//ArrowChat Code
Page 21 of 35 FirstFirst ... 11 19 20 21 22 23 31 ... LastLast
Results 301 to 315 of 521

Thread: Who here flips trikes?

  1. #301
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
    --
    4,114
    The ATC200X stator was a little different than the ATC200S (and similar) models. Basically the 200x stator internally grounds, while the 200s the ground is isolated and ran directly to a regulator/rectifier. The 200s stator is safe for a regulator/rectifier, the 200x won't be right since there's a ground on 2 legs of the 4 diodes, one side shorts out, other side generates a half wave rectified DC power. Also the stators put out different wattages, the 200x was 70w while the 200s ones were 50w. You'll want a 45/45w headlight in the 200x headlight if you want the bulb to last assuming it's a halogen style bulb... let me look that up xD. Yep, it uses the H4 style headlight. Here's a light kit that should match up to what your machine would use for bulbs. I kind of got into the lightbulb reselling business since everyone wants to go LED. I like the stock setups since there's no modding required, always plug and play =).

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/202894519059

    If you prefer, you can pay Honda's prices, $35 at the time of this post. You get a made in Japan bulb (Stanly) instead of Taiwan, Korea, or China.

    https://www.partzilla.com/product/ho...fca195fc02db06

    FYI, if the bulb was a standard style bulb like the tail light, then this wouldn't be as big of a deal, but the halogen design works and gets its long life from basically running as hot as possible just before blowing, if it's ran too cool the physics that make it work aren't in spec and the bulb dies sooner.

    Here's a vid on it, sounds about like a infomercial but they mention the physics I'm talking about. Sadly no good diagrams or anything, can't really find much to actually show it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W7I06nvMLM


    @ATC King

    Yea I get the technology has changed so much. I grew up in the middle of that stuff in the 90's. My dad and family are a bit more old fashioned on a lot of things, he has a sunpro tester that has a bunch of stuff, but the main thing of interest is the exhaust gas analyzer since it was a fool proof way to tune a carb, or atleast see exactly how the engine is burning at different rpm's. I suspect there's a hand held version of it by now, this thing is like 2-3 tool boxes wide, and as tall as the biggest snapon boxes. Sometimes the old way isn't bad though, knowing how things actually work instead of having a computer tell you helps you diag problems more accurately. Like there's plenty of people in the automotive world that sees a check engine code for a bad O2 sensor, so they replace it but never look into the root cause, week later or less it gets the same code. Could be leaky fuel injector, or in the case of my Lexus, the vacuum based idle kick up for the power steering pump was sucking power steering fluid into the engine.

    According to Moore's law (computer science view point), technology doubles roughly every 9 months. The old measurement was number of transistors in a processor, but they are hitting an upper limit anymore and the progression has moved in other areas. SSD/NVME is the biggest jump in storage tech in a very long time... like from floppy drives to the internal hard drive type of advancement. Same goes for power usage, same processing power, but reduced power consumption. For the last like 5 years, computers haven't gotten *that* much faster, maybe like 5-20% per year, but power usage and such has had pretty huge gains. My ~8 year old 6 core computer used a 165W cpu if I recall correctly, my ~1 year old computer (maybe 2 year now?) is 8 core and rated 95w, and probably is around double the processing ability. Latest and greatest AMD cpu has had a pretty big jump in processing power, bit more than the other cpus I bought, but the one that catches my eye for performance vs price is 12 core and 105w and it's a whole new design, so power usage and such should drop in later generations. Also the same story goes for physical size, smaller is part of the doubling.

    Sadly there's no true way to measure every thing, so it's harder to say tech is on the same path as Moore's law, but it seems to apply to any industry that isn't heavily regulated where innovation can take place assuming there's enough competition and consumer demand.

  2. #302
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Florida
    --
    1,044
    Wow PS2Fixer, thats alot to follow.

    I grounded the green wire coming from the 200 (no letter) stator to the engine, the black wire red tracer to the matching black wire w/ red tracer, and connect the yellow wire to the yellow wire. the engine ran, the kill switched worked, but no lights.
    So your saying I need a rectifier? or are you saying changing the bulbs will correct the problem? I lost you.
    Thanks
    MrC.
    mrc_builds on YouTube Channel

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmw...confirmation=1


    My Addiction
    85 200m "Tallahassee"
    84 200x "SouthPort"
    84 200x "Van Halen"
    84 250r "lucky"
    85 250sx "Enterprise"
    85 350x "The Money Pit"
    85 350x Code Red
    86 250r "Unicorn"
    86 trx250r
    88 Lt250r Suzuki

    mrc_builds saves trikes like Jimmy Swaggart saved souls back in the day -said Patriot1

  3. #303
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
    --
    4,114
    The atc185, 200, 185s,200s, 200m etc all has the same basic stator type just to be clear on that. You probably work better with visuals like me. I probably should validate some assumptions on my end, you're using the atc200 bottom end with the atc200x harness (including headlight, tail light etc). Green is ground, and that's the major difference between the 200 and 200x stators besides the raw power output. The 200x didn't have a factory ac voltage regulator (just a regulator since no battery to need rectifier) so the power is ate up 100% by the light bulbs, so they are wattage matched. Aka, 200x makes 70w, headlight is 55/60w + 5w tail light, the atc200 is the same system but is effectively the same engine as like a 200e so it's designed for a battery system or ac only. Since it puts out 50w, 45/45w headlight + 5w tail light is what you should have.

    So long story short, you don't need a voltage regulator or rectifier in your case, just need to match the bulb sizes. The voltage regulator could be an upgrade if you want to protect the bulbs, like if the headlight bulb blows, 100% the tail light bulb blows too because it's trying to eat up 50w but can only handle around 5w. The voltage regulator eats up the excess power to regulate the voltage.

    Now for the visuals from the wire diagram on the stator difference.

    atc200x (internally grounded stator, notice one side of the coil goes to the alternator ring and ultimately connects to the ground symbol just above "Eng")




    ATC200 and several others (isolated ground, the green wire hooks directly to the coil, internally the copper coil never touches the engine, also called a "floating ground").



    Basically, it sounds like you hooked up the stator right, the green wire ultimately gets grounded to the engine/frame on both of those machines. On the atc200, it's normally grounded through the ring terminal at the ignition coil. If it had a voltage regulator/rectifier, both stator wires (yellow + green) would run to it for the "AC" in, and the "DC out" would be to the harness green wire and generally red for positive. Here's an atc200es hookup to illustrate that. The machine has two yellow wires, but it's electrically the same stator you have, just a wire color change.



    Now on the subject of lights, if your grounding for the stator is good, you should have lights assuming the bulbs aren't blown. If you have a multi meter, you can set it to AC volts and read across the yellow/green wire. It should read something around 12v at idle and probably 40-80v at higher rpm's (no load so the voltage jumps way up).

    You can also ohm test the bulbs at their hookups to avoid having to take things apart as much, brown to green for the tail light and you should see a connection (near dead short), same goes for the headlight, green + white and green + blue. If the bulbs are good then I'd be looking at your left handle bar controls and making sure the switches pass connection with out issues. Test would be ohms again (or beep mode) and the power source is yellow, brown should be on whenever the light switch is on at all (dim + brights) and the blue should show connection for brights only, and white for dims only. Here's the table from the wire diagram, might be easier to follow than my wordy way of saying it xD.



    By the way, just to get the engine running, all you need is the black/red wire hooked up. The other two are purely lights only. And you're correct that matching the wire colors in your case is the correct hookups. Technically you could ground the yellow wire and hook green to yellow and have the same exact outcome, but that would make things look confusing, but that's the nature of AC, it doesn't flow in one direction, it effectively vibrates back and forth.

    Hopefully that makes a lot more sense, the regulator/rectifier talk was kind of a blanket statement since I wasn't sure what the source engine was from, or which harness you was using. Like if you used an ATC200E/M/ES harness, things would be a little different.

  4. #304
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Florida
    --
    1,044
    PS2fixer, you sir are a asset to the forum.

    Thank you, for taking the time to explain all that. I have ordered the correct bulbs this morning, I will trouble shoot my switch to be sure.
    Yes, For now I am using a complete 200(no letter) engine (with 200x intake) and a complete 200x harness.
    I haven't decided yet to swap in a cam or swap the entire head over.
    I will be running a left handed master cylinder/brake lever and a longer hose to the rear caliper. No brake pedal, I may regret that later.
    For now, I just want to ride it.
    Thank you,

    MrC.
    mrc_builds on YouTube Channel

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmw...confirmation=1


    My Addiction
    85 200m "Tallahassee"
    84 200x "SouthPort"
    84 200x "Van Halen"
    84 250r "lucky"
    85 250sx "Enterprise"
    85 350x "The Money Pit"
    85 350x Code Red
    86 250r "Unicorn"
    86 trx250r
    88 Lt250r Suzuki

    mrc_builds saves trikes like Jimmy Swaggart saved souls back in the day -said Patriot1

  5. #305
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
    --
    4,114
    From a performance point of view, if the 200x has a good top end, swap it over, it provides better cooling. If you swap the piston too, you get higher compression. The compression difference is purely based on the piston, so new aftermarket would be an option too. The 200x cam probably is a little more aggressive too, same with the spark advancer weights. Pretty sure the CDI is just a "dummy box", the pulse generator and the spark advancer should be all or most of the ignition timing.

    I don't really see a problem with the left handle bar rear brake setup, longer hose might be "softer" feeling brakes, but they should function fine that way. Down the road you could always switch to the right foot operated setup if you don't like it.

    There's also some XR200 parts that might interchange over that could be an upgrade, I don't know those machines hardly at all though, but they are generally based on the 200x/200s style platform.

    Also no prob on the tech/electrical stuff, I'm building a website for that kind of stuff, no reason to not post good info on here too lol.

  6. #306
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Florida
    --
    1,044
    She is alive. I don't know why I waited so long to do this.
    On one hand I want them stock, but broken and stock is stupid, when fixed and enjoyed is an option.
    It took a total of 4 hours to revive a old 200 engine and swap it in to the 200x.
    She is very dirty from sitting 6 months in the shop, I may need to keep them covered.
    I will keep the 200x engine, may be I will swap the head/jug and all, but for tonight, I am riding, I forgot just how nice the ride is on a full suspension bike.
    I have grown accustom to the ridged bikes.
    While I wait for parts to complete the brake lever swap, I will install the regulator on the 350x, and hopefully take her out for a spin tomorrow.

    I have attached a picture of an upcoming project, its not on three wheels but its heart was.

    MrC.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 20201026_195356.jpg   20201026_195418.jpg   20201026_203027.jpg  
    mrc_builds on YouTube Channel

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmw...confirmation=1


    My Addiction
    85 200m "Tallahassee"
    84 200x "SouthPort"
    84 200x "Van Halen"
    84 250r "lucky"
    85 250sx "Enterprise"
    85 350x "The Money Pit"
    85 350x Code Red
    86 250r "Unicorn"
    86 trx250r
    88 Lt250r Suzuki

    mrc_builds saves trikes like Jimmy Swaggart saved souls back in the day -said Patriot1

  7. #307
    patriot1 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Palestine, AR
    --
    356
    Just for what it's worth, I enjoy reading PS2fixers everything, no matter how far above my head they are! Kinda like algebra II
    Last edited by patriot1; 10-26-2020 at 09:42 PM.

  8. #308
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Arkansas
    --
    2,196
    Those look like a good tire combination too, on your new Auto-X.

    One of those Kenda front tires is my next trike tire purchase. They look like a great steering tire.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  9. #309
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
    --
    4,114
    Quote Originally Posted by patriot1 View Post
    Just for what it's worth, I enjoy reading PS2fixers everything, no matter how far above my head they are! Kinda like algebra II
    Haha, thanks, I try to explain things in a common language, but electrical can be hard to explain. It's not the greatest view point, but a lot of times you can think of electricity as water. Works fine until you get into more advanced topics like transistors, relays and such.



    The auto x looks fine to me, I never quite understood the hard tail desire. I started on an ATC200ES and yea it was fun to ride, I rode it more than my 350 warrior because of how reliable it was and easy starting. As soon as I upgraded to an ATC250ES, I completely stopped riding the 200ES, it's still sitting today. That's why my personal rule is, 200cc and under is for parts/resell only, 250cc+ is for me and keep. I tried the 200x and wasn't impressed, but I was spoiled with the 350x and I have a bit of a need for speed lol.

    For the gocart build, I'm guessing you'll have to extend the frame to move the rear axle back far enough to get a good angle for the sprocket setup. I can help with figuring out the gearing if you had a machine you like the gearing on, or could go a bit lower geared due to the extra wheel xD.

    I know you kind of already have an engine picked out, but you could have fun building one with an engine like this. This is a general use engine, they sound mean and give great torque. Not a super high rpm engine, but they seem to hold up well. I traded my 200x parts for a generator with one of these engines =). Not 100% what I'll do with the engine, but it sounds like a crappy generator since it's got some garbage exhaust on it like a cheap American designed generator would run. The generator part doesn't work, been thinking about fixing it though, electric start, 9500w.


  10. #310
    jasong_10's Avatar
    jasong_10 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Croghan, New York
    --
    420
    Figured an extensive thread on flipping trikes would be the right place to ask a paint question. Is there a red out there that matches the Honda frame/swingarm red color? I'm doing a refresh on my 87 X and overall the frame/swingarm paint is in great shape other than a couple high wear spots. It's in good enough shape (along with all the factory decals) that I'm not doing a complete tear-down and repaint, but I wondered about touching up the worn spots if I could find a paint that matches OEM.

    Thoughts?
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  11. #311
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Florida
    --
    1,044
    It seems the red changes from year to year. I like the sunrise red by krylon. It's close to the factory red of the 200s and 200es.
    You will have to see it for yourself if its is close enough.

    MrC.
    mrc_builds on YouTube Channel

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmw...confirmation=1


    My Addiction
    85 200m "Tallahassee"
    84 200x "SouthPort"
    84 200x "Van Halen"
    84 250r "lucky"
    85 250sx "Enterprise"
    85 350x "The Money Pit"
    85 350x Code Red
    86 250r "Unicorn"
    86 trx250r
    88 Lt250r Suzuki

    mrc_builds saves trikes like Jimmy Swaggart saved souls back in the day -said Patriot1

  12. #312
    jasong_10's Avatar
    jasong_10 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Croghan, New York
    --
    420
    Quote Originally Posted by MrConcdid View Post
    It seems the red changes from year to year. I like the sunrise red by krylon. It's close to the factory red of the 200s and 200es.
    You will have to see it for yourself if its is close enough.

    MrC.
    Thanks, I'll check it out. What are your thoughts on just touching up the worn spots? It would be nice to have it all red, but I don't want it to end up looking worse than before I started, lol.
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  13. #313
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    USA
    --
    4,114
    If/when you get the paint, spray some cardboard or something with it and let it dry then compare the colors. If you plan to put sealer or anything over it, hit the cardboard with that afterwards too. If it's too far off you'll notice it, if it's more or less a perfect match, spray away (with some prep work).

    One thing to remember, one machine's Honda red won't match another one perfectly, sun fading from the age, and the fact the paint is never mixed 100% perfect at the factory. They are very close but vary some. I'm pretty sure you can go to a paint store and get color matched paint where they mix the paint to match your color.

  14. #314
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Mexico
    --
    9,003
    Talk to any automotive painter and they’ll tell you red is the hardest non-metallic paint there is to match. Even if you do get lucky enough to match it after a few months in the sun and the patched area will be obviously different.

    If you’re really looking to do a nice job consider painting the entire part.
    It sucks to get old

  15. #315
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Surprise AZ. In the garage working on trikes.
    --
    2,502
    LOL.

    I typically do not flip trikes, part them out, sell them out of my collection, and have crashed/rolled them in the dunes. Rolled is close to flipping but I think the only one who truly flipped them was nitro circus.

//ArrowChat Integreation Code //