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Thread: ATC185S 200S DC Conversion for LED

  1. #46
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    Is thre a watt/amp rating for the regulator/rectifier, or the stator specs for the engine it was designed for? The ATC185S puts out a max of 50w (4.2amp @ 12v).

    What voltage do you read at idle with the ac wires disconnected and reading them directly with the meter? Pretty sure it would be a bit higher than 16v, but I don't normally mess with alternators like that. Another option is if you have the stock blubs hook them up to the ac wire to "load" test the circuit to make sure the AC side is putting out what you expect (stock bulbs are 45w + 5w). You should be able to also put the same bulb on the DC side and get a similar load test through the regulator/rectifier. There will be a slight loss as nothing is 100% efficient.

    One odd thing in your pic is you have your meter hooked up right on DC, but it's showing a neg voltage meaning the output is reversed to what it *should* be. Only thing I can think of is it's defective, or you exceeded it's specs.

  2. #47
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    ATC185S 200S DC Conversion for LED

    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    Is thre a watt/amp rating for the regulator/rectifier, or the stator specs for the engine it was designed for? The ATC185S puts out a max of 50w (4.2amp @ 12v).

    What voltage do you read at idle with the ac wires disconnected and reading them directly with the meter? Pretty sure it would be a bit higher than 16v, but I don't normally mess with alternators like that. Another option is if you have the stock blubs hook them up to the ac wire to "load" test the circuit to make sure the AC side is putting out what you expect (stock bulbs are 45w + 5w). You should be able to also put the same bulb on the DC side and get a similar load test through the regulator/rectifier. There will be a slight loss as nothing is 100% efficient.

    One odd thing in your pic is you have your meter hooked up right on DC, but it's showing a neg voltage meaning the output is reversed to what it *should* be. Only thing I can think of is it's defective, or you exceeded it's specs.
    Thanks. I actually just went and checked the reg/rec according to a procedure from another forum and I think my reg/rec is faulty.



    If I check the continuity between the dc prong and each of the AC prongs, one at a time, one gives me 0.0 Ohms and the other prong has no continuity


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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  3. #48
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    That post seems to lack a lot of details, like what a good ohm reading should be so you know what range it should be set in. A low resistance or inf seems like a wide range lol. Meters also have a "diode" test option, typically with the beep setting and it puts out actual voltage to get past a diode (0.7v drop typically). I know you can test diodes fairly easily, but with it being a bit of a black box, I can't really say for sure how to test it. The regulator technically is 4 wire/contacts, 2 ac, 2 dc, just like a Honda regulator/rectifier like off of an ATC200ES. I haven't had any luck with the Chinese ones so I've stuck with OEM or new with real specs provided. The rectifier section is almost always fullwave, it boils down to 4 diodes, very very simple circuit and extremely cheap. It's the voltage regulator that is the more complicated part.

    Besides the 4 wire style regulator/rectifier, there's a 5-6 wire version too, the primary thing to focus on is the number of input pins though, generally yellow wires. 2 = single phase (same as your machine) and 3 = 3 phase which is like an ATC250ES. 3 phase should work, but you need 3x the spec because all of your power is only using one phase of the regulator rectifier. It's a 6 diode bridge rectifier instead of 4 and again a voltage regulator circuit afterwards.

    The voltage regulation on these machines are generally load based, or in other words, short the excess power to ground and generate heat as a byproduct, so specs are pretty important since no load on the system is maxing out the regulator/rectifier since it's sinking the full load to try to stay in the 13.5-14.5v target range.



    Some day I need to dive back into the regulators and try to find a quality source with a good water proof connector and such, maybe from a modern quad that's 3 phase and wire it up for these older machines. The components to build a regulator/rectifier isn't really all that much, the hardest part is sourcing a connector and a suitable housing to sink the heat to (needs to be metal).

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    That post seems to lack a lot of details, like what a good ohm reading should be so you know what range it should be set in. A low resistance or inf seems like a wide range lol. Meters also have a "diode" test option, typically with the beep setting and it puts out actual voltage to get past a diode (0.7v drop typically). I know you can test diodes fairly easily, but with it being a bit of a black box, I can't really say for sure how to test it. The regulator technically is 4 wire/contacts, 2 ac, 2 dc, just like a Honda regulator/rectifier like off of an ATC200ES. I haven't had any luck with the Chinese ones so I've stuck with OEM or new with real specs provided. The rectifier section is almost always fullwave, it boils down to 4 diodes, very very simple circuit and extremely cheap. It's the voltage regulator that is the more complicated part.

    Besides the 4 wire style regulator/rectifier, there's a 5-6 wire version too, the primary thing to focus on is the number of input pins though, generally yellow wires. 2 = single phase (same as your machine) and 3 = 3 phase which is like an ATC250ES. 3 phase should work, but you need 3x the spec because all of your power is only using one phase of the regulator rectifier. It's a 6 diode bridge rectifier instead of 4 and again a voltage regulator circuit afterwards.

    The voltage regulation on these machines are generally load based, or in other words, short the excess power to ground and generate heat as a byproduct, so specs are pretty important since no load on the system is maxing out the regulator/rectifier since it's sinking the full load to try to stay in the 13.5-14.5v target range.



    Some day I need to dive back into the regulators and try to find a quality source with a good water proof connector and such, maybe from a modern quad that's 3 phase and wire it up for these older machines. The components to build a regulator/rectifier isn't really all that much, the hardest part is sourcing a connector and a suitable housing to sink the heat to (needs to be metal).
    Amazon is pretty great tbh they just sent me a new one and I can return the old one within 30 days. So I should know regardless in 2-3 days whether it was bad or not or if itís just not compatible but I mean it should work


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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  5. #50
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    Try the ohm test or whatever that other post was trying to suggest and compare the two of them. If the new one doesn't work I suspect any readings would probably change if it's over loaded.

    Either case, would be interesting if it works long term, atleast another option for a regulator/rectifier for this era of machine.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    Try the ohm test or whatever that other post was trying to suggest and compare the two of them. If the new one doesn't work I suspect any readings would probably change if it's over loaded.

    Either case, would be interesting if it works long term, atleast another option for a regulator/rectifier for this era of machine.
    Will do


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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZacH_GrifF View Post
    Having an interesting issue...
    That regulator may need a battery connected to function. Any vehicle 12v battery will do, use a car battery if that's all you have. Connect the ground to the reg (just to make certain it's a good ground) and the positive to the center terminal. Just be careful if you're futzing around with a car battery without using a fuse in the system, and obviously don't wear rings or bracelets.

    Battery should be above 12.5 when resting and if that reg is operational and the system is charging, you should see mid 13 to mid 14 volts with the engine running.



    BTW, please put a bolt in that fuel tank mount. You're scaring me.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATC King View Post
    That regulator may need a battery connected to function. Any vehicle 12v battery will do, use a car battery if that's all you have. Connect the ground to the reg (just to make certain it's a good ground) and the positive to the center terminal. Just be careful if you're futzing around with a car battery without using a fuse in the system, and obviously don't wear rings or bracelets.

    Battery should be above 12.5 when resting and if that reg is operational and the system is charging, you should see mid 13 to mid 14 volts with the engine running.



    BTW, please put a bolt in that fuel tank mount. You're scaring me.
    I will try that and I already learned why to bolt the tank down this weekend lol. Throttle stuck and I panic grabbed the front brake and I went over the handlebars. Busted the rear fender and the tank came half way off. I landed in soft sand so I didnít get hurt




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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  9. #54
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    Nice. Sounds like you were having a good time. Glad you weren't wadded up.

    Those kinds of crashes are just learning experiences, but my experience has been that I'm a slow learner. I wrung my bell so hard once while crossing up some ruts, I forgot where the hell I was a moment, only knew that I was laying on the ground. My MP3 player got smashed and there was just car horn sounds coming out of the ear buds in my helmet. I was thouroughy confused for a minute.

    It's odd. These carbureted trikes can actually run upside down for quite a while.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATC King View Post
    Nice. Sounds like you were having a good time. Glad you weren't wadded up.

    Those kinds of crashes are just learning experiences, but my experience has been that I'm a slow learner. I wrung my bell so hard once while crossing up some ruts, I forgot where the hell I was a moment, only knew that I was laying on the ground. My MP3 player got smashed and there was just car horn sounds coming out of the ear buds in my helmet. I was thouroughy confused for a minute.

    It's odd. These carbureted trikes can actually run upside down for quite a while.
    I got the new reg/rec in. It tested the same as the old so Iím sure both are actually fine. I had to hook up a battery like you suggested. It now charges about 12.8v at idle and 14.7~ revved up about half throttle. The stock headlight no longer dims at idle so thats a plus. Just have a standard sealed lead acid battery wired up right now. Will be getting a smaller lithium anti gravity battery and making a mount for it once in comes in. Preciate the help guys




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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  11. #56
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    Nice, I knew some regulators don't like being ran w\o a battery, but haven't came across one yet like that so it didn't even pop in my mind as an option lol. I guess I'm spoiled with the OE Honda ones xD.

    Once you get the machine together enough to ride around and such, would be interesting to hear how it holds up after a long ride with lights off and ideally battery fully charged (no draw so max workload for the regulator). It can get warm, but not sure how hot is too hot. Probably hot enough that you don't want to hold onto it. The wiring is probably 80C rated which I'd guess most components inside are rated for or higher. The main limitation should be heat and it looks like the heat sink is a reasonable size.

    Anyway, thanks for reporting back, always good to know what the solution was.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by ps2fixer View Post
    Nice, I knew some regulators don't like being ran w\o a battery, but haven't came across one yet like that so it didn't even pop in my mind as an option lol. I guess I'm spoiled with the OE Honda ones xD.

    Once you get the machine together enough to ride around and such, would be interesting to hear how it holds up after a long ride with lights off and ideally battery fully charged (no draw so max workload for the regulator). It can get warm, but not sure how hot is too hot. Probably hot enough that you don't want to hold onto it. The wiring is probably 80C rated which I'd guess most components inside are rated for or higher. The main limitation should be heat and it looks like the heat sink is a reasonable size.

    Anyway, thanks for reporting back, always good to know what the solution was.
    Iíll update later with how itís holding up. Thanks


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    1. 83 185s: (the money pit) xr200 cam, 200cc cylinder, 10.25:1 piston, 83 250r front end, 450r hubs, full suspension
    2. 85 Big Red 250es: in pieces
    3. 85 200m

    4. 00 Polaris Magnum 325 2x4: stays broke
    5. 02 Yamaha Wolverine 350 4x4: trail bike

  13. #58
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    Sorry to bring back a dead thread. I've been messing with my 81 185s for the last few days. Thought I had received a bad rectifier so got another. But it's giving me the same result. Here is my issue(s)

    18vac input - 6-7vdc output
    Still reading ac voltage on output
    Output does not increase at all with rpms
    Volts drop to 2-3 when small led is turned on like it's shorting

    I've been reading about a floating ground for the first time. I believe this machine is that way from the start(has a dedicated ground wire going to stator). For my wiring I left all original wiring intact because I wasn't aware the factory light would work on DC and I would like to keep it working. I T'd into the yellow/ green wires where the stator harness connects to the main harness and ran my dc wires to a small led light through a separate isolated switch for my headlights. Thats where I'm still showing ac voltage which I feel like is a clear indication my rectifier isn't doing its job.

    Heres the rectifier I used. Specs are "AC Input Voltage: 20-60V Max Watt: 55W Cable"

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B091M...b_b_asin_image
    Thanks for any help!

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZacH_GrifF View Post
    Just have a standard sealed lead acid battery wired up right now. Will be getting a smaller lithium anti gravity battery and making a mount for it once in comes in.

    If I were going to run that expensive of a battery, I'd install a digital volt gauge on the bars to keep an eye on the system. I know they have a BMS, but if something went goofy and the system started charging 15v or more, I'd want to know, pronto. If charging stopped, that'd be OK because of the Re-Start feature on the AG batteries keeping it from going totally flat.


    Just double-checking, I pulled this from the AG site.

    "The maximum voltage the battery should be exposed to is 14.7V. On the lower end of the voltage range the battery should be put on a charger if the battery voltage drops below the 12.5V range while sitting."

    https://antigravitybatteries.com/hel...rical-charging
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  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kcabbie View Post
    I T'd into the yellow/ green wires where the stator harness connects to the main harness...
    That's likely the problem.

    According to the information on that product's page: "Wire: Red to Battery +, Green to Battery -, Yellow and Pink AC input, connect to magneto coil."

    Yellow will still go to yellow, but pink needs to go to the green stator wire. You can't just 'tie' into the harness either, the yellow and green wire from the stator are now both in play and must only feed the reg/rec. All other grounds after that can remain as stock. If you want any DC system to function properly, it also needs an energy storage device, like a battery or capacitor.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

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