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Thread: ATC110 Suspension Seat

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasong_10 View Post
    Ah, I see it now, lol. Boy I feel dumb . ..

    Nothing to feel dumb about. If you've never used or seen one, it's unlikely you'd know what it is.

    Regular tubeless motorcycle tires aren't too bad, but using tube type tires with a tube on spoke wheels (typical for modern street tires), it can be a literal pain trying to get the valve stem through the hole because of the stiffer sidewall and bead of the tubeless tire. It really chews up the hands.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATC King View Post
    Nothing to feel dumb about. If you've never used or seen one, it's unlikely you'd know what it is.
    That's why I do, lol. I manage an auto parts store and have sold those valvestem fishing tools to some of my shops before, haha.
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasong_10 View Post
    That's why I do, lol. I manage an auto parts store and have sold those valvestem fishing tools to some of my shops before, haha.
    Not to argue with your original assessment but are you really thinking about valve stem installers.

    Here's a cable version:


    I have one just like that. Those are for installing rubber valve stems into tubeless wheels. They screw onto the outside of the stem.

    The picture of the one I posted is for pulling valve stems that are affixed onto tubes, through the wheel. It screws into the stem so it's narrow enough to be pulled through the wheel. The hole in tube type motorcycle rims is just wide enough for the stem to fit through, nothing else.

    The rubber stem pullers work, because the hole to hold the base of the rubber stem is wider than the tip. They won't fit through the hole on a motorcycle rim.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  4. #34
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    jasong_10 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
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    Ah, I didn't catch the difference. I still think I should have recognized it, lol.
    .
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  5. #35
    patriot1 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
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    Awesome work King. Very impressive

  6. #36
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    I'm trying to seal these dog toys up, and bought some Flex Seal stuff.

    The directions say to let cure 24-48 hours, so tomorrow I'll put it back together, with just the top sealed. I'm going to need longer Schrader valves, so even though I'll be able to put it back together, I won't know if it's sealed until later.

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    It's not so much they need air pressure to hold the seat up, it's that they feel kind of dead, because it's just the rubber that pushed the seat back up. If that makes any sense. They're like just having suspension bump-stops as springs, so maybe a few pounds of air will give them a little quicker rebound.

    I'd really like to use the TC Bros air springs, but at ~$140 for a pair, meh, that's too much for this project. Maybe on down the road though, or on another build.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  7. #37
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    Homemade air springs from Kongs . . . I applaud you creativity, I wouldn't have thought of that in a thousand years, lol.
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  8. #38
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    Hear ya go, holds air and is great at parties, put a couple of theses under the seat pan.
    MrC.

    I'm just teasing you, I'm about to make a wood seat pan for my 185s
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails whoopee-cushions_9_65a.jpg  
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  9. #39
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    You joke, but if that Flex Paste stuff sort or seals, but not fully, it may very well end up being a farting seat.

    Just the risk I'm willing to take.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  10. #40
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    My back is loving this thread.

  11. #41
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    I finally got around to a completion point on this.

    The Kongs are air tight; I got them to seal. I don't know what pressure I have in them, because the stems are too short to put a gauge on, but I let them sit for a week and they still had pressure. I just used an air blower with a rubber tip to blip a little into them, probably only a couple PSI.

    The air pressure isn't so much for holding up the seat as it is to give it more rebound. In other words, so the elasticity of the rubber isn't doing all the work and feeling kind of dead. Really, just sealing them and using a solid bolt would probably work as well for most people <220lbs.


    The ride is great. It's a little bouncy, but there isn't the dead hit like with just seat foam when it bottoms out. My hinge has too much slack and there's more wiggle in the seat than I'd like, but while riding, it isn't too noticeable. I'd like to link the Kong air valves so they're balanced, but I'll have to wait to get longer valve stems for that, which probably isn't happening even this year.

    Looking at the pics, the Kongs are at an angle front to back. That was to anticipate the angle change of the seat during it's travel. It didn't really work out like I wanted, but it's not a problem. While using the Flex Paste, it was a real challenge to bolt everything together without the washers and bolts squirting out of the Kongs, because the paste acted like a lube. That was the main issue I had while trying to keep the centerline of everything while I tightened the fasteners. It all just kind of went where it wanted.


    Obviously, suspension seats aren't a new concept, even horse drawn carriages had them. This is the first time I've built one for a trike though. Learning from this one, there are several things I'd improve, but to start, I just buy the TC Bros front pivot and air bags.

    http://http://www.tcbroschoppers.com...eat-pivot.html

    http://www.tcbroschoppers.com/air-powered-spring.html

    I've actually been looking pretty hard at my 200ES for this modification, and I think I can do it with a seat height not too much over stock, if I keep the seat foam firm and thin.



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    The story of three wheels and a man...

  12. #42
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    jasong_10 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
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    Kudos to your ingenuity, that turned out great.
    Jason

    85 ATC 250R - restored stock other than 18" rears, nerf bars, Honda key switch, 14T front sprocket, and white tank and plastics (except rad shrouds)

    87 ATC 200X - restored stock other than 18" rears and nerf bars

    84 TRX 200 - rough but complete budget restore for wife and eventually daughters to bum around on

    Eton Viper 50cc - oldest daughter's current ride

  13. #43
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    I like it, I can tell you have a lot of time invested in this one.
    I could see a tractor style spring or even a Harley Davidson seat spring, either of those may lend themselves to keeping the seat lower

    How does the Wal-Mart mat - foam feel as a seat, I need to make one for my 185s
    Thanks
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    My Addiction
    85 200m "Tallahassee"
    84 200x "SouthPort"
    84 200x "Van Halen"
    84 250r "lucky"
    85 250sx "Enterprise"
    85 350x "The Money Pit"
    85 350x Code Red
    86 250r "Unicorn"
    86 trx250r
    88 Lt250r Suzuki

    mrc_builds saves trikes like Jimmy Swaggart saved souls back in the day -said Patriot1

  14. #44
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    It did take some time, but if I built another one, it'd be a whole lot quicker, now that I've sussed out the design.

    Yes, coiled springs would make for a lower height. The pivot would need to be slimmer, closer to the fender, so the seat wouldn't be sloping to the rear. Using the TC Bros weld on set pivot would work well there, and they also sell multiple types of springs. I think some type of damping device would be preferable with steel springs though, so the rider doesn't get bounced off, being this is an off-road application.

    The Wal-Mart sleeping mat foam is dense and pretty stiff. It's going to be a little too much for a regular seat. I've done seats before, using closed cell foam blocks, and they were too stiff as well. It'd be good for a base, maybe a couple layers thick, then softer on top of that. The stock ATC seats are pretty squishy and thick, if you like them like that. You can still buy 185S seat foam, already formed, and in different densities. I'd just go with that. Check out Hi-Flite: http://hi-flite-usa.com/

    I have a usable 185S seat foam if you want to go that route and just use a cheap Ebay cover. PM me if you want to work that out.
    The story of three wheels and a man...

  15. #45
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    well done..............novel fix! What is the licensing fee to re-pop?

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