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Thread: 83 ATC 200e questions

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    Cool 83 ATC 200e questions

    Hi all, I am looking to ask a few questions about the atc i have purchased recently. Its in pretty good shape, i'm in the process of stripping it down a little bit to clear up some of the frame and give it a overall new coat of paint on the frame. I have two technical questions.
    Firstly, I would like to replace the inner chain guard as its fairly rusty. I noticed that it looks like i need to take part of the left case cover off that houses the Hi Lo gear shifter. Can any of you provide me with some tips or some things to be aware of when removing this?
    Also since this bike is chain driven, I am planning on replacing the front and rear sprocket plus the chain. The previous owner told me the rear sprocket was worn down a bit, so i'm going to replace it. Do most of you guys run Oring chains? or should i look at the standard style chain?
    I always wanted a atc, and am happy with the purchase. It came with a truck full of spare parts!
    -Burden

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    I managed to pop the chain off today. Still unsure about digging into the hi lo gear box to get access to the front sprocket. Any advice? Found a good deal on a o ring chain.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    milky way galaxy
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    94
    Have you downloaded the manual for it? Both my machines are shaft drive so I can’t offer any advice about your specific machine.
    But the manual should be able to tell you everything about it, I have the manuals for both of mine I usually check them out and on the off chance they don’t cover something I come here

    https://threewheelermanuals.com/honda
    just scroll down to atc 200 repair manuals

    I’ll download it later when I get home and see what it says

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2019
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    Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by HorseMcHorseman View Post
    Have you downloaded the manual for it? Both my machines are shaft drive so I can’t offer any advice about your specific machine.
    But the manual should be able to tell you everything about it, I have the manuals for both of mine I usually check them out and on the off chance they don’t cover something I come here

    https://threewheelermanuals.com/honda
    just scroll down to atc 200 repair manuals

    I’ll download it later when I get home and see what it says
    I appreciate the response, I was looking at the manual. I read through most of it the other day as im trying to get a good grasp of this atc. Based off the 200e repair manual it says i need to remove the left case cover and subtransmission ( hi low) in order to access the drive gear(page 26). I'd like to inspect this gear as i know the rear sprocket is worn. As well i'd like to remove the chain guard, however i don't see in the manual about mentioning the chain guard other then where to acess points to inspect the chain. On page 114, it goes into some details about removing the Sub transmission, however im still pretty uncomfortable doing that as it looks a little bit intimidating with the shifter fork and gears and such. I may be overthinking it, but I always am interested to do some research so I can try to prevent breaking things as I need to maintain budget of being a student.
    Thanks,

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    Last edited by NlBurden; 05-21-2019 at 08:12 PM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
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    Edmond, KS
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    If you're going to replace the rear sprocket, you might as well replace the front one too. Those and the chain all wear together. Of you mix new and used parts, the used one will make the new ones wear faster.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Location
    TN
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    1,065
    The 200E sub tranny is not bad. The ES is a bassturd lemme tell ya.

    If you do decide to do it, pull the tank and drain the oil. Then you can pitch the whole machine up on it's side. It will make things easier.
    I was born and raised on Venus & I may be here a while.....

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Location
    milky way galaxy
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    94
    I looked at the manual and it seems simple enough, I wouldn’t think it would all fall apart or anything when you take the cover off, but even if it did all you would have to do is put everything back in the same place it was, like it shows on page 114.
    There’s also a nice internal drawing on page 10 showing how everything is arranged

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
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    Sounds like you got things covered pretty good, one thing to add about putting the machine on it's side, when you pull the cover off, the oil in there can suck thrust washers off and the shafts, so using gravity and working slowly a lot of times you can keep things more together. I've only taken apart the 200ES sub trans for parting out which is the shaft drive version of the same base engine. Never had a 200E or 200M yet.

    If your chain cover is in good shape, I'd say to clean up the chain path well while you're replacing everything, and be sure to reinstall it again after the new chain is in place. Yea it's a bit of a pain to lube the chain etc, but it keeps a ton of dust off the chain, so the chain should last so much longer, heck the one on your machine is likely the orig. My 99 350 warrior has been though something like 6 chains, but it's rode in dusty/sandy areas, and also muddy areas. I really love shaft drive because you just have to change oil once in a while and it's pretty much set and forget, kind of like a car/truck diff.
    Last edited by ps2fixer; 05-22-2019 at 01:13 AM.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    Sounds like you got things covered pretty good, one thing to add about putting the machine on it's side, when you pull the cover off, the oil in there can suck thrust washers off and the shafts, so using gravity and working slowly a lot of times you can keep things more together. I've only taken apart the 200ES sub trans for parting out which is the shaft drive version of the same base engine. Never had a 200E or 200M yet.

    If your chain cover is in good shape, I'd say to clean up the chain path well while you're replacing everything, and be sure to reinstall it again after the new chain is in place. Yea it's a bit of a pain to lube the chain etc, but it keeps a ton of dust off the chain, so the chain should last so much longer, heck the one on your machine is likely the orig. My 99 350 warrior has been though something like 6 chains, but it's rode in dusty/sandy areas, and also muddy areas. I really love shaft drive because you just have to change oil once in a while and it's pretty much set and forget, kind of like a car/truck diff.
    Yeah I heard the chain drives were a bit of a pain before I bought the bike, I bought it anyways because it was in decent shape for the price and it came with a truck load of spare parts. Got a new oring chain ordered. Now gonna try and track down the sprockets. If I can find a new chain guard would be nice. The chain guard on this bike is not horrible but starting to rust out on the rear

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
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    4,114
    Yea, all of the chain drives with the sub trans are a bit of a pain. I think most people replace the change with out touching the sprockets ever. If it needs them though, defo want to replace them as it kills a new chain pretty fast, I've done it before and couldn't figure out why the chain wasn't staying tight.

    The 200ES also has reverse which is a nice perk. Besides that, they are very similar machines. I think the 200M I quite similar to the ES too but never owned one to really grasp exactly what's different.

    Not to pitch my parts or anything, but just so you're aware, I make aftermarket ignition switches for your machine, it should have a neutral light, so that sub harness/socket I can make, and I probably stock the whole machine's bulbs as a set if any are blown out. I also make a lot of adapters for people, so you could like remove the stock AUX plug on the front rack and mount up a normal 12v aux like a car has for better access to the 12v to run like GP, Cell charger, etc. Max draw is 15 amps, but only like 20w extra power with the lights on, 70w with lights off, but over 150w can be pulled, it just will drain the battery over time even with your riding it.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    49
    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    Yea, all of the chain drives with the sub trans are a bit of a pain. I think most people replace the change with out touching the sprockets ever. If it needs them though, defo want to replace them as it kills a new chain pretty fast, I've done it before and couldn't figure out why the chain wasn't staying tight.

    The 200ES also has reverse which is a nice perk. Besides that, they are very similar machines. I think the 200M I quite similar to the ES too but never owned one to really grasp exactly what's different.

    Not to pitch my parts or anything, but just so you're aware, I make aftermarket ignition switches for your machine, it should have a neutral light, so that sub harness/socket I can make, and I probably stock the whole machine's bulbs as a set if any are blown out. I also make a lot of adapters for people, so you could like remove the stock AUX plug on the front rack and mount up a normal 12v aux like a car has for better access to the 12v to run like GP, Cell charger, etc. Max draw is 15 amps, but only like 20w extra power with the lights on, 70w with lights off, but over 150w can be pulled, it just will drain the battery over time even with your riding it.
    Sounds interesting I’ll have a look at your links. Yeah I wouldn’t mind picking up a es eventually, maybe when I get back working again. For now I’m doing this e up a bit for fun. Gonna ride it all summer then I’ll probably strip it down to the frame over the fall and clean it up good. I like projects

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
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    4,114
    Sounds good, my most active area is my ebay account at https://www.ebay.com/sch/atcrider201...?_trksid=p3692

    Not everything I do is listed there, out of stock on a fair bit of stuff and I make harnesses, just haven't tried the big red ones. The 82-83 harnesses I think I could make, just figured making a new one being fairly complex would be more expensive than most would be willing to spend (like $200-250 for ball park guessing). I'm fairly cheap when I'm buying parts, and if I saw something like that, I'd probably stick with used because of the price.

    I really need to make a page to show case some of the projects I've done for people on my website(s) (http://atcfixer.com for basically my ebay parts, http://atvmanual.com for tech info, wire diagrams etc, work in progress, and my kind of dead project http://atvinterchange.com for interchange notes). I'm kind of thinking of making the atcfixer my store front, and all info/tech/interchange etc on the manual site.

    Anyway, if the 200E is anything like the 200ES, it's still a ton of fun to ride, even though it's basically a utility machine. The ES was my first three wheeler I got and I dreamed of getting the 250es for the power/suspension. After I got some of them, then I found out about the 350x and was like o.O that's the machine for me, so I have two of them too lol. The ATC250SX is also a great machine, effectively a 250es with no racks and a bit lighter. I ride pretty hard and fast and abuse my work machines (ugliest ones I've picked up lol). Heck I'll dig up my 250es work horse/mudder do w\e with machine. Threw in a bonus pic of my old collection, under the cover is 3 250es big reds and a ton of parts etc, near left is a 250sx, and right is that 200es. Oh can't forget the 350x too, this was the first one I got, really trashed machine, I've replaced a bit on that machine since those photos, still have the bent forks and effectively no brakes though. That tire tread style is on like every 3 wheeler I buy and I hate them lol. Land in the photo is my mom & dad's place.

    Not trying to flex I bought all these machines or anything like that, but if you have any questions about any of the Honda 3 wheelers, I've had nearly all models at some point. Most were in horrible shape, I went nuts buying every cheap 3 wheeler around for like 5 years lol, like that 350x was $280 "non running" aka out of gas. $400 engine later, $100 exhaust and some small parts like airbox lid, new front tire and such and it's a pretty nice rider now.
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    Last edited by ps2fixer; 05-22-2019 at 08:23 AM.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    49
    So basically the es has shaft and reverse? That’s the main difference? I seen a bunch of bikes for sale here locally. One guy has two running 200s but they don’t have reverse either. I’ve been confused with some bikes because people will have listed 200s and it will be shaft. Some people list 200s’ and they’ll be chain. Does the shaft models cause much trouble? I had a 92 300 Fourtrax and I know they’re famous for the rear ends blowing in them and not sealing properly, but not sure the similarities with the 3 wheelers. I’m only starting to get into three wheelers recently. The 250 es is hard to find around here in good shape, they’re all extremely overpriced or beat up badly and still pricey.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
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    You get the high prices with the "highest" models machines, 250r, 250es, and 350x. It took me about a year to find my first 350x, then like a month later I got a second in great shape for $800. Trashed riders were listed at the time for $1500.

    The 200ES is the same basic core engine, just the output section goes into the high/low box, and the output is like further back and the 90 degree adapter to go to the drive shaft is in the middle of the engine. Besides that, no rear suspension, similar front suspension, dash has neutral and reverse lights, same charging system and basically the same harness minus the CDI connector changed (84-85 thing for most models). Shaft drive naturally is less efficient to put power out, so the ES would be heavier from the shaft drive setup, and a bit less power to the wheels, but maintenance wise, just keep the diff full. The ES diff is super huge, I've had like 5 of that year, and only 1 that was bad and the guy never replaced the bearings in it and was still riding it right up until he parked it under a pine tree for what looked like 20 years even though he said it was like 3 years. I have photos of that machine too on here lol.

    The 250ES is a bit of a similar design to the 300 quads, I've heard about that issue with them too, I think the 250ES has the issue probably, but less people hard core mud them to really have it show up. My beater 250es has been in mud over the rear rack several times with no problems, never drained the rear axle tubes or anything like that. I just check the diff fluid once in a while. The SX has a similar design as the ES btw, I put an ES diff and axle in my cousin's SX.

    A lot of people really love the 200x, which is more or less the same engine you have but higher output and some sport related changes (no hi low etc). All the ones I've been around seem to be a joke though. The 250SX is about the same speed, lot heavier since it's kind of built after a utility machine, but has the huge perk of shaft drive. I'm not sure what your riding style is, but the 250SX's around me were pretty common to see for $600-800 for a pretty nice machine when a 250es trashed was going for $1000. My 250sx was $500 and it's only problem is a cracked rear fender, small dent in the gas tank, and the carb needed to be clean. The SX is my 2nd fav machine after the 350x for it's raw power and amazing control/torque. The 250ES is 3rd and probably the 200ES 4th. I'm not a big 250r person for 2 strokes, yea they are fast but it's kind of all or nothing, not my style of riding all the time, and the 200x is like a toy vs the 350x from what I experienced across 4 different machines.

    Anyway, back to the 200 series machines, there's a TON of them, 185, 185s, 200, 200E, 200ES, 200M, 200S, 200X and they go into motorcycles too like the XL200. That basic engine design has been in use for ages and ages, so really I'd half expect some parts from modern machines could be made to work on the other engines, or just cheat and do an engine swap if the mount locations are similar. All of the models above are chain drive except the ES. The E and M are chain drive with high and low. Pretty sure all of them have no reverse except the 200ES which the sub trans is where the reverse gear is located in. I don't know the history of the engine that well, but I suspect it was designed as a motorcycle engine orig and found it's way into the 3 wheelers. Not a bad engine design, seems to be reliable and built like a tank, just don't expect huge power unless you're modding things etc. The 250es/sx feels like 50% more power/torque even though on paper it's a lot less, like my 200es I'd drive around more or less floored to take off, while the 250es I only do that when I'm screwing around. The 350x you can't do that, you'll be flipped over laying on the ground if you held it floored lol (I use grippy tires, so grab and go).

    Not to bash the 200 models or anything, but personally the only machines I buy for keeps are 250cc and up for 3 wheelers. They have enough power to drive hard and slide the rear end around corners via power in sand vs like my 200es where if it starts to tip, it doesn't have enough guts to spin the tires to go flat again, so you have to use the brakes. Probably sounds weird, but that's how I drive my 350x, if I don't lean enough for a corner, I just goose the gas a bit to break the back tires into a slide. Never wiped out from going around a corner on a 3 wheeler though. Only once screwing off more than I should have on my 250sx in the winter going about 30 (the 3 wheelers plant and stop now, no rolling after you like a quad, just remember to jump when it's beyond saving). All the other times I had problems was when I was still learning them on the 200es, ran up the back side of my leg a few times, hint, don't stick your leg out like a dirt bike rider would want to do, either lean or adjust to save it, or jump tuck and roll. Really depends on the situation though. I've been hurt more on quads (nothing major at all) than 3 wheelers, and I grew up on a 350 warrior since I was 12, started riding 3 wheelers around 15 or 16 and said forget the quad lol.

    Learning the tipping point of a 3 wheeler is kind of a key thing if you want to push your machines for speed and such, riding around on two wheels and such should help with that if you're up for a challenge. I can throw my body weight and generally ride around a circle a time or two on 2 wheels pretty much at any time given enough space, just do it at low speeds and what you learn should translate into higher speeds just fine. I am one of the younger members here to, so I get if you're not looking to drift corners and stuff =).

    I just noticed you're in Canada, I suspect you'd probably love a 250es or 250sx up there. The ES stock does have 25in tires, would help a bit in the snow, SX stock is 22in. Final gear ratio (engine rpm vs distance traveled) is the same on the two machines more or less. Putting ES parts in a SX makes it into a lower geared wheelie machine though.

    Here's a vid, even has a 200es in it. Guy could use hitting higher gears more like when he tries a donut, shift in 2nd gear, rev it some and let the shifter down to get those tires cleared out lol. The 200ES guy rides more like me, but I know how to wheelie a 200es, you need 2nd or 3rd gear low range, you shift it into the gear (down, it's reverse logic, down to up shift) and let the shifter up to put power to the wheels with it rev'ed. The 250SX and wheelie on it's own by just leaning back.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tX5-lxi4i8Q

    Short vid of someone actually doing something with a 250sx to kinda show the power

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fd6fpPcVkY

    Here's a 350x to compare to =). Clearly I avoided perfectly rebuild or race machines, to give a real idea what the average one is like. This guy needs to work the carb over or learn to start the 350x though, mine starts in 2-3 kicks in winter normally. It's hard to describe a 350x, there's nothing else like one at all. The closest description I've seen and experienced is the 350x does exactly what you tell it. You want to wheelie, blip the throttle, want to flip over, hold it. It doesn't have reverse, and is a manual clutch like sports quads, but I grew up on a sports quad so wasn't a problem. Also yes they have plenty of power at idle to be in first gear and idle along just fine. Watching these vids makes me want to ride my 350x now lol.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LY3YcSCbOCY&t=115s

    Here's a 200es on cement, I was doing wheelies in loose sand though. Pretty similar, just he doesn't use the shifter trick. Doesn't seem to lean enough for the turns too, but cement riding on a 3 wheeler is way different than dirt/sand etc.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZtm0jJdyTU

    All the 3 wheelers are a blast, I even rode around on a 1976 ATC90 for a while and an 1984 ATC70 that was like brand new. The 70 had pretty good get for being such a tiny machine, lean back just a tiny bit and it would wheelie pretty easy lol. My little sister had a blast on it till she turned a corner too fast and it flopped over in the sand. Freaked her out and she wouldn't ride it much after that. She was like 8, didn't get hurt or anything like that. She still loves riding atv's to this day, and still doesn't really get on 3 wheelers much.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Location
    Canada
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    49
    Cool man, ill check those videos out this evening! I have been looking for a 250es for a long time now, usually its sold before i get the chance to look at a good one. They seem to be very popular around here. I'm not into the racey ones very much, but i do like the traditional utility style trikes. I got the oring chain on the way, but am having a hard time sourcing the front sprocket and rear sprocket around here. I was saddened to see that the local honda dealership no longer carries the sprockets and only have one outsource for getting the sprockets to me but it is pricey! Out of curiosity are the sprockets heat treated by any means? I'm learning lathes in some of my classes in college and could probably fabricate up that front sprocket, just not sure if it would last haha! I've looked at some sources from in the states to get the sprockets up to me, but i'm finding shipping costs are more then the parts themselves. Time to go poke back at the bike!

    Also do you guys have a good way to tell if a sprocket is completely worn? I got a spare set of sprockets that came in my spare parts pile, one of them looks very newish but i can't tell if its worth throwing on for a while or not.

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