What Pisses you Off?

[coolpool]

This could be fun and may even offend some folks here; if it does, my job is complete! Keep it simple and try to stay away from politics, there's not enough band width.

1. People who drive with their fog lights on in clear weather.
2. Aftermarket HID lights
3. People who drive Ram trucks with their mirrors flipped out when they're not towing. Up our way the call it "moose-ing", WTF lame?
4. Special interest groups calling the shots now.

Pete, out!

[devilman]

People who text and drive, especially when they have a kid in the car. Makes my blood boil.

[schlepp29]

People who don't atleast drive the speed limit, my 250r (310r ), tv commercials! I hate the corny tv commercials,and these pretzels are making me thirsty!

[shortline10]

Yuppies :lock::lock::lock::lock::crazy:

[DAM shop]

Store clerks who carry on conversations with customers when I'm standing in line.
People that don't t know how to merge.

[schlepp29]

Oh ,honey boo boo and her mom

[DAM shop]

Oh ,honey boo boo and her mom

Hahahaha, that was funny

[Rob Canadian]

1. People who drive with their fog lights on in clear weather.


I drive with my 'driving lights' on all the time. Are you talking about the yellow 'fog lights' OR me? LOL.

Things that piss me off:
1: People who wait to see the final total at a cashier before taking there wallet out...
2: Not signaling at a intersection
3: People/parents leaving a child or pet in a hot car and go shopping etc. We had a 3 year old child die just the other week and in another incident a a child that
needed medical attention for dehydration.
4: My EX wife.

[DAM shop]

All the trike tires we have broke down over many many years using a post hole pounder and a heavy arse piece of steel before finding the beadbuster tool. It still ticks me off.

[fabiodriven]

Friends who don't know how to stop their yap and get in my way while I'm trying to fix 1,000 things for Trikefest. If I need your farking help or input, I'll ask. Otherwise shut the fork up or go the frig somewhere else.

[ironchop]

1)People who park their shopping carts in the center of the grocery aisle sideways while they read ingredients on the back of packages and text ppl

2)People who show up to the post office with empty envelopes and boxes unaddressed with the stuff they want to put inside in their other hand and wait until they get to the window clerk expecting either the clerk to do it for them or for everyone in line behind them to wait while they attempt to figure out how to fold, tape, and address a package... On my lunch hour with a line out the door. Happens every time I'm there.

3)People who double park behind the employees of my shop, block our loading bay doors, or vandalize our no parking signs so they can save twenty extra feet of walking distance to the music store next door to us and avoid being towed away because they think if the sign isn't posted, we can't legally have them towed away

4)People who buy lottery tickets, scratch them off at the counter while the clerk helps other people in line, and then finishes scratching and immediately cuts in front of the next person in line to cash in her two dollar winner

5) the people who think that, because they are a particular gender, they should be able to get away with numbers one through four among quite a few other acts of complete inconsideration and utter rudeness

Bonus points for figuring out what gender is usually the offending party





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[Joseph Farrow]

People who always drive in the Left lane and that are usually only going the speed limit at best.

People at fast food places who never ask for your order or say "thank you". They hand you the bag or just say "Here!" The same ones will always ask you "is that all?" after I complete my order and make a point to alway tell them "that is all".

People who walk in the road when there are sidewalks.

People who are in line at a C Store and want to pay for things one at a time. i.e. Give me a cigarello....awe yeah give me a $2 Jumbo......how much are your wings....naw just one wing. Mean while all I want to do is get a receipt from where I tried to pay at the pump so I could avoid all of that and the pump is out of register tape.

I could go on and on. Alot of it is where I choose to live. The older I get the more I'm leaning toward just Checking Out and going off the Grid.

[83ATC185]

People at the grocery store that stand at the register all totaled up, then send their kids on a mission to collect the other 14 items they forgot.

And needy people, the ones that you can't help. People that ask for your help, then sit on the sidelines while you do it for them, and no matter how much you do for them, its never enough.

oh...and the entitled spandex bike guy that rides in the middle of a very curvy road with a 45 mph speed limit that i come near to hitting every morning.

[ironchop]

People who always drive in the Left lane and that are usually only going the speed limit at best......

I agree with the rest and especially off the grid....

That one I quoted above really stuck with me. It's also becoming the norm here in Southern KY lately and it's usually the same gender as my list, however not exclusively.

My wife and I both have alot of relatives out of town and state and we drive alot. I'm pretty OCD about my rear-view mirror watching as my windshield time and every time on 2 or 3-lane sections of I65, when I see a car roaring up the far right line, we play a game we call "Tennessee driver or not"....EVEN IF I'm in the center lane going well over the speed limit as usual and the Left passing lane is totally empty, there's almost always an encounter with a vehicle passing everyone in the far right lane....and 90 percent of the time, it's a Tennessee plate as opposed to Kentucky. They almost never pass on left up around Southern KY highways.

So your post just made me think that it's your left-lane campers that are the sole reason why most the TN drivers in my neck of the woods pass on the right all the time... Learn something new every day.

Left lane camping is just as F@#$IN rude, in my opinion, as blocking the grocery aisle with your sideways cart.

It's so bad here and getting worse that the State Police were in the news recently informing people that they are going to start ticketing left lane campers...which is awesome.


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[ironchop]

People at the grocery store that stand at the register all totaled up, then send their kids on a mission to collect the other 14 items they forgot....
I'm betting it's not those kid's father.....[emoji848]



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[83ATC185]

I'm betting it's not those kid's father.....[emoji848]
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Good call. It's always the 450lb member of the opposite gender.
Shitchunot the last time this happened to me it took 9 minutes for them to get back. i stood in that line and made a game of it. Then the foodstamp card wouldn't work so she had to make a call and get the PIN number.

It's reason #871 why i go shopping either very early or very late.

[ironchop]

Good call. It's always the 450lb member of the opposite gender.
Shitchunot the last time this happened to me it took 9 minutes for them to get back. i stood in that line and made a game of it. Then the foodstamp card wouldn't work so she had to make a call and get the PIN number.

It's reason #871 why i go shopping either very early or very late.

Yeah it's the opposite here. Lululemon yoga pants wearing soccer moms who drive a Lexus SUV in between body wax and nail appointments are THE rudest bunch I've ever seen and this town has thousands of them for only being pop. 50K...same ones who are the Post Office bottleneck creators.

Our 450 pounders are the shopping cart roadblock operators [emoji23]

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[Shep1970]

The little tv screens at the gas pumps/ hate commercials/don’t force them on me....
The crossing guard down street from the school/ stops cars when kids are still 2-blocks away from crossing.
Stupid show naked+afraid? On discovery channel always shows some guys asss when I’m flipping through channels.
When a homeowner says I’ll pay in cash, what kind of discount do I get.. “none” or the $5 it’ll cost me in gas to get to bank
The towns all around me says “no” more plastic grocery bags—-that’s ok I’ve got 10,000 I bought on eBay to use:p
When the frozen food isle lights don’t come on until you’ve already passed what your trying to see...yes there on sensors
When waitresses think there getting a good tip when not deserved...I don’t tip unless it’s worked for/deserved

I’m sure there’s more,

Shep

[Arky-X]

I'm not a left-lane camper but what pisses me off is once I pass a car, I signal to move over to the right (leaving enough space between my rear and their front not to cut them off).....the a-hole riding my bumper jerks their car over trying to pass me on the right. I have the signal on and keep on coming. I see them and I don't care. They need to wait a dam second and let me clear the car I just passed. Signal is on moron.
World's gotten itself in a big dam hurry.

Texting and driving

That I essentially only had 2 choices....a mad-man with a bad hairpiece.....or a crazy bee-yotch

[Arky-X]

Shitchunot ........you get out of the car at the store parking lot..........and using your peripheral ..........3 -4 "people" are moving slowly toward you to ask for money ...........i fackin hate that...........it`s like night of the living dead..........here comes one of them now .........would i sh!t you ?Hoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier Daddy:w00t:Hoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier Daddy

Next time you notice them, beat them to the punch and ask them for money first. Or when they ask you just tell them, "Nah, I was just about to ask (or ax) you for some money. My car just broke down and I ain't got a job and my family and I are traveling across the country so I need anything you can spare."

[ironchop]

Shitchunot ........you get out of the car at the store parking lot..........and using your peripheral ..........3 -4 "people" are moving slowly toward you to ask for money ...........i fackin hate that...........it`s like night of the living dead..........here comes one of them now .........would i sh!t you ?Hoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier Daddy:w00t:Hoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyHoosier DaddyTell them you're out of money but know exactly where they can find some work.

You won't believe how fast they walk away

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[fabiodriven]

Lmfao, nice thread Pete. I think I agree with everything that's been posted, lol!

[BOB MARLIN]

1) Living in this f'd up state of California.

2) People that stop at a stoplight but are 3 car lengths back of the limit line so the light sensors don't trip.

3) I second the one about driving with the fog lights on.

4) Prius

5) The spandex army bicycle riders

[schlepp29]

That's the truth about people being to far back at a red light and not tripping the light. Morons

[3 Wheel Drive]

Asian drivers, not the ones that have been here. I’m talking about the ones fresh off of the banana boat!

[atc12]

1) Living in this f'd up state of California.

2) People that stop at a stoplight but are 3 car lengths back of the limit line so the light sensors don't trip.

3) I second the one about driving with the fog lights on.

4) Prius

5) The spandex army bicycle riders

I just passed one in the left turn lane and pulled up to the line. The guy was a good 50' back

[greenhuman]

Glad I am not the only plastic shopping bag nut. I also just bought 1,000 on eBay. That'll show em.

[BOB MARLIN]

People that say "worter" instead of water.

And pronounce the days of the week like there is two e's on the end of the word. Example: instead of Monday, they say "Mondee. Or Friday is "Fridee". Is it because the part of the country they are from ?. I don't get it.

[devilman]

Looks like we need to start a road rage therapy thread.

How about when you are in a hurry and you get stuck behind the little old lady who digs though her purse to pay with exact change or they wait until the very end of check out to start writing the check...

[83ATC185]

People that say "worter" instead of water.

And pronounce the days of the week like there is two e's on the end of the word. Example: instead of Monday, they say "Mondee. Or Friday is "Fridee". Is it because the part of the country they are from ?. I don't get it.

Yeah that's most likely just a southern thang. Guilty as charged :D

[Joseph Farrow]

People that say "worter" instead of water.

And pronounce the days of the week like there is two e's on the end of the word. Example: instead of Monday, they say "Mondee. Or Friday is "Fridee". Is it because the part of the country they are from ?. I don't get it.

How about people saying "Fur" instead of "For"

Was flipping through the channels the other day and ran across "Wheel of Torture" and it was at the begenning when they introduce the contestants. One woman was a high school English teacher and she said she "worked FUR so and so High School"

[Arky-X]

Looks like we need to start a road rage therapy thread.

How about when you are in a hurry and you get stuck behind the little old lady who digs though her purse to pay with exact change or they wait until the very end of check out to start writing the check...

I gotta stick up for the old people because I hope I will be there some day. If I get behind an old person and they are moving at their own pace, I find a way around them. I've told my kids, when I get that age, I won't give a F. I think 75-ish qualifies you for that privilege.

Blinker on.....blink....blink.....blink.....old person moving over.....better clear me a spot! I'm too old to turn my head to check for blind spots.

[ironchop]

..........they wanded me for weapons ? ........fack Roscoe`s !
Are you F@#king serious?

Police state waffles?

Yeah...............No.


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[Arky-X]

We aint got The Waffle House ........we don`t even have a place to get shot at !!!! ..........I foggen love chicken and waffles .........ate at Roscoe`s in Hollywood..........they wanded me for weapons ? ........fack Roscoe`s !

Dang! I guess chicken & waffles & guns don't mix?

That pisses me off because I was a firm believer in never ordering chicken & waffles at illegitimate chicken & waffle places. Waffle House can't serve chicken........KFC can't serve a waffle.......they are posers if they do that. I always said you have to get chicken & waffles from a legitimate chicken & waffle establishment......BOYCOTT ROSCOE'S!!!

[DAM shop]

What pisses me off is all these jacked up toilet tank flushers.. what the heck? No two are the same. What was wrong with the metal rod, float ball and rubber flappers? Goofy arse things.

[x-rider]

Looks like we need to start a road rage therapy thread.
People that switch lanes in traffic 2’ in front of my bumper. Enough said MF’s.

[roostin atc]

It`s all this low flo garbage .........nothing wrong with the old ball-cock method !.........what it is 1 gallon or less water..... combined with a bladder tank that compresses air by water pressure....... and air and water push the sh!t down the drain ! ......the problem is it`s not enough water to float the sh!t and paper to the city side or septic .........more stoppages !! .....sh!t plumbing was my game .........the bladders are non repairable in most cases ..........cheaper to buy a whole new toilet ........

https://youtu.be/vPzDTfIb0DU
Have a good Sunday morning for me. The corn is gone. If the pitch is right. Roll one tight.

[Shep1970]

I’ve got one more as of this am.....
Yamaha decided to put a aluminum drain plug in and its seemed to cold weld itself in place...
Then have to siphon/ suck the oil out through the filler.
I didn’t drink any but I won’t be needing chapstick anytime soon.

Probably could have gotten it but it is “not” the day to break it off/ that’ll be next time;)


252976

Shep

[JayBone]

1) Everything, Everything, Everything about NJ
2) TV, News, internet
3) The new human Gender issues of today.
4) When you want to rely on someone and you know they will fail you, over & over.
5) The Company I work for.
6) Any slow driver in any lane.
7) How a certain group and or big business feels they need to remake every TV show or Movie more diversified. It just screams we lack creativity and need a quick buck.
8) People who don't save money.
9) Paying school taxes when I don't have a kid/s. I should be at a reduced rate. 50%
10) Heartburn
11) The same People who ask you over & over how to do this or that or fix something because they know you know instead of looking it up themselves.
12) NJ.
13) Coworkers who used kids as an excuse to get out of work constantly. That probably burns my aXX up more than anything.
14) Job Recruiters who don't look at your location or the part that says "No one could pay me enough to work in NYC" before contacting you.

[83ATC185]

Another thing, the fact that i paid good money for 3rd row seats to see the Drive by Truckers and Tedeschi Trucks saturday night, only for them to hang a black lives matter sign and start singing songs about unity and loving each other. I didn't even recognize any of the songs they played.

[ironchop]

Another thing, the fact that i paid good money for 3rd row seats to see the Drive by Truckers and Tedeschi Trucks saturday night, only for them to hang a black lives matter sign and start singing songs about unity and loving each other. I didn't even recognize any of the songs they played.

I would be furious. Screw that. Thanks for the warning

I'm tired of entertainers thinking it's their job to socially engineer us. Who the f@#k do they think they are anyway?

These musicians and sports figures, actors.... Every one of them needs to STFU.... They don't seem to understand that they are just bread and circuses for the people. Nobody spends good money to go get front row tix at a BLM rally and neither do they make popcorn to watch C-Span.

I'm running out of celebs to boycott. Still angry with Steve Earle for teaming up with SPLC, a left wing hate group disguised as a hate group watchdog. Morris Dee's is a POS

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[ironchop]

I hate when on pimple popping video`s..........they don`t get all the sh!t to barrel out...........mostly women fiddle fack around and don`t get the sh!t to squirt out da muvfacker ..........don`t you hate that too ???*LIKE*

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[keister]

1. People who drive with their fog lights on in clear weather.

People in China who drive at night with no headlights. I don't know if they are so conditioned to save energy and think they are OR if they are saving hours on their bulbs.


3. People who drive Ram trucks with their mirrors flipped out when they're not towing. Up our way the call it "moose-ing", WTF lame?

This one I never knew was a pet peeve. I truly never noticed before my friend pointed it out. Now I see it all the time. Still don't find it too bothersome.

[keister]

I would like to add grocery store clerks who find it necessary to comment on my items at checkout.

"Wow, that looks good......"
"My husband and I tried that brand last week......."

It happens all the time and it is so irritating.

I swear some day I am going to buy duct tape, KY jelly, a turkey baster, an extension cord, adult diapers, and a gallon of milk. Then we will see what she has to say!

[ironchop]

My mom paid for her, my aunt, cousin, me and my brother and sister to go see Journey and Def Leppard. (Mom likes rock) We get there and the beer is 24oz. Cans of domestic for $13.25 EACH. My wife wanted a concert t-shirt....$45

A mixed Jack Daniel's drink was $20 a solo cup full.

An eighties flashback just shouldn't cost that much

They gentrified my Def Leppard and my Journey and it pisses me off

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[ironchop]

Years ago .........i`m sittin outside @ San Diego State for Def Leppard ..........chick comes up says you wanna....... here ya go .......sha-wing batta !...........i`m in and it`s MILF city !!!!!..........had ta rub one out later............TMI to foogen bad !!! .........I hate when Wemens Talk too much !!!It was no MILF City where I was at in Indianapolis. Alot of ugly people there. Out of a thousand females in the crowd, you might find one true MILF. My brother and I expected much better eye candy than that and were very disappointed. Lots of mom haircuts and extra pounds.

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[83ATC185]

I would be furious. Screw that. Thanks for the warning

I'm tired of entertainers thinking it's their job to socially engineer us. Who the f@#k do they think they are anyway?

These musicians and sports figures, actors.... Every one of them needs to STFU.... They don't seem to understand that they are just bread and circuses for the people. Nobody spends good money to go get front row tix at a BLM rally and neither do they make popcorn to watch C-Span.



That's the exact discussion we had on the way home after we left it early. And we were up front with all the groupies that didn't seem to know that they used to be a southern rock band.

Focus the camera on the black saxophone player, and put up a black lives matter sign up on the end of the keyboard facing a 99.9% white crowd, and you'll learn that the real racists are the ones on stage.

I felt like the punchline of a bad joke that night. Because we were.

[ironchop]

This.....I can't stand shyte like this...https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180710/f2e211c3a5ee4bac3f372f6dc163e814.jpg

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[ironchop]

Is that a Whataburger cup in the parking lot ??..........you`re lucky we don`t have Whatabuger here ........oh that mustard slaw !!Rally's (Checkers)

I WISH we had Whataburger here too. Not far enough south.

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[El Camexican]

- People that go to a self-serve buffet for lunch on a workday and spend 2 minutes poking and inspecting every freakin item before making a selection from each tray. Put three of these people in a line and you can expect to be late getting back to work. Oh to have a cattle prod

- Waiters that follow up my simple request for a Coke with ‘Would you like diet?” I always say “No thanks, I’m in denial”

- People that let their kids run wild in public places like restaurants, airplanes, airports, malls and movie theaters and totally ignoring them as they kick strangers, break things, yell, scream and whatever the heck else they want

- People that rush to enter elevators before everyone has gotten off them

- TSA agents

- Checkout clerks at the grocery store that ask if I’d like them to start checking my items after I’ve already waited in line for 30 minutes to pay for them. Makes me want to scream out “No, I just spent an hour gathering this sh*t and placing it on this belt so that the two of us could stare at it awkwardly for the rest of the day while my truck collects dents from unmanned shopping carts in your parking lot that some genius decided to build on a slope

- Banks that make old people stand in line as if to punish them for being clients instead of letting them take a number and sit down to wait for their turn

- Parents that speak softly to their children when they are throwing a tantrum and kicking and hitting them, or twisting on the floor like a scene from the Exorcist. My advice: Grow a pair and beat the devil out of them before you end up in the basement freezer with them collecting your pension checks.

- People that use ATM’s as though it the first time they’ve ever seen one and need 5 minutes to withdraw $20 bucks

- Large people that don’t wash under their rolls

- Trying to figure our who is a LGBDXYZ and who isn't. WTF, wear a sign that explains it please

- People that fill their gas tanks and then leave the vehicle at the pump while they go buy smokes and Powerball tickets

- Having to pay cash in advance to fill my tank because no one trusts me even though I’ve never stolen anything in my life

- Getting my sh*t inspected when leaving Wal-Mart with things I’ve already paid for and have legal ownership of

- Mexican traffic cops that stand next to wrecks and watch the traffic back up because they are too lazy to direct it around the scene

- Getting my credit card statement in the mail 3 days after the due date

- Car salesmen that don’t know what they’re talking about “Your oil needs to be changed every 6 months even if you don’t drive your car because it get old” Yeah, ok zipper head and the 2016 model car that’s still on the lot with a $10,000 factory rebate offer has had how many oil changes?

- Large people that prefer to use half of my airplane seat than pay the extra for a second one and the airlines that enable them to do so out of fear of lawsuits

- People that shoot non-varmint animals only for their horns

- People like me that complain a lot

[ironchop]

That's the exact discussion we had on the way home after we left it early. And we were up front with all the groupies that didn't seem to know that they used to be a southern rock band.

Focus the camera on the black saxophone player, and put up a black lives matter sign up on the end of the keyboard facing a 99.9% white crowd, and you'll learn that the real racists are the ones on stage.

I felt like the punchline of a bad joke that night. Because we were.
Speaking of DBT formers..
I haven't cared for Jason Isbel much since his sobriety and I hear that he's becoming alot more politically outspoken too. He's not about to miss the Left Wing Bandwagon either (while he pretends to be individualistic)

Yeah hipsters are flocking to anything from the Americana genre and also bluegrass and Traditional. I think the city of Austin was probably the birthplace of the hipster subjugation of all things good music. The custom motorcycle scene has become the same thing... The SJW "bikers" grow beards, dress in intentionally dirtied clothes to pretend they are "dirt bags" and then when someone posts an old school pic of a bike built in 1959 that has a couple of SS lightning bolts on it or a swazi, the hipsters freak out, virtue signal each other, and then report the post so it's deleted because Jews Up, Nazis Down. The Kings of Irony apparently don't really understand irony, after all

Then, in their never-ending quest to be 'ironic', they put F@CK HIPSTERS stickers on their helmets and bikes and insist via online signalling that they are not hipsters despite the fact that everyone but them knows they are.

You know the ones I'm talking about. They also all suddenly picked up drinking Pabst Blue Ribbon and Johnny Cash as if they've been slugging cheap beer and singing Ring of Fire all their lives and wearing blue-collar attire and 65 yr old eyeglass frames. They refer to riding a bike as some sort of existential experience that nobody else understands and then they 'recreate' cross-country chopper voyages as if they are just like Dick Allen in 1969... all while they rely on cell phones and internet and other creature comforts not available to bikers in 1969 but hey they slept on the ground under their bike tarp so it's the same thing.....all while taking 1600 selfies, updating Facebook, posting shoutouts on InstaFam so nobody misses their epic adventure, and employing an additional professional photographer to follow them around so they can post their "existential" "Rideout" on Instagram where other pathetic hipsters can live vicariously thru them.

To summarize my rant.... Hipsters can kiss mah balls

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[keister]

^^^^^ EDIT: Ok, I guess he covered this yesterday. Day late and a dollar short as usual.


That's the exact discussion we had on the way home after we left it early. And we were up front with all the groupies that didn't seem to know that they used to be a southern rock band.

You mean they aren't anymore? I guess it has been a while since I have heard any of their stuff, but "Southern Rock Opera" and "Decoration Day" are two of my all time faves.

[keister]

- People that go to a self-serve buffet for lunch on a workday and spend 2 minutes poking and inspecting every freakin item before making a selection from each tray. Put three of these people in a line and you can expect to be late getting back to work. Oh to have a cattle prod......................

- People that shoot non-varmint animals only for their horns

- People like me that complain a lot

Whew, that was a lot of gripes!! Can't say I disagree with any, but you were airing grievances like a Costanza at a Festivus party. Now for the feats of strength......

[83ATC185]

You mean they aren't anymore? I guess it has been a while since I have heard any of their stuff, but "Southern Rock Opera" and "Decoration Day" are two of my all time faves.

Well i suppose they still are...but it was kinda like in the movies where they clone somebody and it walks around emotionless, saying pre-programmed responses, just a hollow shell of the real thing.

They didn't play any songs off those albums which is the kind of music i went to hear. I know that it's probably 15 years old and maybe I'm behind, but i didn't expect them to do a complete 180, if anything i thought id hear new stuff i would be into. And its not even that they changed that bothered me so much, It's that I went to hear music and got their political and social views shoved down my throat while they stood on stage acting superior to the people that made their lifestyle possible. I don't care what kind of music they choose to play or their lyrics, i can like it or not.

I guess just being talented and letting your music speak for itself isn't good enough anymore...

[ironchop]

SHEETIE PRODUCTS

...Like a 2 yr old Trane heatpump system that has leaked all it's freon out and doesn't currently work for the FOURTH time in the last 13 months. This thing cost me $300 extra a month on my utility bill every time it goes on the fritz. They keep replacing leaky coils and expensive freon.

I get online and find out that in more than few places, Trane and other top manufacturers are also having this same issue so much so that Trane had generally scored 1 out of 5 stars in some online reviews. The other top manufacturers didn't fare any better.

There's no excuse for making such cheap quality and overpriced junk.

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[DAM shop]

^^^I agree Don`t buy Chevy , Ford or Dodge trucks ........they`re junk .......don`t buy Samsung appliances......... JUNK ...........:lol::Bounce:lol::Bounce:lol::Bounce:Bo unce:lol:and never ever buy anything other then Honda ATC 250R ........Thank You !
That made me laugh.

[Arky-X]

SHEETIE PRODUCTS

...Like a 2 yr old Trane heatpump system that has leaked all it's freon out and doesn't currently work for the FOURTH time in the last 13 months. This thing cost me $300 extra a month on my utility bill every time it goes on the fritz. They keep replacing leaky coils and expensive freon.

I get online and find out that in more than few places, Trane and other top manufacturers are also having this same issue so much so that Trane had generally scored 1 out of 5 stars in some online reviews. The other top manufacturers didn't fare any better.

There's no excuse for making such cheap quality and overpriced junk.

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We replaced our heat pumps (1 upstairs/1 downstairs) 12 years and they had a 10 year parts/labor warranty as long as they serviced it 2x year. Not a cheap endeavor but for 10 years......not my problem.
Year 3 they were handing me a bill for adding refrigerant.....I handed it back and told them I wasn't paying a dime until they located the leak. They replaced all the line sets for the new refrigerant during the install so THEY had a leak, not me. I was looking over their shoulder when they came back the following week to check for the leak. The service guys were cool (no A/C pun intended here) with me asking questions and making sure it was found and fixed. We will see how it goes now that it is out of warranty.

My siblings houses, mom's house and her rent houses have had issues. Their A/C guy has tried Lennox, Rheem, Ruud.....all have their issues. He says it doesn't matter anymore which you get because all of the components are coming from China. Then why the hell do they cost so damn much?



We have to start a revolution but we are in this cycle. Cheap crap (cheap as in quality because it is not $cheap$) is all people will buy so when a quality product is made, no one will pay the small incremental price for that quality anymore. Quality-R-Us manufacturer can't stay in business because no one will pay that price......sickening. We have no options but cheap crap.

[ironchop]

We replaced our heat pumps (1 upstairs/1 downstairs) 12 years and they had a 10 year parts/labor warranty as long as they serviced it 2x year. Not a cheap endeavor but for 10 years......not my problem.
Year 3 they were handing me a bill for adding refrigerant.....I handed it back and told them I wasn't paying a dime until they located the leak. They replaced all the line sets for the new refrigerant during the install so THEY had a leak, not me. I was looking over their shoulder when they came back the following week to check for the leak. The service guys were cool (no A/C pun intended here) with me asking questions and making sure it was found and fixed. We will see how it goes now that it is out of warranty.

My siblings houses, mom's house and her rent houses have had issues. Their A/C guy has tried Lennox, Rheem, Ruud.....all have their issues. He says it doesn't matter anymore which you get because all of the components are coming from China. Then why the hell do they cost so damn much?



We have to start a revolution but we are in this cycle. Cheap crap (cheap as in quality because it is not $cheap$) is all people will buy so when a quality product is made, no one will pay the small incremental price for that quality anymore. Quality-R-Us manufacturer can't stay in business because no one will pay that price......sickening. We have no options but cheap crap.That's what my local buddies who are AC Techs told me too... All the formerly quality brands are now pieces of crap thanks to cheap parts. I found class action lawsuits on quite a few brands online

If only there was a guy who implemented tariffs on those cheap products so that they would be as expensive to buy as the quality American made stuff and perhaps encourage investing in American products....hmmmm..... He would probably be called a Nazi Fascist by the people who profit from the flood of cheap crap and foreign, unregulated child labor though.

I think it's hilarious when some globalist tells me that foreign goods help keep prices in America low and then they are proven completely wrong when the new 'free trade' product made by exploited foreign child labor is just as expensive as the formerly American made by adults product they had purchased before. It's as if they don't understand the motives of globalist corporations and stockholders very well... Or even at all

When I purchased my new Kenmore Hecho en Mexico laundry set, I expected to see the huge labor savings reflected in the price as opposed to the previous Kenmore products made in America. What I got was two pieces of crap that lasted less than five years for the exact same price as before NAFTA. Lies. Globalist lies.



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[ironchop]

Whatever the deep state wants ........the deep state gets...........the one thing you won`t hear Trump say ..........Israel runs the USA ..........another fackin puppet .........but what is encouraging is the way the people here are no longer swallowing what the big 3 auto maker are shlepping out ! .........maybe 5-6 yrs ago if i said the BIG 3 sucked ..........they`d all booed me off the page !............we`re all getting sick of this sh!t ..........Home Depot - OVER PRICED CRAP IS KING !! ........it`s sad ........Oh what i hate most......... women that talk too much ....it pisses me offfffff !!!!Oh snap... You said Isra-hell.....I can tell you're a Nazi. Only a Mister Bungle Nazi would speak out against the Semite Mafia.

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[ironchop]

I`M surprised we don`t see Government propaganda like "Reefer Madness" and "MR. Bungle goes to lunch" anymore ........you know "THEY" still think we`re all retardsThat's because that stuff was about "good wholesome family values" and there's currently a War on That Stuff.... So that type of social engineering is no longer welcome. Today's Social Engineering starts with Disney and ends with Michael Moore and it's called "Everything Traditional Must Be Destroyed" by Freak Show Studios.

They're training us to be armed freak show retards now. The Purge movie is a suggestion.

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[Rob Canadian]

Out getting groceries yesterday. Lady in front of me was on her cell phone going through the till. While still on phone she asked what the total was. THEN had to dig through her purse to get her debit card. Dammit lady. You knew you would have to pay!!! get your stuff ready!!!!

THEN her card declines. YUP still on the phone. Tries her card again but puts the wrong PIN in... Puts the right PIN in and insuffient funds. YUP. Still on the phone yakking away.

I was PISSED. Get off your cell phone and deal with stuff in front of you. Time and place to be yakking on the cell.

[ironchop]

Out getting groceries yesterday. Lady in front of me was on her cell phone going through the till. While still on phone she asked what the total was. THEN had to dig through her purse to get her debit card. Dammit lady. You knew you would have to pay!!! get your stuff ready!!!!

THEN her card declines. YUP still on the phone. Tries her card again but puts the wrong PIN in... Puts the right PIN in and insuffient funds. YUP. Still on the phone yakking away.

I was PISSED. Get off your cell phone and deal with stuff in front of you. Time and place to be yakking on the cell.So did "I'm more important than everyone in the room" lady ever pay for the groceries or just walk out and leave it for someone else to clean up?

I've seen ppl like that do exactly that before. She sounds like one of our Bowling Green soccer moms

1) "my call is too important to interrupt. Shelly's husband is cheating on her with a man and Bridget got a boob job and lied about it. My friends need to know this."

2) "I can't be bothered with knowing wether or not I have enough money to make this purchase to begin with. That's my husband's problem"

3) "why should I memorize my pin number? That's too many numbers to memorize. Numbers are useless"

4) "math is hard so I just throw things in my cart even though my phone had a calculator until I deleted it to make room for Twitter and the Shoedazzle app. I guess I'll know if I spent too much when I get to the register and it's all rung up. They can put everything back if I get declined. That's what they get paid for anyway."

Yes I know I'm making alot of assumptions but the MO fits a specific personality group so, like a dickhead, I naturally projected all their crimes onto her.... But it's for comedic effect, so it's ok, right?

I'll bet a hundred bucks she was also parked in the fire lane or a handicapped spot and she probably blocked every aisle that she walked in with her cart too.

She has to be an inconsiderate cow because oppression and the patriarchy. Not her fault. Whats important is to nurture her ego so that she gains more self esteem and removes the yoke of social responsibility and consideration for other humans from her shoulders, a mere social construct created by the patriarchy as a way to oppress Wahmen.

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[El Camexican]

What pisses me off today is that whenever I give my dogs a bath they go straight for the dirtiest spot in the yard and roll in it.

[Rob Canadian]

So did "I'm more important than everyone in the room" lady ever pay for the groceries or just walk out and leave it for someone else to clean up?

I've seen ppl like that do exactly that before. She sounds like one of our Bowling Green soccer moms

1) "my call is too important to interrupt. Shelly's husband is cheating on her with a man and Bridget got a boob job and lied about it. My friends need to know this."

2) "I can't be bothered with knowing wether or not I have enough money to make this purchase to begin with. That's my husband's problem"


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Welp. I don't know what she was saying on the phone. I only speak English. She could have been saying. "OMG. There is a great looking STUD behind me in the line." IDK. :)

The cashier had to put her stuff off to the side. Lady said he had to call her husband. Cashier rang my stuff through. HONESTLY. If she was not on the phone and being ignorant. Yes ignorant. I would have payed her $100ish bill. Get her name and number and she could pay me back and transfer funds later. Stuff happens.

She was no soccer mom. :)

[ironchop]

Welp. I don't know what she was saying on the phone. I only speak English.

Quebecois?[emoji38]

Or one those recent tourists on the Canadian Welfare Diversity World Tour?




She was no soccer mom. :)

Hockey mom? LMAO



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[El Camexican]

Quebecois?[emoji38]

Or one those recent tourists on the Canadian Welfare Diversity World Tour?



Hockey mom? LMAO



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I’ll guess Hindi.

[Rob Canadian]

I’ll guess Hindi.

She was of East Indian decent. I do speak a little French. LOL. Point is GET OFF THE PHONE. :). Time and place to talk on the phone.

[Shep1970]

When its 4:30ish and all I gotta do is cut stair balasters and put in 8 screws and trim the posts down- “half hours work”. The whole neighborhood looses power!!!!!!!! CRAPp

I guess come back tomorrow and set back up........cold shower is calling me anyway I guess- “it’s hot”

Shep (just venting). 253934 And the dang pics crooked———jeez

[ironchop]

When its 4:30ish and all I gotta do is cut stair balasters and put in 8 screws and trim the posts down- “half hours work”. The whole neighborhood looses power!!!!!!!! CRAPp

I guess come back tomorrow and set back up........cold shower is calling me anyway I guess- “it’s hot”

Shep (just venting). 253934 And the dang pics crooked———jeezAhhhh.....Tri-levels..... The most needlessly complicated home floor plan design ever conceived.... Definitely not for the "I hate stairs" homeowner crowd

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[sledcrazyinCT]

Lie straight to your face coworkers/company owner

[roostin atc]

Leaving the jobsite with the apprentice with plenty to do. Come back and easy tasks are half done phone in hand mid text. I take it in bite my tongue knowing my day got longer. Same guy is late every day.

[sweetip2000]

Self consumed self important swiping tapping cell phone tards that are so helpless they would not know how to pour water out of a boot with directions on the heel. The Me generation. ID10T error 24/7 365

[Shep1970]

When my electrician forgets to connect (wire up) two breakers. He’s paid and done. On vacation.... soooo I need to stand in 2 inches of water/mud and do it for him. “I survived” but I think it’s time to find a new electrician.
254888
Now I have to figure out why the furnace isn’t starting (low voltage) wire is cut somewhere- fun(not)
Welcome to my day:D

Shep

[ironchop]

.
254888
Shep

It puts the lotion on its skin.....



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[fieldy]

Daylight savings time, that'll get me cussing. Just added stress to adjust. I wasn't raised with it but probably had it changing now for ten years. Now i'm pissed.

[Gabriel]

Fractional measurement system.

The metric system is based on units of ten. EXPONENTIALLY easier to figure than doubled units starting with one. Especially when you start machining things because you don't use fractions. 1/16th is expressed as sixty two and a half thousandths. Screw remembering all that!


What's worse, the rest of the planet has moved on and we cling on to it here in the states for dear life. Only 3 countries still use the English system. THREE!

Death to the english measurement system!!!!!!



LOL!!!!!

[83ATC185]

That moment when it all comes together after you've cut grass and go to shower off, and for some strange reason there's a rock in the middle of your bathroom floor.

[Arky-X]

That moment when it all comes together after you've cut grass and go to shower off, and for some strange reason there's a rock in the middle of your bathroom floor.

Took me a second on that one......"why is there a rock in.....OH!"

That's why you pay homeowners insurance. So you can make a claim and they can go up on your premiums and cover that claim tenfold.

[Arky-X]

Speaking of insurance......

I have 5 cars and the one with the highest personal injury (injury to the driver and passengers) is my wife's 2015 Caddy which is by far the safest car we have :wondering

That car will apply the brakes when it thinks you are following too close, adaptive cruise control, lane departure warning, those light thingies in the mirrors that tell you someone is next to you, 482 individual airbags (a little exaggeration).

The agent wanted to talk to me about my policy (basically wanted me to buy more than the state minimum required liability) and he looked at me like I was an idiot when I asked him about this. His reply, "It's the newest vehicle." WTH!?!? That thing won't let you stub your toe getting in or out of it....much less wreck the damn thing.

[ironchop]

That moment when it all comes together after you've cut grass and go to shower off, and for some strange reason there's a rock in the middle of your bathroom floor.[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

Tell me it flew through the screen and it didn't break the glass

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[83ATC185]

I wish...At least it was going fast enough to punch a hole through the glass and not just shatter the whole thing out. A rock the size of a marble knocked a fist sized hole in the window and went through the plastic mini blinds and hit the wall 8ft on the other side hard enough to leave a mark in the sheetrock. I'm really glad it didn't hit me. Windows are easy to fix, my eyes are a lot harder to come by.

I've known people that would probably file a claim for that...and we wonder why insurance is so expensive and quick to drop people. It's unfair to everybody really.

I've been paying the same insurance rates on my vehicles for the past 11 years, doing my own repairs and I've never been in an accident, while bubba files a claim for every door ding and microscopic clear coat damage due to bird trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro.

[Gabriel]

Some of us aren't information whores. I don't need to know what NASA is doing & frankly don't give two wags of a ratz azz. Or the NSA, CIA or any other acronym organization. None of us have the power to change what they are doing so who by worrying about it can add anything to his wallet? If only some cool Jewsih guy had already told us that...OHH wait!

The machinations of greater (than me) men are of no concern to most of us rednecks. They don't pay bills, put food on the table or a frosty barely pop in my hand. SO....F 'em. Tin foil is for wrapping a brisket not my head.

[ironchop]

"........but you don`t care cause your killing DEAR and showing your square bodied trucks ya fackin redneck`s........

Yeah how about you seaside surfer sissies lead us stupid rednecks into salvation? You've been such stellar examples of Social and Civil masculinity thus far, maybe you flaxon-haired beauties can teach us all in Middle Earth about how to be real men.... Like Charlie Sheen or Jared Letto or whatever she-male the cosmopolitan city of LA churns out this week

Your righteous indignation loses alot of it's bite when you flap those biscuit lips from literally the biggest state full of sissies on the planet. Anyone from California saying anything remotely like "you should stick up for yourselves" has zero credibility

You surfer warrior cupcakes let your entire state get taken over by unemployed thieves and nutjobs who steal more of your money than in any state in the union. I'm pretty sure even the Constitution is illegal in California. You can have weed but that's it. No rights, no paycheck, no private property, no respect, no dignity.

You're going to need us rednecks to save your trailprotrailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro from Governor Lenin when he decides to imprison anyone who's not a nutjob in The La Raza States of Commiefornia and secedes from the US.

You ain't gonna win sh*t when you're by yourself because you mocked all your potential allies before the first real battle began

Go burn one and chill TF out Rick... You live in California. You've already lost the Geographical Stereotypes Contest before you even started playing

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[Gabriel]

Hmm, bad times: Do I want the wonderful people of Beverly Hills covering my hind end or some good ole boys from West Point Kentucky (Knob Creek). One cries 'bbbut we have rights' the other says "Brrrrrappppp. Anyone left?"

LOL!!!!!!


https://youtu.be/h11uEvGc7u8?t=77

[knappyfeet]

What pisses me off??........

The cost of this truck on ebay. 15K? This travesty is here...on earth....forget mars.


https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F28 3255834736

255584

[knappyfeet]

Actually I'm re thinking the whole AZ thing......now that it's not hot out there.

Nice quiet living in Buckeye....then just park the RV in front of my kids house and bug them for a month.

[El Camexican]

Yeah see ...........think i`ll move to Glamis .........fack diss sh!t !

Think bigger Glamy!

Why not a one-way trip to the Moon in a Tesla? Lunar taxes are non-existent, it’s like Akaska, they pay YOU to live there!:Bounce

All you need is a Gofuckme page to pay Mr. Musk “and your gone.... Glamy on the Moon with muskets, Glamy on the Moon with muskets, dut, dut dut da... awe, awe...”

[Gabriel]

Nope, we are all gentiles but it would be no insult to me to be a Son of Abraham.

[El Camexican]

Why don`t you marry your sister...........like all the rednecks do cause they can`t get a date ..........or Punyetta`s !..........jackoffs

I prefer YOUR sister-in-law, she works the “tubo” like a union plumber :drool:

[Gabriel]

You don't piss me off. I find you quite comical though.
My head ain't in the sand either. I just genuinely don't care. I didn't vote trump in. I've never voted in my life. I don't care. People are gonna do what they will and what they can get away with. Everyone.
I live my life the way I want and don't care about the rest. I live today because yesterday's gone and there's no promise of tomorrow. I didn't have and didn't want kids, I leave nothing behind except empty beer cans and probably a three wheeler or two i never managed to get running.


You're pretty entertaining though. If only half of what you type is genuine, I hope you're on some quality BP meds. You're poor old heart must be working it's socks off.

[Scootertrash]

Actually I'm re thinking the whole AZ thing......now that it's not hot out there.

Nice quiet living in Buckeye....then just park the RV in front of my kids house and bug them for a month.

This You knappy?

255585

[Gabriel]

..fits right in with the redneck thyme around here !

Add a little rosemary to that thyme and we might get some lamb chops grillin'!

[El Camexican]

Yo pass the frickin grits .......ya`ll........what is grits ......Styrofoam ?

Why don’t you kiss my grits.... surfer boy.

255592

255593

[El Camexican]

If you think wild animals talk like they do in Disney movies you might be from California.

If you drive an electric car that cost you as much as a small house in the Midwest, but the smoke and pollution from your annual brushfires creates more pollution than all the other cars in North America you might be from California.

If you eat beef, but think that killing a deer is morally wrong you might be an idiot.

[BOB MARLIN]

The person who takes a doughnut and tears it in half and puts the other half back in the box. Nobody is going to eat the other half after you had your fingers all over it.

[El Camexican]

People who get off airplanes, or to the bottom of a train station escalator with luggage and then stop abruptly as if they’ve reached an invisible finish line and begin to rummage through their stuff looking for coats and such as the rest of mankind piles up behind them.

[coolpool]

The fact that our state police (RCMP) can now breathalize for no reason except that they want to. Police state bullshit. I don't drink and drive but they should concentrate on the texter's and drivers, they're killing more than impaired drivers any day. I don't even want to have a beer when riding in the middle of our icy 120 sq/mi lake because they're out there on sleds too!

[83ATC185]

That my neighbors won't put a pipe under their driveway so the water crosses the road and floods half my yard and driveway with over a foot of water.

[Tri-Z 250]

^^Call the county or township road services. If your on a private lane look to your road agreement. If it's a secondary drive to a main, a culvert and permit is needed around my way. The friendly conversation obliviously hasn't worked. That's frustrating in it self.

[fieldy]

That my neighbors won't put a pipe under their driveway so the water crosses the road and floods half my yard and driveway with over a foot of water.

Several options. Start a mosquito breeding/ research/facility in the captured flood water.
When rain approaches park old junky boat with noisy 2 stroke motor in that flooding area you have built the scrap wood dock on. Run motor often because water is rising and one has yo be prepared in situation like this. "Dont know how much rains coming" "did you read about that ark?"
Plant some pretty shrubs in that area. There are certain varieties that are really beautiful,, like hedge, locust, white thorn, multifloral rose, cedar...
Good place for a raised dog kennal?

[Tri-Z 250]

Hog Farm always gets em' ! Not knowing if it's secondary, private or main. You have a local TownHall meeting one night every month. Attend 1meeting to see how it operates before you jump on the soap-box. The engineer area heads as a Mayor, Trustees will be there, ask good question to the right people. I had a neighbor with 5 500Galaxy 4door sunk in his yard...unless you have current tags, no more than 1 is allowed County wide. It might take time, you may still have options.

[HorseMcHorseman]

The $5 fee Craigslist started charging to post cars and within the last week or so now motorcycles. Very angry. Who knows what’s next...

[bkm]

The $5 fee Craigslist started charging to post cars and within the last week or so now motorcycles. Very angry. Who knows what’s next...People still use craigslist? Actually, I think the fee weeds out the bullshite. If you're will to pay the $5, you're probably serious about selling. My only problem is it's about 10 years too late. No one uses it anymore.

[HorseMcHorseman]

It’s the only place I buy my three wheelers. I’m not aware of another classified site. other than bookface marketplace but I refuse to make a bookface account

Furthermore some of the best things aren’t even posted. example i got my big red in a trade for a 4wd atv that I had listed. If I didn’t have that atv listed I never would have gotten my big red.

long story short I hope they don’t start charging for atv/utv/sno it will be a devastating loss. At least I’ll still be able to browse but who knows how much I’ll tentatively lose out on by not posting.


And how many people selling cheap cars atvs etc will be steered away by the fee, plus not everyone has a credit card

[bkm]

Facebook is horrible, but Marketplace has absolutely crippled craigslist. The only thing I like about Marketplace is that you can half asse see who you're dealing with and notifications are instant. I was selling a transmission a few weeks ago and put it on craigslist with my phone number and received 5 scam texts in the first 30 minutes. I sold it the next day in Marketplace. As far as the card thing, if you don't have some sort of card linked to a bank this day and age, I'd say you're in the minority and I've got no answer to that other than good luck.

[ironchop]

It won't last long.....CL is already at a serious disadvantage to FB and FB is free and has a million times the daily traffic as CL. I hate FB and don't have a page, but there's no way I'm paying five dollars to list a car or a motorcycle especially if I only want a few hundred dollars when I can do it free on Google/Zuckvision and I guarantee that's what most people will do too. I realize that classified ads in publications charged for a FS ad, but free versus five dollars? Yeah. Fail. They should have taken on ads first before they tried that. Are they unaware of FB Marketplace? I doubt it. FB/CL/internet are the reason alot of printed classifieds are dying out and it has everything to do with fees or the lack thereof.

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[HorseMcHorseman]

there's no way I'm paying five dollars to list a car or a motorcycle especially if I only want a few hundred dollars when I can do it free on Google/Zuckvision and I guarantee that's what most people will do too.
.... They should have taken on ads first before they tried that.

Exactly, I wonder about how much will be missed out on maybe I wanted to buy that xyz item someone was getting rid of for cheap but maybe now they don’t put it on craigs because of the fee

and I would be fine with ads, they’re everywhere else anyway

[sledcrazyinCT]

Some of my best purchases in past years was posted on Craigslist. It went downhill when GOOGLE screwed with Searchtempest so it was so more time consuming to search multiple C-list areas.

Oh BTW I hate dentists, cracked a tooth first week of October and after the third appt the bums finally pulled it tonight.

[keister]

Oh BTW I hate dentists, cracked a tooth first week of October and after the third appt the bums finally pulled it tonight.

^^^^^ Antidentite ^^^^^

[El Camexican]

Something that pisses me off is when you buy a used vehicle and the first time you drive it as an owner everybody that pulls up beside you at a red light has a vehicle that is knocking, smoking or emitting some sort of obnoxious oil, rubber or coolant odor that makes you think that your vehicle is jacked up when in fact it’s theirs that is.

Does anyone else besides me find this very stressful, or should I seek help?

[yaegerb]

Something that pisses me off is when you buy a used vehicle and the first time you drive it as an owner everybody that pulls up beside you at a red light has a vehicle that is knocking, smoking or emitting some sort of obnoxious oil, rubber or coolant odor that makes you think that your vehicle is jacked up when in fact it’s theirs that is.

Does anyone else besides me find this very stressful, or should I seek help?

Haha, I thought I was the only one who thought like that!

[ps2fixer]

Some of my best purchases in past years was posted on Craigslist. It went downhill when GOOGLE screwed with Searchtempest so it was so more time consuming to search multiple C-list areas.

Oh BTW I hate dentists, cracked a tooth first week of October and after the third appt the bums finally pulled it tonight.

Sounds like you need to seek another dentist. I don't have dental insurance, but the place I got to does great work... and they don't accept Medicaid, but they do accept Medicare (I'm not old enough for that). Since it's a small place I asked them why that is, and effectively they would have to double their prices because Medicaid requires the business to write off 50% or more of the bill as a loss.... and people wonder why health care is so expensive. Also since I was paying with cash, I got a 10% discount on top of their already pretty good prices. A solid gold crown was $800, and the install process was another $800 so $1600 total. I could have got the porcelain coated gold tooth to look "natural" but I prefer longevity over looks for a rear tooth.


Anyway, thread caught my attention so had to check in, so I guess I should post something on topic too... well not much stuff gets me worked up, about the only thing that really gets under my skin are tailgaters and people with bright lights behind me (or a combo of both).

[sledcrazyinCT]

Sounds like you need to seek another dentist.

Maybe out your way the dentists do it all in one place as a walk in, that must be nice....We have to use an oral surgeon for extractions and root canals, etc which means a person can't simply show up at an oral surgeon's office unless your regular dentist confirms your tooth is busted, and referred you to the 'specialist'.

As with most procedures the doctor would need to check patient initially, then reschedule the surgery for a later date. So if I were to just show up at an oral surgeon's office without a referral from another 'dentist', they would book me two separate appointments anyway....heaven forbid they take a patient's word for it that they have a broken tooth!
It is a racket with or without insurance, and cash isn't an incentive for them to get you in and out same day...booking multiple appointments are more to their liking.

[ps2fixer]

The dentist I have does all the work related to teeth. The helpers he has does like cleanings and such, but the "real" work he does. The office has something like 5-7 workers, was two dentists but the younger guy retired already at like 50 years old and the guy still doing his stuff is around 60. He's not even in a huge rush, takes his time, does quality work, and you can ask questions and such. I got into their office by just calling them and explaining my issue (had a wisdom rotted through the crown). They charged extra because it was an "emergency" appointment.

The last dentist I went to also did great work, but same story, doesn't take the insurance. Sadly his office is so booked, soonest appointment slot is 6+ months out. My mom's dentist she hates, rough finish work for fillings (gaps/holes) and they are in a huge rush and don't care if you go through pain etc. My fillings take about an hour, her's are like 30 mins.

For the crown it was 3 appointments, first was to inspect and basically validate what I already knew. Took antibiotics and about 3-4 weeks later was the next appointment to get the tooth molded, grown down, stud installed and the temp crown glued in. Last appointment was removing the temp crown and installing the permanent one.


Maybe state laws are different for different states or something? What you describe sounds like normal doctors and all the hoops they require you to jump through.

[HorseMcHorseman]

What are some people’s problem?
see picture.
some other examples off the top of my head are the the mount washington ride and that atv park in new york, even though i’ve see three wheelers in the videos that the atv park in new york posts so not sure on that one if it’s a new rule or just not actually enforced.

just ranting because i was thinking about going to the snow bog

261264

[ATC King]

So show up on a Murray riding mower with an open exhaust Hayabusa engine, and pin it to the rev limiter every minute while riding. Make certain to shake a fist like an old man at children crossing his lawn whenever anyone passes you at more than a walking speed.


If it has a flag, it's OK!

[ironchop]

Ughhh....SxS and golf carts. They aren't even cool anymore. Back in the day, you could get in big shenanigans with a golf cart. Now it's just the family cruising vehicle for your kids to ride around the subdivision in.

I saw SXSs in Gatlinburg cruising the strip all week.... What's the point of a 1000cc turbo Can Am if you're only doing 10mph, 16ft at a time, all day long, down a street in Tennessee?

Every car show here is infested with golf carts. I'm not talking about the race teams or campers getting around between areas. It's just kids and drunk people cruising the walking areas so that pedestrians have to move for the lazier, motorized ppl. Minibikes are getting just as bad. I quit going to events at Beech Bend raceway because of this. They don't care because they rent golf carts and make money. Parents rent them to entertain their kids and keep them busy terrorizing the walkers.

Fun Fact: your ten year old son needs to walk more. It's healthy for his a**..... Also, if you're too drunk to walk in a crowd of people, you're also too drunk to drive a golf cart in a crowd of people.




Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[Scootertrash]

Also, if you're too drunk to walk in a crowd of people, you're also too drunk to drive a golf cart in a crowd of people.

Say WUT??:wondering:eek:Dammit:shiftyeyes:

[ps2fixer]

Talking about that, the local mud bog hole (private property) was shut down for the same reason, people drinking and driving their mud bog trucks around a crowd of people which included plenty of kids running around etc. It's the few that ruins it for everyone.

[DAM shop]

WTF does the cornavirus affect the global market. WTF?

[ps2fixer]

WTF does the cornavirus affect the global market. WTF?

It effects the Chinese global market lol. Both Chinese suppliers I'm in contact with stopped production and work for a while to prevent the spread of the virus. Also bought a thing off ebay and inquired about a bug (typical quality issue) and they were also unable to reach the manufacture. For the time being, anything chinese, expect even worse support than normal lol

[ATC King]

NEW Parts


By that I mean Never Even Worked parts.



Just like a multimeter can help diagnose parts as bad, it can't prove them good either. New parts are most certainly not going to work 100% of the time and I just got me some of that new part fail percentage, and it pisses me off.



I've been working on a '99 Suburban with a 5.7L Vortec, that had a crank but no-start condition. Being a mechanic, I have worked on and have a pretty good knowledge of these year engines. In hindsight, probably made me a little overconfident.

The scan tool I'm using is an Autel MaxiSys MS906BT (my personal tool) and I have factory repair manuals for this one year and vehicle (literally five books and 1,000's of pages). There were no codes pertinent to the no start. There was a downstream O2 sensor code, because a dog had chewed the wires apart, which I repaired.


In the end, I overthought the whole thing and eventually came to my reasonable senses and knowledge of the issues with these engines to find the problem.



A problem I made for myself, was replacing two parts at once. I know better, but slipped up.

Original problem was hard starting, which eventually turned into a no-start. The hard starting turned out the be fuel pressure below specifications, which was a bad pump. These year Suburbans have a 44 gallon fuel tank...better hope that joker isn't full. The CSFI injection on these will not work with anything below 45psi and even 50psi, it still may not. These have a poppet style injector and they physically won't squirt fuel at low pressure and the specification is ~55psi minimum.

There is an updated electronic injector set for these, which the later Vortec engines had stock. CSFI was problematic. Another thing that pisses me off is people calling this 'spider injection.' IT DOES NOT INJECT SPIDERS! IT ALSO HAS A NAME!

That's a Twofer pissed off for ya. Get yer monies worth on this read.




I replaced the fuel pump, but at the same time, the distributor. These have a plastic distributor. Yes, the whole thing is plastic. One problem is the screw bosses where the distributor cap bolts on, tend to break off after a couple tune-ups. I happened to look at it and seen they were cracked, so I installed a new aluminum distributor that came with a new cap. Just as a precaution, I've replaced several of these because new aluminum distributors cost less than a tow. The plastic distributor is a known problem on high mileage engines and a easily, inexpensively upgradable.



OK. So battery charged, key in...cranks but won't start. O.M.G.


Right now, I'll say this is one of those situations where some backyard mechanic using starting fluid as a diagnostic aid would have likely damaged the engine. You'll see why later.

Dang. Another pissed off scenario. The hits keep coming.


With a scan tool, I'm able to use a fuel pressure gauge and manually fire each one of the injectors with the engine off to determine if they're functional, and they're all working. It's getting fuel if the system is telling it too (a caveat).

I pull number one plug and it's firing, while also lining up with the timing mark on the balancer. So it's getting fuel, spark, and the timing is correct.


The problem is it isn't starting and also acting like the ignition timing is off. Ignition coils can exhibit these symptoms, but so can ignition modules. Regardless of my experience, I ignore something I should double check, even if it's new. Into the rabbit hole I go.


Ignition coils can be tested and the test are typically definitive unless the case is cracked or broken somewhere and there is voltage leak. The coil check out. My next diagnostic step is unplugging the computer and doing a pinout test. A shorted wire or bad connection to the ignition module or other sensors could be the problem and being the computer is right there under the hood and couldn't be any easier to get at, a pinout test is actually pretty quick and easy.


When first started, these engines are in open loop and only need the crankshaft position sensor, MAP, and ECT sensors to run. There is a camshaft position sensor in the distributor, but it isn't needed for basic function. The distributor is mainly a physical functioning piece, just like any older one. They are very, very simple systems, but still have a lot of wiring and connections that can go bad after 20 years. Everything checks out with the wiring.

It's getting fuel and spark but still not starting. Out of curiosity, I did check compression and it was good. I also looked at valves moving by removing spark plugs and using a bore scope as I turned the engine over by hand.


One thing I can't directly see functioning parameters on my scantool is the ignition module. Anyone with HEI experience knows these things and have probably been road foundered by one. Everything otherwise look copasetic and it should be running. I fire up the parts cannon, and shoot a ignition module at it. Negative.


I have to step back and think, think, think. It's still spitting like the ignition is out of time and I know for a fact that everything mechanical is in time. Fuel pressure is good and the ignition module didn't fix it and the coil is good. All the wiring and grounds check out. It has a new distrib...


I've got to be stupid. I just took a Vortec stupidity test and failed.


Getting on with my presumption, I get out my remote start button and a timing light. I use a timing light as a quick, non invasive way to check for spark function. I hook the light to number one cylinder, press the starting button, and everything is as before. I get a regular, rhythmic light on TDC, exactly how it should be. Then I clamp onto number three...


I'm thoroughly pissed off at what I see. The timing light is flashing like a strobe, as in firing like number three is firing every time the coil does, for every cylinder.


Anyone who knows Vortec distributor caps, knows their fatal flaw. How can this one be bad, it's NEW?

I can't post pictures right now, but look for pictures of a clear Vortec distributor cap and the potential for crossfire becomes obvious. In an effort to clean up the engine bay and route plug wires more aesthetically, GM made a cap with internal routing that placed all the odd cylinder on one side and the even on the other. The HUGE problem with this is the cap is prone to internal shorting across wires because the plastic breaks down, or in my case, was bad to start with.

This condition can't be seen, and can't be tested by resistance, because there is no direct short, it's only the high powered secondary spark that jumps within the plastic molded around the internal paths, and number three happens to be a close path to the coil wire, or the highest energy.

Although every plug was getting spark, they weren't all getting it at the right time because of a NEW distributor cap with internal shorting. Number one looked good though :(

This is where the starting fluid may have caused intake damage, because the upper intake plenum is plastic and a energetic backfire wouldn't have been good. Bad ignition timing and starting fluid is a recipe for disaster. Imagine an engine with a recoil starter and having it very forcibly ripped from you grasp because of a backfire with starting fluid. People with good imaginations probably have sore hands now.



Never Even Worked parts. They're on a shelf, waiting for you.

[ps2fixer]

Been there done that, had an early 90's grand am, it only missed under a load, thankfully my dad's an auto mechanic and I just got the car and told me to do a basic tune up on it just to rule up the simple stuff. New plugs, wires, and cap & rotor.... fired it up, now it misses completely on one cylinder! Started pulling spark plug wires to find which cylinder it was, found the bad one, pulled the plug and all looked good, so moved it to another cylinder, reinstalled, problem followed the spark plug. When I went to remove it, the top half of the plug broke off. Brand new plugs out of the box bad, maybe someone dropped it, who knows. Another new plug and it ran good... well for a couple months then the head gasket blew and I scrapped the pile of junk xD. It had the undesirable "U" motor instead of the quad 4 that people don't like either, but I had fairly good exp with them, just head gaskets, burp the engine with anything anti freeze related, and typical electrical nightmares.

Since I sell parts, I hate the idea of someone getting a part and it not working out of the box, so my quality control is to test every one. My main seller is modified ignition switches, so they can be tested electrically, and physical inspection for any cracks etc (some are China sourced). If I didn't do any quality control, I'd have around a 10% failure rate for the China sourced parts, they are had some really bad batches. I'm getting pretty fed up with their garbage where a product isn't half bad, so I buy 150qty and they are the worst piles of garbage. Sadly that means more expensive parts, but I'm moving to source from Honda which means retail price + mod costs + shipping, ebay fees etc. The parts game is interesting, but it's getting so flooded with truly junk Chinese parts, no one can find the parts that I go through and do my best to make as good as possible with what I'm working with. Like there's a ton of Chinese starter solenoids listed on ebay for some 3 wheeler models, they are known for getting stuck on, so I've bought some Honda ones, modded them, listed, 0 sales in months. Worst case, I have some high quality starter solenoids I guess.


Back on topic with the last post, one thing I've suggested to people trying to diag problems is if they replace a part and it makes no change, revert back to the original part unless the new part is a known working part on another machine. Most of those people are just blindly replacing parts though and I'm basically telling them to stop and atleast attempt some diag work. It's crazy how many people have multi meters, but no one can use it. One guy had 2 china meters, first one broke and his wife found another one exactly the same thing lol. That cap design sounds pretty crazy, also the distributor being all plastic just spells out trouble to me. I haven't gotten around vehicles that new, refuse to buy them, too much plastic, quality dropped too much, etc. The only thing going for them is the engine tech, more power and potentially good mpg for the given power level, but I'm driving a 1990 atm, fixing my 1998 truck, and my gas miser is a 1997, simple, effective, good to great mpg, the 97 has over 300k miles, I put 80k on it myself xD.

[ATC King]

In many ways, newer vehicles are much easier to diagnose. They are perpetually connected to test equipment.

If lucky, an old vehicle has a water temp and oil pressure gauge, while many just had warning lights. If wanting to check anything else out, something, another gauge, has to be attached. Fuel pressure, vacuum, tachometer, timing light, voltmeter, the list goes on.

Want to know transmission pressure and temp, new cars already have those sensors installed. Engine load, timing advance/retard, spark knock, injector pulse width, cylinder misfire (and which ones), air-fuel ratio, fuel pressure, manifold pressure, intake air temp, radio volume, air conditioner evap temp, vehicle security status, if it passed onboard emission test, fuel tank pressure and temp, the list goes on, a long freaking way.

New cars are rolling test labs and newer scan tools don't even require a physical connection because they use Bluetooth dongles. Anything late 1970's-early 1990's were absolute nightmares to diagnose and work on. All the vacuum lines and crappy electronics, and before OBDII was mandated by the government, it typically meant only dealerships had access to manufacturer specific scanning equipment.

For what some people pay for a phone and plan, a person can buy a good quality scan tool and totally geek out on a new car. You don't need a $15,000 Snap-on Zeus to get into learning about onboard diagnostics. I've used everything from the early Snap-on 'brick' to a Zeus, and other brands of tools on a daily basis. Many times we'd double check by using two different brands of tools if we weren't sure about the information received.

If someone has a new car, buying a scan tool with support for it is much more affordable today than years ago. The support for my tool alone would cost over $500 a year, but I let it lapse since I'm not working in a shop right now. Support is, among other functions, for vehicle updates, the tool functions just fine without it, it just won't automatically update when online. A older scan tool at used prices is perfectly good for someone to start learning on, and with the stupid crap people waste money on, a $1,000 for a scan tool is money well spent, if just for one's own vehicle repairs.

As far as new cars being junky, the higher end and more luxury they are, the harder they are to keep going and work on. The most basic vehicles are the ones on the road the longest, with the fewest repairs. That's been true since about, forever. Other than interior parts, many budget priced vehicles give really good service. On caveat is manual windows. They are typically junk, power windows work better and last longer.

[ps2fixer]

I've seen the opposite effect, but I'm talking in the context of Toyota, they do things a little different from other brands. Their bottom of the bucket cars are cars built for mileage, still very reliable, but they are also built down to a price and weight. My LS400 for example has been in Michigan all of it's life, and barely has rust on it, better paint, thicker metal, overall build quality was better. Electronics wise, the LS400 does have a couple issues, but it's their attempt at making things futuristic instead of keeping it simple, like the gauge cluster is one of the first ones I know of with LED lit needles fully electronic controlled, the capacitors go bad in them and sometimes the needles don't move the correct amounts per pulse, or the caps for the led lighting is bad (I read they are over driven). The Corolla on the other hand is like any other toyota from that era, everything was was back lit based on standard bulbs. Climate control in the Lexus works really well, full range automatic fan control, but the displays had an issue where they'd go out. replacement display is $30, not a huge deal. Other car is just sliders, so worst case a cable goes bad.

For window controls, manual and power are super reliable on all of the Toyota's I've been around (40+ and only 1 electronic one failed, 2 manual). This is in the context of rusted out beater vehicles that were parts only when I bought them, or my dad bought them. Now jump to a 2014 Chevy Cruze, and the mirror control switches have already failed, master window switch is part of the same assembly, so it's like $140 for just the part.

I completely agree though, diaging newer vehicles are nice because the tons of on board sensors, but it's also a nightmare if there's an actual electrical issue that the computer can't tell you about. With more sensors also comes more possible parts to fail. I really enjoy the 90's vehicles, some were complete garbage, some were really good, but I had the not enough sensor problem going on with my T100. Misses when warm, cold it runs fine. Knew it had to be coil related (ignition coil, crank/cam sensor, etc). I just started swapping parts with known good ones which was more of a waste of time, I should have grabbed the ohm meter out and started probing. Injector #2 was 1200ohms, rest 13.5ohms. ECU didn't log the misfire, not sure why, being a 98 it should have a code for #2 misfire.

I didn't quite say the new cars are complete junk, just more plastic than I care for. The engines have progressed well it seems like, which goes along with the ecu and onboard diag equipment.

The LS400 is known to go 500k+ miles if taken care of, one of the most reliable vehicles out there from the 90's. Every vehicle has issues of some sort, and after 30 years, this model has held up really well to the test of time and Michigan salt. It only has 235k miles on it though quite low for the age, which means it sat more than it probably should have, or the odd chance it was legit not driven often.

With some knowledge of how the electronics work on a car, a $50 scanner can get you in the ball park fairly well. Clearly having access to oscilloscope readings and such would be ideal (not sure if the newer cars offer that kind of data logging or what resolution it's in or how exactly it's communicated). Maybe my experience is with too old of vehicles though, like 96-2005ish, has the OBD2 spec updated since then?

Ironically, I don't mind manual windows, for GM products I think the manual windows were more reliable than power windows at first. They were really bad in the 90's, not sure how 2000+ is like since I quit buying US branded and instead started buying actually US made (yes the Lexus is Japanese made, Corolla was made in Ohio). For Toyota, power windows all the way though.

I pretty much wouldn't want a vehicle newer than 2000, but maybe 2010+ the build quality got better. I see so many plastic parts on heat related areas on newer vehicles though, then there's issues with the plastics after 5 years. Like the intake gasket problems of the late 90's on US made cars, no idea why they made them out of plastic, the "Job Saver" gaskets were made of metal, no more problems. Also saw a 2018 Ford F150 with a leaking upper radiator hose... it doesn't clamp on like every other vehicle I've seen, it has a chunk of plastic at the end of the hose with an O-ring in it, the o-ring failed and the parts store don't sell just the o-ring. The guy wanted the truck up and going asap, so whole upper radiator hose had to be replaced, probably will fail in another 2-3 years. A standard rubber hose with hose clamps didn't fail so soon unless I have bad memory (very possible, I'm getting older lol).

So yea, new is good/bad, old is good/bad, everything has their pros and cons. I just happen to like the older stuff more for now atleast. About the only brand I'd buy newer would be a Lexus, but the LS400 got a million features by 2000, stuff I wouldn't need, like rear seat fridge, heated and cooled seats front and rear. I wouldn't mind heated mirrors though, the defroster doesn't reach the mirrors so well xD.

[ATC King]

Plastic has been used for major automotive parts much longer than many people may realize. A couple things I have to say about the plastic engine parts, like intake manifolds, is they don't corrode like aluminum will from neglected coolant and they don't hold heat in like steel or aluminum. They're also lighter weight and have smoother interior surfaces. If you like Toyota as a brand, their new trucks have plastic beds. I don't mean a cover, or liner, the entire bed floor is plastic. They've been that way for a number of years now and a lot of people like them too. They're lightweight, won't rust, and they won't dent like steel or aluminum.

I think the main thing to keep in mind, is car buyers aren't the same they were 20 years ago and further back. Most won't keep the same vehicle past the warranty and will continually trade their used one in on a new one. Their idea is that as long as they keep a car payment and a newer car, with a warranty, they'll have reliable transportation and they've accepted lifelong, monthly payments as default. They're not necessarily wrong. As repair costs have climbed, along with everything else in a modern lifestyle, people are willing to pay a little more upfront for transportation security. Automobiles have only been around for an infinitesimal amount of time in human history and our overreliance on them borders on insanity. No matter how it's looked at, they're an expense that people can do without, just like humans have been doing for tens of thousands of years, but anyone wanting to partake in that modern lifestyle has to pay to play.

I drive an old truck. My ownership and use of that older vehicle is a luxury most people can't afford. I have the skillset, experience, and tools to repair and maintain it myself. If not for those, I could not afford to own it. That puts me ahead compared to most peoples vehicle expenses, but I did got to a automotive technical school and have worked in automotive shops. Plus, I have $$$ in tools. I still paid for it, but I think I'm paid ahead for a while.


An answer to your question of how progressed vehicle engine controls have come is the variable displacement engine. This is also known as the V8-6-4 engine. It has been a concept well before the 1980's, but Cadillac tried it and the tech flopped. It's back and it works. New Chevrolet trucks use this and it's seamless.

Since the 1990's, automotive computing power has increased significantly. This means sensors can read inputs and change outputs so rapidly, it's mind blowing. This increase in computer and electronic component capability is why the next big change for internal combustion engines will be a free-valve design. Having full, variable control of the engine's valves has been engineer's wet dream concept since about the creation of the ICE. It'll mean smaller, lighter, less complex, and lower cost engines, with power, efficiency, and lower emissions far beyond what even current engine have. It'll have some growing pains just like any other leading edge tech, but it'll flip the car industry on it's head. Essentially, after that, anything with a camshaft will look like a Popping Johnny.

One thing all the electric car enthusiasts forget, is the flexibility of the ICE. It'll run on just about any inflammable liquid or gas. They already run on gasoline, alcohol, propane, and compressed natural gas as commercially available fuels. The other thing is, ultimately, a car is the same size regardless of it's power source. That means as population density in cities continues to increase, there'll be less space for them. Cars are incompatible with urbanism. Singletrack vehicles (motorcycles, mopeds, bicycles) and mass transit are the only means of mechanized transport that makes sense in a high population density area.

Rural areas are where cars are going to remain, because of the distances traveled. Battery energy density will not outpace population growth, so the ICE will continue to improve and remain for a while.


There are some people who won't get onboard and think carburetors and points still have a place in a modern lifestyle. Arkansas State Representative Jack Fortner is one of those, and doesn't think 'anything good happened in the auto field after ’72.' https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2019/03/20/despite-prior-opposition-new-arkansas-law-increases-antique-vehicle-cutoff-from-25-to-45-years/

Another is a guy I worked with. I can't call him a coworker, because he wasn't much more than a chair warmer. A near retirement aged knob, who refused to use a scan tool. This guy could have jumped onboard from day one and progressed as the vehicles did, but was just lazy and ignorant. He had the same job for most of his adult life and never really learned anything of significance. He's unemployable in the modern automotive repair field because he's too far behind, but it's a government job he's had for years and he won't get fired. He'll continue to suck up tax money into retirement and sit on his rear as everyone else is getting it done. He is on the computer all day, clicking on any 'you won't believe what happened,' clickbait ad that has a sexy woman in it, but doesn't have a clue about deleting his browsing history or temp files.


I'm not bagging on carbs and points. I like me some carbs...points not so much. Had them when I was a teenager, along with a three speed column shift. I'm bagging on the ideology that they're superior by people who are fat and lazy (euphemism). Fat as in their life has been too comfortable and lazy as in not putting effort into learning.





As an argument for newer technology, I like to use the EGR valve as a point. Them danged EGR valves are the devil, put on Earth to soil the purity, and sanctity of my gasoline burning engine, harumph!

New cars don't have them and don't need them. Variable valve timing allows the manufacturers to accomplish the same thing without a EGR valve.


Just like air injection pumps (smog pumps) are gone, so to is the EGR with modern engine technology. It's all about combustion process control, and with more advanced systems, there's more control and less need for added appendages.






Nothing above is meant to be taken personally. I'm certainly not being too serious, except for those two guys mentioned. They're turd heads. I like all types of cars, unlike that turd head who doesn't like anything past '72, and probably doesn't like anything earlier than '55. Which, I guess, is him regretting he got old, while not realizing the alternative isn't any better.

Forrest for the trees type of nonsense, I guess.


Free Willy, Free Valve!

[Shep1970]

My 2-cents, I’ve got a newer 2016 Chevy truck with the “variable displacement engine” it’s complete crap/ I’d never buy another Chevy truck that had it.... I know some like it but the people that I’ve spoke to in person that own newer Chevy trucks feel the same way, and more than a couple have spent the money on some chip that’ll shut it off, and guess what there mileage hasn’t changed, but will void any warranty or whatnot. When my warrantee is done I’ll get that upgrade also/ turning off that foolish v8v6/v4 mode.

OH... then there’s the damn power windows... there’s two-settings on my drivers window switch that I at most times just open my window about an inch. The other setting it goes all the way down and the sensitivity or closeness of notches on the switch is almost nonexistent.
so who’s the lazy person who designed that... just keep you finger on it longer to go all the way down.
I’d personally rather have manual windows myself
Then there’s the traction control..... why would anyone want that.
Ya I guess I’m the guy that doesn’t like anti- lock brakes either.
.
My opinion/just venting/ probably need a drink or two also

shep

[ps2fixer]

Yea the fully electronic valve system is 100% the future. I knew that back when I was a teen and was wondering why it didn't exist back then.

I've heard nothing but bad experience with all of the V8-6-4 engine setups. I don't think Toyota does that with their V8 trucks, there's probably a reason for it.

I get why points are effectively old news, there's not a whole lot that can be done timing wise with them, and ignition timing can really make an engine perform a lot better. Carb with electronic ignition is a pretty happy middle grounds for old tech and modern tech. Like I'd rather stick with an ATV with a carb over the EFI setup in most situations, but my dad does have a 680 rincon with EFI and hasn't had any problems with it. Now in the chain saw world, the electronically control carbs were terrible based on my dad's experience, he went to a different brand and fell in love with their build quality and design.

I don't doubt engine tech has came a long ways. For a car/truck, generally speaking newer engine designs are better, tend to last longer etc. Problem is more electronics also means more potential issues that tend to be harder to diag if the computer can't sense what's going on.

I didn't know about Toyota make the plastic beds. That's interesting, but time will tell how long the plastic lasts for. We have cold winters up here, for the most part plastic parts hold up alright from Toyota, but not sure if I'd like the plastic box. Put racks on it and put a real load on it and the plastic might break from over stress. No first hand experence, so clearly just shooting in the dark. I haul wood, I throw it in the truck. Sometimes I need to pull stuff and sometimes mistakes happen and I get pulled sideways into a tree etc. Minor enough to just cause a dent, and hit the back side with your fit and it pops back out. Same hit might just pop out with plastic, but depends on the type of plastic. Seems like if it's a bendable plastic, it would be weak for heavy loads, if it's a stronger plastic, it would be more brittle so impacts could be a problem. I'll have to check out the boxes though, plastics have came a long ways too, so has glass. I'm just not a fan of plastic intakes, never really ran into corrosion issues with AL heads/intakes on a Toyota. GM products I have though. Luck of the draw, or something, I can't say 100%. I've used aftermarket boxes with fiberglass bed sides and a metal bed. They work well, but the tail light mount spots are always stripped out. Just a bad design in that area though. I wonder how well the plastic holds up to sun light, that tends to cause damage for pretty much any plastic parts. I looked around on youtube and on google and don't see any mention of broken boxes or major problems. The mounting system on them isn't the greatest and can cause rattles.

This is kind of an interesting thread, the story may or may not be true though.
https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/be-careful-deer-hunter-hole-in-my-bed.113134/

That does remind me though, has the newer cars figured out how to make plastic headlights that don't fade in the sun? I've preferred vehicles with glass headlights for ages because of that issue. One of the nice selling points of that 96 Tacoma, glass head lights, my Lexus is glass too, corolla and camry is plastic.

Another thing newer cars keep doing is creating more and more hp for each vehicle type. Yea, I like having power, but there's a market for cars with high mpg. I don't understand why there isn't a low hp ultra efficient car made. Like my Corolla with 300k miles can get ~40mpg with the right diving habits, that's a 1.8L 4 cylinder. It was rated for 23mpg city, 31 highway by the EPA. Maybe I have a fluke though, with my scan gauge on it, if at cruise I lift up and just feather touch the gas just right, I get around 26 degrees advancement and pull great mpg figures, if I just drive it "normal" or use cruise control, it jumps to 39 degrees advancement and the mpg figures drops a lot. Before that car I thought I understood ignition advancement effect on MPG somewhat alright, but not really sure since then.

I get that today people throw stuff away and buy replacements more often than getting stuff fixed, and if stuff is getting fixed, finding someone that's skilled and honest with their work can also be hard to find. I do all my own work on my vehicles because I don't trust mechanic shops around here. My dad's worked at most locations and none of them are really a good work environment, and there's always the person that wants to be lazy and not do the job right. Rust is a major problem up here from the road salts, part of a brake job should be cleaning up the rust so the brakes work well, but some of the people just slap new pads on and call it good.

Anyway, I fully get this is a discussion, if it turns into fighting/arguing I normally just leave the conversion since there's no value being created at that point, and no one is willing to learn on either side of the fence. I try to keep an open mind as much as possible and view things from more than just my own view point.

Even though I'm not the first person in line for an EFI atv, I still think it would be interesting to take the modern system from a new quad and make the parts fit on say a 350x and see how the effects are. Doing turbos and such is probably easier with EFI.



@Shep

The window switch design sounds stupid to me, what happened to the press it a little and you can control the window like normal, and press it hard and it goes all the way down on it's own? That's how the toyota ones work, I can crack the window 1/8in pretty easily or go 1in, just a quick light press of the button.

I actually had a car that had traction control that I actually liked, it worked well for once, no ignition cutting effects. Toyota (well Lexus) kept it simple, the intake has two butterflies, one for the main throttle, and the other for traction control. When it senses the tires are spinning, it cuts off air to the engine to keep from spinning the tires. I tested it out in the snow and ice, spun down in the snow down to the ice. I left the traction control on, and drove out, didn't spin a bit and I was floored how well it worked. I backed up in the same spot, turned traction control off (simple button for the Lexus) and it was a back and forth fight to get it to come out. For "normal" driving, having it on I'd be happy with. If I want to play, just tap a button, and it doesn't mess with you at all. My daily driver doesn't have it, I only tested it on a parts car I bought that happened to have it. Worst case, pull the fuse and it's always wide open. The car has nothing on the brakes for traction control, only ABS.

Now the Cadillac my grandpa had, that thing had the worst traction control system. My mom and dad's place is nothing but loose sand and the parking area is at a slight hill. That car would cut out and hit the brakes and do all kinds of stupid stuff and it'd just get stuck in the sand. Disable it, and you could just drive up it with a little tiny bit of wheel spin. This was way before I got into Toyota's and basically viewed all traction control systems as junk.

I don't mind having the extra electronic features, but I want full control to disable what I don't like too. When the vehicle does stuff it thinks is best and I have no control over it, that's when I buy another vehicle. I don't run windows 10 because of how much garbage it's doing it the back ground. The clear thing everyone hates is the forced automatic updates, the tech people can get in and disable it, but if you do a manual update, then all settings (and new settings) have to be checked again because they change what you initially setup. This includes privacy settings and such.

[ironchop]

My 2-cents, I’ve got a newer 2016 Chevy truck with the “variable displacement engine” it’s complete crap/ I’d never buy another Chevy truck that had it.... I know some like it but the people that I’ve spoke to in person that own newer Chevy trucks feel the same way, and more than a couple have spent the money on some chip that’ll shut it off, and guess what there mileage hasn’t changed, but will void any warranty or whatnot. When my warrantee is done I’ll get that upgrade also/ turning off that foolish v8v6/v4 mode.

OH... then there’s the damn power windows... there’s two-settings on my drivers window switch that I at most times just open my window about an inch. The other setting it goes all the way down and the sensitivity or closeness of notches on the switch is almost nonexistent.
so who’s the lazy person who designed that... just keep you finger on it longer to go all the way down.
I’d personally rather have manual windows myself
Then there’s the traction control..... why would anyone want that.
Ya I guess I’m the guy that doesn’t like anti- lock brakes either.
.
My opinion/just venting/ probably need a drink or two also

shepMy car drivers window do that. Annoying as hell.

I don't care for anti-lock or Trac control either and the latter never works right for very long in any vehicle I've ever owned that had the feature.

I'll take vacuum operated power brakes and I like me some hydraulic steering but I want a carbureted V-8 with two sensors. Temp and oil. Don't need anything else. EMP proof it. I don't care if it gets terrible mileage at this point. I think modern cars are overpriced, underbuilt, and overcomplicated

One thing that perplexes me is when folks talk about the efficiency of electronic controlled fuel systems and how much better fuel economy they produce but I remember when my buddy's parents got him a new Honda CRX for college back in 1986 and I'm almost certain that car was carbureted and not fuel infected. We took it to Kings Island and it got 51mpg there and back with a manual trans.

Today's "high efficiency" and heavily electronic sensored single fuel/single drive (not hybrid) autos are in the high 30s hwy mpg AT BEST.... So what gives? Either electronics aren't that efficient or maybe they're being programmed to be inefficient. 51mpg gasoline in 86 and high 30s now? That's regression. We should be getting much higher figures so I'm suspicious.

Remember the first gen Honda Civic? Early seventies and it got, I think, 40mpg hwy on gasoline (probably leaded) and with a carburetor and no electronics. Is there a gas Civic today that gets that kind of mileage?

What gives?

Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[DAM shop]

My 2-cents, I’ve got a newer 2016 Chevy truck with the “variable displacement engine” it’s complete crap/ I’d never buy another Chevy truck that had it.... I know some like it but the people that I’ve spoke to in person that own newer Chevy trucks feel the same way, and more than a couple have spent the money on some chip that’ll shut it off, and guess what there mileage hasn’t changed, but will void any warranty or whatnot. When my warrantee is done I’ll get that upgrade also/ turning off that foolish v8v6/v4 mode.

OH... then there’s the damn power windows... there’s two-settings on my drivers window switch that I at most times just open my window about an inch. The other setting it goes all the way down and the sensitivity or closeness of notches on the switch is almost nonexistent.
so who’s the lazy person who designed that... just keep you finger on it longer to go all the way down.
I’d personally rather have manual windows myself
Then there’s the traction control..... why would anyone want that.
Ya I guess I’m the guy that doesn’t like anti- lock brakes either.
.
My opinion/just venting/ probably need a drink or two also

shep

Shep regarding your cylinder deactivation, yes a chip will shut it off from going from 8 to 4 cyl, but that's only part of the solution. The internals of these motors are somewhat different, different valves (smaller oil ports on 4 of the valves) and cam to accomadate the whole deactivation thing.. To do it right is about a 2,000 dollar bill I believe, going in and switching out all the valves to single cylinder ones and changing the cam over and yes the chip also so you can reprogram once your done.. I've looked into this with a buddy that does that.. I suppose the upside of that is you can get a better cam, reprogram the chip thus get some better performance out of it..
As for me it was advised that I buy the chip now, shutting off the deactivation of the cylinders. Let it ride and if it takes out a cylinder from (being starved of oil) then we spend the money and do the top end.. It's an odd set up and does nothing to increase fuel mileage I think it actually hinder's it.. I drive my truck at times in tow mode giving me more lower rpm's and much better response in lower gears. Chevy never got this system totally figured out, I think other manufactures have. Mine is a 2012 and being your's is newer it tells me it's still an issue. Good intention's to make the government happy with the whole gas mileage thing and to maybe help boost sales saying " better fuel economy with cylinder deactivation" Phooey!

[Shep1970]

I should just buy like a 78 Chevy pickup/ I’m kinda just old school when it comes to electronics/gadgets/buttons/touchscreens I guess, I like things simple.

[ATC King]

Now this thread has some life!


I want to casually respond to couple things mentioned.


A lot of the GM vehicles that have the auto window feature are also user programmable. Meaning the user can turn that function off. There are a lot of user programmable features in the vehicles settings menu.

I know a couple people with 2019 Chevy trucks, and they don't have an issue with the variable displacement system. Maybe they've improved. I don't notice any issues when driving them and I intentionally jack around try to make something weird happen.

There's usually a way to turn off the traction control. A good thing to know is how it works on different vehicles, so if shopping for a new one, a decision can be made based on if it's a system the driver enjoys or is annoyed by it. A good system is one that isn't noticeable when it's working. A lot of cites don't clean their streets anymore and when it rains, the roads are like ice. With more and more traffic, and less cleaning, city streets are downright dangerous during the first few minutes of rain.

Modern traction control, among other inputs, using things like a Yaw-rate sensor and accelerometer. These are things that are in the cell phone in your hand. Anyone would also be hard pressed to find a new vehicle that had a throttle cable. Manufacturers started going to fully electronic controlled throttle bodies years ago, and that improved traction control systems.

As someone who used to drive a four wheel, drum brake pickup, I can appreciate disk brakes. I can also appreciate ABS, though I virtually never use the brakes hard enough to activate it. I appreciate it even in my old truck, because it keeps idiot drivers from crashing into me. I've seen it work in my rearview at traffic lights, and the startled look on the drivers faces.

I will definitely take vacuum assisted brakes over Hydro-Boost in a gas vehicle. I don't want anything but the steering box hooked up to the power steering pump.

Fuel mileage has increased to some degree, but cars have gotten much heavier and trucks much larger, so the increase isn't realized. The weight largely comes from safety features. New cars are much safer than old ones. People are able to walk away from crashes that would've killed the occupants forty years ago. My 1979 Ford F150 weighs hundreds of pounds less than a new one but is less safe in a crash. The doors don't even have a cross brace in them. If I was hit in the door, it would shove into the cab.

The other extra weight comes from creature comforts. I can easily remove the entire bench seat from my truck, by myself, but one modern pickup seat, with heat, air bag, adjustable lumbar, electronic adjustment, and whatever else they can stuff in it, is enough to blow my guts out my rear if I try to lift it out. My truck doesn't have air conditioning, and that's a pretty good weight reduction that most people would rather have.

My truck also doesn't have much sound insulation, and isn't nearly as quiet and comfortable to drive. It does manage to get close to 18mpg, but doesn't have the power of a new truck with an equivalent sized engine. The gigantic size of modern trucks is one reason their fuel economy isn't better. They have a large frontal area to push through the wind, and with everyone wanting to drive 70mph, that simply sucks up the fuel. The faster the vehicle moves, the more air resistance it has to overcome, and the more power it takes. A lot of people want their big 'ol pickup nowadays to use as a family vehicle, when there are other people in the world using LUV and Courier sized trucks, for actual truck work.


Feel the LUV. Be the Courier of happiness.

New trucks look so angry.


Below are a couple links to short articles about just how large new vehicles have become. People want the room and safety, apparently, and there's no getting something for nothing. No eating of the cake and having it too, as it were.

https://www.carscoops.com/2020/03/trucks-and-suvs-are-getting-too-big-for-home-garages-and-public-parking-spaces/

https://jalopnik.com/the-surprising-other-reason-cars-keep-getting-bigger-1785292229


I had a 1985 CRX. Awesome fuel economy, but it was tiny and lightweight, with the biggest safety feature being the grey stuff between the driver's ears. Literally, big truck tires are about as tall as the roof on a CRX and that's a little unnerving with interstate truck traffic. The closest thing to a street legal go-cart that I've ever owned. Motorcycles have larger engines now.

That thing actually had about 100 vacuum lines on it. There were numbers printed on them. It was like an octopus orgy under the hood and I don't like seafood.

Looking at all the older Japanese cars, the newer ones are all larger today. Growth hormones in the chicken making Americans bigger?



Electronics have actually become simpler over the years. Used to, every single electronic device had wiring and individual sensors for everything, now with multiple modules, they can use one wire as a data cable with one sensor instead of multiple wires and sensors. https://www.knowyourparts.com/technical-resources/electrical/diagnosing-serial-data-buses/

The electronics continue to become more streamlined, dependable, powerful, and easier to service. That distributor cap issue I had on the '99 Suburban didn't set a code or anything. Like the mix of metric and SAE fasteners on those years (pisses me off), the electronics don't have the coverage they have today and makes diagnostics a mix of modern and older techniques. Nobody sells a computer controlled hammer to work on 'em.


Lastly, a lot of the systems on vehicles today are for emissions control. I don't think anyone who's lived in Los Angeles since the 1950's would complain about cleaner cars. Myself, living in a rural area, smog is not something I'll every have to deal with on a daily basis, but cities with large, car driving populations have a real problem. With the COVID-19 virus going on right now, the effects of reduced car travel in large cities is extremely obvious. There are cities in China that have clearer skies than they've had in decades. China didn't have that problem when people were poorer and rode bicycles, it's only when their (perceived) standard of modern living increased. Owning a car actually makes a lot of people poor. People aren't necessarily poor because they don't own one.


Fuel injection is already on gasoline commercial riding mowers. It will quickly make it's way onto residential ones. I have already worked on them and have the software on my laptop.

[ATC King]

I should just buy like a 78 Chevy pickup/ I’m kinda just old school when it comes to electronics/gadgets/buttons/touchscreens I guess, I like things simple.


I do like my '79 Ford. It's nice using the touch screen GPS when traveling and listening to the satellite radio.


The adjustable rev limiter in the aftermarket ignition keeps me from scattering the stock 300 I6 if I miss a shift :)


The twin 55 air conditioning doesn't work too well in the rain though!

[DAM shop]

I should just buy like a 78 Chevy pickup/ I’m kinda just old school when it comes to electronics/gadgets/buttons/touchscreens I guess, I like things simple.

I love the old mid to late style Ford crew cabs. I actually looked for one before I bought this 2012 but couldn't find one that I really liked for the price.. The main reason I drive a truck is the room. My wife has an older 2007 lexus 350 Great vehicle but the dam seats are to small that pisses me off. I can sit for about 2 hours in that thing and I'm done.. We take a lot of driving vacations so comfort and roominess are paramount in anything that I drive.. I did't buy a truck for fuel economy so all of the hype over fuel mileage never bothered me..

[ATC King]

There is a company that makes a plug-in device to deactivate the system on GM and Dodge trucks.
https://www.rangetechnology.com/products/afm_disabler/


They also sell a version to keep it in V4 mode up to %80 of the time, for fuel economy.
https://www.rangetechnology.com/products/afm-plus/

[Shep1970]

One thing about my Chevy it is very comfy, and rides great no complaints there at all. Also shuts off the outside world when windows are closed. Except for “that” guy that’s got his rap music blaring three cars back......
The hydrolic tailgate is a nice option too (doesn’t slam down)
I drive in M5 most of the time so the V4 doesn’t kick on, but when I forget I notice it right away.
Lots of hills around here, like say I’m cruising in V4 stop to take a turn up a hill it definetly pauses/lags/shudders going back into V8.
My biggest thing is I bought a V8 not a 4. And yes I’ve got a lead foot.
Traction control can be shut off (flip switch right there)
I feel it should be off (everytime truck started) and turned on if wished too.
See if I get the urge to lay a little rubber..... I shouldn’t have to remember to flip a switch first/ if that makes sense.

Alright my timers going off/ gotta go pour some rubber.

Shep

[ps2fixer]

Ironically, I prefer the more sensors over the multi sensors in one. I get why the difference, it's all $$$$. When one fails you have to replace 5 sensors at once, it's good and bad unless the price for the group is similar to the single sensor prices. Also with the serial communication bus system, any one device on the "network" can make communication issues, I don't think it's common but I've heard a lot of people having problems with the CAN bus vehicles, atleast in the early days.

I don't buy the whole mpg effect of weight either. My dad built his own truck basically back in the 90's. I don't remember the details super great since I was like 8 years old at the time, but I believe it was a 1973 1 ton chevy frame with a dually 1 ton axle, 4:10 gearing, home made box (weights some stupid amount of weight like 1500-2000lbs, the bumper is part of the box), cab was made from a 70's Chevy station wagon front end with a chevy cab back matched up to it. The engine was an oldsmobile 350. I think he used a 350 turbo or 400 turbo trans with a devoured transfer case to make it 4x4. He used that truck to haul scrap, 4 tons in the back of it wasn't an uncommon thing, he's rolled over the scales above the limits for the spring weight limits because the state cop he called said he couldn't load his truck heavy enough to worry about it. After the truck is empty, it weighed around 2 3/4 tons, I don't remember the exact figure, but 5600lb is coming to mind. He was getting around 15-18mpg and wasn't exactly driving it for mileage. That truck is long gone, he wrecked it out in the woods drunk on his birthday, hit a tree so hard his pipe bumper got a tiny bit of a bow to it, but it broke the frame and front axle housing.

My dad also bought a 1996 F250 power stroke diesel (Turbo'ed 7.3L). He drove that thing about like a race car in town, then he got a programmer and then it would actually do it. He used a mild setting and gained 2-3 mpg, think he was around 18mpg, of course diesel is a different animal.

With my Tacoma and my T100, I've had cases where hauling a car gave me better mpg than empty. Around that time I was driving roughly 45mph everywhere to save $$$ on fuel, so my Tacoma target in cruise mpg was 22-27mpg, I didn't track the tank averages super great, but I was getting 22-24mpg pretty often and it's 4x4 3.4L v6 with over sized tires. Pull a car, sometimes it would drop to 17-20mpg range, other times I'd get my normal mileage. I think once I got 24mpg while pulling a car.

When my dad bought his T100, he was driving a 1989 Mazda B2600i (2.6L 4 cyl built in Japan). He loved the truck, but the mpg wasn't great for the size and really was bad for the power it had (not much). We had to dolly the T100 home which is bigger than the Mazda. My dad was always trying to break 20mpg with it and most of the time it was just shy at fill up time. When we pulled the T100, we had to deal with hills, which we don't get much of around in michigan. Instead of running in 5th gear and running around 2200-2500rpm, he was in 4th gear for a few hundred miles running around 3000 rpm. That truck loved it for some reason and got the best mpg it has ever gotten, 27mpg. It's not like it's never been on long trips of steady speed traveling or anything, but it was the longest trip I've done for a vehicle, Michigan to South Carolina.

The distributor cap story is interesting. Those are common service parts, have to change them like spark plugs. My Lexus has .... TWO of them, if you know anything about the laws of chance and failure of parts, when you add more parts to the mix, they are more likely to fail given the same time between failure of the part. These caps and rotors are known for going 100k+ miles, I bet the ones of my car are still factory with 235k miles.

Here's a video showing the parts a bit, yea 1990 DOHC v8, don't think that was too common back then lol. Have to love how Toyota keeps it simple, just one belt sprocket to drive two cams, the cams tie together via gear to gear, makes a timing belt job so much easier.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCDKNH826bo

Anyway, back on the MPG thing, probably should mention, yea reducing weight generally helps MPG, but it has a pretty low effect if you drive according to the weight in the vehicle and not expect the same performance empty vs loaded. Also I have life time averages for the Corolla, I used it like a truck, I had stuff sticking out the truck fairly often and that hurt numbers sometimes. It really didn't like winter though. Pretty old logs now looks like it's been sitting about 7 years.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/em-fuel-log.php?vehicleid=5932


The safety is an interesting point, I drive with the understanding crash tests are only done at 35mph and there's still major damage to the vehicle and still a fair chance of getting hurt at those low speeds (I think it's been recently upped to 45mph but I could be thinking of something else). When my 92 Camry had the brake lines go out, I borrowed my mom' Camry which I didn't realize had an exhaust leak. Cracked windows plus the air circuit I had set to "fresh" air in. I got tired suddenly after about 45 mins of driving and was planning to stop at the gas station about a mile down the road. Instead I passed out, crossed over to the left side of the road, dropped in the ditch and hit the side of a drive way going about 50-55mph. Clearly the car got totaled, I walked away with not even a scratch. Once the tow truck dropped the car off, I fired it up and parked it behind the house. That was a 1995 Camry, just had the driver's and passenger's side air bags, nothing else and clearly the wreck was in favor for that type of air bag.

A year or two before that I hit a deer going 70mph on the express way to work (midnights). Deer took out the upper radiator support bracket, condenser, radiator, and hood. About 4 hours and a parts car to grab the parts from it was back on the road. I ate the deer too. Air bag did NOT deploy, the sensor is in the fenders and they were not bent, so effectively didn't go off by design. Impact wasn't that hard and I again walked away with not even a scratch.

My cousin was in some sort of GM as a passenger, late 90's early 2000s. Icy roads, got in a head on with both vehicles going about 45mph. The car did not deploy the air bags and it really needed to, and the body got damaged enough it should have deployed them. The driver braced himself and broke his arm in 4 or 5 spots, my cousin hit his head hard enough to cause brain sheer (bleeding on the brain) and he was basically deemed that he would die that night. They had to put him into a drug induced coma and survived it barely. He recovered really fast, about a week later he was able to go home. There was talk of cutting the top of his skull off if his brain swelled too much. After a month or so he was pretty much back to doing his normal stuff. He's never been quite the same since then, but he's still alive and functioning.

My mom was in a wreck in a Oldsmobile station wagon from the early 90's, but I can't remember much about it. She had both feet on the brake when she ran into the van that pulled out in front of hear and has had problems with her sciatic nerve acting up from time to time.

Not really a large sample set of data, but the Toyota safety system's seem to work pretty well in my experience, I've never personally been in a wreck in other brands, don't really plan to test that stuff out xD.





@DAM Shop

I don't know about the newer Lexus cars, but the LS400 was designed for CEO's that drove their car, around the 3rd gen (like early 2000's) it was designed for the CEO that paid someone else to drive the car. You might like going older if you don't mind the mpg drop and probably less power than your current one. The seats in that thing are the best I've ever sat in, I'm not big though, just tall. I'm not exactly a huge fan of leather seats though. I just learned they could come with cloth seats, but really uncommon. The LS400 is the only vehicle I can think of that I've drove that has enough seat adjustment that it can go back too far. My corolla was terrible for that, I needed the seat back atleast 2 more inches.

https://img123.s3.amazonaws.com/2019/11/01/40/929b189a73ea8893_29e2af99fbab8b.jpg


Also, there was a guy on ecomodder that was pulling some really amazing numbers out of his diesel v8 truck, like pushing 50mpg. Trucks can get good mileage too.






This is pretty interesting to look at. Like I said before, modern cars that are built for mpg tend to have a lot more hp than the old ones which generally translates to more fuel ate up. Just think if they made the small cars of today have similar power figures as the cars in the 90's.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/bestgasmileage.php

Bigger list for cars... I suspect most people buying 2010+ vehicles probably aren't super crazy on mpg, but I still find it interesting that the old cars are doing as good or better in a lot of cases.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/bestgasmileage.php?top=mpg&class=car&fuel=gasoline


Also, go to the extremes for mpg and you get a car that looks like this. The guy's goal is to drive completely normal but get great mpg. It might be ugly as hell, but why isn't there any cars using this "tech" for even a small niche car.

https://www.aerocivic.com/

I wouldn't mind driving the car to see what it's like, but I don't think I could put up with all the attention it would get. The guy did do an engine swap for a lean burn Honda engine, so using the newer tech in the older car.

[DAM shop]

Dam Ps2 you covered just about everything in that post, lol.
My son drove infinite’s for a good long while. Those seats had a extension on the seat that moved out to support behind the knees. That didn’t piss me off, that was nice.

[ps2fixer]

Yea, it's my style of reply, why reply 20 times when you can put it all into one =). I'm also a pc user, and pretty fast at typing (75-100wpm). I guess that's why I make books for post replies lol.

I know there's seat belt extenders for ford, pretty much any ford dealer has them, can't remember what the requirement is but they were free last I knew as long as you own a ford (probably need a vin or something to give proof even if it's not on the road).

I've seen extenders made for the seat mounts, once I got my corolla back on the road and it holds up well after the repairs and the fact it has sat so long, I might look into making a set to move the seat back about 2-3 inches over stock. I think it wraps around a chunk of metal, so probably will have to lift the seat slightly too to keep the design simple.

Here's a crude paint drawing of the basic toyota seat frame mount system. Black is the car body/unibody, red is the seat rail, and brown is the bolts.

https://i.gyazo.com/1a18ce2112f51cb88aa8a6721f72f7e4.png

Here's kind of my basic idea on how to extend it back... not exactly hard, but things aren't perfect right angles and such. Like the front bolts are closer to a 45 degree angle.

https://i.gyazo.com/45800cbf0de454b5da1507291c200cf4.png

The Corolla was a budget car, and from what I can tell, there wasn't a lot of $$$ put into the design, it's more like a Camry that's stripped down and cost cutting anywhere they could. Even the "golden" years of the corolla has rust out problems for this era of machine (93-97 vs older verse 1-2 gens newer).

I also just learned the 4A engine in the corolla that I don't like is a race engine, high reving no bottom end torque design, about like a 4 stroke dirt bike when built. The corolla engine I like is the 1.8L 7A which is a stroked version of the 4A and it's the go to block to turbo.

I still can't believe that white truck has a corolla engine in it.... well it's a 4AGE "G" being performance, and the typical/common Corolla engine is a 4AFE, basically the head is the main difference which was designed by Yamaha for Toyota (they do a lot of partnerships like that).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgVxhdMdae4

I really love how the 1UZ runs, but that little 4 cylinder seems to out do it, atleast for mudding lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_77o8KdFnp0

There's also the 2JZ, I guess it's somewhat of a similar engine to the 4A, just the 6 cyl version, very similar sound. These engines are not cheap to find, but they hold up great to boost.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5EPkyH5aoI

I kind of want to turbo my Corolla now..... I have an engine with 123k miles on it in a parts car. Would make it fun to drive, but I think the MPG benefits would disappear pretty fast. I have another car with a blown up 1.8L that still runs (rod through the block) with a stick trans.... Oh and I have a roller 1987 toyota truck with no engine/trans sitting out back that already has a bobbed frame. I really need to build a garage lol.

[Arky-X]

I've got a 2007 Chevy that has the 4 cylinder mode. I ended up getting a Diablo tuner and did a couple data logs and sent them to a guy who does email tunes. Back and forth emails a few times and he had the ECM and TCM dialed in and shut off the AFM.
I have to run 91 octane to realize the performance difference but it does make a difference. I installed the stock tune back in it for a while and felt like a turd. Changed the transmission servo out for the "vette servo" and it banged way too hard. So I used the tuner to adjust the TCM to get a quick but softer shift. Wide open throttle though will still hit pretty hard shifts.

There is a place up the highway from me, Gwatney Performance (GPI), that has the AFM delete kits. They will also install it, cam, all the other goodies and throw it on the dyno. I've seen some guys with the 6.0 and 6.2 and a GPI package at the local drag strip and for a truck, those things are tough.

I'm thinking that power may be another factor to the mpg. If these things weren't pushing 300+ hp, they wouldn't use the fuel. But while gas is cheap and people are buying, they want their power so they can drag race from stoplight to stoplight. Mentioned above as well is the size. Some of these do look huge and there is no aerodynamics to that brick for a front end. They are pushing a lot of air at 70-80mph.

[ATC King]

But while gas is cheap and people are buying...

Winner, winner, chicken dinner!


Seems like just a short while ago, trucks were almost impossible to give away. That'll probably never happen again though.

[ps2fixer]

Yea I miss grabbing Toyota pickups for $100-250 each for parts when they were almost in running and yard beater condition. The trip + time, storage area etc isn't exactly free either but they are also worth quite a lot as parts. Couldn't pass them up since I was paying as much or more for broken down 3 wheelers and there's the scrap value to the trucks even if nothing sold I could get most of my money back.

[ironchop]

I do like my '79 Ford. It's nice using the touch screen GPS when traveling and listening to the satellite radio.


The adjustable rev limiter in the aftermarket ignition keeps me from scattering the stock 300 I6 if I miss a shift :)


The twin 55 air conditioning doesn't work too well in the rain though!

Agreed. I ran GPS for navigation in my 79 and it had the added feature of being my only accurate speedometer while I was running 38.5 IROKs.... Mostly because I was too lazy to change the trans speedo drive gear to the correct tooth count so the OEM guage would register accurately... So mine had a dual purpose lol

I used to joke that my '66 Chevelle was "scary fast" but not because it was literally faster than most cars. It was scary because when you go fast, you needed three minutes to stop with those 4-wheel drums and no booster. I'm definitely down with 4-wheel disk power brakes, just not ABS. I know when I want to lock them up and when I don't and I would prefer to choose on the fly.

I'm running an electronic ignition in my Ford. It's actually a GM one-wire HEI on a BB Ford distributor housing and shaft. It's historically reliable and simple. The ignition modules inside are affordable so I got extras. I do keep the OEM points distributor that came with the 460 engine in case we have a CME big enough to wipe electronics, and I could drop that in quickly and go, but I prefer the electronic ignition system. A Faraday cage ammo can would also do well to store an extra electronic ignition and serve the same purpose....but I digress.

I still feel that all this modern technology in fuel/ignition management should be producing FAR greater gasoline fuel economy than currently available. Maybe I watched too many documentaries on Netflix. The Big Oil debate is it's own thread, though, so I'll stop at that!

I also think that we have overcomplicated our automobiles and invited repair issues that weren't present or common before in much less electronically controlled vehicles in the recent past (especially concerning transmissions in Dodge and Chrysler vehicles). Currently, my windshield wipers don't work properly because I need a $300 chassis control computer which also runs my climate control as well as any other feature inside the car like the lighting. I also have no defrost as of yesterday, because one of the 4 electronically controlled electric motors required to open any gate in all the ductwork to change modes, is currently "not reading the signal" according to the computer I purchased to be able to diagnose the problems I have with the car.....I was perfectly fine with vacuum controlled automatic transmissions and vacuum operated cab climate controls like in the 80s and early 90s.... If it didn't work right, you knew the 10¢ piece of vacuum hose or a vacuum canister was to blame. I like my air-conditioning but I would prefer it not require a microprocessor stuffed inside a hot tight space begging for problems if that makes sense

Its still more comfortable than a horse and carriage, I guess



Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[ps2fixer]

Wow, sounds like the electronics went pretty stupid on the new stuff. My Lexus rear defroster runs through some sort of timer, and is a push button type switch, push it and after like 10-15 mins it will turn off automatically. I think the Camry got the same setup, the Corolla I think was a click style button, in for on, out for off, so no timer on that one. Nice thing about timers, they are pretty easy to bypass, but you have to change the switch type (who wants to hold the switch in to have the defroster working). I'm not a fan of the "body control modules" that the American vehicles like to run. I always hear problems with them, and when they have issues, they can do some really odd things.

Talking about lemons, at my first job I met a guy that bought a new Jeep, he's been trying to get it replaced with another vehicle since like 3 months of owning it. He has a legit stack of paperwork a few inches thick of warranty work done to it. He was planning to take them to court over it for the Michigan lemon law. Just about every week he had a new issue with it, or an old issue would return. If I remember right, it has something like 16 computers in that vehicle, and some of the issues could be caused by any one of the computers to harm the communication network they are on (CANBUS I think). I quit my job there before it was resolved, so not sure how the story ends. The guy was the head for site planning for a large factory, I'm sure he had the money to take them to court over it. He was great to talk to though, first time I met him, he excused himself, and went outside for a sec and came back in. Then he wrote some math about pressure on the white board and circled the end number and said.... I really had to fart. He was also really good with AB style testing. He legit used a stop watch for boot up times on his computer and knew exactly what normal was, when the computer was slow, he had us work on it (I was part of the IT Tech team). After 3-4 people worked on the computer, it was as good or better than he started with, I was the last to work on it in that case. He contacted our boss and gave us a great review and stated every one that came out he saw improvement.

I really wonder how good of mpg a modern engine in a small car with the correct tuning/gearing/transmission setup could get for mileage. Like the Toyota Prius, it's a mid sized car, like a Camry wagon basically, and it's pulling 50mpg or so. The whole hybrid system might help a little, but the engine is a completely different tech too. I think they are like a 1.5L and have variable displacement so on take off it has higher compression ratio for the extra power, and in cruise it has lower compression which I guess is better for mpg. I wonder how good it would do with out the battery pack, it's a lot of extra weight and such. Also put it in a smaller car like a Corolla sized platform. My dad trying hard for max mpg could hit around 35mpg while my corolla could hit around 45mpg. Grabbing a real number on the prius.. Looks like the 2020 one can get about 55mpg combined, so applying the same ratio Camry vs Corolla it should be 70.7mpg combined if the ratio is linear like that. The prius also has a very unique transmission setup with the electric motor and such, I suspect the design there makes the engine more efficient too. I get the concept of the batteries, but the energy lost charging and discharging the batteries seems like it would kill the benefits to be only a little better at best. Like most electronics are 90% at best for converting power, batteries I'd have to look up but I think they are also around the 90% efficiency mark, then running it back through a motor is again around 90% efficient. Loosing around 10% of the power in each stage would kill the benefits so much, but I haven't looked up real numbers either. It might sound silly, but if this gas engine to drive electric motor thing is so great, why not use a small engine and a bigger engine, or like two gas engines inline, both say 2 cylinder and can decouple so one isn't turning. Heck could do that for every cylinder to keep the engines ultra simple. Clearly there would be a delay from stabbing the gas and getting full power, but if one cylinder could generate enough power to push the car at say city speeds, just think how that would translate to fuel savings. Of course this adds a ton of electronics to the mix and the main cylinder would get the most wear, so logically making it so any cylinder could be locked to a common shaft would probably be a better design for longevity. Heck one "engine" could blow up and the computer could just avoid using it till it's fixed/replaced.

Watch, in the next 10 years, something similar comes out into production. I've done that kind of stuff so many times. Like back in college I had a talk with another student about game design. My concept would be a game where things down just spawn back, like if someone cuts down a tree, it has to grow back, dig a hole, and the hole is there for everyone. The guy said, if you can do that, but make is so the players could also build their own buildings, towns, etc, it would take off. Well Minecraft is quite similar to what we was thinking. It was around 2008-2009ish when we talked about the idea.

Anyway, got side tracked a bit, but there's no real topic of the thread so whatever xD.

If the 79 ford had an electronic style speedometer, there's a resister that could be changed to adjust the counts per mile setting to make it calibrate to your larger tires, atleast for Toyota's that's how they are. Resisters are far cheaper than the trans gear, but requires soldering. I might be thinking of the tach, like v6 vs 4cyl, been a while since I messed around with that kind of research.

[ATC King]

Agreed. I ran GPS for navigation in my 79 and it had the added feature of being my only accurate speedometer while I was running 38.5 IROKs.... Mostly because I was too lazy to change the trans speedo drive gear to the correct tooth count so the OEM guage would register accurately... So mine had a dual purpose lol

The speedometer in my '79 didn't work for about 3 years. When I rebuilt the transmission I didn't have enough time to wait for the plastic speedo driver gear to come in, and later on, even though very simple, I didn't want to remove the tail housing to replace it. I definitely used the GPS for a speedometer. It wasn't really needed though, because with a manual transmission, it's pretty easy to tell about what speed I'm going. I never got a speeding ticket.


I used to joke that my '66 Chevelle was "scary fast" but not because it was literally faster than most cars. It was scary because when you go fast, you needed three minutes to stop with those 4-wheel drums and no booster. I'm definitely down with 4-wheel disk power brakes, just not ABS. I know when I want to lock them up and when I don't and I would prefer to choose on the fly.

A real problem with ABS, is the vehicles will tend to not stop at all if there is gravel on the road, or on a gravel road. Or at least that was the early ABS. It's still a problem with some current motorcycle ABS, and many of them won't activate ABS during a lean, which more are able to now. There are several motorcycles that have switchable ABS, where either the who system can be shut off, or the rear/front wheel can be. The increasing ability to read more than just wheel speed had made ABS much more functional though.

I know I certainly don't miss driving a four wheel drum brake vehicle in pouring rain! Or for that matter, across a low water bridge, or forgetting to hit the brakes a couple times BEFORE pulling all the way out of the car wash. Some big ol' finned aluminum Buick drums do look good with some open designed wheels though! I'd definitely go for some of those on a modern custom build with some wheels that show them off.




I'm running an electronic ignition in my Ford. It's actually a GM one-wire HEI on a BB Ford distributor housing and shaft. It's historically reliable and simple. The ignition modules inside are affordable so I got extras. I do keep the OEM points distributor that came with the 460 engine in case we have a CME big enough to wipe electronics, and I could drop that in quickly and go, but I prefer the electronic ignition system. A Faraday cage ammo can would also do well to store an extra electronic ignition and serve the same purpose....but I digress.

It's hard to beat the simplicity of an HEI. Other than the distributor just getting slap dab worn out, about the only thing that happens is a coil or module goes bad, but either of those are small and inexpensive. Keep a spare of each, and you'll never walk because of ignition issues. I've experience both failures, and even if not having a spare handy, hitching a ride to the nearest parts store is about all it takes, even if you have to buy a torx driver too. I keep more tools with me nowadays.

I wired in the aftermarket ignition and coil on my '79, so that it's reversible if it goes out, and I keep a regular coil and Duraspark box in the truck. I've got a spare coil for the aftermarket ignition too. Small parts that I don't want to walk because of.




The car companies are definitely in cahoots with the oil industry, but the oil industry is much more than gasoline or diesel. Petroleum was being refined well before gasoline was a wanted commodity, and they just burned it off like natural gas is at oil wells today. In a way, petroleum saved the whales, because it provided a cheaper type of lamp oil. I ran fracturing pumps when I worked for Halliburton, and it was mainly on natural gas wells. I may be partly responsible for some Oklahoma earthquakes. :naughty: I know some of what goes down them holes, and I wouldn't want to live on land with a oil/natural gas well on it.


Kind of like the people against plastic grocery bags now, are the same ones who wanted to stop using paper to save the trees, not realizing that with less need for paper, there would be fewer managed forests and fewer trees. Paper bags would biodegrade, now they got a plastic problem. Addiction replacement, but the addiction remains.


If I start thinking about anything of relevance today and try to make sense of it, I'm going to end up thinking about dinosaurs. It happens every time. Current politics...dinosaurs. Hollywood actors...dinosaurs. Hillary Clinton...dinosaurs. Terrible lizards.






I do like the technology that's made it's way to the aftermarket, because I like old vehicles. There's a lot of cool things going on with older engines now. A big one is ignition controls. People are taking carbureted blow/pull through turbo setups, adding modern ignition controls, and getting good, reliable power from older engines without adding much more complexity to the entire system.

Here's a new video from this year with a 292 inline Chevy engine they added a turbo to. It's a basic engine build beyond that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfyofaN0j3g

Incredible torque. The problem is they done it backwards by not using an advanced ignition system. Without even a knock sensor, that engine can self destruct pretty easily if the driver isn't in tune with it. A modern ignition is what will help keep an engine like that alive and running top notch at the highest power with less chance of damage. It's a good build, but they failed on that aspect for a turbo engine with the modern systems that are available.

The same people also done build/dyno videos for a Jeep and Dodge I6 engine.

I've got a 292 in the shop. It's a typical build with a little overbore, RV camshaft, headers, aluminum intake and four barrel carb. It's sitting on the floor right now, but I had some fun with it in my '68, which I need to put back together. The ignition I had on it is on my Ford 300 now.

What they don't talk about in those videos is the cost to build a I6, versus the power output. It cost a lot more and delivers a lot less than an equivalent V8 build. I've been a I6 fan since a teenager, so I understand the reasoning behind the builds. It's kind of like being more fun to drive something slow, fast, then to drive something fast, slow.

[ps2fixer]

If you line I6's you should love the Supra engine then, 2JZ. Little 3.0L and can be pushed up to around 600hp w\o replacing internals. I think the main things are fuel pump/injectors, aftermarket computer, and a bigger turbo, but I haven't built one personally.

I recently learned the Corolla 4A and 7A engines are based on a high reving race engine. Explains why I hate the 4A engine for MPG and the 7A is like a torque monster vs the 4A. The 7A is a stroked version of the 4A.

I'm still blown away that the budget cars have an engine that responds so well to being built with a turbo. Not sure how much is required to slap a turbo on it and double the hp or so (like 200-250hp, stock 7A is around 105hp). You can see it doesn't have a very good bottom end torque, but the high reving makes it run about like a dirt bike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6k7yBqxNzzY

Here's the 2JZ engine, clearly these ones don't have stock internals.... I guess the 4A engine is a pretty similar design to the 2JZ engine even though they are completely different families of engine (A vs JZ).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTi5FTJ5_Z0



Also, on the drum brakes thing, get a booster. Generally a brake booster from a ABS vehicle is bigger to fight the motor better. It's been a while since I've done the math, but the bake booster provides so much extra help on the brakes. I helped a guy with a 1987 Toyota Motorhome, disc front, drum rear and it has the "heavy brake package" aka the front pistons are like 67mm vs 60mm but the drums in the back are the same size I think. It has a typical 2wd brake booster, going from memory but it was like a 9in single diaphragm (the thin pancake style ones). I did the research and found a late 90's T100 booster would effectively bolt right on, I can't remember the size, something like 11in for non-ABS and 12in for ABS. He grabbed the non-ABS one for the clearance issues, and the added benefit of that booster was the dual diaphragm design which gives around 50% extra braking assistance. He went from not being able to lock up the front tires at all to being able to lock up the front tires on a gravel road. Not sure if he could lock them up on dry pavement, I didn't advise that since it would wear the tires pretty bad. He also put in a manual proportioning valve to override the stock Toyota setup that reads the rear axle height to adjust the rear brake's pressure and got much better braking from the much less brake lines in the system (that system runs a brake line all the way back to the front to bleed off the pressure to the front. My 98 T100 I can lock up all 4 tires and it also has rear drum, so I don't see where drum is by design bad, just the system isn't balanced out.

Manual brakes (no booster) generally means you have more leverage on the master cylinder than a brake boosted vehicle. That's why a vehicle with the vacuum line pulled off the booster has completely garbage brakes. The master cylinder size vs piston sizes effects the ratio of energy input vs output. Like a 10mm master and 20mm piston will give a 1:2 ratio, or 10lbs of push in and 20lbs of effort put out, then add 4 pistons to the system and it applies across all of them. Most people want to make their master cylinder bigger, but that actually makes the brakes weaker (it moves more fluid so shorter pedal travel). If you have solid brakes night and high, get a size smaller master cylinder, a little change there can really effect the whole system. Chevy's were known to have garbage brakes back then, but modified they did really well. I guess the engineers were sleeping back then or something. Like my dad built a truck using a Chevy frame and he really wanted 13in rear drums on his 1 ton axle, but his rims wouldn't fit over the drums so he had to go to 11in. It had good brakes, but not amazing brakes. He hauled atleast 4 ton+ all the time scrapping vehicles and such with it (he'd haul two 70's-80's era cars on top of each other, stuff them both, then load up the back of the truck with high value stuff like cast iron, short steel etc). Frame was from 1973, not sure what year the axles were. He tried that (~4 ton in the back of the truck) with his 1996 F250 7.3L power stroke Diesel and didn't like the frame flex (the gap between box and cab). They don't make vehicles like they used to. Heck he rolled over the scales at the scrap yard with his 1982 Toyota pickup with 4 ton in the back of it. It wasn't exactly happy about it, but it did it. I wish I had photos and weight slips yet, we haven't done stuff like that in a long time, too many vehicles on the road and such any more. Endangering out own lives is our choice, but when other people get involved, it's a no go. Like we used to take beater junk cars through the woods, 50-70mph, no big deal. Last time I did that was around 2008 with a 1991ish Toyota Corolla, I think it topped out about 40-45mph in sand lol.

[ironchop]

If you line I6's you should love the Supra engine then, 2JZ. Little 3.0L and can be pushed up to around 600hp w\o replacing internals.

I definitely like Inline 6s........ Especially whatever model Toyota used in my '78 FJ40 Landcruiser and I am also fond of the I-6 that was in my 77 Datsun 280Z.

I'll take "Things that are simple and effective" for $1000, Alex.

Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[ps2fixer]

Land cruisers I'm a little weaker in for knowing about their engines. The Diesel engine I think is a 2L engine, but the most common gas engine is like a 4.5L inline 6. I guess I'll google it for the sake of being complete xD.

Looks like 92+ had the 4.5L FZ series engine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_FZ_engine

Looks like the Land cruiser from 78 would have been an F series engine, I think I've seen them with F2's but not 100% sure on that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_F_engine

Those engines had tons of torque, but they didn't exactly get great mpg. The gearing also killed mpg, so that might be quite a huge factor. In fact I know gearing can make a crazy effect on mpg, 22r with 4.10 gearing might get like 20-25mpg, while my 3.56 geared truck easily pulled 30-35mpg with a front caliper hanging up and the carb flooding at idle. There's also the 4x4 vs 2wd difference, so yea, the 4x4 sits a bit higher and such, little more spinning mass in the front tires (manual hubs), but not enough of a different to really pin the blame just on the config difference. I'm sure the 2wd with 4.10 gearing would drop 5mpg easily, maybe more with it's problems. I should fix that truck up, convert the engine to EFI and swap in the even higher rear diff from the trucks that came stock with the 4 speed transmission, like 3.42 gearing. Make a truck that's effectively a car with a bed in the back of it, horrible power for take off, but pulls awesome mpg numbers. If I could get 40mpg with that truck, I might ditch driving a car at all since it's so useful to be able to throw stuff in the back. From my memory, they rode quite nice for a truck.

[ATC King]

I'll take "Things that are simple and effective" for $1000, Alex.


For something nuke proof and as simple as possible, one of those older mini trucks with a diesel engine would be the ticket. I'm guessing they have an electronic solenoid to shut the fuel off, but other that that, shouldn't require any electronics to operate. The Datsun/Nissan trucks had an available diesel and maybe the LUV and Courier had one available. If not, I know there are many three cylinder N/A diesel engines with mechanical fuel injection that'll fit into them.

There are definitely the older Volkswagens cars and truck with diesels in them.

Maybe a 1980's American car with an Oldsmobile 350 diesel? Add a water separator to the fuel system, O-ring the heads and add head studs instead of bolts, or...maybe not. Hearing one of those cars run is an odd sensation though.


The old JD tractor here has that manual pull knob for the fuel shutoff. Turn the key off, pull the knob. I like it. Funny though, because the earliest tractors were steam powered, then gasoline. Diesel was the later technology. I've hand cranked some things when given the chance, used air starters, and seen equipment with pony engines, but I've got to give that electric start an applause. The centrifugal start like on Tiger tanks, and some other stuff, would probably be pretty failsafe.

[ps2fixer]

Yea, the olds engines always sounded like they had a miss. To the people that build Chevy v8's they think they have a hot cam in them but it's stock. Olds was the king of torque and always had a unique sound. The 350 gas and 350 diesel used a lot of the same parts, my dad converted a diesel to gas before but he used the diesel cam and had rev problems, ran great up to like 3k rpm though. If I recall correctly he put 455 heads on the 350 block to reduce the compression some, but it would still diesel on 87 octane. Heck a stock 350 gas olds if shut off while hot will diesel for a short time, heard it so many times since my dad's a fan of oldsmobile and his brother has to try to out do him in everything, so he always fiddled with the carbs and made them too lean.

Were those 350 diesels known for blowing head gaskets or something? Why the o-ring and such requirement? I heard they weren't the greatest diesel around but don't know any of the why's.

My dad has scrapped so many old v8's, the oldsmobiles were the heaviest, can't remember exactly, but I think it was 3 bare blocks would make a ton. I think a fully dressed engine is like 800 pounds. Some had factory steel cranks, roller lifters and such.


Talking about old engines, I just saw the carb cover/sticker thing for a buick wildcat engine. I bet he would sell it if anyone is interested in it. It's something like this, but it's just the sticker part that goes on the air filter cover. I know he has some for oldsmobile too. He had so many engines, crazy to think as an early teen I was moving around v8 engines in his loft and taking them down to disassemble for scrap. It was fun to me as I got to work on engines and see how they were put together and such.

https://i.gyazo.com/67f8ca050dbdd54352fdc98b2e901e21.jpg

He had two of the wild cat engines, I know one was all gone through, balanced etc, then it dropped off the engine stand and landed on the crank pulley. I think the other engine was just pulled out of the car. Not 100% sure if he has them yet or not though. I know he has olds 455 engines, transmissions, heads, etc.

[ATC King]

If you line I6's you should love the Supra engine then, 2JZ. Little 3.0L and can be pushed up to around 600hp w\o replacing internals. I think the main things are fuel pump/injectors, aftermarket computer, and a bigger turbo, but I haven't built one personally..

The Ford 200ci I6 is very popular and can make huge horsepower. Largely in part to the available cross flow head. Some enthusiast managed to start making their own aluminum heads.

Those guys in Australia are probably the Ford I6 masters. For the smaller Chevrolet I6, it's probably South America, or more precisely, Brazil that has the I6 nuts building those. They were produced and sold there much longer and got upgrades by GM. I think the later ones came with fuel injection as stock.

The larger truck engines are more about torque at low RPM.




Also, on the drum brakes thing, get a booster

Automotive, (American) hydraulic drum brakes are self actuating, so they don't need a booster. That's the reason for one long and one short shoe. It's also why that type of brake doesn't have as much stopping power in reverse, it's forward biased. There are other designs though. Front disk/rear drum setups have to use a proportioning valve to lower the line pressure a considerable amount to the rear drums, to keep them from locking up when used in conjunction with power disk brakes.

The problem with drums, well, one problem anyway, is they get really grabby when wet. Until the water is out of the drum, or evaporated off, the brake doesn't want to grab, but then it'll grab suddenly, and on a four wheel drum vehicle, it'll cause it to dart dangerously one way or the other.

The braking power of a good drum in dry conditions is really substantial without power assist. Another problem is even with automatic adjusters, they won't all engage at exactly the same moment, which isn't ideal for performance, but works just fine for regular driving. Then there is the springs and all the other hardware to make them work. There just can't be enough consistency between everything to make all four brakes work exactly the same, engage at the same time, and there's no mechanism to balance stopping power between all of them. To an extent, each does it's own thing.

A couple positive things about four wheel drum brakes is no brake dust on the wheels. Old mechanics got all that in their lungs. Yum...asbestos.

OK, that was a positive with a negative.

Another positive is zero drag. There are some zero drag automotive disk brake calipers out there, but it's not the norm. A properly set up drum brake makes absolutely no contact with the braking surface until used. This is translates into increased fuel economy. A front wheel drum brake just rolls on pretty good when spun by hand, a front disk brake won't continue to spin.



I've drove plenty of 18 wheelers, and they continued to used a full drum setup far longer than passenger cars and trucks. Most of them, OTR trucks anyway, have air disk brakes now. I've done a lot of brake service on big trucks, and that's a PITA with all slack adjusters and S cam bushings to lube. They're also not nearly as easy to replace the shoes on as the newer disk brakes are to replace pads. A pad change doesn't even require caliper removal. Truck drums are heavy, and I'd rather not have to wrestle them around. I've got a couple junk ones I keep around the shop to use as stands or to stand on when working under the hood of a pickup.

[ATC King]

Were those 350 diesels known for blowing head gaskets or something? Why the o-ring and such requirement? I heard they weren't the greatest diesel around but don't know any of the why's..

Yes, poor head sealing was one of their downfalls. GM adapted a gasoline V8 block and didn't make the needed modifications for the increased compression of a diesel engine. Most of them got junked, and I doubt anyone would spend the money to machine O-ring provisions, but that's what is done for older engines that have turbo chargers running higher boost pressure. No reason it wouldn't work on the diesel Olds.


My dad has scrapped so many old v8's, the oldsmobiles were the heaviest, can't remember exactly, but I think it was 3 bare blocks would make a ton. I think a fully dressed engine is like 800 pounds. Some had factory steel cranks, roller lifters and such..

Actually, the later generation Oldsmobile big blocks were very light. That's one reason they were a popular jetboat engine. It's like the Cadillac 500 V8, all those engines were car engines (hilarious to think about today), they were designed to pull around large, heavy cars, and weren't as heavy as large pickup engines that were meant to pull heavy loaded trailers and generally be stressed more.

For the Oldsmobile, that was also their problem. They had 'windowed' mains. That means while other engines has solid casting around the crankshaft, Oldsmobile didn't.

Rocket Racing now sells an aftermarket Olds 455 block, that solves a lot of their problems. $5,000 for the bare block.
https://shop.rocketracingshop.com/ROCKET-RACING-BLOCK-12050.htm


I have a 455 Olds in my Buick, and it's going to stay like that for sentimental reasons. I just put a new distributor in in a few weeks ago, then realized I have a front tire with a broken belt, so haven't drove it yet with the new distributor. Old distributor was just worn out. Advance weights flopping everywhere, and that's after I unfroze them. Was driving it with no mechanical advance for a while.

[ps2fixer]

Yea I guess I needed more context, the Olds engines were like 1972 and older, none of the low compression emission engines that were gutless w\o mods. I suspect that's the erra the cutlass was called a gutless, but I didn't grow up in that era. My dad did say his dad said he couldn't throw an olds engine in truck because it was a car engine, same logic, but the olds engine out did the truck engines every time testing with a big load and with a pretty steep overpass. He tried a low miles chevy, a buick, and finally threw in a high miles olds all 350's and the olds was by far the best according to his words.

I've never seen the windowed mains, so must have been the later engine design.

Can't you get an electronic distributor for the 455? I get mechanical advancement might be EMP proof, but I'm pretty sure there was an electronic advancement setup too. I'd have to bug my dad about it to get the details, I just know he has a bunch of stuff he saved. He also has pretty nice 1968 Olds Cutlass black seats too which are correct for the 442 if I recall correctly and I think chevy used the same seats too.

I had a 1976 Buick Lesabre, one with a buick engine and one with an olds 350. transmission was a 350 turbo and sold that to my uncle for his F150 2wd that he put an olds engine in. The 350's aren't quite heavy enough for hauling metal/scrap all the time, he also doesn't know how to take an easy when he's hauling a load either so that's probably the reason he has so many trans problems. I think that truck went through 3 transmissions. One was to pull my dad's F250 power stroke with the bulldozer + truck loaded, and his F150 was also loaded with a stuffed blazer on the back of it. He was pulling a train of like 20 tons or so. The transmission lines got so hot the rubber coating on them burnt off. They replaced the transmission before it failed, fluid was nice and burnt smelling too.

I wonder how much a good old school 455 block is worth. I know my dad has one with real low miles, like 50k, he's been wanting to build a "real" truck with that engine for years.

If I flip over the the Toyota side of things, I've only known of one transmission going bad and that's on a 4runner that's mud bogged every weekend, then all week long it's drove to work, rarely washed off etc. Rode hard and put away wet as the saying going even though he's not flooring it all the time (that I've seen). He has to manually shift it with the shifter, the automatic shifting doesn't work. Suggests to me bad wires, but I haven't diag'ed the problem. Same truck also has a directly wired starter solenoid to a push button to start it, same type of thing, suddenly the starter quit working, seems to me like bad wires.... same general area too I suspect. Probably caught a log or something in a mud hole and did some damage is my thinking on it. I could get it for about $1000, body is nice and he paid like $4500 for it, but it has a bit of frame problems and those electrical issues plus him and his dad like to rig up electrical, probably be a lot better off not buying it lol.

I've bought a couple Toyota trucks with bad engines, one was ran with no oil (kid was excited and forgot it had no oil), another was claimed to have just been rebuild and it threw a rode, took it apart and the nuts came off the rod cap so probably was rebuild and not torqued right. Got a camry v6 car with a rod thrown, haven't checked that one, story was he was driving down the high way and it just threw the rod, and a Corolla with a thrown rod that still runs and drives with the big hole in it xD. Can't remember the story but I think it was similar to the Camry story. Then I have a ton that have 200-517k miles that all still run. I always went for the cheapest vehicles so I got the ones with the worst problems. It's so nice having parts on hand just walk out and grab it. I've pulled an igniter off a car and put it in my T100 to test the miss I was having with it, no change, figured a way to ohm the injectors and one injector tested bad. Have to get o-rings for that, the reman injectors had the wrong o-ring size and they leak.

Anyway, the mains are kind of a funny topic. I remember people going crazy talking about v8's that had 4 bolt mains and how strong they where and everything. Then I got into the 1UZ engines and found out it's a factory 6 bolt main... Here's the part of a Toyota/Lexus you don't see too often lol.


https://www.lextreme.com/Engine%20021.jpg
https://www.lextreme.com/Engine%20011.jpg

[ironchop]

I'm especiallly fond of the Olds Cutlass especially late 60s thru 1972. I've owned four of them in that date range and one from 86

The Olds 350 Rocket is a fantastic V8 engine in my experience. They've been in every one of my old Cutlass' and i put another into a '78 base model Firebird. I exchanged the Rocket in my '71 Cutlass for a 455 out of a '71 Delta88. I believe they were about 500+ ft/lbs of torque but only about 275hp. That car would twist up the rear-end pretty good launching with sticky tires

In other news, my Landcruiser got 9-12mpg going downhill with the 4spd and I think it topped out at 62mph on the highway with my gearing.

I can't remember what my Z got for fuel economy but with all those carbs, I'm betting it wasn't very frugal with the fuel. That car was pretty fast and a blast to drive, though

Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

[ps2fixer]

Depends on the appication, but I think the numbers for the 455 was around 400hp, but around 500 ft-lbs or torque. It's been a while since I've seen the numbers and that's at the crank. My dad has books with all of those specs, wonder if he still has them around.

According to this page, the W30 455 from 1970 was 370hp 500 lb-ft of torque (I've always said foot pounds, is there a difference in the order?).

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/article/1970-72-w-30-455-oldsmobile/

Just for fun and to play the numbers game. I looked up a 454 Chevy engine 1970 specs. This site often gets things wrong, but here's what they claim.

11.25:1 compression ratio for the LS7, 465hp and 490 ft-lbs of torque, so based on those numbers, in a 1/4 mile the chevy should win (more work over time), but the torque is slightly less than the 500 ft-lb 455 olds which sounds to have been 10.5:1 compression ratio. Either case, pretty similar numbers, but if they are accurate, it seems the Olds has a lot of head room to make more power, like jump up compression more and rework the head to get better hp numbers. It seems the oldsmobile transmissions worked well, maybe they were the same trans, but I remember the chevy trucks shifting a lot different than the ones with the olds transmissions. My dad always said it was because of the torque difference.

https://itstillruns.com/gm-1970-ls7-454-specs-7617778.html


Of course those engines are more high performance, the context I've been talking has been effectively stock engines with maybe a cam swap. My dad knew which heads to look for and such too, if I remember right, "J" was junk, "C" was great, and "D" was ok. I think there was an "F", "G", and "H" too but don't remember anything about them. This was stuff from back when I was like 10 years old lol.

[ATC King]

There are many good engine designs out there, and just as many people who've got a really good understanding on how to make power out of them.

A lot of it is the proper application and assemblage of parts. Many times people have opened up a catalog, just to throw money and parts at an engine and end up with a golden turd. Then someone else, with knowledge specific to the same engine, can use mostly factory parts (albeit some mixing and matching), and build something more powerful and reliable. That'd be like me throwing some aluminum heads on my 455, without changing the pistons. The aluminum heads may have larger combustion chambers, and it would lower the compression if the pistons were changed to compensate. It would possibly end up making less power where it mattered, and get lower fuel economy. But boy, they'd sure look fast!



I haven't seen this personally, but I know the later Oldsmobile engines have larger letters cast onto the outside of the heads, that have something to do with their designation or design. There are some other numbers, but I don't think they can be seen while the head is on. Apparently, the 'F' heads are some good stock, cast iron pieces. The problem is there are some lower flowing 'E' heads too, and shifty people doctor the E to look like an F, trying to get good money for an otherwise ordinary part.


As far as OLDs 455's, maybe up until a few years ago, they weren't worth much in stock form. Demolition derby car owners typically use the same engine in different cars, and a lot of times it's some simple small block. They would buy one of those big cars and basically scrap the 455, or sell it for almost nothing.

If it was a W30 engine, or some other performance 455, that would make a difference, but I don't think there were any W30 Delta88's. I most certainly could be wrong though. Chevy Impala's used to have high powered engine options.

[Granpdpa] - Grandma, glue your dentures in, we're going for groceries!

[Arky-X]

I mentioned the 455 Olds in another thread. Brother had one built to the W30 specs for a dirt track car in the late 80s-early 90s. There wasn't any LS engines so the 350 Chevy was the go-to. Everyone pretty much built 383 strokers at the time. The 455 did good on a short track but holy crap on a 3/8. There was a 1/2 mile here that he ran on twice before it closed. His driver was not too interested in running on it because the top speed was scary fast for a Camaro/Firebird with some bars welded around you. If you wrecked, you were gonna get hurt. It was fun watching it pull a link on any other car on a straight on that track.
The tech man looked at engine, turned around and told the other guys, "you boys better go back to the drawing board." At the time the rule of "there's no replacement for displacement" held true. Today, not so much.

[ps2fixer]

Yea seems like today the big thing is there's no replacement for a bigger turbo lol. Even with a super charger, the smaller engines can't get that bottom end torque like the old v8 engines though. They were great for trucks and such. Having to rev up to take off empty is bad enough, but when you have a big load, now you really have to ride the clutch, or work the torque converter since engine rpm has to be higher to get the torque needed to take off. I've never driven an old v8 truck with a stick, but when I was a kid, I don't think I ever saw my dad stall a stick. He stalls his truck fairly often now with a newer engine because the bottom end is no where near as torquey as they used to be. Granted he's driving a mid to full size truck with a V6, the T100 never came with a V8 till the Tundra was released and it became made in USA and all the frame recall stuff with Dana dropping the ball on the frame production process. Toyota sued them, won, and that money is what the "buy back" program was funded by.

[Shep1970]

What pisses me off-
When the god dang waffle iron looses its non stick coating.....! My attempt at breakfast this am fail.
Then the wife tried / now the waffle iron is in the trash (waffle and all)

I feel I need a cocktail and it’s only 9am[emoji16]
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20200425/d578592f70c8733118a8a5b27b8ffcc2.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[schlepp29]

Trying to get simple parts for a 69 charger and they don't even offer a aftermarket part.

[schlepp29]

Well to get specific about the parts I was referring to is an aftermarket market wheel hub that uses the drum brakes. But they offer everything thing else besides the hub.

[El Camexican]

Double standards.

Ghislaine Maxwell was just arrested after what the FBI called a "Manhunt"

https://www.ibtimes.com/ghislaine-maxwell-arrest-how-jeffrey-epsteins-confidante-dodged-year-long-manhunt-3004923

Why MAN Hunt? Why not Chick Chase, Cunt Hunt nor some other female based terminology?

It's time for change bitches, stop stealing our male criminal culture, woman up and get your own!!!

[Yelowfincroaker]

Double standards.

Ghislaine Maxwell was just arrested after what the FBI called a "Manhunt"

https://www.ibtimes.com/ghislaine-maxwell-arrest-how-jeffrey-epsteins-confidante-dodged-year-long-manhunt-3004923

Why MAN Hunt? Why not Chick Chase, Cunt Hunt nor some other female based terminology?

It's time for change bitches, stop stealing our male criminal culture, woman up and get your own!!!

A scum bag woman to be sure...........what was her bag ..........drinking kiddy piss..........or skat all over her chi-chea`s ...........eeeuuuwww!..........mad about two things this 4th of July....... the fact that Dr. Foukme has`nt been raked over the coals for selling Co-vid to the Chinks...........and the fact that as long as there`s no Vaccine life is gonna suck for 2 - 3 more years ..........is no body else upset ?.........like how about some sanctions for China ..........or sell Dr fauci back to China ?......hey now !

[El Camexican]

A scum bag woman to be sure...........what was her bag ..........drinking kiddy piss..........or skat all over her chi-chea`s ...........eeeuuuwww!..........mad about two things this 4th of July....... the fact that Dr. Foukme has`nt been raked over the coals for selling Co-vid to the Chinks...........and the fact that as long as there`s no Vaccine life is gonna suck for 2 - 3 more years ..........is no body else upset ?.........like how about some sanctions for China ..........or sell Dr fauci back to China ?......hey now !

Nuevo Leon: ZERO travel between 10:00pm and 5:00am on weekdays, essential travel only during the open hours, food or medical. 10:00pm Friday to 5:00am Monday ZERO movement allowed unless for medical emergency or food delivery.

Will Ghislane...

A - Commit "suicide" in her cell when the cameras stop working?
B - Have her lawyers send a little black book to a media source with the nut sack to publish it?
C - Bargain her way out of this with some sort of misdemeanor plea in exchange for her silence?
C - None of the above?

Foukme and all the others know NOTHING! No one knows anything for sure, it's all just political BS bla, bla, bla being rammed up our azzes to try and keep us calm while they hope it goes away. These internet doctors pretending to know what we need to do is as rich as a car mechanic trying to explain how a UFO works. The last time this happened was over 100 years ago when a largest social gathering event short of a wedding was a barn raising. Subway, airplanes, 500 people church services, this is all new. The Presidents fault? China to blame? What about Obama? Fuk me, it doesn't matter where it started or how we try to fight this, it's going to make the rounds. All this BS about how one country or another is beating the virus is based on locking people down. As soon as they open the doors it will start all over again, and again, and again, and again. Herd immunity, get used to it, or stay locked up and wait for phase # 468 to kick in.

PS. They cancelled my flight to Vegas and I'm pissed.

[Scootertrash]

A vaccine don't mean squat. The current flu vaccine is only 45% effective according to the CDC, and I know plenty of people who get the flu shot every year and have still gotten the flu.

Flu related deaths:

2017-2018 season-61,000 deaths

2018-2019 season-34,200 deaths

We're all gonna fukin die!!!!! AAAAHHHAHAHAHHAAHH *COUGH COUGH*

Don't ferget to wear yer mask! :Bounce:Bounce:w00t::naughty:

263484

I need to go check my temperature.........

[DAM shop]

Double standards.

Ghislaine Maxwell was just arrested after what the FBI called a "Manhunt"

https://www.ibtimes.com/ghislaine-maxwell-arrest-how-jeffrey-epsteins-confidante-dodged-year-long-manhunt-3004923

Why MAN Hunt? Why not Chick Chase, Cunt Hunt nor some other female based terminology?

It's time for change bitches, stop stealing our male criminal culture, woman up and get your own!!!

“Woman up and get your own”. Hahaha, I love that el!

[ATC King]

How about the reckless use of 'original', 'low hour', 'one owner', and other descriptors being used to sell trikes?

If anything has been changed, including tires, it's not original. Oil, filters, and the like maintenance items get a pass. Fuel too.

If it doesn't have an hour meter or odometer, nobody except experts can approximate the hours on it.

If someone bought it from the original owner to resell it, it's not a one owner anymore. Without a tittle or MSO, that one is nearly impossible to determine anyway.


Something else is the liberal application of shiny, shine shine products, all over the dang thing. Some of those must smell retched the first time they're warmed up, with all that junk over the exhaust.

Original, dry rotted tires with 'good tread,' but with tubes in them is hogwash.

Junk, junk, and more junk. Good thing I've already got plenty of junk that didn't cost an arm and leg.

[Joseph Farrow]

I have some NOS air for your original dry rotted tires with tubes. ;)

[ATC King]

Though I'd watch Wynona Earp last night. I haven't seen it and I like Sci-Fi shows. Looked like it was going to have a strong female lead character, but in the first minute it turned into a cuckholding, femnazi hypocrisy, and I changed the channel, never to watch again.


First words were a unattractive male figure, shaming himself for looking at Earp's rear, the next were Earp saying 'One small step for a MILF, one giant step for MILF kind."

trailpro


Does every show have to be some twisted, soft-core porn parody nowadays that reduces women to nothing more than a prepackaged meat product, and men to sniveling cowards? I miss the old Sci-Fi shows that weren't produced by sex starved, porn addicted, Manchurian candidates, doublethinking and Newspeaking.

This series belongs on an episode of MST3K.

[Trike_crazy]

People that can't admit they are wrong even when presented with proof they are. Then try to talk in circles dodging the fact they are.

[ATC King]

So...you have a problem with the majority of politicians. And? :)

[Trike_crazy]

Yeah lol. And a guy named Bill Casey. Thinks he knows it all but I proved that he was wrong so he blocked me on Facebook lol. Just because he's been in the trike game for over 30 years doesn't mean he's always right. Never heard good things about him anyway

[DAM shop]

The lack of customer service and how we have all allowed it to go down the toilet. How we except lack of service for the new norm. Well not me folks. I have recently got rid of a credit union that thinks it’s okay to conduct business through a drive up window on part time hours. Or my LP company that I just joined discussion group to figure out where they went wrong when they decided to let corporate deal with customers. How about my satellite company that I have monthly discussions with about their lack of dedication to the loyal customer. How about the DR. I had to fire because I was stuck in a waiting room for 1.5 hrs. Oh yeah and the other Dr I fired. The management I just talked to at a local retailer because they had a ton of customers in line with only 2 registers open and 4 cashiers standing around talking, wtf?
My point here is that it pisses me off that we or you all have excepted lack of customer service as the new normal because you don’t want to deal with it. Well I say horse s***t. If we allow this to continue it will continue. Amerigas my lp supplier is bleeding customers because of the messed up changes they made dealing with customers. Now they are paying me to do online surveys. Idiots! There is always another contractor, satellite provider, cell service, doctor that can do the same thing. I for 1 won’t tolerate it and either should you.
Whew! I feel better.

I believe it all started when they did away with full service gas stations, one of the biggest mistakes we made. All for what because someone thought my mom wanted to pump her own fuel.

[sweetip2000]

The lack of customer service and how we have all allowed it to go down the toilet. How we except lack of service for the new norm. Well not me folks. I have recently got rid of a credit union that thinks it’s okay to conduct business through a drive up window on part time hours. Or my LP company that I just joined discussion group to figure out where they went wrong when they decided to let corporate deal with customers. How about my satellite company that I have monthly discussions with about their lack of dedication to the loyal customer. How about the DR. I had to fire because I was stuck in a waiting room for 1.5 hrs. Oh yeah and the other Dr I fired. The management I just talked to at a local retailer because they had a ton of customers in line with only 2 registers open and 4 cashiers standing around talking, wtf?
My point here is that it pisses me off that we or you all have excepted lack of customer service as the new normal because you don’t want to deal with it. Well I say horse s***t. If we allow this to continue it will continue. Amerigas my lp supplier is bleeding customers because of the messed up changes they made dealing with customers. Now they are paying me to do online surveys. Idiots! There is always another contractor, satellite provider, cell service, doctor that can do the same thing. I for 1 won’t tolerate it and either should you.
Whew! I feel better.

I believe it all started when they did away with full service gas stations, one of the biggest mistakes we made. All for what because someone thought my mom wanted to pump her own fuel.

Holy Shnykeez customer service ? It is beyond poor customer service. It is a lack of interest in life. I mean like really. This is a total breakdown of society. We manufacture nothing here in the USSA. We have been lied to about everything. And now we have to tolerate the Bernie Maidoff of medical industry and wear a diaper on our face because he says so ? LoL the best customer you will have is yourself so make the best possible logical investment you can. A will. A plot. And a grave. We are all slated to be exterminated. Search Duck Duck G0 for Georgia Guidstones.

Its a miracle anyone has a job at this point in time. We are so F tire tire tire tire tire tire. Shaboingy !! whatever the F that means oh well its just an expression

[cymbala23]

Californians!

[ironchop]

"experts"

I'm sick of self-proclaimed experts and experts that are proclaimed by other experts

Since the word 'Expert' doesn't imply honesty, transparency, education, or moral superiority, I'm not sure why people trust them so much to begin with. We should start giving out dictionaries again.

When the death of this nation is written about in the future, it will be titled:

"How 'Experts' Lead Americans off a Totalitarian Cliff of Ignorance."

Sent from my motorola one 5G ace using Tapatalk

[ATC King]

Sharts. Never trust a fart.

And the first place winner for internet photo search for shart is...

268922

Is there a word for laughing sharts? I guess the guy with the gun is the shart villain. Maybe rajkumar kohli is how it sounds and
kewal misra is the missery felt after the warmth wears off.