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Thread: Construction Contracting... Who does it

  1. #1
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    Construction Contracting... Who does it

    Back story.... In the early 90s I left machining and got a job as a commercial/industrial Carpenter and learned steel framing, drywall, drywall finishing, drop ceilings, wood framing, etc.

    Also, I worked for a couple of home improvement contractors and had my own roofing sub crew and a drywall hanging sub crew for a time I also learned plumbing, electrical, insulation, roofing (shingles only and associated flashing, drip edge etc), siding.

    As a sub, I did carry liability insurance and was bonded however I was not a fully licensed contractor so I stayed subbing. We were very successful until my partner shot his brother in law during a drunken fight and the business was dissolved to pay for his attorneys. I took my half and went to work for a major commercial contractor in Indianapolis for a time. Eventually, I got tired of being laid off so I packed up my family after taking a job as a machinist for a major V-twin aftermarket manufacturer.

    Investor demands for ever-increasing quarterly profits, hidden inflation, and the flood of cheap labor, locally, coupled with advancements in CAD/CAM tech is strangling the wages of fellows like myself. It's just completely uninspiring, as well. I refuse to go into debt at 48yrs old to go back to college, so that's not even on the table. Local trade schools have all added useless class credit requirements to the core curriculum so that they can charge you more for an associate's degree. I'll pass on trade school as well.

    That leaves me with taking matters into my own hands, so I've decided to go back into business for myself.

    My wife just started a sales career with a national roofing company. She specializes in insurance storm damage claims. As a part of her contact with potential customers, she's received several requests for a reference to a good contractor to fix the damage inside the house or just general general home improvement work. She's probably referred about $2500 of work to me just this week. I feel like I'd be dumb to pass this up. I've always received a profound amount of satisfaction when I was working construction whereas the honeymoon for being a machinist wore off in 1993 and only occasionally rears its head. Mostly, when I'm making parts for my own personal projects

    I do still have quite a bit of construction tools and I'm looking for a good used pickup and my son, who programs a CNC Plasma table for the company I work for, is interested in jumping into this with me as well

    So.......... Shep or anyone else who is a licensed contractor, I'm soliciting advice. If there is something you wish someone told you when you started contracting, post it here.

    If you're from Kentucky, is like to know about what the licensing test contains and since I live 20 minutes from Portland Tennessee, I'm wondering if I should get licensed in two states as I assume that's probably the law.

    So, yeah I can go read a website about the requirements but I'd also like some advice from other contractors here if you don't mind chiming in.

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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
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    My advice chop if this is the route that you choose.
    Keep your work about the customer and not the profit.
    Return customer phone calls
    Never put a projected customer off longer than 2 business days, at least a phone call
    Never ever turn down work, even if you don’t know how to do something. You can always learn or contract the job for a commission.
    Be honest with your customer. I have learned to do my homework before hiring any contractor for any job so at least I know if they are trying to bull**** me. Remember there are thousands of other folks that do what you are doing.
    Set yourself apart from the others, however that may be. Quality, honesty, willingness. Selling yourself is just as important as selling your services.
    My son just drafted this email for projected customers for his business. This is what we believe and hold ourselves to it.

    Hello,

    I would like to introduce myself to you and (business name here). My name is Jonathan Spencer, my father and I own and operate a small business in the area. Spencer Services specializes in hard surface floor care and wood floor refinishing. Both of us also work full time with me being a manager at a local manufacturing plant and my father at a church in Davenport.

    Our mission and purpose as a small business is to provide high quality work, unbiased service recommendations, and provide value to the local community. With that in mind we have seen a gap in the local community in the area of floor care and refinishing. With a combined 50 years of experience we have acquired both the tools and knowledge that can benefit organizations such as (business name here).

    We extend this letter as an introduction to our services within the community. We offer favorable rates to churches and other non profits as we understand the economics that guide non profit organizations. We also extend this introduction as a small business that understands the value of having someone local who can be reached out to for unbiased recommendation of what is best for the organization. Whether that be in the form of proper cleaning techniques, supply recommendations, and evaluation of the current state of the facilities.

    We would great enjoy hearing from you and have the opportunity to earn your business. Please feel free to reach out with questions and how we can be of service to you.

    Best Regards,

    Jonathan Spencer

    A good friend of mine retired from ups and planned on flipping houses something he always did on the side since high school. Started doing odds and ends for folks he knows. Years later he’s so busy he can’t get to everything that he wishes to. So instead of hiring people he gets to pick and choose his jobs.
    He’s honest, reliable, a nice guy and affordable.
    Last edited by DAM shop; 11-17-2019 at 09:22 PM.
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
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    East of Worcester ma
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    Ah, well my best advice is to keep the business small- meaning don’t have a crew. When u start hiring guys or just one other helper, workman’s comp/ health insurance and insurance you need so an employer can’t sue “you” if he/she gets hurt comes into play. Not to mention the paperwork at taxtime quadruples.
    I’ve got just the minimum general liability insurance I need to be legal. I pay about $650 per yr. it’s only gone up $150 dollars in the last 15yrs. (Never needed it) I’ve been lucky I guess.
    If you stay a small enough business/ every dollar u earn is yours well except what the taxman takes. About 15% here in ma. So Cash jobs are nice to have now and then. My health insurance is through my wife so it works out there.
    I worked with my dad and grandfather right out of high school, but been on my own the past let’s see about 19yrs, people ask me all the time why I haven’t grown my business well I’ve learned enough from other contractors that have failed not too over the yrs.
    I’ve honestly never had business cards or advertised anywhere, it’s/I’m just kept busy by word of mouth really.
    If you had to ask my yearly salery well it depends on who’s asking
    I’ve turned down many jobs cuz I’m just me/yes I could probably build most anything “but” I’ve found people’s patience doesn’t last forever. I try to keep my largest job size at max 3-months.
    I’m finishing up a job this Wednesday and two of there friends have already contacted me that they want work done also.. GOOD. And right now I’ve got work until mid April/ but will lose a few jobs between now and then too. It works out most of the time though.
    Yes there is slow times too but there hasn’t been a lull in work for a couple yrs now.
    Um think that’s about it,
    It’s great being your own boss “but” remember no-one pays you on days off.
    My dads been a town building inspector for 20yrs now so he answers any questions I may have on occasion.
    He can’t or isn’t supposed to inspect my work but I do find myself “over” building some jobs because he does do surprise visits to my jobs now and then.
    There’s not too many that enjoy there job but well I like mine kinda most days I guess.
    So good luck, and hope any of this helps even though I just keep rambling on.....

    Oh
    One more thing / learn how to plaster (skim coat) I always hire the same guy but if I learned how to yrs ago it’d be more $ in my pocket now. Like when it’s slow I do tile work also it’s just not my favorite thing but it pays the bills.
    You’ll learn to hate drywall jobs I gotta spend the next 3-days a couple hrs a day muddlng/ sanding this job (pic) nice 4’x10’ bay window install though. Two wks pay (cash) just labor and they’re hard to work for so ya gotta charge a lil extra so the job doesn’t drive you nutz (homeowner is a dink) putting it nicely...
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    Shep
    Most likely I’ll edit this later to fix many things or maybe not
    Last edited by Shep1970; 11-17-2019 at 10:01 PM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2006
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    DAM Shop.... Thanks man. Solid advice. Your sons intro letter is fantastic and a fantastic idea.

    I admire your craft. I was a carpenter/super for a company called FCA and they built those Lifetime Fitness centers. It was very interesting watching the contractor that laid down the basketball and racquetball court flooring. Unfortunately, the building wasn't sealed and it rained for two weeks straight which buckled that floor pretty bad before they got a chance to begin finishing it. Took a week to dry out that flooring using machines before it laid down flat again

    Shep.....I forgot about my tile experience. Thanks for bringing that up.

    I actually like drywall with the exception of hanging ceilings now that I'm older and sanding topping compound kind of sucks. I'm a pretty good gypsum mud slinger but have zero experience in plaster. I hung million of square feet residential and nearly that much commercial. Commercial is good because you almost never do ceilings and when those firewall need hanging, that's double layer both sides of the wall so it's twice the sq ft. I also neglected to add my substantial paint, and caulk experience, Fire blocking, and a little bit of EIFS experience too . I did do some carpet laying and floor tile of the flexible variety beside ceramic style back in the day. I don't care for carpet laying though. Hung thousands of sq ft in FRP panel too.

    This weekend I finished mudding a repair I did on one of our bedroom windows. The PO had added on a two car attached garage to the side of the existing house and they left the windows in that end of the house so they looked out into the garage..... Which is dumb. I pulled the windows out and framed them in (scabbed in some nailer wood because they are already framed to be load bearing), insulate, sheetrock, finished, and painted.

    I really enjoy doing construction. I get a sense of accomplishment that I don't get from making a single part for a much bigger assembly that I'll likely never see in some local factory.

    Pics aren't the greatest. Just proof that I started and finished the task. My landlord reimburses me for the work I do on the house, so that's been nice. He never comes over so I just send pics and collect a check or prepay rent with the proceeds. I got a year ahead in rent a few years back just doing improvement and repairs around here. That was a great year!



    Guys, thanks for the replies... Yes, the mesh tape in the pic doesn't extend the joint far enough but I did correct that after I took that pic so it's all good now

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    Last edited by ironchop; 11-17-2019 at 11:29 PM.

  5. #5
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    Aug 2015
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    Idaho
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    Hey chop, first of all-good luck! Secondly, if you want to set yourself apart from most everyone, else.....just be on time and do what you say you’re going to do.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    new england
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    U have the skills, motivation and referral system
    Do it

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Leander TX
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    "Return customer phone calls
    Never put a projected customer off longer than 2 business days, at least a phone call "

    Do this and you'll be ahead of 95% of contractors based on my experience in San Antonio TX.

    If you love the work and can make enough money to support your family, hobbies, and fund retirement you should do it!
    At 48, you should have an exit plan - that is, when/how are you going to retire. Or if you get hurt. Bummer, I know, but I turned 50 this year and reality is hitting me hard lately.
    A good contractor can make enough $ to do this.

  8. #8
    Scootertrash's Avatar
    Scootertrash is offline Just Too Addicted: Protecting Our Community The day begins with 3WW
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    I was on my own for a few years in the early 2000's till the wife was diagnosed with MS

    Always have a contract that defines the scope of the work to be completed and a payment schedule. Always! Family, friends, neighbors, etc. Money makes people weird. The only people I've never gotten a contract from is my parents, but they don't get charged for my work either

    I don't know about your state, but Minnesota requires a pre-lien notice in 10 point or larger bold font, explaining that the customer has the right to withhold payment for materials until proof of payment has been provided (typically a lien waiver from the company providing the materials) or pay for said materials and deduct the cost from the final billing.

    Contractor licensing is a joke. Anybody can pay around 200.00 to take a class so you pass the licensing exam. When I got my license there were 50 people in my class, only 3 had any construction experience, all but 2 passed the exam (seems to me it should be a bit tougher). A license doesn't make you a good contractor. That said, it can be a benefit having one.

    I still have people I did work for 15 years or more ago call me back for more work or referring friends and family to me.

    Good Luck to you, you'll do well.

    One other thing: Remember construction has been booming for quite a few years now, there'll be another slow down in the near future, make sure you're prepared for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by fabiodriven View Post
    Trick the people into thinking they're enacting their own will and you have willing slaves.

    Liberalism suspends the intellect of its victims, while at the same time tricking them into believing that they're smarter than everyone else.


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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2016
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    East of Worcester ma
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    Soooo chop, hows the self-employment route going? I’m running out of inside woodwork, so hopefully these 4 bathroom tile jobs (two small two larger jobs) will keep me going at least till the end of March maybe....but I’ll have nothing but sore knees and lower back until there done. Just started 1st one. Click image for larger version. 

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    Yes I’m trying to change subjects from political thread....
    Springs coming!!!!
    Shep

  10. #10
    stoshu is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerFirst time rider
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    Just finished this job out at Lake Of The Woods. Kept 3 of us busy for 86 hours over 3 weeks. Doubled my usual price, and the owner accepted immediately. Found out later his quote from the locals was double my quote. Still walked away with over $40 000 after expenses and wages. I can live with that. Still have the decks and a boathouse to building the spring.
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  11. #11
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    You'll rock this venture Doug, like you do with all your endeavors! You have quite the pedigree of experience but I was wondering if a niche market exists for installing ICF foundations (Styrofoam block) in your neck of the woods? It's pretty common in Canada and makes the "greenies" happy from an energy efficiency standpoint.

    Good luck, bud!
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  12. #12
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    Neat thread, seems like the advice here is already solid and some even applies to me xD.

    One thing that people don't like to talk about, but it should be atleast monitored is where the money goes. Doesn't matter if you make $10k/year or $1m/year, if you blow it all you made $0. It's good to get investments rolling and think about your future, doesn't matter what age you are. Not saying don't have fun, just budget it into the money (I've seen give 10% to your "fun" fund).

    Of course the other big one is, stay out of debt, but it seems you already have that covered. Net worth is a neat thing to look at, just don't let it get you depressed because around 15% of people are at a net worth of less than $0. The scale of the graph is really bad but I can't find a better one. BTW this is 2016 data.




    Here's a better image with a better sense of scale. Pretty much anyone that owns their own house and has little to no debt should easily be in the top 50 percentile.



    Image source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wealth...stribution.png

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2004
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    olean n.y
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    contracting

    ive been in construction over 20 years and ive been on my own for 10 the key is to stay small and do quality work, have good comunication. i dont advertise much just word of mouth in my area keeps me very busy. heres a few pics of some recent projects
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  14. #14
    Scootertrash's Avatar
    Scootertrash is offline Just Too Addicted: Protecting Our Community The day begins with 3WW
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    Quote Originally Posted by thornton View Post
    ive been in construction over 20 years and ive been on my own for 10 the key is to stay small and do quality work, have good comunication. i dont advertise much just word of mouth in my area keeps me very busy. heres a few pics of some recent projects
    Nice tile work! How did you like working with those niches? You're as anal as I am with those, I'm referring to how you carried the pattern/layout thru the niches instead of taking the easy way out and changing up the pattern inside the boxes. I like how you used the floor/seating tile or stone on the sides of the niches.

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    I'll post up some pics of a downstairs bathroom I did last winter.


    ETA: Nice work in all of your pics, not just the tile
    Last edited by Scootertrash; 02-08-2020 at 04:38 PM. Reason: Fergot an RRRRR matey
    Quote Originally Posted by fabiodriven View Post
    Trick the people into thinking they're enacting their own will and you have willing slaves.

    Liberalism suspends the intellect of its victims, while at the same time tricking them into believing that they're smarter than everyone else.


    If we've done business together, please leave me feedback. Thank You!:

    http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthr...t=Scootertrash

  15. #15
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolpool View Post
    You'll rock this venture Doug, like you do with all your endeavors! You have quite the pedigree of experience but I was wondering if a niche market exists for installing ICF foundations (Styrofoam block) in your neck of the woods? It's pretty common in Canada and makes the "greenies" happy from an energy efficiency standpoint.

    Good luck, bud!
    Thanks man

    Ive heard of ICF being used down here but a little further north than I am.



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