HD clutch for a 200e?

[swampyred]

I'm collecting parts to build my 200e up a bit. So far, I have decided on a 200x or xr carb, rcm pipe, 10.25 piston, porting, oversize valves, and web stage 2 cam. Will my stock clutch, rebuilt of course handle these 1 or 2 extra hp? Or do they make a tougher one. It is used as a trail-swamp thumper, not a hotrod.

[barnett468]

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you can use stock springs and preload them around .040" with AN style washers providing the springs are within spec . . if they are a little shorter than spec yo can buy new ones then preload them or preload the used ones so they are .040" longer than spec.

you can buy heavy duty springs from barnett but this make the clutch a bit stiff and if you pull the clutch in a lot your hand might get a bit tired.

you can also use 3 stock springs and 3 stiff springs and alternate them on the hub but i done do this.

the stock discs are fine if they are good, otherwise you can buy aftermarket ones from barnett or someone else.m

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[86125m]

one problem I foresee is because this bike has a centrifugal semi auto clutch. You might fry the centrifugal clutch that's in there with those heavy duty clutch springs.

[swampyred]

By replacing the main clutch springs? I'm confused. They are seperate. Can you feel the hd springs in the shifter? I dont want to kill anything.

[86125m]

yes the are separate but they work together. instead of you manually engaging and disengaging the clutch, the centrifugal clutch does this for you. So im scared if you hop up the main clutch with those heavy duty springs that it will prematurely wear the centrifugal clutch shoes and those shoes are very expensive. But now that I'm thinking about it the clutch as long as you rebuild it probably can handle the extra horses. But honestly this is all just speculation. you won't now until you really try it out. I think I would rebuild it and replace all the springs and the clutch disks. replace with the Honda springs if I knew for sure that the 200x springs would fit I would probably use those they have a different part number than the 200e. and replace the clutch disks with the vesrah disks as they are just as good as the honda disks but are a lot cheaper.

[swampyred]

Was checking out the barnett springs. Cheap and easy. You really got me on the pot on this centrifugal clutch issue...

[swampyred]

Ok. Sweet. Thank you. I was trying to figure out how the hd springs would hurt that go-cart clutch in there. Lol. Has anyone ran the HD springs? I wouldn't think it would make shifting that much more difficult, for my foot. Part of the reason I want the power is to not have to shift as much anyway. (that and my 86 LT125 will outrun the 185 and the three 200's in my yard. Lol) Thanks for the advice. I appreciate it! What I don't want to do, more than anything, is wear out the shifter-clutch stuff abnormally fast, because of clutch springs.

[swampyred]

Quick question. Doesn't that sportclutch work like any other hand clutch? The only difference in an auto, is simply the clutch is operated by the shifter right? Excluding the cent clutch from the picture. You could get rid of the cent clutch completely if you wanted, you'd just have to push the shifter up or down, or stop in neutral. Eh?

[barnett468]

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Ok, I didn’t see that it was an e model when I posted, however, the same concept still applies with this addition . . The two clutch system, is no stronger than its weakest link . . This means that you can put 300 lb springs in the clutch that has the discs but if the centrifugal clutch does have enough force against the hub, it will slip which will negate the 300 lb springs you put in the other clutch.

The best thing to do is improve the holding power of the weakest clutch, however, no one knows for sure which clutch has more holding force . . This being said, there is no cheap or easy way to increase the holding force of the centrifugal clutch . . It certainly could be done but it would cost a little bit.

One way would be to add weight to the shoes, especially on the end that is opposite of the pivot/mounting point . . If the metal on the shoe is steel, this could be done by tack welding or screwing a piece of Mallory to the outside of it, or by drilling a few holes in it that are approximately 5/16” in diameter, then install the Mallory in those with a lite press fit of maybe .0005”, then put a tack weld on one side for added insurance.

If the metal on the shoe is aluminum, the Mallory can just be screwed to the side of the shoe, or pieces that are around .030” narrower than the shoe can be pressed in with red loctite so they are recessed from the shoe surface the same amount on both sides, then the outside of the hole can be hit with a sharp punch to flare it over as added insurance to keep the Mallory from coming out.

The reason for using Mallory is because it weighs around twice as much as steel, and since there is not much area on the shoe to add weight, the heavier/denser the metal is, the better.

The additional weight will apply more force on the shoe against the hub at all rpm's . . This additional force is what will increase the holding power of the clutch.

Doing this will also cause the clutch ti fully engage a little sooner which could cause the engine to bog a little . . If this occurs, numerically higher gearing would compensate for it.

The best shoes to use are the factory ones.


CLUTCH HUB

The inside of the hub the clutch shoes ride against when it is engaged, often have grooves in them from wear . . When new shoes are run with a grooved hub, they will not have the optimum amount of friction/traction against the hub until they wear and then conform to the irregular surface in the hub.

If your hub is worn and you can’t find a new or mint used one, you can weld the inside of your hub up then machine it to proper spec, however, as one would guess, this ain’t cheap.


PRE LOADING THE CLUTCH SPRINGS

imo, this is the best option for the clutch with the plates in your case . . A stock clutch and plates that is within spec can handle a bit more power than the stock engine has . . Pre loading the springs will increase the amount of force required to shift by around only 5% . . The additional clamping force on the plates should be sufficient to prevent it from slipping under any condition you are likely to encounter.


PRE LOAD WASHERS

They need to have a thin wall like there . . Some copper brake line sealing washers will also work.

http://cdn2.bigcommerce.com/server100/367cc/products/15893/images/176652/WhitesideMachine_W300__77876.1314228473.120.120.jp g?c=2
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[Yamawheeler]

So hd clutch and springs is no good or good. Lamens term answer. I understand everything but it's all what ifs. Will it work and is it really hard to shift as in bend or break something.

[barnett468]

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clutch plates have absolutely no affect on spring pressure providing they are within stock spec.

[swampyred]

So rebuild the clutch and call er' good.

[swampyred]

3 wheels, a man, and a mad wife.