forth by man for recruitment than good. If you cant look around and see that then something is wrong.
I wish you good will.


True true words right there!!!

The gospel, good thing. The idea of church and fellowship as it was originally intended, good thing... "Religion", that thing, ordained and institutionalized by men, I can live without. These type of rigid, judgmental ideologues are the modern day Pharisees who got it all wrong (if you are one who believes in the new testament gospel).

[Mickey Dunlap]

ya know, I was fine with you trying to save us all until I read this part.

So by your own definition, I am a sinner and you are a sinner. Everyone is a sinner.

Do you NOT see the hypocrisy in this statement?......So a sinner (you) is going to call me a sinner too and I`m just supposed to listen to the guy (you) who is, by Biblical definition, no better than me and I am supposed to blindly follow the man whom is just as blind as I am? Because a sinner knows all about how I too can become what? A righteous sinner?

The biggest problem I have with today`s drive-thru version of Christianity is that someone, who claims to be no better than I am in the eyes of God, is hellbent on telling me how how to be a better piece of crap. Do you fail to see why that`s a load of malarkey to me? You are expecting that I should be smart enough to figure out that we are all just mindless apes whom would eat their own feces and fornicate wildly if not for the glory of God and his promise of everlasting salvation IF I choose to worship him wholeheartedly and "give myself" to his son.....whom I might add he crucified in order for us to continue being mindless apes but without that pesky retribution for our irresponsible behavior.

He allowed his own son to be murdered by the local Roman death squad to what? Prove a point to humanity? "My son had to die because you are all fkups. So get your act together or face hell in eternity".....yeah because murdering someone else always makes me tow the line.

I get so ticked off every time I hear some "well-meaning" person tell me that all the Evil in the world, all the tragedies, all the senselessness is just "part of His Plan"......or my personal favorite "God is testing you to see if you are worthy and if your faith is strong" as that person`s child dies of a brain tumor or from being hit by a drunk driver.

I`m not Abraham. If God asked me to kill my son to prove my loyalty I would tell him to get @#$%%#......and I would NOT feel a bit bad about loving my own son enough to not murder him so that someone else respect my faith.......You can`t possibly hope to gain any followers with this stuff.

Point is Mickey, folks like you have an image problem.....the image you put forth is one of Defeatism (because we are damned sinners by default). Why would I even want to do anything good at all when it doesn't matter ultimately? What apparently matters to people like you is that after I commit heinous crimes and acts against humanity all I need to do is repent and worship......God expected me to be an ass so I can go whole hog because allowing him to control me (even though you claim he already does control everything but somehow bad people have free will whereas good Christians gave up their free will in exchange for eternity in paradise)

What is the point of Hell, then ? By your own words, it`s merely where non-believers go.....doesn`t matter if they weren`t all that bad just matters if they worshipped God. No God, No Heaven.....this guy over here? Oh he killed seven kids with an axe but ya know what? He found God while in prison so he`s welcome in the kingdom.....doesn`t sound like any kingdom I want to be a part of. You can have it.

Now I know these are all generalizations and we both know that this is NOT the message that was intended from the Bible but for some reason people who claim God guides them still want to interpret that book however it suits them for whatever the circumstance and frankly I am tired of it. BTW there are more than ten Commandments just like there were several books that were purged from the Bible as we know it today. So apparently Christianity today picks and chooses and doesn`t follow any real proscribed doctrine all except for that "make sure you worship me or else" part. On the other hand, God expects complete obedience doesn`t he? So why don`t any of you who are proselytizing preach the whole word? Why not preach the whole truth?

You freely admit that you don`t agree with the dates for Christian holidays or the manner in which they are celebrated. So what does the Bible say about those who turn a blind eye to Blasphemy? You know damn well what it says. Are you patrolling the mean streets and getting the word out that we are all hellbound unless we repent immediately? No, you have bills to pay just like us. Does God give a damn if you have bills to pay? Nope. You can make excuses to us but we both know God doesn`t accept excuses, does he? So this makes you really just a part-time believer just like all the rest....but secretly Mickey, I`ll bet you believe that since you are saved it`s ok with God for you to be a part-time righteous person because God only concerns himself with the condemnation of Unbelievers

No, that isn`t what was written as the word of God and that`s not what was intended. That sure is what is being broadcast though, isn`t it?

The fact that you even implied that I am nothing but Hell fodder in the eyes of God because I don`t show up and idol worship in some building that raises money for an entity that doesn`t even need money, on the wrong friggin Sabbath day, while paying homage to a martyr by eating crackers and grape juice like it somehow represents the atrocity I witnessed while watching Passion of Christ, all while you tell me nevermind all the inconvenient inconsistencies, half truths, outright lies, and abominations?......well It`s not me that looks crazy, is it?....the fact that Christians outright adopted pagan holidays should have incurred God`s wrath a long time ago.

When you cheat at a basketball game there are punishments levied against you but I guess it`s just OK to cheat at being Christian, right? You don`t have to follow the rules in The Good Book to a "T",just be completely obedient in your worship and ask forgiveness for being such a flawed creature from the person whom CREATED these flawed creatures......Ironic. You are boiling it down to sound as if in a cruel twist of irony, God knows he created little monsters but his whole point was for you to just REALIZE you are a little monster and be sorry for being a monster even though you have no control over how you were designed......that's crap, buddy and I don`t care if that makes anyone mad. If only Frankenstein had realized his sinfulness and repented for being to blame for his own creation by the good Doctor Frankenstein then the townsfolk would have put away the pitchforks and torches and lived happily ever after......this just sounds insane to me

Remember Matthew 12:12? It`s ok for people to sell cross jewelry, though and I always have been amazed at how many people are wearing idols around their necks in church. In modern times instead of flipping over tables in the Temple and running people out for selling religious trinkets and sacrificial animals all Jesus would have to do is walk through Any Church USA and rip the necklaces off of people. Now you`ve tried hard to stay as far away from Golden Cow as you could by adopting a wooden cross but does that really change the definition of Idolatry? Does that not redirect your worship of God into more a worship of the act of Christ`s killing?

My point is Mickey, THIS is what you come off sounding like. Now it may float your boat but it raises alarm bells for me all the way around.

I live my life trying to love unconditionally. I don`t steal, cheat, maim, kill, adulterate, bear false witness or any number of things. I do covet my trike collection so sue me. I try to live with Honor and Integrity. I was born with a kind heart and I was taught right from wrong by wonderful people. Implying that I`m not as decent as I think I am because I`m not decent by God`s standard is arrogant and baseless. The difference between you and I is that I try to be good because to be otherwise is rude, selfish, mean, and inconsiderate whereas you try to be good because you fear a wrathful God and a loss of his grace....So which of us is selfless and which one is looking out merely for his own salvation and nothing more?


I'm sorry but you haven't been listening to anything I said because you twisted it all. How you get murder from " For God so loved the world, that he gave his son............." He loves you sooooo much that he made a way for sin to be washed away. Any thing you twist away from that is just not something I'm going to read. If you really went back and read everything I said it is nothing even close to what you said.

[Mickey Dunlap]

True true words right there!!!

The gospel, good thing. The idea of church and fellowship as it was originally intended, good thing... "Religion", that thing, ordained and institutionalized by men, I can live without. These type of rigid, judgmental ideologues are the modern day Pharisees who got it all wrong (if you are one who believes in the new testament gospel).


I understand what you are saying, man can mess things up, that's why it is so important to find a church that doesn't waver on the word. Having said that, there are no perfect churches, even if I found one I couldn't go there because then it wouldn't be perfect anymore! lol

[ironchop]

I'm sorry but you haven't been listening to anything I said because you twisted it all. How you get murder from " For God so loved the world, that he gave his son............." He loves you sooooo much that he made a way for sin to be washed away. Any thing you twist away from that is just not something I'm going to read. If you really went back and read everything I said it is nothing even close to what you said.

then how did you know what I "twisted" if you indeed didn`t read it?

you are your own adversary....which is sad, really.

So if my sins are washed away already ahead of time then I can do as I please right? If Jesus was murdered (calling it anything other than that is a lie) 2000 years before I was born so that my sins I have not committed yet will be excused when I do commit them as long as I have His favor for my repentence and my request for forgiveness?

Yer digging yourself a giant hole, Mickey. If you think you can condescend to others without facing condescension as well then I probably gave you more credit than I should have. If God`s will is for you to piss everyone on a trike forum off as a way to save souls then I am truly in awe.

Good day

[El Camexican]

So how about them quantum physics?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STF0moww_zQ

[tripledog]

God sent Mickey here. It is yet another one of his tests.

[Chopsaw]

God sent Mickey here. It is yet another one of his tests.

Put me down for " Failed "

[350XJEDI]

I think i failed too!
thanks for the interesting thread fabio.

[fabiodriven]

You are the one that said you are a good person, so if you make a statement you should be able to tell us by what measure you make that statement by. That's a pretty simple question, isn't it?

It's all been written. You don't see anything outside of your Jesus Christ! bubble. I don't know how I could express myself any more thorough than what's been written in this thread. Seeing where as you choose not to take anything I say for face value, ask someone else. I don't mind if it's difficult for you to relate to me or take me for my word. We are from two different planets.

[Mickey Dunlap]

then how did you know what I "twisted" if you indeed didn`t read it?

you are your own adversary....which is sad, really.

So if my sins are washed away already ahead of time then I can do as I please right? If Jesus was murdered (calling it anything other than that is a lie) 2000 years before I was born so that my sins I have not committed yet will be excused when I do commit them as long as I have His favor for my repentence and my request for forgiveness?

Yer digging yourself a giant hole, Mickey. If you think you can condescend to others without facing condescension as well then I probably gave you more credit than I should have. If God`s will is for you to piss everyone on a trike forum off as a way to save souls then I am truly in awe.

Good day

You read it but didn't understand it, or you didn't read all of it, so you have twisted it, either way. Now I will take the time to go over ever thing with you to help you understand it if you want, but if you are not wanting to do that and you don't want to understand it then there is no reason to go into all. Let me know if you want to understand it.

[Mickey Dunlap]

It's all been written. You don't see anything outside of your Jesus Christ! bubble. I don't know how I could express myself any more thorough than what's been written in this thread. Seeing where as you choose not to take anything I say for face value, ask someone else. I don't mind if it's difficult for you to relate to me or take me for my word. We are from two different planets.

No, there has to be a standard by what you measure how good of person you are, what is it? You are dancing around the simple question.

[fabiodriven]

No, there has to be a standard by what you measure how good of person you are, what is it? You are dancing around the simple question.

No I'm not. I've said it over and over and don't feel like repeating myself.

[Mickey Dunlap]

No I'm not. I've said it over and over and don't feel like repeating myself.


Well I must have missed it, could you share it one more time?

[kaymo]

By what measure do you use to say that you are a good person?



i dont know about everyone else, but i will answer this one as a non-christian

I have a conscience. It was developed over time by doing things and seeing how it effected myself and others. Things that i did that negatively effected other people despite how my outcome was made me feel badly. thus my conscience developed to automatically judge outcomes of decisions before i made them. I deem myself a good person when i follow my conscience, which i rarely deviate from. I still find times in life when i must ignore my conscience and do things solely to improve my own situation, but nothing that is so terrible that makes my conscience hurt.

i learned right and wrong from my parents. they did not have to use god or satan, heaven or hell, to teach me right from wrong. yes you can teach a 5 year old to believe in imaginary friends and get him to believe in god because its a lot easier to explain existence to a 5 year old by saying some powerful being made everyone and everything and we thank him daily for doing so than to explain the big bang, evolution, and the history of the planet. its a much neater package thats easier to deliver and it makes disipline easier when you tell them god (and this time of year, santa) is always watching.

i for one hope that god doesnt see everything, i like to jerk off sometimes and that would be just creepy lol

i dont steal and i dont rip people off and i dont intentionally hurt anyone. i consider myself a good person and dont need anyone telling me im not a good person because i didnt accept jesus as my personal savior. I have plenty of real people to thank for the person i have become.

[El Camexican]

No, there has to be a standard by what you measure how good of person you are, what is it?

There sure is. I think it's made by Toledo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrLzYw6ULYw

Mickey, did you watch the video I posted? It offers a scientific explanation of how it would be possible for God to be everywhere and in everything all at once.

[Mickey Dunlap]

There sure is. I think it's made by Toledo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrLzYw6ULYw

Mickey, did you watch the video I posted? It offers a scientific explanation of how it would be possible for God to be everywhere and in everything all at once.


That was so true, yet funny at the same time! Perfect! lol

No I didn't watch the video, I know how he is everywhere.

[Mickey Dunlap]

i dont know about everyone else, but i will answer this one as a non-christian

I have a conscience. It was developed over time by doing things and seeing how it effected myself and others. Things that i did that negatively effected other people despite how my outcome was made me feel badly. thus my conscience developed to automatically judge outcomes of decisions before i made them. I deem myself a good person when i follow my conscience, which i rarely deviate from. I still find times in life when i must ignore my conscience and do things solely to improve my own situation, but nothing that is so terrible that makes my conscience hurt.

i learned right and wrong from my parents. they did not have to use god or satan, heaven or hell, to teach me right from wrong. yes you can teach a 5 year old to believe in imaginary friends and get him to believe in god because its a lot easier to explain existence to a 5 year old by saying some powerful being made everyone and everything and we thank him daily for doing so than to explain the big bang, evolution, and the history of the planet. its a much neater package thats easier to deliver and it makes disipline easier when you tell them god (and this time of year, santa) is always watching.

i for one hope that god doesnt see everything, i like to jerk off sometimes and that would be just creepy lol

i dont steal and i dont rip people off and i dont intentionally hurt anyone. i consider myself a good person and dont need anyone telling me im not a good person because i didnt accept jesus as my personal savior. I have plenty of real people to thank for the person i have become.

I had something to say but El Camexican's video all ready said it all.

It is Appointed Unto Man Once to Die, and Then the Judgement

[El Camexican]

That was so true, yet funny at the same time! Perfect! lol

You do realize how asinine that seems to all non-born again people, right? The concept is no different than getting someone else to take a test for you, or using a cheater engine to win a race, but it sure is a great way to get a bunch of people who have either been bad, or told they are bad to step up and join the Christ club.

[Mickey Dunlap]

You do realize how asinine that seems to all non-born again people, right? The concept is no different than getting someone else to take a test for you, or using a cheater engine to win a race, but it sure is a great way to get a bunch of people who have either been bad, or told they are bad to step up and join the Christ club.

Yes I understand how crazy everything I talk about sounds to the unbeliever. Like I said I always believe I would go to heaven because deep down I had a good heart. This let your conscience be your guild doesn't quite work. Your conscience get less and less convicting as we sin more in one way or the other. One person says he's a good person but he hides his porn from his wife and kids. Why hide it if there is nothing wrong with it. That might not have been the best subject to use on here. lol I'm sure I'll hear about that! So one person feels it's OK to come in late to work and leave early but doesn't think it's steeling. I could go on and on but the point is there is no standard to base how good you are. God says it very plain, there are none that do good, no not one!

[ironchop]

You read it but didn't understand it....

Right, because I`m an ignorant non-believer.



or you didn't read all of it, so you have twisted it,

what a logical conclusion......I don`t read therefore, I twist.....out in Left field again Mr. Dunlap, grasping for imaginary straws



either way. Now I will take the time to go over ever thing with you to help you understand it

Condescension.....look it up


......if you want,.....

NO, dude.....that's wtf we all been trying to tell you this entire thread but you won`t take NO for an answer so you get what you give


Let me know if you want to understand it.

for the final time.....Thanks for the offer but NO

[fabiodriven]

Well I must have missed it, could you share it one more time?

Honestly if you know what good means you can take my word I am a very good person or you can go back and read where I already wrote it. I feel as though I'm going to have to explain what "being a good person" means and I'm not going to explain to you how to do that right here.


This let your conscience be your guild doesn't quite work.

Assuming you meant "guide", letting your conscience be your guide does not work for you. That doesn't mean that it doesn't work for other people however.


Your conscience get less and less convicting as we sin more in one way or the other.

This should read-
My conscience get less and less convicting as I sin more in one way or the other.

[ironchop]

Can we just go back to talking about Quantum Physics?

I`m really trying hard not to sound like a dick or attack anyone for their beliefs at all.

I honestly believe in a Supreme Creator.....I just don`t subscribe to the current school of thought on that.

This thread is like starting a thread about the 86 250R and while everyone comments on that model and how it compares to other makes, One guy shows up and proclaims that the 87 KXT250 is the one and only way and that anyone who doesn`t think so is uneducated and a non-believer and will surely perish in fire for their insolence regarding trike choices. While I agree the 87 KXT was the king IMO, I`m not going to browbeat everyone in a 250R thread into changing sides because I know secrets they don`t.

[fabiodriven]

The thread will continue on about quantum physics Doug. This is something that I am passionate about and need to find more information. The links provided by you and the other members will have me busy for a while and I'll be revisiting this thread for a long time chasing links. This is a thread I've been debating on putting up for a long time, but I wanted to learn a bit before I did. I've learned a lot on my own and a lot from this thread, which I thank you all for, and I'll continue to study and post back. I've got a lot going on right now so it might take me a bit to build up a reserve of new information to discuss and share. By all means, let the thread continue and the thoughts fly. It's a fantastic subject.

[El Camexican]

[QUOTE=Mickey Dunlap;1343032]This let your conscience be your guild doesn't quite work.QUOTE]

Sure it does!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOZzNOkcEgM

[Mickey Dunlap]

Right, because I`m an ignorant non-believer.




what a logical conclusion......I don`t read therefore, I twist.....out in Left field again Mr. Dunlap, grasping for imaginary straws




Condescension.....look it up



NO, dude.....that's wtf we all been trying to tell you this entire thread but you won`t take NO for an answer so you get what you give



for the final time.....Thanks for the offer but NO

I never call you anything, you are trying to put words in my mouth. I gave you a heart felt invite to go though everything with you point by point, but you don't want to do that because you already know what I said. You don't want to hear it so you twist it to sound bad, but anyone that reads it can see with plane old common sense what it all means.

In the end it will come down to this.

For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name,so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth,and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Honestly if you know what good means you can take my word I am a very good person or you can go back and read where I already wrote it. I feel as though I'm going to have to explain what "being a good person" means and I'm not going to explain to you how to do that right here.



Assuming you meant "guide", letting your conscience be your guide does not work for you. That doesn't mean that it doesn't work for other people however.



This should read-

You can try to pick me apart because I'm just dumb old country boy that can't spell or read, but answer me this, does a good person break the laws of the land, are you above the laws? Do take it upon your self to say what is right and good above God?

[350XJEDI]

:DI have been watching the NASA chanel, science and space travel are advancing but not fast enough to get me and custom trike to mars before I'm 70 :cry:
wormholes to a different dimension that i could ride through !
Or maybe hitch a ride with some trike friendly aliens .:wondering:welcome:
:l
ol::lol:

[350XJEDI]

Was reading a article today on quantum teleportation, its just information not solid matter ,but still interesting
Scotty is not going to beam me up yet !

[JesseA420]

http://ct.fra.bz/ol/fz/sw/i53/5/9/9/frabz-Dafuq-Is-going-on-here-62aefb.jpg

thread titled "quantum physics" =\= 10 pages of a sheep trying to explain to everyone why he is part of the herd. i literally facepalmed multiple times reading through this thread.

religion is simply a form of mind control, created on the basis of explaining things that at the time of the religions creation could not logically be explained. the majority of which were unintentional psychadelic encounters they had they no knowledge of. beit inhaling fumes from a burning acacia bush which is high in concentration of dmt and seeing mystical visions, snacking on a tasty looking fungus that looks similar to that button mushroom u had for dinner last night which just so happened to hold another unknown chemical at the time, or simply a traumatic event that triggers an indogenous dump of dmt through your blood brain barrier.

mickey, go start a religion thread or contribute. quit derailing.


OP im not going to go back and quote bc its so far back but on page 4, alot of that stuff you mentioned in the post on that page is pre-cognition. i was reading an article about theory and this was a comment at the bottom.

"Amidst the twists and turns in the development of quantum theory, it is hard to sort out what has been proven, or at least firmly established, from what is conjecture. As I understand the current situation, Bell's theorem has put an end to Einstein's general approach, as well as to the de Broglie-Bohm kind of search for hidden variables, by proving (and I do mean proving in the mathematical sense) that no LOCAL hidden-variable theory can be consistent with the formalism of quantum theory (and hence bolstered by the vast wealth of experimental evidence supporting that formalism). However, it leaves open the possibility of a NONLOCAL hidden- variables approach, and in fact David Bohm's later work veered in that direction.

But Bell's approach has actually deepened the mystery by showing that nonlocality really has to be admitted and that widely separated events are coordinated and do in fact exert influences on one another. What has happened is that the alternative of his thought experiment that Einstein (and Podolsky and Rosen) believed to be absolutely inadmissible turned out to be the one that actually is true. So, although some things have been clarified, the findings are just as mysterious, from our human point of view, as they were before. Incidentally, David Bohm was very willing to accept new findings and modify his theories to conform to them and thus exemplified a true scientific spirit, whereas many others get stuck in a rut and go through life unable to admit they were wrong.

Best regards,

Donald W. Zimmerman"

if all the crap religion comments were filtered out of this thread it may become half decent. OP u should clean house.

also i seen interstellar this weekend, fantastic film :)

[Mickey Dunlap]

You know I think about it every time someone says, give it a rest Mick we don't want to here it, and I remember all the times I said that to the people that tried to tell me about Gods love for us and how to be born again. But then I think of how selfish we are when we tells me to shut the F up! Maybe there is someone that needs to hear it. Maybe it's not right now, maybe it's later, maybe it's you later, maybe it was this guy that had to jump on 9-11. Did someone tell him how to get saved before he had to jump? God says "today is the day of salvation" because you don't know if you will have another chance, you may not make it another day. I think about when someone like my self last month when I need prayer and some say, "prayers sent" Do you know if you are not born again your prayers don't reach God, if you are unsaved God doesn't hear you. The only prayer is the one you pray when you want to be save and you want to be a child of God, that's the only prayer he hears before you are a child of his. So I will not stop preaching the Gospel of the good news of Jesus. It is very selfish for you to even suggest that I do!

[350XJEDI]

You just cant stop ,stay on topic or start your BORING BORN AGAIN thread that no one will read

[Mickey Dunlap]

You just cant stop ,stay on topic or start your BORING BORN AGAIN thread that no one will read

Then no one's reading it here either then so what does it matter? Don't read it! Last time I checked this is a OPEN FORUM! And this is America, freedom of speech!

[dave ytz250s]

Hey Mickey, I don't know who you are, you seem like a good person but your addiction to Jesus is starting to look like an alcoholic or a drug addict that can't admit he's abusing of a substance that can be good if taken with moderation. But it's even worst, you want everybody to do like you no matter what they think or believe. So please for god's sake, say something about quantum physics!!

[Mickey Dunlap]

Hey Mickey, I don't know who you are, you seem like a good person but your addiction to Jesus is starting to look like an alcoholic or a drug addict that can't admit he's abusing of a substance that can be good if taken with moderation. But it's even worst, you want everybody to do like you no matter what they think or believe. So please for god's sake, say something about quantum physics!!

Sure, even God says in his word that he would like to see everyone come to him, but we both know different. But since we don't know who will and who won't you have to tell everyone. But you can't tell who,or where I can tell them and who will hear it. If they don't want to hear it don't read it. But telling me I can't say it is wrong. If someone opens a thread on 4 stroke 200x's and someone jumps in and talks about two stroke motorcycle do they tell him to stfu? Oh and I'm not addicted to Jesus, but he is the biggest part of my life and there is nothing bad about him, you are talking about addictions that are bad for you and causes death.

[JesseA420]

this is America, freedom of speech!

no u nincompoop. this is the internet. (explain the internet to jesus later when u talk to him he pry will think u are god)
here things called message boards have threads, usually and in this case, titled with the topic to be discussed. this thread is not entitled "religion discussion". im sure there are plenty of bible loving message boards who would love to discuss further with you. QUIT DERAILING this thread.

quit peer pressuring me to believe this cult u follows idealogy, i am offended.

what does a thread have to do to get some moderation around here?

[350XJEDI]

Yes to freedom of speech and freedom of religion and most importantly the second amendment,

i am Catholic but that doesn't mean i cant think for myself i won't be judged by you ,luckily
god made quantam physics and everything in the universe, all we need to do is learn more understanding of it al so we can
and go out there and multiply and realize the true potential of the gifts we were given
there is infinite possibilities for hum

[350XJEDI]

We are made to think try it

[Mickey Dunlap]

no u nincompoop. this is the internet. (explain the internet to jesus later when u talk to him he pry will think u are god)
here things called message boards have threads, usually and in this case, titled with the topic to be discussed. this thread is not entitled "religion discussion". im sure there are plenty of bible loving message boards who would love to discuss further with you. QUIT DERAILING this thread.

quit peer pressuring me to believe this cult u follows idealogy, i am offended.

what does a thread have to do to get some moderation around here?

What is the difference in you telling me what to do? Simple question.

[Mickey Dunlap]

Yes to freedom of speech and freedom of religion and most importantly the second amendment,

i am Catholic but that doesn't mean i cant think for myself i won't be judged by you ,luckily
god made quantam physics and everything in the universe, all we need to do is learn more understanding of it al so we can
and go out there and multiply and realize the true potential of the gifts we were given
there is infinite possibilities for hum

That's what I said if you took the time to read it, keep looking, keep learning. I already know the one that made everything!

[JesseA420]

lets take it back to basics. double slit experiment.

what do u think makes the particles react differently while being viewed, as to not being viewed when being shot through the double slit? what role does consciousness play?

[El Camexican]

lets take it back to basics. double slit experiment.

what do u think makes the particles react differently while being viewed, as to not being viewed when being shot through the double slit? what role does consciousness play?

I liken it to trying to pee when someone is watching. Stuff just reacts differently.:lol:

The beam me up Scotty thing is a mind bender. I worked with a guy years a go that swore we'd be able to do it in less than a 100 years. He may just have been right. Tesla's story is on History channel down here on Saturday. Be sure to tune in if they are showing it up there!
205883

[redsox]

I'm no quantum physicist, and i'm no Jesus junkie. i have no horse in the race. i don't know the answers, and i don't really care to know. the more i learn, the less i'm sure of, and the less i like. I do know that Mikey is getting his head kicked in for posting his opinions in a thread where religion is a main topic. Religion, and its comparisons to QF, is a large part of the starting post. Why should he not weigh in? If he's gonna post about Jesus, where should he post it?? i think this is the place. You don't have to like what he says. you don't have to read it. but this is the forum for it. I know we had a decent weed thread going a little while back that got hijacked by Jesus and subsequently shut down. That thread had nothing to do with Jesus. it got chippy, and, boom. GONE. Discussions are not the same as arguments. A bunch of you guys would be happier if you understood that. All this bashing is killing my vibe lately. its all over the site. You say tomato, i say you're a jerk. Thats not how things should be. Rant over. Resume physics.

[Billy Golightly]

I've deleted, locked and banned people for threads and posts that made my head hurt trying to decipher them or for poor assed attitudes more than anything here. Rarely for the content, but anyways.


This has been a really good interesting discussion so far, don't let it devolve into name calling because you don't agree with someones opinion or it frustrates you.

[JesseA420]

ya m8, teslas story is a good one, i recently read "the man who invented the 21st century", decent read.


I liken it to trying to pee when someone is watching. Stuff just reacts differently.:lol:


so u consciously are aware they are watching, which changes your behavior. think about this in reference to the true definition of infinity. science to date can only see as far in space as light has been able to reach, since the creation of the universe. everyday we can see farther because light has traveled farther. as far as technology has advanced, we are still simply limited by our capabilities.
what if some... thing is so small, infinitely smaller than our nano-scale, that makes up the particles, with its own consciousness and is fully aware of our actions, and is reacting to being viewed, just as you are pissing in front of your buddy, (lol). after all, when viewed with our most advanced viewing devices, atoms are mostly empty space, yet all matter is physically made of them, and are what make matter a "physical thing" to us. what if they arent empty space, but made up of something infinitely smaller than our viewing capabilities.
or maybe they arent infinitely smaller, but just slightly smaller than our current capabilities, and a slight advancement will lead to all the answers.

infinity is a fascinating concept.
here is an article about consciousness i read recently, lengthy but good.

http://themindunleashed.org/2014/11/every-7-years-body-mind-spirit-evolve-ways.html



PS why does u r without the space, turn into trail pros? @.@


DMT .....you might learn how to chill...
it will teach you the fact that we arent individuals, the collective consciousness is undenyable that is for sure. the word "they" dissappears from your vocabulary lol. the rest is completely undescribeable, but if an ayahuasca ceremony was a worldwide requirement when u turn 22, it would solve all the worlds problems without a doubt. the best part is you dont have believe anything. u just have to have the courage to let it show you the answers.

[fabiodriven]

I am very impressed with my brethren here, very. We have some smart people on these boards, indeed we do.

JesseA420, you appear to be very well versed in this subject, much more so than I. What I need is someone like you that I can spend time with in person. People fail to realize "you are the company you keep". If anyone doesn't understand what I mean, you are far more likely to become a certain type of person should you choose to spend the majority of your time with said group. If you hang out with drug addicts, you'll probably become one. If you spend time with successful people you'd be much more likely to be successful on your own. I only have one friend that I can relate to with the law of attraction stuff, but as I stated earlier in the thread he is a religious man so we cannot connect on quantum physics. I have nobody to relate to on that level. I enjoy educating myself but the best way to learn, in my opinion, is with other people. You stand to benefit from the point of view and experience of another person or people. If you can assemble a group of like minded people all with a collective goal, you can build yourself a "mastermind" and all serve to benefit from each others experience, knowledge, and ultimate success. I have been invited to a group and know one of the guys in it, he's actually the person that introduced me to the law of attraction and set the wheels in motion to change my life for the better. I went to a meeting once and brought my friend of whom I already mentioned, the one who I discuss the law of attraction with. I was turned off because they had some kind of business theme going like a pyramid scheme and I'm all set with that. However that's not all these people are about. Their ultimate goal is to be more successful in life, an idea which I share wholeheartedly. What I find is that most people are so greed driven that success to them is measured in dollars. This part I do not share in their view of. I don't concern myself that much with currency, I concern myself with genuine happiness. Once you're happy and know what you want, all else will follow. I'm still curious about this "master mind", but I'd like to connect with them on a level outside of gaining wealth and then see what follows. I'm not looking for a pyramid scheme to easy street, I want knowledge as I find this to be true power and the answer to many, many situations.


lets take it back to basics. double slit experiment.

what do u think makes the particles react differently while being viewed, as to not being viewed when being shot through the double slit? what role does consciousness play?

It's amazing, isn't it? The best part about this stuff is that it's so amazing because it is real. There are so many tidbits such as this out there that can assist greatly in the art of manifestation. It works!

Jesse some of that stuff you posted I really had to read about 10 times in order to digest it, and it's not all that often I have trouble digesting written information. Truly great words posted and I thank you for those!

I started this thread with a post heavily populated with religious subjects, therefor I see nobody to blame if there is too much religion in this thread but myself. Mickey is free to write as he wishes. Quite honestly I feel as though it bolsters my points about religion even if it's unintentionally so.

Mickey I reported your post with the poor man jumping out of the building. It effects me so deeply to imagine what that man would think if you told him his last second on earth would be captured on film and used as someone's little internet agenda banner. I'm actually upset you made me see that and now I'm commenting and therefor thinking about this. Just my opinion, you have a sick mind posting things like that regardless of what the keyboard jockey splashed across it to make it "fit for public consumption". I'd appreciate it if you deleted it if the mods haven't already. The fact that you can post that in good conscience and then call us sinners is exactly the kind of hypocritical attitude that turns me off to religion. That picture is morbid in my opinion and I don't appreciate it. On September 11th, 2001, I was 21 years old and driving a tractor trailer up route 95 in Massachusetts. I heard about what was going on through the Howard Stern show, which is based out of New York City. I used to move military personnel when they transferred to different bases. When we arrived at the home to move the people in it hadn't yet set in what was going on. We stopped about halfway through the move as they frantically wanted the TV. We hooked it up and watched the horror unfold. The following year I served in Iraq which subsequently effected my life greatly and I would appreciate it if you showed a little more respect to the entire 9/11 situation by not posting those kinds of pictures.

I have a theory I've hatched a long time ago and I've never uttered it to anyone, ever. I'm not sure I ever will so I'm not making any promises here. I like to learn things and watch a theory change or evolve with new information. It's obviously not uncommon for people to wonder why we're here, who created us, where we came from, etc... I have my own theory based on my limited education on the universe. I feel as though all types of people from all walks of life and the diversity this planet has is enough to want someone to make us, even if it were just merely to observe. That alone seems like enough for someone to create life. There is one common thing that I feel man has to offer from all creeds, sexes, ages, and nationality. It is a wacky thought but certainly not impossible. I'm curious what others think, all kidding aside, as far as why we're here, who made us, etc... This part I won't say no more religion, but I will say right off that most of us are familiar with religion and what the beliefs are there. I don't feel as though there is a really big need in a thread about quantum physics to hear about religious origins only because most of us, if not all, are very familiar with religion on this particular part of the subject. My aim here is to get some modern, fresh thoughts that are science based and don't rely on the boundaries of religion, which I happen to find close minded.

[Mickey Dunlap]

I understand why you guys get made at any talk about God, it's like salt in a open wound. Salt hurts for a time, but in more time it heals. I keep telling you guys to keep reading and keep learning because everything is going to lead you to not worry so much of how the stars were formed, but who made the stars. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, (Genesis 1:16-17, KJV)


The wisdom and all the knowledge you are looking for is in a study of only 1 book of the bible, and that would give you so much you couldn't handle it, Proverbs!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Why would I start with QF, that would be going backwards :wondering

1:1 The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel;


1:2 To know wisdom and instruction; to perceive the words of understanding;


1:3 To receive the instruction of wisdom, justice, and judgment, and equity;


1:4 To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion.


1:5 A wise man will hear, and will increase learning; and a man of understanding shall attain unto wise counsels:


1:6 To understand a proverb, and the interpretation; the words of the wise, and their dark sayings.


1:7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge: but fools despise wisdom and instruction.



You talk about hanging out with people that are of like mind, who came up with that, God! There is a place people of great wisdom meet every week, it's called "The Church". You can study every book in the world, but you will only find the answers to everything in the bible, that's why it's called the living bible, the more you study the deeper it gets. Not only that but it's the creator of the world!

I study the bible with the help of the Strong's exhaustive concordance, with both the Greek and Hebrew.

205922


You talk about wanting to prosper, and here again is the answers but you don't take the time to study it!:wondering

Psalm 1:1–3

1 Blessed is the man that walks not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor stands in the way of sinners, nor sits in the seat of the scornful.

2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law does he meditate day and night.

3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that brings forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatever he does shall prosper.

[Billy Golightly]

I missed the image the first time through, and still didn't even see it after it was reported (I don't know why, blended in with the background or something I guess), but yeah, I deleted that. I understand the point, but that was pretty poor taste and usage...

[greenhuman]

To me religious kooks are brain damaged.

[JesseA420]

thanks for the reply fabio. i only know a little bit about a little bit, but make an effort to learn something new everyday. i did reread your first post, and you did make lots of references to religion, but i feel religion has no part in a QF discussion, and here is why. other than buddism, every ancient religion was created on the basis of making sense of things at the time they could not explain. "do u know why that happened" "no?" "must have been the work of god, write it down!" after you do that several thousand times and publish it with the heaviest poetic license in history, and advertise it as the work of the lord, people have no reason not to believe, because they didnt know any better and didnt have anyway to findout otherwise.
fortunately for humankind, today we do. science explains phenomena WITH FACTUAL EVIDENCE.

mickey i have read u are "born again" which i assume means u were not brainwashed with these ideas from birth, but rather u chose to believe a book of nursery rhymes. with this ability to choose, i assume u did research on every worldly religion and after comparing, objectively made a decision based on what was most logical to you? because if not, i have news for u, seeing how all religions believe their god is the one and only god(other than buddism), all you were doing was picking straws. every post you have posted in this thread, is simply quotes from a fairy tale novel.
can you form your own opinions?
i would love to hear you form a objective idea that didnt involve "its the lords work!" i would love to hear your actual opinions as to what i referenced in my first post of this thread about the logical explainations to the instances i referenced. also a follow up to my request about telling jesus about how me and you are right now wirelessly conversating, instantaneously from 1000s and 1000s of miles away. i am dead serious.

have you even had spiritual experiences/encounters? because i have. i have had many. and contrary to what u spew, they have led me to believe it is the exact opposite of what the cult leader talked you into believing. they have taught me to form my own opinions, based on my experiences and the knowledge i have gathered from them.
the idealogy i live my life by, is that we are all part of a collective consciousness. ever wonder why there is not a pinpoint exact location of our actual consciousness in this organic computer we call a body? perhaps it is because it doesnt actually reside in our bodies. perhaps our brain is merely receiver/tuner like a radio is to a fm signal, or a television is to a broadcasted signal. thats why i said there is no they. we all are we. do i know this for a fact? no. this is what i have gathered based on my PERSONAL EXPERIENCES. is there a god? i dont know. and neither do you. you think you know, but really you just think you do. just like every follower of every other religion on the planet.
your ego that formed based on external stimuli is clouding you from realizing just how infinitely amazing simply being conscious is, and with that in mind giving the credit to a external entity u call "god" is really selling yourself(US) short. attaching the word "god" to something you deem to be HIGHER than our complexity is completely preposterous. we are a god. you are a god. i am a god. it really means nothing.
in every one of my posts am i trying to force feed everyone viewing this thread this idealogy? no. that would come off completely obnoxious and seem like a mind control tactic, just like everyone of your posts. just because you blindly believe a book wrote thousands of years ago without proof does not mean everyone else is that gullible.

fabio i would stay away from any gathering of individuals that have that mindstate. in all honesty, unless you are in a university where you can converse with physicists and philosophers, your not going to find the open mindedness you are looking for. but luckily for us, we have the internet. search out and study many physicists and philosophers findings, and form your own opinions and ideas based on your findings. there is tons of podcasts out there also, where these highly informed and intelligent beings explain their findings. pm me if you want some info on some links.

[atc007]

Just had a service guy here for alarms. Super polite great guy to speak too. He was telling me of the curse of "little trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotr ailpro" The Porsche Spyder that killed James Dean,, Aftr his tale, I immediately thought of this tread...Which I have yet to read unfortunately.. WILL someday.. The conversation evolved from him spotting a almost New Suzuki LT 250R out for fresh air today. He said his buddy raced Zillas.. Somehow thinking he had talked over me lol... Anyhow, I told him I had new and old of them and they were cool. And I had owned one that had killed not one,but two men. I very reluctantly took it on trade and very ,very reluctantly sold it after a LONG disclosure to the buyer how I thought it should be burnt... Not kidding. Anyhow, he said the car had killed men before Dean owned it.. He also said it killed the tow truck driver the day of the crash,,,slid off the ramp,,,,And Pieces of the wreckage sold off later by George Berris,were involved in fatal crashes, There are most certainly much larger things at work above/around us then we will most likely ever know. We are indeed,,,,Tiny,,miniscule ,little unseeable pinpoints in a GIGANTIC universe. Treat others better than you feel you should be treated and live happy.

[ironchop]

I have engaged the Quantum Power of my Mighty Ignore List

and`s it`s made this thread and many others suddeny so much more enjoyable. No way to get mad or frustrated if you can`t even see what someone is saying or are failing to make any headway whatsoever, right?. It`s a Win-Win IMO.

Whom am I to thank for this tool for peace?

[Mickey Dunlap]

thanks for the reply fabio. i only know a little bit about a little bit, but make an effort to learn something new everyday. i did reread your first post, and you did make lots of references to religion, but i feel religion has no part in a QF discussion, and here is why. other than buddism, every ancient religion was created on the basis of making sense of things at the time they could not explain. "do u know why that happened" "no?" "must have been the work of god, write it down!" after you do that several thousand times and publish it with the heaviest poetic license in history, and advertise it as the work of the lord, people have no reason not to believe, because they didnt know any better and didnt have anyway to findout otherwise.
fortunately for humankind, today we do. science explains phenomena WITH FACTUAL EVIDENCE.

mickey i have read u are "born again" which i assume means u were not brainwashed with these ideas from birth, but rather u chose to believe a book of nursery rhymes. with this ability to choose, i assume u did research on every worldly religion and after comparing, objectively made a decision based on what was most logical to you? because if not, i have news for u, seeing how all religions believe their god is the one and only god(other than buddism), all you were doing was picking straws. every post you have posted in this thread, is simply quotes from a fairy tale novel.
can you form your own opinions?
i would love to hear you form a objective idea that didnt involve "its the lords work!" i would love to hear your actual opinions as to what i referenced in my first post of this thread about the logical explainations to the instances i referenced. also a follow up to my request about telling jesus about how me and you are right now wirelessly conversating, instantaneously from 1000s and 1000s of miles away. i am dead serious.

have you even had spiritual experiences/encounters? because i have. i have had many. and contrary to what u spew, they have led me to believe it is the exact opposite of what the cult leader talked you into believing. they have taught me to form my own opinions, based on my experiences and the knowledge i have gathered from them.
the idealogy i live my life by, is that we are all part of a collective consciousness. ever wonder why there is not a pinpoint exact location of our actual consciousness in this organic computer we call a body? perhaps it is because it doesnt actually reside in our bodies. perhaps our brain is merely receiver/tuner like a radio is to a fm signal, or a television is to a broadcasted signal. thats why i said there is no they. we all are we. do i know this for a fact? no. this is what i have gathered based on my PERSONAL EXPERIENCES. is there a god? i dont know. and neither do you. you think you know, but really you just think you do. just like every follower of every other religion on the planet.
your ego that formed based on external stimuli is clouding you from realizing just how infinitely amazing simply being conscious is, and with that in mind giving the credit to a external entity u call "god" is really selling yourself(US) short. attaching the word "god" to something you deem to be HIGHER than our complexity is completely preposterous. we are a god. you are a god. i am a god. it really means nothing.
in every one of my posts am i trying to force feed everyone viewing this thread this idealogy? no. that would come off completely obnoxious and seem like a mind control tactic, just like everyone of your posts. just because you blindly believe a book wrote thousands of years ago without proof does not mean everyone else is that gullible.

fabio i would stay away from any gathering of individuals that have that mindstate. in all honesty, unless you are in a university where you can converse with physicists and philosophers, your not going to find the open mindedness you are looking for. but luckily for us, we have the internet. search out and study many physicists and philosophers findings, and form your own opinions and ideas based on your findings. there is tons of podcasts out there also, where these highly informed and intelligent beings explain their findings. pm me if you want some info on some links.

Why is it you PM me and call me a muppet, but you wouldn't answer my question to you?

Is there anyone that has believes a nursery rhymes, if that's all the bible is, why does it change peoples hearts? I had the faith of a child and didn't know anything, but there was something telling me this is right. It's a hard thing to do in front of 2 guys you just met, to get down on your knees and pray a simple but humble prayer, to ask God to forgive me, I have sinned against you, I believe your son died for me, to wash away all my sins forever, and to come into and live in me, thank you Lord for saving me!

I had no real idea what would and did happen in the blink of a eye, but it was by faith I was saved. You can't argue about that. You can't even begin to under stand anything about what God does to the hearts of men. I was dead spiritually. Now it's been since 3-18-1992 that that happen to me, and you would think if it was just some feeling I got it would have past by now. I remember my first win racing mini bikes, pretty big deal at the time. I raced for many years, but it didn't stay with me. I remember getting my first big contract with American Honda, a life long dream came true, one of only a small few that can say that, but it didn't stay with me. In fact it didn't take long before I was looking for the "bigger better deal"! But when Christ came in to my heart it for ever changed me, He is always with me, even when I turn my back to him, He's still there. You mock what you don't understand! Yes I can say for 100% God is real, and that everything He says is 100% true weather you believe it or not. Fairy tails and nursery rhymes, are just that, it's weak to say the bible is anything like that, and anyone that says that has never studied that facts, they just mock it with out really looking at the facts. It easy to say it's just this or that but not one of you has really set out to find the truth so you cop out and just say it's a nursery rhyme. So all we have here is some very selfish people trying to stop me from telling people the greatest thing you could ever tell them, putting down something they have no idea about. I say this is a sign of weak people grasping at something they admit can't be proven.

[Billy Golightly]

I have engaged the Quantum Power of my Mighty Ignore List

and`s it`s made this thread and many others suddeny so much more enjoyable. No way to get mad or frustrated if you can`t even see what someone is saying or are failing to make any headway whatsoever, right?. It`s a Win-Win IMO.

Whom am I to thank for this tool for peace?
I use it too, it makes things so much nicer..

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

[JesseA420]

It's a hard thing to do in front of 2 guys you just met, to get down on your knees
here are your puppetmasters my friend. i have no idea what your PM meant so why would i reply.
there is no mocking going on m8. just because u take offense to the way i refer to a several thousand year old book wrote in metaphors for the reader to interpret the way they seem fit, doesnt mean i am mocking it. it is what it is.

this comment has me mind boggled, honestly it does.

some very selfish people trying to stop me from telling people the greatest thing you could ever tell them, putting down something they have no idea about. I say this is a sign of weak people grasping at something they admit can't be proven.
you say were selfish because we dont need you to save us, at the same time selfishly trying to force your ideas into everyones face regardless of the response over and over. you say we are weak, right after saying things such as "I was dead spiritually" and "the faith of a child and didn't know anything" about yourself. u selfishly assume everyone is weak like you were and needs help like you did/do. the irony here is mind blowing.




you quoted my entire response, yet literally repeated your 100% real 100% true 100% facts again, and once again provided no other reasoning other than how, the idea it is true, has changed your life. if that idea is what has made your life marvelous to you then great, but you failed to answer any of my directly straight to the point questions in my quote about actual things, that u quoted. please, i await your answers.

[Mickey Dunlap]

here are your puppetmasters my friend. i have no idea what your PM meant so why would i reply.
there is no mocking going on m8. just because u take offense to the way i refer to a several thousand year old book wrote in metaphors for the reader to interpret the way they seem fit, doesnt mean i am mocking it. it is what it is.

this comment has me mind boggled, honestly it does.

you say were selfish because we dont need you to save us, at the same time selfishly trying to force your ideas into everyones face regardless of the response over and over. you say we are weak, right after saying things such as "I was dead spiritually" and "the faith of a child and didn't know anything" about yourself. u selfishly assume everyone is weak like you were and needs help like you did/do. the irony here is mind blowing.




you quoted my entire response, yet literally repeated your 100% real 100% true 100% facts again, and once again provided no other reasoning other than how, the idea it is true, has changed your life. if that idea is what has made your life marvelous to you then great, but you failed to answer any of my directly straight to the point questions in my quote about actual things, that u quoted. please, i await your answers.




I asked a simple question, "What does your name (JesseA420) mean"? You couldn't understand that?:wondering

You mock Gods word and you don't even know anything about it. You can't fully understand it unless you have Christ living in you, and that is why people who are not born again come up with selfish reasons to believe parts that doesn't fit their way of life. Lets just take a look at what qualifies someone to be a pastor. He must also be “the husband of one wife” (I Timothy 3:2; Titus 1:6). Now my mom goes to a church where the wife is the pastor, but since that doesn't line up with what she wants to do, "they say that's what they did back then, but today things have changed". No! Gods word does not change. See that's where things go wrong , when people change the word to fit their life style.

You say it boggled you mind, what I say, I know you can't understand the things of God. You don't want me to be able to preach the Gospel because you feel it's all made up, but what about everyone that is reading this, don't they matter? Isn't that self centered you wanting me not to share with those that want to hear. I'm not taking any thing you say personal, everything I say is what God says to tell to all the world. I can't save you, that's Gods part, I can't force you and either will God force you to do anything, it's all your choice, you have all the free will you want, but when it comes down to death, your choice to reject everything you heard then there won't be anymore choices to be made. What is so mind blowing about that? It is so simple, you just are not there and I keep saying that's OK, keep searching.

I don't see any direct questions to me I need to answer, did I miss something or did you miss the answer?:wondering

[JesseA420]

the username? its somewhat of a social experiment so as to show a persons character based on how their view of the world has been formed based on their ideas/stereotypes etc. and no i dont partake, but thanks for the character confirmation.

as for the questions once again i facepalm. here let me hold your hand and lead you to them. i shall bold them so you do not get confused.


i have read u are "born again" which i assume means u were not brainwashed with these ideas from birth, but rather u chose to believe a book of nursery rhymes. with this ability to choose, i assume u did research on every worldly religion and after comparing, objectively made a decision based on what was most logical to you? because if not, i have news for u, seeing how all religions believe their god is the one and only god(other than buddism), all you were doing was picking straws. every post you have posted in this thread, is simply quotes from a fairy tale novel.
can you form your own opinions?
i would love to hear you form a objective idea that didnt involve "its the lords work!" i would love to hear your actual opinions as to what i referenced in my first post of this thread about the logical explainations to the instances i referenced. also a follow up to my request about telling jesus about how me and you are right now wirelessly conversating, instantaneously from 1000s and 1000s of miles away. i am dead serious.

have you even had spiritual experiences/encounters? because i have. i have had many. and contrary to what u spew, they have led me to believe it is the exact opposite of what the cult leader talked you into believing. they have taught me to form my own opinions, based on my experiences and the knowledge i have gathered from them.
the idealogy i live my life by, is that we are all part of a collective consciousness. ever wonder why there is not a pinpoint exact location of our actual consciousness in this organic computer we call a body? perhaps it is because it doesnt actually reside in our bodies. perhaps our brain is merely receiver/tuner like a radio is to a fm signal, or a television is to a broadcasted signal. thats why i said there is no they. we all are we. do i know this for a fact? no. this is what i have gathered based on my PERSONAL EXPERIENCES. is there a god? i dont know. and neither do you. you think you know, but really you just think you do. just like every follower of every other religion on the planet.
your ego that formed based on external stimuli is clouding you from realizing just how infinitely amazing simply being conscious is, and with that in mind giving the credit to a external entity u call "god" is really selling yourself(US) short. attaching the word "god" to something you deem to be HIGHER than our complexity is completely preposterous. we are a god. you are a god. i am a god. it really means nothing.
in every one of my posts am i trying to force feed everyone viewing this thread this idealogy? no. that would come off completely obnoxious and seem like a mind control tactic, just like everyone of your posts. just because you blindly believe a book wrote thousands of years ago without proof does not mean everyone else is that gullible.


also i would like to hear your opinion on my idealogy which is underlined.

remember form your own opinions based on your experiences, no bible quotes.

[Mickey Dunlap]

the username? its somewhat of a social experiment so as to show a persons character based on how their view of the world has been formed based on their ideas/stereotypes etc. and no i dont partake, but thanks for the character confirmation.

as for the questions once again i facepalm. here let me hold your hand and lead you to them. i shall bold them so you do not get confused.



also i would like to hear your opinion on my idealogy which is underlined.

remember form your own opinions based on your experiences, no bible quotes.



The answer to your username is great!:lol:Can't even give a straight answer to that.:rolleyes::rolleyes:

As far as all the religions and their gods, where are they?, they are all dead! Jesus is the only one the was resurrected from the dead, and is seated at the right hand of the Father. That's it, I worship a living savior which lives also in me. So to answer a silly question about how we can talk from one place to another by computer or phone is nothing compared to how I can talk to God through the spirit. That's the real question! The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God, a living God!

As far as your spiritual experiences/encounters, I believe that 100% to be true. Do I know which spirit is behind it all, yes I do, but there is nothing wholly about him. By your own words you don't even know how he has impressed his ways on you. He will come into you if you ask too. He can come across as a angel of light, he likes to fool you into believing his ways, he roars around like a lion, but he is defeated by the cross. He is also why you keep saying don't use Gods Word! Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Any more question?

[JesseA420]

i have literally facepalmed more times in reading your comments than i ever have, in my life.
that is exactly what the username is intended for, sorry you cannot comprehend, and understand the concept.

religions are all dead? LOL. ill take that as a "no i did not do objective research and come to a conclusion based on said research, i just picked one and ran with it".

all i got from your final paragraph is that you, in fact, have not had any of your own spiritual experiences/encounters which makes everything you spew just passed down information, and zero first hand accounts. it is hilarious listening to you say you know what my experiences mean when u have never even had any of your own, LOL.

fortunately, i dont need to crutch on an idea of a higher being to feel i have a fullfilled and happy life. i dont need faith in an idea, i have faith in myself. i am my own god. instead of working on following said idea, perhaps you should work on understanding why you dont have faith in yourself without that idea. think about that.

with that said ive had enough of these bible babblings and need pointed to the direction of the ignore feature. if someone would point me in that direction that would be fantastic. sincerely sorry for feeding the troll btw. lets get back to theory talk.

[Mickey Dunlap]

i have literally facepalmed more times in reading your comments than i ever have, in my life.
that is exactly what the username is intended for, sorry you cannot comprehend, and understand the concept.

religions are all dead? LOL. ill take that as a "no i did not do objective research and come to a conclusion based on said research, i just picked one and ran with it".

all i got from your final paragraph is that you, in fact, have not had any of your own spiritual experiences/encounters which makes everything you spew just passed down information, and zero first hand accounts. it is hilarious listening to you say you know what my experiences mean when u have never even had any of your own, LOL.

fortunately, i dont need to crutch on an idea of a higher being to feel i have a fullfilled and happy life. i dont need faith in an idea, i have faith in myself. i am my own god. instead of working on following said idea, perhaps you should work on understanding why you dont have faith in yourself without that idea. think about that.

with that said ive had enough of these bible babblings and need pointed to the direction of the ignore feature. if someone would point me in that direction that would be fantastic. sincerely sorry for feeding the troll btw. lets get back to theory talk.

I understand what you username says, it's just funny how you answer a simple question. :rolleyes:

Being born again is spiritual experiences if you want to word it that way, the highest form for that matter. And not only do I know about mine I said I believe in yours too. It's just yours has a sad ending that I pray you don't go to. Calling me muppet and a troll only shows your god as you say is weak, and the one true God is true. Seems to be a pattern here. Tell Mickey to stop talking about Jesus, and to stop quoting the bible. Then when that doesn't work walk away after twisting everything I said. Oh and don't forget to correct his spelling!

[redsox]

JesseA420,,, you brought the heat with your first post. i was very, very impressed. fast ball down the middle. but I'm now skeptical. more on that later. but first, let me say that i've had some long boring hours lately and this thread has been a crutch for me. super interesting. i love the content. especially the science and the theories and the "what if's." mind blowing stuff. but i especially enjoy the juxtaposed old school religious angle. maybe a bit over the top sometimes, but mickey can take a punch. he keeps getting hammered but sticks to his guns. if you read my earlier post, you'd see that i admittedly don't know where we come from. i don't know the meaning of life. i don't know who God is, or why we're here. i enjoy the bertrand russell quote about the wise and the foolish. i think it applies well here. now before any of you think i'm tossing bombs calling you guys fools, i'm not. i'm just saying i think science can be dangerous. todays facts will be laughed at tomorrow. i'll give you an example. i'm a fan of old books. not books written along time ago, but rather books that are themselves old. i have an old text book from the fifties. its called "Man and the Animal World." Quite a read. its so backwards its laughable. but, i always think how it must have been written smart guys. scientists. the top guys of the time. things that were "facts" in that book are not "facts" now. science has changed things. the "facts" have changed. the rate of intellectual development is exponential now. we learn faster. things change faster. it won't be long before future generations look back on us as dolts. our grandkids will laugh at us as simpletons. the more doors science opens, the more questions arise. theories spawn theories. new facts replace old facts. round and round we go. my question is, does anyone think that QP will answer the "why are we here" or "where did we come from"? does anyone think that it will get answered? like, someone will someday say, "huh, there it is. there is the answer. through this microscope i can prove the big bang and we were all monkeys and there was another shooter on the grassy knoll" i doubt it. my position is that we cannot know. we were not meant to know. additionally, in this short time we're here, knowing does not matter. does it? if we did know, would it change anything? would future generations believe us? or would knowing become laughable? a fairy tale, balked at and disproven by future science.

as for JesseA420,, are you one person? or a team effort? some things in your later posts don't add up. i'm skeptical.

[El Camexican]

Just had a service guy here for alarms. Super polite great guy to speak too. He was telling me of the curse of "little trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotr ailpro" The Porsche Spyder that killed James Dean,, Aftr his tale, I immediately thought of this tread...Which I have yet to read unfortunately.. WILL someday.. The conversation evolved from him spotting a almost New Suzuki LT 250R out for fresh air today. He said his buddy raced Zillas.. Somehow thinking he had talked over me lol... Anyhow, I told him I had new and old of them and they were cool. And I had owned one that had killed not one,but two men. I very reluctantly took it on trade and very ,very reluctantly sold it after a LONG disclosure to the buyer how I thought it should be burnt... Not kidding. Anyhow, he said the car had killed men before Dean owned it.. He also said it killed the tow truck driver the day of the crash,,,slid off the ramp,,,,And Pieces of the wreckage sold off later by George Berris,were involved in fatal crashes, There are most certainly much larger things at work above/around us then we will most likely ever know. We are indeed,,,,Tiny,,miniscule ,little unseeable pinpoints in a GIGANTIC universe. Treat others better than you feel you should be treated and live happy.

Great (but tragic) stories that bring up an important point that has been touched on here already.

In my opinion things of this terrible nature (curses if you will) are related to the laws of attraction. If you allow something to enter and remain into your psyche it will eventually manifest into reality. It works both ways, good and bad. The King Tut curse, James Dean's car, the quad you had, Voodoo etc. Did you see the guy in the Internet the other day that tried to auction himself off the other day and only got like $20 bucks? He proclaims himself to be the worlds least employable person and he right. Not because he is, but because he believes he is!

Nothing is worse that a defeatist attitude in this life. As someone said; "whether you believe you can or you can't you're probably right" I doubt that the laws that govern this universe will ever be fully understood in our lifetimes, but one thing I am certain of is that we reap what we sow mentally as well as physically.

I hope the guy that bought that quad converted it into a trike and lived happily ever after.:)

[atc007]

Great (but tragic) stories that bring up an important point that has been touched on here already.

In my opinion things of this terrible nature (curses if you will) are related to the laws of attraction. If you allow something to enter and remain into your psyche it will eventually manifest into reality. It works both ways, good and bad. The King Tut curse, James Dean's car, the quad you had, Voodoo etc. Did you see the guy in the Internet the other day that tried to auction himself off the other day and only got like $20 bucks? He proclaims himself to be the worlds least employable person and he right. Not because he is, but because he believes he is!

Nothing is worse that a defeatist attitude in this life. As someone said; "whether you believe you can or you can't you're probably right" I doubt that the laws that govern this universe will ever be fully understood in our lifetimes, but one thing I am certain of is that we reap what we sow mentally as well as physically.

I hope the guy that bought that quad converted it into a trike and lived happily ever after.:)

My point exactly,,We reap what we sowe. As I know Fabio has seen.

Edit,,,My response didn't make a lot of sense relative to This post. I was tired,lol. I did put a whole 5 minutes of research into the Little Baztard,The pieces auctioned off,,,2 tires ,and another piece. They were clearly bought by fans. And then,,years later,,raced on, .I think,,,, someone who bought them,brought them into their lives,,,then went RACING on them, Had ZERO connotations they were cursed or haunted...But ended up dead anyhow.. The remains of the wreckage also fell over at Berris' shop and broke a workers legs,,,Stuff happens lol,,,,but,,,,,, I will make a separate post which I think is EXTREMELY important to all of this later...

[HondaXRider]

I think this thread should be turned into a book called LIFE???
Everyone needs something to hang on to.... to help them get through this life. Because no one is perfect everyone needs something to fill in the gaps.

[atc007]

I would like to ask how many here believe in ghosts, Furthermore,,,who have watched Ghost Hunters.It's a show on History channel, just finished their 10th season on tv. But have been ghost hunting MUCH longer. Long story short. I did not believe. My Wife watched the show religiouslly, I soon realized the founders, Jason and Grant,were as straight of shooters as you are going to find.Are they human ,sure, But wouldn't compromise their integrity for drama or anything else. They are Roto rooter guys by trade. And go into every investigation{,for free I might add} to DISprove everything that's going on. Over the years,I have watched them film ghosts of all shapes and sizes. Sounds,voices,things moving,almost every episode. One trick they have is loosening their flashlight to the point of no contact on the battery . And interviewing the ghost ,the ghost can turn the flashlight on for yes. We have watched this SO many times it is almost common. Ghosts are real, what realm are they existing in? Scary and sad. One investigation,,Here in Hershey PA. Old restaurant. Grandpa and Grandma are roaming this restaurant up and down the stairs,,,Blowing out the candles all the time,,, Broke my heart. I have personally had one 1st hand experience at my Sisters. They are absolutely REAL, How do we explain that??

[JesseA420]

JesseA420,,, you brought the heat with your first post. i was very, very impressed. fast ball down the middle. but I'm now skeptical. more on that later. but first, let me say that i've had some long boring hours lately and this thread has been a crutch for me. super interesting. i love the content. especially the science and the theories and the "what if's." mind blowing stuff. but i especially enjoy the juxtaposed old school religious angle. maybe a bit over the top sometimes, but mickey can take a punch. he keeps getting hammered but sticks to his guns. if you read my earlier post, you'd see that i admittedly don't know where we come from. i don't know the meaning of life. i don't know who God is, or why we're here. i enjoy the bertrand russell quote about the wise and the foolish. i think it applies well here. now before any of you think i'm tossing bombs calling you guys fools, i'm not. i'm just saying i think science can be dangerous. todays facts will be laughed at tomorrow. i'll give you an example. i'm a fan of old books. not books written along time ago, but rather books that are themselves old. i have an old text book from the fifties. its called "Man and the Animal World." Quite a read. its so backwards its laughable. but, i always think how it must have been written smart guys. scientists. the top guys of the time. things that were "facts" in that book are not "facts" now. science has changed things. the "facts" have changed. the rate of intellectual development is exponential now. we learn faster. things change faster. it won't be long before future generations look back on us as dolts. our grandkids will laugh at us as simpletons. the more doors science opens, the more questions arise. theories spawn theories. new facts replace old facts. round and round we go. my question is, does anyone think that QP will answer the "why are we here" or "where did we come from"? does anyone think that it will get answered? like, someone will someday say, "huh, there it is. there is the answer. through this microscope i can prove the big bang and we were all monkeys and there was another shooter on the grassy knoll" i doubt it. my position is that we cannot know. we were not meant to know. additionally, in this short time we're here, knowing does not matter. does it? if we did know, would it change anything? would future generations believe us? or would knowing become laughable? a fairy tale, balked at and disproven by future science.

as for JesseA420,, are you one person? or a team effort? some things in your later posts don't add up. i'm skeptical.

not sure what u are skeptical about, i apologized for antagonizing, i just wanted to feel him out.
what do you mean by u think science is dangerous? i mean of course the things we believed to be true 50 years ago seem crazy now, that is due to the technological advancements growing exponentially in these past few years. it would not have been the case 500 years ago, as it could take that long just for information to reach someone. its a marvelous time we live in, with everything right at our fingertips. there has to be this progression, since these past findings all lead to the current findings, and the current findings will lead to the future findings.
will physics unlock the answers? they dont even know if it will or not. but that is why they are doing what they are doing. i just watched the documentary called Particle Fever this weekend on netflix. It explains the entire process from the creation of the large hadron collider, to the finding of the higgs boson particle, and what they are moving towards next. it was a fantastic watch for a layman to get the basics of what they are working towards and why they are working towards it. i cant recommend it enough. here is an article just published highlighting whats next for the collider also: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2872035/Better-faster-stronger-Large-Hadron-Collider-set-restart-March-DOUBLE-power-help-scientists-learn-God-Particle.html


i also watched "the secret", which is basically an hour and a half of phd's explaining how to be a positive person and lead a positive life.

as far as "ghostshunters", it is a reality show like every other reality show. of course they are not asking for compensation from the ones seeking ghost hunters, the television network bankrolls everything.
you say ghosts are real. but what is a ghost then? of course the phenomenon is real, but what is the phenomenon? i think the general consensus is that a ghost is a spirit that no longer has a meat suit to reside in? i cant really get behind that idea. when i theorize about "ghosts", it reminds me that how we perceive reality, is merely how our brains translate signals our eyes are sending it. everything is energy, and our eyes have only come to be able to see certain energies. All of the various lights waves, ultraviolet, infrared, color spectrum, x-rays, gamma rays, microwaves, sound waves, radio waves, EMF, radiation, etc, are "invisible" to us, but are all still there. imagine what it would be like if we could see all, or even one these existing energies. what a different reality we would exist in. heres an article about sound wave experiments, fascinating:
http://www.learning-mind.com/this-is-what-the-music-would-look-like-if-we-could-see-it-video/

what if the "ghost phenomena" is just something else our crap eyes cannot collect signals of, for our brains to translate into what we view as reality? could some be living, breathing.... creatures just made up of energies our eyes cant collect signals of?
could it be just us (the collective consciousness), strumming on this strings of time trying to communicate the answers of the universe, from a 4th or 5th dimension where time is just a physical thing where every moment of every universe is a thing, and can be controlled and manipulated long after the finding of all the answers to all quantum theories?
with so many varieties in unseen phenomena, it could be both, plus an infinite amount of other things, we just dont know merely because it isnt something our minds can translate as part of our seen reality.
what do you guys think?

will we ever find the answers? i dont know. whether good or bad(relative to us), i hope so. im 100% team people. but with how exponential the learning curve has been over the past 200 years, trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro the past 30 years, imagine what we will know 200 years from now. it gives me hope. :)

[fabiodriven]

Jesse that is a fantastic post man. I've had too much going on with work and home to be able to study as much as I'd like to be. I started this thread when I had some time off for Thanksgiving and since then the crunch has been on.

Particle Fever is an excellent watch, I've watched it a bunch of times. With almost all information on quantum physics I pick up, I have to read/watch it multiple times. I find that much of it I grasp but some of it needs to be digested more than once. I pick up a new thing every time I view this stuff, which I find great.

One thing that time has shown me is that many people lack the perception in general to even be able to understand your last post. Many people lack the ability to even imagine how many different angles of perception there are. Things that are unexplained or not understood, must be "supernatural" or "spiritual", as if there is no other explanation at all. I laugh at those who laugh at me for thinking that UFO's are real, yet they think fairy tales about magic are real. It's been so strongly drilled into their heads that UFO's don't exist yet god is real that people will dismiss that which they see with their own two eyes and go out of their way to make old fairy tales "factual". In my opinion, that train of thought is is the direct opposite of logical. Here is what I mean-

I have seen UFO's in real life with my own two eyes on more than one occasion. I have seen countless photos and videos of UFO's as well. I don't know what UFO's are, but I do know for fact that they exist as I have seen them more than once. Most people have. Your government wants to pretend they don't exist and would prefer you do the same, hence the public consensus that those who have had close encounters are crazy or liars. That's exactly what you are expected to think and that's what's been influenced unto us (you).

Neither I, nor you, nor anyone you know, has ever seen Jesus or god or Noah, nor has anyone any pictures or proof of any other form that these people ever existed, never mind performed all the "miracles" or whatever they did. It's asking a bit much in this day and age to ask for so much, so many rules, limits, do's and don'ts, and in many cases money and just as important, time, when there are so many other paths in life that could be explored without the hindrance of religion. I've said it before, science looks for answers and religion won't even ask questions. They just tell you what to think.

On the subject of life from other planets or more likely from what I've seen lately, other dimensions (laugh it up!), it's not just mathematically possible that there is other life out there, it's actually mathematically more likely than not there are other life forms out there. So we have video and photographic evidence, eyewitness accounts, my own personal experiences, a government who plays dumb (should be a huge red flag!), and science all in this corner. In the other corner we have, this old book. You must believe the book. You must believe the book. Say it with me. You must believe the book. Louder Mickey! You must believe the book! You must believe the book! YOU MUST BELIEVE THE BOOK!!!!!!!!!

[El Camexican]

When you stop and think about it religion, ghosts and UFO's all have something in common. We'd have a much, much better chance of understanding all three if there weren't so many idiots lying about their experiences with them.

[Mickey Dunlap]

You know it really is boring to hear people say the bible isn't true when the never set out to study the facts. There is so much info we have now I didn't know where to start. I challenge all you to study the facts about the bible then come back and tell me why you believe it's not true. https://search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0SO8yQBwY9UXugAq9hXNyoA;_ylc=X1MDMjc2 NjY3OQRfcgMyBGZyA3lmcC10LTkwMS1zBGdwcmlkA3g2aThUNE pNVC5hYnpRSVdqdnVfZkEEbl9yc2x0AzAEbl9zdWdnAzAEb3Jp Z2luA3NlYXJjaC55YWhvby5jb20EcG9zAzAEcHFzdHIDBHBxc3 RybAMEcXN0cmwDNjMEcXVlcnkDdGhlIGJpYmxlIGlzIHRoZSBp bmZhbGxpYmxlIHdvcmQgb2YgZ29kIHNjcmlwdHVyZSBrZW4gaG FtIHZpZGVvBHRfc3RtcAMxNDE4NzA3Mjkw?p=the+bible+is+ the+infallible+word+of+god+scripture+ken+ham+video&fr2=sb-top-search&fr=yfp-t-901-s&fp=1

[JesseA420]

http://bit.ly/1szwRgV

the ufo debate is one that i think will go on forever. from the government aspect, it makes complete sense to deny deny deny everything and anything, so as to do their best to keep the population under control. i had a "unidentified flying object" encounter last summer, but it doesnt fit into the flying saucer-ufo type sighting at all. more like a very VERY upclose encounter with what science has referred to as "ball lightning", except it did not occur in any of the same context as any of the descriptions of ball lightning i have read about. i was with another person and both my dogs, and they all 3 seen it, stopped dead in their tracks and were completely dumb founded. i still completely am left without any kind of rationalization, but i have found something that closely resembles it, which is the naga fireballs in Indonesia. it most closely resembled these, except it just came from the ground not out of water.

one aspect i find very interesting about ufo encounters is the abduction phenomena. generally, these occur while asleep, or while almost asleep in a semi-conscious to unconscious state. im sure everyone has heard the basics, your in your bed(comfortable cozy place), then you are shot out into some cold metal room where aliens prod you with utensils before you awake or return. this is also very traumatic for the "abductee"
from my experiences with meditation and subconscious exploration, your brain has stored everything your consciousness has encountered while here experiencing this reality. you do not forget anything, but simply lose connections to where those memories are stored.
while lucid dreaming or just perhaps having an overload of dmt release while sleeping, you can reconnect these lost connections to memories, and experience them with the same vivid clarity and senses stimulation like you really are there. i have, many many times.
now lets analyze what it would be like to be born. your cuddled up in your mothers woom all warm and safe. then all of a sudden you are blasted out into a cold, lit room full of beings with their hands all over you sticking devices into your holes in your face and head to clean out mucus and check for body temp. traumatic? very. also sounds just like what people refer to as being abducted dont you think.

lucid dreaming and astral projection are fascinating. i urge everyone to research and give it a shot. a background in meditation helps to understand and apply the ideas.

[El Camexican]

The truth about the Bible Mr. Dunlap is that it was written, edited and translated by the hands of flesh and blood humans. While I understand your type of Christianity (Born again) to be as closest to the teachings of Christ as there is, you have to keep in mind that there are literally billions of people who over the past 1,700 years have been oppressed, abused, murdered and tortured by those wielding the Bible and professing to be Christians.

These atrocities have been seen and experienced by humans that still live today. With all this going on you can't expect everyone to fall in line and become believers because you tell them to. As I have always said; the 10 commandments are a perfect way to live... until one person breaks one of them and the rest of us are forced to do the same in order to survive amongst them.

[Mickey Dunlap]

The truth about the Bible Mr. Dunlap is that it was written, edited and translated by the hands of flesh and blood humans And " inspired by the wholly spirit" . While I understand your type of Christianity (Born again) to be as closest to the teachings of Christ as there is, you have to keep in mind that there are literally billions of people who over the past 1,700 years have been oppressed, abused, murdered and tortured by those wielding the Bible and professing to be Christians.

These atrocities have been seen and experienced by humans that still live today. With all this going on you can't expect everyone to fall in line and become believers because you tell them to. As I have always said; the 10 commandments are a perfect way to live... until one person breaks one of them and the rest of us are forced to do the same in order to survive amongst them.


Yes there has been sufferings by people who stand for what they believe, heck I go through it on here, so what, if you don't stand up for what you believe, what do you stand for, nothing!

The only thing the 10 Commandments where given by God was to show the people that you can't live up to them, no one can apart from God.

This in the kind of nonsense I'm talking about, no one has study, they just have opinions with out facts. You don't have to do anything. You can just sit back and rattle off what ever you want, but if you want to debate something learn the facts first.

Like I said I challenge you to study the topic before giving us what you think without knowing what you are talking about. If you want IMO one of the best books to read these day get http://www.amazon.com/The-Evidence-That-Demands-Verdict/dp/0785242198

I'll bet none of you will take the time to read it!

[JesseA420]

FFS....

http://genius.com/Sturgill-simpson-turtles-all-the-way-down-lyrics
there is also a play button at the top

[El Camexican]

" inspired by the wholly spirit" I think it's spelt the holy spirit, but regardless that right there is where it gets hard to separate the fly sh*t from the pepper. You can't keep a straight face and tell me God intended for women to be treated like crap, that slaves should not try to escape their masters, or that Jews are the chosen people. That was put in the Bible by men motivated by personal interests, not the holy spirit.

As much as I'd like to have the time to read the entire Bible cover to cover I belief my soul would be better nourished in a shorter time by watching Monty Pythons "Meaning of Life"


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUspLVStPbk

[Scootertrash]

Now I'm hungry for a spam sammich. :I

[ironchop]

Now I'm hungry for a spam sammich. :I


Hey Scooter....true story.....When I was putting back some emergency food stores I made up in some buckets last week, I made sure to put plenty of two important foodstuffs:

1) Several cans of Dinty Moore Beef Stew (which my wife makes into a mean stroganoff)

2) about a case worth of SPAM!!! (which pissed my wife off because she hates the stuff)( I love SPAM)

SPAM is the official zombie apocalypse fuel for Manly Men

[JesseA420]

http://themindunleashed.org/2014/12/everything-taught-origins-lie.html

i love this article. take in those numbers very carefully. hundreds of millions. how does this make you guys feel?

[JesseA420]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/10857855_863272343729912_6577067216007039983_n.png ?oh=21d155fdae747639b86ec7b5e936aa31&oe=550CA43E&__gda__=1430381446_8534cd04c683c170d99f6f1b2c7dbe4 8

[JesseA420]

another idea to ponder while your posted up on the pooper if u fancy a read lol.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/the-dominant-life-form-in-the-cosmos-is-probably-superintelligent-robots

[fabiodriven]

another idea to ponder while your posted up on the pooper if u fancy a read lol.

http://motherboard.vice.com/read/the-dominant-life-form-in-the-cosmos-is-probably-superintelligent-robots

That is an excellent read Jesse and thank you for posting it. If I imagine that theory to be true, it really answers a lot of questions for me. This is why I stated earlier in this thread that I like to gather knowledge and watch a theory evolve.



I have a theory I've hatched a long time ago and I've never uttered it to anyone, ever. I'm not sure I ever will so I'm not making any promises here. I like to learn things and watch a theory change or evolve with new information.

Based on what I just read I can imagine exactly what human beings would be in the scenario presented in that article. It's my own personal theory, but my theory would make so much sense if advanced civilizations were in fact artificial life.

[El Camexican]

It's my own personal theory, but my theory would make so much sense if advanced civilizations were in fact artificial life.

I think we currently classify as "artificial" in the grand scheme of this planet. We sure as heck aren't a natural fixture in this environment.