Our hearts ache for Vegas

[Thorpe]

Well guys, if I may... Add my $.02

I was in Vegas when this shtf. I was across the street when this all happened. All I can tell you is this whole story the media is giving, stinks of fish. (This is the condensed story) There is a certain detail I learned about myself that Sunday, Oct. 2nd, and that is that I REALLY DONT APPRECIATE BEING SHOT AT. Now here is the eff'd up part. When the Mandalay Bay shooting happened, my wife and I made ourselves scarce, and in a hurry. We got 3-4 blocks away into Planet Hollywood casino, which was getting locked down in a hurry. There was a rush of people coming in, as my wife and I asked the security guard what was going on, and the look of fear on his face was real... We started backing up as gunshots started flying in the casino. These were not the report from a side arm as security was carrying, but that of a short barrel, high powered rifle, more than likely a 223/556. I know this sound. I know it very well. It was not a book being dropped, it was not a chair getting tipped, it was not a slot machine falling over. It was not "full auto" it was not from a "bump stock". It was semi auto. Needless to say, we started to beat cheeks out of there. We ran across the casino floor, everyone ran. Card jockeys, waitresses, everyone. Chips were flying, cash on the floor, everyone was running from the gunshots. Multiple gunshots. We found ourselves on the far end of where we were, with options of a bar, and a bathroom, no exit. After what happened in Orlando, those were not options I was cool with. I saw a service elevator and drug my wife in there, along with another couple, and we dropped down a level and ended up in a kitchen area by the dock. The first employee I encountered seemed to think we shouldn't be there, as I quickly informed him his opinion didn't matter at the current moment. We ran toward the dock, finding an emergency exit, peaked outside and found the coast to be clear. Out the door and to the left, made it about 3 steps before hearing shots again. Immediate U turn... As we got the hell away from PH we grabbed a young couple, and a single gal that were headed toward danger and made them come with us. I watched a police helicopter circling PH with its spot light on. We made our way to Hard Rock Cafe, where I was able to convince the security guard to let us in (somewhere safe) We started checking the Internet and news... Immediate reports of one shooter down, and 3 in custody. Also there was news forming about a shooting at PH. Google it now, you won't find a damn thing. If there is no report, it must not have happened, right? Well, I still want to know who the eff did I cross paths with, and who the F was shooting at us?!? Went back to PH the next day, Police presence was ultra high, security ultra high, full banks of slot machines being replaced... Neighboring businesses shut down completely for the day. If it smells like fish, looks like fish, and tastes like fish... I'm gonna say it's fishy

I forgot to mention too, word on the street the next day was there was shots fired at Aria, and Ceasars Palace that night too... Weird, no media coverage...

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Wow Thorpe! Thanks for sharing that and glad you made it out!

[RIDE-RED 250r]

So I have been watching all of this unfold, mainly news bits online from various points of view some of which believe the one shooter scenario and others that don't. It's really hard to KNOW the truth of what happened, and unlikely the whole truth will ever be made public..which in and of itself is a very sad state of affairs. I remain open minded and hopeful that as unlikely as it is, the whole truth is made known.

Having said that, the thing that pisses me off almost more than the incident itself is the fact that some had no qualms about jumping right into attacking our liberty, gun laws, constitution, etc before the bodies of the victims were cold! Of course I am sad for those effected by what happened, and the brazen disregard for those people to advance a tyrannical agenda is beyond reprehensible to me. And this isn't just a few wack-jobs with a youtube channel, these are "big" people in politics and media. It's disgusting and abhorrent! Now I am not going to get into all of that, the other side tries to argue with fatally flawed logic and pure emotion. You cannot have an honest debate with those types. It just makes me sick that any time something like this happens they "never let a crisis go to waste" standing on the still warm bodies of the victims to decry our natural rights and attempt to usurp them. The people are morally bankrupt. These assholes want more restriction on firearms? I expect them and their security teams to be first in line to hand over their high capacity magazines and every other "scary looking" weapon they use.

I'm sick to death of this !

[atc007]

So,,here's my thing..... Fellas,,who I care about and respect,,Ride red, Sox,,anyne else with ANY doubt about us crazy "conspiracy theorists".. We have here a man who we know to be good,one of us. Thorpe. He was there with his wife. Now,,I wouldn't be caught dead in Vegas or anywhere anything like it. I'm a mountains,pine trees and lakes kinda guy. But Thorpe was there,amongst the flying bullets. I haven't taken the time to google maps where the PH is adjacent to the MB....Are we to believe this "lone" gunman on the 32nd floor LMAO,,,took out the interior of PH ,where Thorpe was...?? The cell videos I saw the AM of Monday were so very very clearly semi autos,,many,,much more than 3,on the ground. As I posted above. Sometimes I wonder why I even try lol. Am I alone here? A 757 flies a perfect ground pattern into the pentagon in front of 85 + cameras 9/11. Zero footage of any airliner anywhere in DC that day has ever been shown. But 911 was real !?? Cmon guys !!! .... And now this...Hell, I would be far more likely to listen to Santa Clause did this,than the stories they come up with.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

For the record, I am not in any way expressing doubt about Thorpe's account and what he and his wife experienced there. It's stories like his along with footage from cell phones posted online that still has me sitting here wondering if and when the whole truth will be known.

The 9-11 thing, yes I have seen some things about it that compels one to wonder and question. And that is A-OK by me, Jefferson said to question everything including the very existence of the almighty. I don't want to go down the 9-11 trail in this particular thread though so that is all I have to say on that subject at the moment.

One thing going for the side of truth, modern tech, smart phones, etc really can be useful in making the truth known. Not too many camera phones even around at the time of 9-11, but this LV thing has showed us that people know when to hit "record" and that I believe is a good thing.

Bottom line is, we all have to decide who to believe because the fact is the vast majority of us were not there, did not personally witness the act. How do we decide who to believe, especially with 9-11? Now the LV shooting gives us all alot more info to digest from alot more sources thanks to individuals using their phones recording what happened. I think that helps to keep the truth from being tossed aside and buried.

To me, Thorpe's story is another addition to the pile of other things that keep me doubting the single shooter narrative that's being pushed.

[fabiodriven]

There's more than enough evidence in regards to 9/11. You just have to have your eyes open in order to see it.

[fabiodriven]

Now, I pride myself on my ability to spot a lie. I'm good at it.

Not nearly as good as you think.

[Thorpe]

I'm not much of a tech guy, so please excuse my inability to paint, but red is MB, and the lower red was the concert and the green is PH....

[Kamnahrt]

Just to add some info to the pile. The guys story is interesting but the part i wanted to share is the police scanner recordings at the very bottom. Multiple accounts in there of active shooters in different locations than just the hotel.

http://twofeed.org/2017/10/07/las-ve...-gunman-crowd/

[knappyfeet]

I still believe it's just some lonely kook who likes to choke/rape high end hookers.

Maybe I'm wrong.......I've been wrong before

[redsox]

Just catching up here. I'll try and make as much sense as i can here, but forgive me if i jump around a bit. First, have you ever watched the replay of the "news" on the morning of 9/11? Reports of bombs going off in hotels, car bombs in times square, shooters in other airports, etc, etc. All untrue. All false, crowd sourced reports and misconstrued information rushed out to the public by a useless media looking to break a story. Look at the Boston Marathon Bombing. Anyone want to tell me that was fake? Believe me, you don't. The New York Post put a picture on the front page of two men with the headline "Wanted by the FBI" They weren't. The news was WRONG. I think conspiracy guys mistake ineptitude for charade. Both with the media and the government. They're not pulling the wool over you eyes. There is no puppet master. Everyone is inept. The larger the scope of any organization, the more mistakes will be made. If you need any evidence, just look at the Federal Government.

There's more than enough evidence in regards to 9/11. You just have to have your eyes open in order to see it.

Not so much opening your eyes as a willing suspension of your disbelief.

Not nearly as good as you think.

What makes you say that?

Stop having babies.

I don't get it? Overpopulation is the problem?



Thorpe, I'm glad that you and your family are OK. That was a war zone. Horrific. I can't disagree with your account, nor do I have any reason to believe otherwise. Like I said in my first post, i think more will come with this. A vacuum of information will get filled with misinformation. I do wonder, was anyone struck with any rounds near PH? Were there any victims? I would think that a mobile shooter on the ground with a short barrel, high power 223 would be easily able to inflict some real damage in those massive crowds. I also think that someone like that would have shown up on camera somewhere. Allow me to float another possibility. Do you think what you heard might have been return fire from Law Enforcement? It seems unlikely based on the topography, but i wouldn't discount the possibility. Law Enforcement has historically overestimated the capabilities of their weapons. Especially those other than their sidearm, that they are not accustomed to carrying, and probably only qualify with yearly. That would not only account for the lack of killed or wounded at PH and other places, but also the lack of video of the shots, as LE would have likely cleared the area where they were. I suppose that would raise the question of where did the rounds go? I don't know. I do know that the gunfire in Watertown following the Marathon Bomber manhunt was almost exclusively LE and it was undisciplined and wild. Its amazing more people were not killed. I'm just wondering if the same applies to the LV scene, being that it was an extended event. Are you thinking that the shooter on the ground is still outstanding? Or, are you theorizing that he/she was killed and covered up due to muslim/russian/korean affiliation? All of it interesting fodder i think.

The gun control aspect of this event is just foolish i think. Does anyone feel otherwise? I think that argument ha been put to bed on this thread, as we are on the same page. (at least theres that)

[bkm]

Just catching up here. I'll try and make as much sense as i can here, but forgive me if i jump around a bit. First, have you ever watched the replay of the "news" on the morning of 9/11? Reports of bombs going off in hotels, car bombs in times square, shooters in other airports, etc, etc. All untrue. All false, crowd sourced reports and misconstrued information rushed out to the public by a useless media looking to break a story. Look at the Boston Marathon Bombing. Anyone want to tell me that was fake? Believe me, you don't. The New York Post put a picture on the front page of two men with the headline "Wanted by the FBI" They weren't. The news was WRONG. I think conspiracy guys mistake ineptitude for charade. Both with the media and the government. They're not pulling the wool over you eyes. There is no puppet master. Everyone is inept. The larger the scope of any organization, the more mistakes will be made. If you need any evidence, just look at the Federal Government.




Not so much opening your eyes as a willing suspension of your disbelief.



What makes you say that?



I don't get it? Overpopulation is the problem?



Thorpe, I'm glad that you and your family are OK. That was a war zone. Horrific. I can't disagree with your account, nor do I have any reason to believe otherwise. Like I said in my first post, i think more will come with this. A vacuum of information will get filled with misinformation. I do wonder, was anyone struck with any rounds near PH? Were there any victims? I would think that a mobile shooter on the ground with a short barrel, high power 223 would be easily able to inflict some real damage in those massive crowds. I also think that someone like that would have shown up on camera somewhere. Allow me to float another possibility. Do you think what you heard might have been return fire from Law Enforcement? It seems unlikely based on the topography, but i wouldn't discount the possibility. Law Enforcement has historically overestimated the capabilities of their weapons. Especially those other than their sidearm, that they are not accustomed to carrying, and probably only qualify with yearly. That would not only account for the lack of killed or wounded at PH and other places, but also the lack of video of the shots, as LE would have likely cleared the area where they were. I suppose that would raise the question of where did the rounds go? I don't know. I do know that the gunfire in Watertown following the Marathon Bomber manhunt was almost exclusively LE and it was undisciplined and wild. Its amazing more people were not killed. I'm just wondering if the same applies to the LV scene, being that it was an extended event. Are you thinking that the shooter on the ground is still outstanding? Or, are you theorizing that he/she was killed and covered up due to muslim/russian/korean affiliation? All of it interesting fodder i think.

The gun control aspect of this event is just foolish i think. Does anyone feel otherwise? I think that argument ha been put to bed on this thread, as we are on the same page. (at least theres that)

Learn to swim! Sorry, I had too.

[fabiodriven]

Just catching up here. I'll try and make as much sense as i can here, but forgive me if i jump around a bit. First, have you ever watched the replay of the "news" on the morning of 9/11? Reports of bombs going off in hotels, car bombs in times square, shooters in other airports, etc, etc.

To rehash this again, there have been countless posts on this subject and I have I think two threads on this subject alone, 9/11. If you didn't see it then and you're not interested in looking now, I don't know how else I can show you. You claim these reports of explosions are false, however there is plenty of video evidence of explosions at the street as well as subterranean levels, people describing their first hand experience of explosions in the basement and people losing their lives to explosions in a basement, a long time before the buildings came down. One man in particular comes to mind who died under very suspicious circumstances, and his name is Barry Jennings. If you're interested I suggest you look at his story because not only his story, but countless others will tell you there absolutely were explosions at ground and subterranean levels.

What makes you say that?

What makes me say that is the very clear evidence that I am aware of, as well as many others, which you choose not to look at. I'd be nervous to see it too if I were you, so I get it. You sitting here and typing that the claims of street level explosions were unfounded does not make them unfounded. You show me proof of why it is that is unfounded and I'll show you multiple eyewitnesses to street and subterranean level explosions and I bet I could even find explosions at street level on video for your eyes to see. There is proof Dan, tons and tons and tons of proof, it's just a choice as to whether or not anyone wants to see it.

I've said it before, the American people's attention span is too short to care about the truth once it comes out. The truth will come out on this someday and you will see it, everyone will, but what are you going to do about it at that point? They'll have already won. The amount of control the powers that be gained that day is absurd. They gave themselves license and free reign of every aspect of our lives, and they can always point back to that perfect storm of events that happened that day when two 767's achieved amazing by a pilot's standards maneuvers even though they were flown by people who were not pilots and flew them into two buildings which were designed to take a direct hit from a commercial airliner, which when they were built was the 707, a heavier plane than the 767 which then somehow melted, even though the laws of physics dictate that there is no way that fire could have gotten hot enough to melt steel (that theory has been reproduced and shown to be impossible and I've linked that video already before) and cause the only three steel and concrete buildings in the history of mankind to collapse due to fire, ever. Never before or since that day has one steel/concrete structure fallen due to fire, but it happened three times that day, and let's not forget building 7 was barely grazed.

Not specifically just to Dan but to whoever has at least one functioning eyeball. Look at building collapses, look at ten of them. Look at 100 of them, look at all of them. You tell me how many buildings in history have ever collapsed perfectly in their own footprint. It is an insult to your intelligence Dan, that you cannot put whatever you were told aside and believe what you can see with your own two eyes. Three clear building demolitions, engineers and demolition experts around the planet speaking out, families of the victims who know the truth, and it's all there for see if you want to see it. The reason you don't is because it's not on your evening news anymore, but I promise you it's there, so once again, if you open your eyes, you can see it.

The United States openly admits that the Gulf of Tonkin incident was reported exactly backwards, it's not even hidden anymore. That incident was the spark that set off the Vietnam conflict. That is what's known as a "false flag event", and the United States is caught red handed, guilty as charged. So when is their day in court? You don't care, nobody cares, because everyone else is on to the next thing and it doesn't matter anymore. If this isn't figured out in 50 years, which I bet it will be sorted before then, they can just do the same thing. "Hey remember what we told you when those countless people died from our lies? Haha! Yeah you totally bought that! Steel and concrete burning, buildings falling perfectly in their own footprint? HAHAHAAA!!!!!! Sucker!"

[fabiodriven]

I might suggest we keep the subject Las Vegas. I'll gladly continue this discussion with anyone but we're mucking a bit here.

[El Camexican]

I might suggest we digress. I'll gladly continue this discussion with anyone but we're mucking a bit here.

Yeah good point, was thinking the same thing. This thread was started by an resident of Vegas and we owe it to him to not turn this into a sheet show. I think we've gone way off the intended track, yours truly included. May want to start a "What really Happened in Vegas?" thread and move this over.