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Thread: 185s won't spark when cold, roll star works and runs fine. At the end of my rope

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Veneta, Oregon
    --
    4

    185s won't spark when cold, roll star works and runs fine. At the end of my rope

    Hello all,
    Matt here, I've been searching this site for weeks trying to get my bike running right.
    Here is what it is doing.
    I put the choke on once and pull start it and nothing. Try it without the choke and nothing. I could pull it 20 times and nothing. Roll it down the hill and pop it into 1st and it fires up. At this point I have to
    keep on the gas until it is warm. If I don't let off it will run perfectly. Once warm after about 5 minutes I can use the kill switch and it will pull start first time. I went on a 45 mile ride last week and as long as i kept it warm it fired fine.

    Here is what I have done so far.
    New carb
    New air filter
    New CDI box
    New Ignition coil
    New spark plug/ Tried 2 new
    New Lightning coil (got the fly wheel off and replaced it.)
    Ohm tested the exciter coil and it was fine at 245.
    Set the carb at the 2nd notch of the needle like in the manual I have
    Turned the air/fuel mixture in all the way and backed it out 2 turns
    Set the idle to 1400
    Did a Valve adjustment set at TDC .002 with the Rotor aligned and there is no knocking.
    No oil leaks
    Chain tensioner is set
    Clutch is set
    Kill switch is clean and works properly
    Ohm tested the CDI wires coming out the side of the rotor and the tested fine also the gap was .3 on the rotor.
    Broke the pull rope trying to start it so I just fixed it.

    I'm at the point where I'm going to give up.
    I ordered another Ignition coil off ebay Just to make sure it wasn't the other new one that is bad.
    Should get it in a week.
    It literally runs perfect when it's warm, any thoughts?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Sarnia, Ontario, Canada
    --
    3,415
    Where did you get that new carb?

    What about engine compression? Numbers?
    Current toys..
    1986 Honda 350X..trail bomb!
    1985 Honda 250SX..my main mudder
    1985 Honda 250ES..Back in Black Trike
    Current non-trike toys:
    1990 Honda TRX300FW
    1995 Seadoo GTX
    1998 Polaris Indy Lite 340(Nearly new looking)
    1998 Polaris Touring 500
    1998 Club Car (electric)

  3. #3
    Dave8338's Avatar
    Dave8338 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Central MN
    --
    378
    Sounds lean to me. Have you tried a spritz of starting fluid when it is cold, to rule out a fuel problem? Also, a hard cold start is often a symptom of valves that are too tight.
    Just a thought or two.
    The Goal... All I Need Is The Time...

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Veneta, Oregon
    --
    4
    I got the carb off e-bay, it was working fine before so I don't think that is it but anything is possible. I still have the stock carb I can try and clean and put back in. As far as compression, do I need to take it to a shop for that? I'm trying to save money, I have 500.00 into the bike and my local shop quoted me 250.00 just to give at a once over. Thats insane. I adjusted the valves yesterday and they are right, I will try the starter fluid. I did have the sparkplug off just now and saw no spark when I pulled it. I just tested the wires from the cdi to the box and that was good, as where the coils from the fly wheel.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Pacific NW
    --
    4,255
    Hey there,

    Gimmie a call.
    I'm in Veneta too surrounded by trikes.
    935 42 zero six

    So the new story is no spark with pull rope but it will 'jump start when rolled?

    If it's a 'speed of spin' issue, your spark advance plate may be stuck in the advance position.
    They get rusty and stuck.
    You said you fixed the lighting coil under the flywheel?
    How did the ignition coil look under there?..the pack of gum looking thing that throws ac voltage to fire the ignition, not the one that connects to the spark plug.
    Is that what you mean by 'exciter coil'? they can ohm out nice but also like to have a good ground connection.

    I have nipped the last tiny bit off the sparkplug wire so the spark plug cap has some new fresh copper to bite into. That alone has fixed some really odd nonsensical issues before.

    I just talked to doug at v town motorsports about intermittent heat / cold issues and we
    agree that a hairdryer can be greatly diagnostic.
    If it runs great warm, and no spark cold, maybe heat up the cdi with a hairdryer and see if you magically have spark. Then heat up the cover that says 'cdi' and so on until you heat up the right part, mimicking a warm engine.

    The mechanic from Cascade Motorcycle lives on Warthen and is a good resource too.

    You can use my compression tester but sounds like the spark / no spark might be the place to focus.

    I'll be working around home for the next few days if you want to call or borrow parts etc.
    Wickedly frustrating, I know.
    I don't walk too well so I REALLY need my trikes to run.

    You'll get it.
    We always do.

    ps - I see you're posting in member commencement.
    You may get more responses in the 'new member discussion area'.
    and you've checked the search key box undoubtedly.
    Last edited by tri again; 05-08-2013 at 04:36 AM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Veneta, Oregon
    --
    4

    Cool Got it!

    I bought a new CDI box and another new coil. Ends up the "new" ignition coil I had on it must have been faulty because as soon as I got the next on on it fired 4th pull. I had tried to cut the sparkplug wire down but it didn't fix the problem. Thanks for the advice, that's a good Idea using an hair dryer. I checked the spark advance plate as you suggested and it looks good, no rust or anything. Both coils under the flywheel looked good, I had taken them off and cleaned them. Hopefully it will stay running. I'll be in the market soon for another bike, I've been looking at a 4 wheel Warrior or TRX 400. I've been riding for 24 years and the trail riding I do is just unsafe on my three wheeler. Downhill lots of ruts in the trail, sharp corners, I've dam near wrecked half a dozen times.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Pacific NW
    --
    4,255
    I understand the rut issues.
    Most of our riding is work on the farm.
    I mow a creekbed which is like 3 feet deep and 10 feet wide by 100 feet long,
    more like a lawnmowed half pipe but it tunes us up for the dunes.

    I'll be working here for the next few days if you want me to take a look at your trike.
    Those chain drive hardtails are just magical in the mud, but I undertsnad the trail ruts for sure.

    Anyway, giver a shout if you want.
    I have known working parts to swap out if you think that will help.

    so?
    you're still in the 'no spark' limbo?
    I remember my first cdi 185 and the spark really isn't all that dramatic.
    Not like the fat blue sparks from anything I was ever used to.
    and? it will roll start cold and pull start when warm?

    or? your last post said you have spark on the 4th pull, cold?
    Is it consistent yet?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Veneta, Oregon
    --
    4
    Yes I got it and I've been checking it everyday. Today I choked it first pull and the second pull choke off it started! So the cold start problem is fixed! Thanks for the offer! I keep my bike in Triangle lake at a friends and ride on the BLM land and logging roads mostly. So I never have to trailer it anywhere, just fire it up and drive up the back of his property to the roads. My next project is the first bike I ever road. My 1984 Honda 250r dirt bike, it was my fathers and when he passed it went to me. I have it all apart and had the frame sandblasted and painted. The kickstarter broke off so I'm stuck until I find a new shaft and lever.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Pacific NW
    --
    4,255
    We had a 250r here for a short while.
    Waaay too fast for us and 'visitors' always got into trouble.

    Glad you got the trike running.
    Any idea what the main problem was?

    yeah, trike prices keep going up so you'll be ok if you need to trade it out.
    Not sure where to look for your kickstart shaft and lever.
    I'd prob start w/ ebay.
    or see if Cascade mc on w 11th has a lead.
    My favorite bike junkyard has closed so not sure where to look.

    Good luck and congratulations.

  10. #10
    Worden18's Avatar
    Worden18 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Minnesota, USA
    --
    298
    Glad to see you got it figured out. I love my 185, and not long after I first got it I had to replace the stator and the ignition coil. Turns out the first coil I ordered from ebay was bad, just like yours was. Always check the primary and secondary on those before you even put them on.
    My Trikes:

    1983 Honda 185s
    1986 Honda 250es Big Red
    1985 Yamaha 225 DX
    1984 Yamaha 200EL "Yamahauler"

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