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Thread: Woods and general riding pipe

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    VA Beach
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    63
    Quote Originally Posted by bkm View Post
    This is an excellent woods setup. This pipe is comparable to a DG or Cobra and probably made by the same company like Power Pros. Any of these stamped type pipes work very well in a woods situation. With the money being asked, you'd be hard pressed to find a better deal for your intended use.
    I’ve read multiple opinions about FMF & DG being junk, compared to the ones I originally mentioned. I’m hard pressed to spend $225 with shipping on the one offered, when I don’t even want the silencer. After spending another $150 to have it ceramic coated, I’m $375 deep in a pipe that I can’t find any info on. I can get an ESR ATC5 for $300, to my door.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    House Springs MO
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    5,496
    Quote Originally Posted by Insanity Plea View Post
    I’ve read multiple opinions about FMF & DG being junk, compared to the ones I originally mentioned. I’m hard pressed to spend $225 with shipping on the one offered, when I don’t even want the silencer. After spending another $150 to have it ceramic coated, I’m $375 deep in a pipe that I can’t find any info on. I can get an ESR ATC5 for $300, to my door.
    I've been in the liquid 250r game for 30 years and have owned multiple pipes from PT, Selvy, Fmf, ESR, CT, Bill's, Coffman, and ESR.

    For all around riding on a stock cylinder the FMF/Bills, CT, and Coffman pipes were the best in that order in my opinion. All the others fit like shite and were mostly mid, to top end pipes, unless you can find a PT type 6 pipe, but good luck.

  3. #18
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    The Open Road
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    4,729
    I would just buy a new pipe if you don't think it's economically sound. No sense spending as much to ceramic coat a used pipe as it cost to buy the pipe to begin with unless it has collector value. Most used aftermarket pipes in solid shape are minimum $150+ range. The days of cheap trike stuff are long gone. Last time I shipped a pipe, it was $30 and that was 17 years ago. I'm not sure how much Kenny Roberts paid to ship the pipe he built for me but I'll bet it's much higher now

    As for reviews, you can ask the internet or you can ask people who've actually run a few different pipes before they decide they have the experience to determine what's junk or not. I would estimate 70% of internet opinions, especially outside of this site, are people who are regurgitating third and fourth hand information, sometimes from 1991, mostly to make themselves look more knowledgeable. Sometimes, it's much simpler. Like firearms, people like to blame the equipment when they suck at using it. "My Remington 700 with Leupold glass won't hit the broad side of a barn. Remington is junk". In reality, they simply can't shoot accurately but they blame the equipment in online forums or on the largest collection of internet experts, Facecrack. Then forty two other guys who never owned a 700 in their lives take every opportunity to tell the world how 'junk' Remington is and suddenly #junk700 is trending.




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    Last edited by ironchop; 07-22-2019 at 11:58 AM.

  4. #19
    Mosh is offline I'm the one with all the 2 stroke around here! The day begins with 3WW
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
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    na
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    5,702
    IMO the term " woods pipe" only has relevance to certain machines that lacked low end grunt and good running 85-89 250R does not fall into the realm from my experience. On the quad that had a little more weight, with a stock engine, those did have some "woods pipes " available, but they signed off really fast on the top end...Mostly lower cc 2 stroke dirt bikes and the Banshee/Blaster were what that term was meant for, and most of those pipes focused on low end grunt with good mid torque, but signed off on top end. On the ATC250r most DG's were always reported as near stock in performance, but a slight upgrade, mostly just a weight saver that was very inexpensive. FMF fatty pipes are great for low to mid hit with "okay" over rev on stock and mild engines, but will choke out a built engine. However I owned one that had a wicked port job and I ran that FMF from trails to MX to drags and it performed everywhere, except at the top end where that engine could still pull, the fatty choked it back..
    Woods setup, has a lot more going on than just a pipe. Typically, most woods riders prefer low end grunt combined with wicked mid range pull as top end does not really get used in tight woods and trails. For that the FMF fatty is a good pipe. Paul Turner Hi-revs and type 6 pipes are awesome, but a type 6 really can be snappy on a ported engine. Not a bad thing, but many riders may find the midrange hit very violent and abrupt. Personally I like that feeling..
    For me, bumping up the compression slightly with a 89CR 250 head gasket, V force reeds, and FMF Fatty, PT or ESR, all are great pipes for woods and trails. The ESR was always a great pipe, and the older models were built like a tank, and did not dent as easy as most other brands..Some matching port work will make any of those pipes shine. Gearing can come into play as well, but I always found with 20 inch or smaller tires, 13/38 gearing was good all around. Taller tires may want you to drop to a 12/38 gearing to keep your low end torque feel with the bigger tires. Also a good pwk 38 mil carb will make a host of difference over a stock R carb, although the 86 PJ carb was not terrible.
    Last edited by Mosh; 07-22-2019 at 12:29 PM.
    Here is where my long useless list of stuff nobody cares about should go...


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  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    VA Beach
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    63
    All great info, thank you for the replies. When searching for info I look for posts from the guys who chime in often and seem to know what their speaking of first hand, mostly looking on this forum for info. That’s why I’m quick to say “from what I’ve read”.
    When I refer to “woods pipe”, I’m simply referring to my riding terrain is mostly woods, with an occasional long stretch of field. No dune riding on the East Coast. A snappy mid range would be perfect, I’m running 18’s. Low end is fine as it is, coming of corners or breaking out into a field is why I stated strong mid range is preferred.
    I love remingtons, my ole 1100 magnum has knocked down a many deer!

    Nothing against that Answer pipe, I would have been fine with paying $150 shipped for just the pipe, no silencer. But it’s a package deal only.

    In my googling, I’ve found ESR, FMF and I think DG are the only pipes left to buy new. Am I missing any others that are in the $300-$450 price range. I kick myself for not jumping on the PT Hi Rev that sold on Ebay last week, I didn’t know if bottom end would suffer with it.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    House Springs MO
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    5,496
    I hated my PT Hi-Rev on my stock cylinder. It was too on/off and fit absolutely horrible. On the Pro-x cylinder, it was great though. I actually took it off and put my FMF back on while I ran my stock cylinder.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    VA Beach
    --
    63
    Quote Originally Posted by bkm View Post
    I hated my PT Hi-Rev on my stock cylinder. It was too on/off and fit absolutely horrible. On the Pro-x cylinder, it was great though. I actually took it off and put my FMF back on while I ran my stock cylinder.
    I’ve actually read the same thing several times about the hi rev on stock cylinder. The next size up on my cylinder will be +1.0, and I’ll have some mild porting done, mostly clean up with a little better direct flow. I’m not racing so want to keep durability over all out power. I’ll be the first to admit that I over think my performance needs for riding style.

    Does the FMF have a good fit, and can they still be bought raw? I see plenty of nickel and chrome fattys, a few golds available. Any preference over the three? I’m a fan of ceramic coating, my dad always has his headers coated on the race car and they look great for years.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    House Springs MO
    --
    5,496
    I actually had the gold series nickel on a slightly cleaned up cylinder with a CR250 head gasket and rechambered head. I ran a few different carbs, but the stock 34mm carb always seemed to run the best everywhere in the power range. I then switched to a Bill's pipe that moved the powerband up a tad, then a CT mid range, then a Coffman. I knew a big bore cylinder was going to be in my future so I bought a PT Hi-Rev. It was just too peaky on the stock cylinder, so I went back to the FMF.

    When I went to the 310 cylinder, the PT shined and for giggles I tried an ESR ATC5, but honestly noticed no difference except that my foot hit it when i started the bike, so I went back to the PT.

    For "cool" factor, the CT and Coffman pipes looked the part and fit nicely. The FMF, CT, Bill's, and Coffman pipes all fit the best. I don't remember the ESR much because I only had it a month or so before I traded it back to a buddy, but I remember the stupid PT lower mount like it was yesterday. It just plain fit like shite.

    With anything though, it all comes down to preference. I think the FMF gets an undeserved bad reputation because it's mass produced and doesn't have the "vintage cool" factor, but for me, it was a great pipe, but your mileage may vary. I was also about 75 lbs lighter back in those days too.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    VA Beach
    --
    63
    I purchased a new ESR ATC5, haven’t mounted up yet. I’m surprised they don’t have a tag on it, I kinda think of it as free advertisement that they’re missing out on.
    The day after I ordered, I also snagged an FMF Gold in good shape off eBay for $85 shipped!

    Work days are long until the fall, after I get a couple good runs on both, I’ll post back on my opinions for those who stumble across this thread and are interested.

    Thanks to all of you who shared your experiences and offers, much appreciated.

    Scott

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