200m Transplant

[wagx2]

Hello all,
found 3 wheeler world, while searching for wiring diagrams:

i have 2 85' 250es big reds, and had a 200m engine laying around and couple other parts, made a jeep to put it in, and had it straight wired to make a wiring harness, and also had it running then it just quit.

wiring diagram shows 2 yellow out of alternator, and the ones on mine are 1 yellow 1 black, is this the right alternator, or did someone switch it? I wired it to 5 wire regulator unsure if needed 4 wire one. but all seemed to work fine. and then it died no spark, have ohm'd all componets as to manual and all checked out, except cdi cause I don't think the meter will work on it as manual says need special meter tried it anyway and nothing. excitor coil ohm at 125 think cdi quit, which it was used one I had (6 pin) cdi with 5 pin plug. unsure of the model because serial number is half gone like the chain was rubbing. but then again it looks like the number stamp or plate that was used was damaged. the prefix that is on it match prefix of 85 200m in the 3 wheeler world spec section.

so I think I need cdi, but wanted to check about the rectifier, and alt. wire colors to see if I need 4 wire or 5 wire rectifier, cause I don't want to burn up anything, in this process, also if the green and yellow wires from alt are correct does it matter which yellow wires each go to in the rectifier? will move this over to discussion thread. sorry

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[YTZ drew]

Welcome! That's quite the machine you've assembled there! I agree that it sounds like the cdi went, but check for good grounding from engine to frame, frame to coil mount, and frame to cdi box. As far as the alternator wires go, they won't affect the ignition operation. It looks like originally there should have been 2 yellow wires from the engine, and they both need to go into the regulator. If your colors are different, just make sure that the pair of wires your using for the alternator have continuity between each other, but nowhere else (not ground or any other wires). That would be the best indication that you have found each end of your source coil.

[wagx2]

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i did use the wiring diagram from this site, then removed lights and switches i was not going to use then added in what i was going to use you can see the difference between the 2, and i am in process of making a harness, (the one with the color coding on it was one i made, colored beside the wires with color of what wire using in harness) when cdi quit, only thing i did wrong is i used 5 wire rectifier and cdi from a trx125, and coil is old one out of the spare parts for my 250es it ran great after i wired it, then 3 days later i tried it fired up ran for around 15mins just died, I'm kinda wondering if the 250es coil was to demanding on 125 cdi?? i wouldn't see anything wrong, because it worked fine to start with, so either something between the 2 is wrong or it was just the 125 cdi's time to go?:D

does all the 200 Hondas electronics interchange as long as plugs match? and the yellow wire don't matter as long as there the ones connected to the alt. output wires. ok I'm currently out of town for work it will be this weekend before i have time to check it all again, and order cdi, may try the $25 off ebay generic that says it fits 200m? see if i can get it by time i get back so its waiting on me!

you can see video of it running, see where I've plan to mount them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wOHRUJUaGQ

also have build video on you tube.

[YTZ drew]

The coils should be electrically interchangeable between the 250 and 125, so I don't think that's your issue. The cdi may not be exactly the same from the 125 to the 200, but it was obviously similar enough to give you spark (for a while anyway). Stupid question, but are you sure the ignition switch you're using is the small engine style, IE- closed in the off position, open in the run position?

[wagx2]

The coils should be electrically interchangeable between the 250 and 125, so I don't think that's your issue. The cdi may not be exactly the same from the 125 to the 200, but it was obviously similar enough to give you spark (for a while anyway). Stupid question, but are you sure the ignition switch you're using is the small engine style, IE- closed in the off position, open in the run position?

not sure, what you mean it should connect the battery (rwire) over to (b wire) just like the factory switch, then since starter switch send + side of the starter relay it start position I rerouted the relay to operate from switch on + side inside the switch instead, of using -side to engauge relay, thru neutral start switch and - thru start button. if that makes since?

[YTZ drew]

Oops, my mistake. I missed the separate "kill" button in your jeep wiring diagram. Disregard my former question about the ignition switch, that part is fine. Since all your ohmmeter tests checked out, I'm still leaning towards the cdi being bad.

[wagx2]

well bought a cdi and took 12 volt test light, and the igniter coil lights it nice and bright, and touched it to coil connections while trying to crank and get moderate light up from it, in pulse form but still no spark, (yes I did ohm every thing to spec) changed the cdi and ignition coil, still no spark, so figure either pulse trigger not breaking or new Chinese coil no good. also looking at shop manual, shows ground from cdi and pulse trigger directly connected in the break down of the system, but in main wiring diagram shows both tied into main ground. but before I connected them directly together and separate from the main ground had no indication of power getting to coil, then when separated from main ground and tied the 2 together started getting signals with test light, why would manual show it not connected in one photo and tied together in the next.215341215342

also in the picture there are 6 wires coming from cdi, 1 is designated ground but still 1 tied into ground on pulse coil. I have 6 pin plug but only 5 wires are in it?? wrong connector? the pulse trigger ohm'd at 40 but, and used pull starter to turn it over and ohm reading never dropped to zero when magnets past pick-up, but dropped from 40 to around 26 ohm. manual says 20-30 ohm so it may be my problem and wiring also. have 2 different meter both give diff. readings for pick-up/pulse trigger, one reads with-in spec other shows 40?

Do I need 6 pin cdi connector, even in the ignition section of the manual they only label 5 pins for use, but picture shows 6 wires from cdi???? any suggestions.

[wagx2]

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just a update, got engine wired, and running again and made some progress on assembly, switched stock muffler out with 1.5'' piece of exhaust pipe and a muffler that was for a car, the 200m pulls this thing fine even with 2 adults, all though still getting the bugs out may need a clutch, seems to want to rev little between half and full throttle, like it may be slipping or could still need carb adjustment, used Chinese carb on it cause old one I had was eat up in the bottom with corrosion, know its running rich plug carboned up more than I would think it should be? but so far going good

[350for350]

So what was the problem? Pretty cool project!

[wagx2]

Changed every thing, and switched it over to Chinese type square plug cdi, all working now, think all the cdi that I had either didn't work or are from wrong models that wired different, found 3 different wiring diagrams for Hondas with round plug, and could get any to work. but now its switched to cheap cdi and bought 3 extra, just to have on hand, want have to bother with finding used, oem cdi that are labeled off running bike, or any so called nos, that don't work.