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Thread: 110 hard cold starts-turned out to be low compression

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    --
    997
    Well...may have ran into a big problem. When torquing the 4 head nuts on those long studs, one of the studs snapped. The other 3 torqued fine to 15 ft/lbs. Do you think it will be fine to run with 3 studs or do I need to tear this thing back apart and replace the stud? That pretty much finished my day.
    84 Honda 200ES Big Red


  2. #17
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The Open Road
    --
    4,729
    Quote Originally Posted by longbedGTs View Post
    Well...may have ran into a big problem. When torquing the 4 head nuts on those long studs, one of the studs snapped. The other 3 torqued fine to 15 ft/lbs. Do you think it will be fine to run with 3 studs or do I need to tear this thing back apart and replace the stud? That pretty much finished my day.
    It snapped at 15lbs? Wow that sucks

    Yeah, you're going to need to replace that. You'll most likely end up with a big head gasket leak with only three studs holding.

    I'm surprised you didn't have a compression leak before as that stud was probably shot before you got it. If one was bad, the others need looked at too and possibly replaced.



    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    --
    997
    Quote Originally Posted by ironchop View Post
    It snapped at 15lbs? Wow that sucks

    Yeah, you're going to need to replace that. You'll most likely end up with a big head gasket leak with only three studs holding.

    I'm surprised you didn't have a compression leak before as that stud was probably shot before you got it. If one was bad, the others need looked at too and possibly replaced.



    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk
    It didn't even get to 15 ft/lbs. As I was tightening it, it "kept tightening" for way longer than it should have, so I stopped. I thought it was pulling the threads out of the case, but it was apparently twisting itself to death. . This went from being fun to being a big PITA.
    84 Honda 200ES Big Red


  4. #19
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The Open Road
    --
    4,729
    Quote Originally Posted by longbedGTs View Post
    It didn't even get to 15 ft/lbs. As I was tightening it, it "kept tightening" for way longer than it should have, so I stopped. I thought it was pulling the threads out of the case, but it was apparently twisting itself to death. . This went from being fun to being a big PITA.
    Yeah it was already cracked, then.



    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Davenport iowa
    --
    1,144
    The mechanical side of it is the fun part isn't it? We put together a motor yesterday, looked on the bench and noticed the oil gear sitting on the bench.. hahahaha

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    --
    997
    Just got it back apart and there is enough to grab on with some vise grips. It's gonna sit overnight with some penetrant and I'll give it a whirl tomorrow. The bottom right stud(with the cap nut on the end) is in real good shape, but the other two have pretty bad rust at the bottom. Don't know why it never occurred to me to replace these...I stared right at it earlier and thought "that looks bad". Doh! Do you think I will need to get another new headgasket since this one was already squeezed? Also, are there any upgrade studs that are stronger than the thin bolts Honda used? Maybe something stainless?

    Quote Originally Posted by DAM shop View Post
    The mechanical side of it is the fun part isn't it? We put together a motor yesterday, looked on the bench and noticed the oil gear sitting on the bench.. hahahaha
    I don't know whether I'd laugh or cry or invent some new cuss words and go back to the house.
    Last edited by longbedGTs; 02-24-2018 at 09:42 PM.
    84 Honda 200ES Big Red


  7. #22
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The Open Road
    --
    4,729
    You should be able to reuse that gasket

    I'm not sure if anyone makes upgrade bolts.

    There are two different studs. Right pair and left pair are different numbers. I looked it up on partzilla to be sure. They are discontinued.
    I found these...
    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F252280596871

    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk
    Last edited by ironchop; 02-24-2018 at 10:51 PM.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    --
    997
    Quote Originally Posted by ironchop View Post
    You should be able to reuse that gasket

    I'm not sure if anyone makes upgrade bolts.

    There are two different studs. Right pair and left pair are different numbers. I looked it up on partzilla to be sure. They are discontinued.
    I found these...
    https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F252280596871

    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk
    Dude you're awesome. Thanks a ton!
    84 Honda 200ES Big Red


  9. #24
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The Open Road
    --
    4,729
    Quote Originally Posted by longbedGTs View Post
    Dude you're awesome. Thanks a ton!
    I don't mind. You're trying to fix it right and it sucks that you're almost done when this happened and I'm bored so there ya go

    Sent from my Z958 using Tapatalk

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Texas
    --
    997
    Well, finally got the beast back to life. Got it right the first attempt and it fired up after a few pulls. Minimal smoke on startup and zero smoke after a little run time. I tried doing a compression test just for curiosity sake and couldn't get an accurate reading because the little rubber tip you press onto the plug hole kept blowing out. The highest reading it would show was approx 149psi. I need to get a screw in fitting to get a better reading. Also replaced the 3 seals on the left case cover as the neutral indicator seal was leaking pretty badly as well as the dipstick o-ring. I'm guessing the crankcase was being pressurized due to the rings not sealing well and letting compression pressurize the crankcase. I let it idle for 20 minutes, then let it cool completely and changed the oil, then took it for a drive around the yard with accel/decel periods. Sound good enough for breaking in the rings? Thanks for all the help!
    84 Honda 200ES Big Red


  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    SW Oregon United States
    --
    145
    Real good thread. Just when I'm about to tackle the 110 my 84es seems to be struck by the 3wheeler zombie. And this thread hit home about not going half-way with the project. Sure... waiting for parts is no fun and reading threads like this one helps to make a NEED LIST before I start.
    Just a P>S. It sure doesn't help getting big red to start when you pull TWO brand new plugs out of the boxes and find out neither is any good!@#^%$#@!

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    SW Oregon United States
    --
    145
    Oh, I forgot to add that in some cases head bolts are designed to expand slightly when the head heats up, not to say that's the case in all air cooled engines but just be careful exchanging with stainless, etc.

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