LT500 motor in 3-wheeler?

[DixiePlowboy]

Has anyone mocked it up....or eyeballed setting a Quadzilla engine in a liquid R, a Z, or a second generation Tecate chassis?

The Suzuki motor looks to be large(or at least long) for a swap of this nature, but I've been daydreaming about this since acquiring my Zilla. Off the top of my head, I would like it in a Tri-Z more than the others.....but who knows..

[code200k]

go for it i would to see it in a Z...never seen it done before

[Bryan Raffa]

your 13yr old would be pissed.... but hey,,, he'll get over it ...

[Orangecnty250r]

Man I never thought of that build...When did suzuki kill the rm 500?

[DixiePlowboy]

your 13yr old would be pissed.... but hey,,, he'll get over it ...

LOL! He actually loves the idea, but either on another Z or else he gets to keep it if I turn his into a Tri-Zilla.

Seriously though, his (and his brother's) are in Michigan and the boys are down here with me till Sunday, so I can't set them side-by-side and size them up until summer. Aside from the obvious cost of having a custom pipe fabbed up, I don't know just how much frame modding would be necessary....I'm guessing quite a bit. My friend and neighbor has a full shop and custom builds rail buggies from straight tubing and plate steel, so I don't consider this an impossibility.

.....just don't know how practical it would be. Sounds cool, though.

OC250r,

I'm only finding info on RM500's in 1983 and 1984.....both air cooled motors.

[3Razors]

Not really worth it imo. The LT500 is the best 500 motor for a quad because it has a counterbalancer BUT it has some factory flaws that need some attention to be a reliable runner. The CR500, KX500, YZ490 have much more power in stock form, are built stronger, and vibration isnt much of an issue in a 3 wheeler.

[cr480r]

3razors hit that one right on the head... I would go with a cr500... its simple, more compact, more powerful, and bulletproof....even after the custom engine cradle the zilla engine would probably rub on the front tire, and would require a funky custom pipe and intake.. I always thought building a quadzilla trike from scratch using quadracer parts would be cool, but I woudn't swap a suzuki engine into somethin else

[brapp]

if your gonan go trougth that much work just start with a cr or kx motor thier far more reliable

[DixiePlowboy]

I'm thinking that you(cr480r) and 3razors are both right in your respective arguments.

I really don't want to cobble something together of likely bad geometry, nor try to stretch the frame cradle of another machine to shoehorn the LT engine in.

I guess I'm just having a hard time adjusting to having a quad in the carport. I am starting to worry, 3razors, about all the talk (between here and QRHQ )of reliability issues with the LT500 engine. Is this engine worth fixing for someone that is counting nickles and dimes? Is it going to grenade every year or every other ride if I can't spend big bucks Rx-ing and Q-ing it?

[brapp]

well the 87's were a lil worse than the later zillas but they can be made fairly reliable but i still dont beat on my zilla too much cause when the do scatter parts are expensive and a few are hard to find.

[fabiodriven]

I am starting to worry, 3razors, about all the talk (between here and QRHQ )of reliability issues with the LT500 engine. Is this engine worth fixing for someone that is counting nickles and dimes? Is it going to grenade every year or every other ride if I can't spend big bucks Rx-ing and Q-ing it?

I have never been a fan of anything Suzuki, except for some of their street bikes. Pretty much anything they make for off road use is a pile of junk. I grew up with friends who had LT250's and they would break down every day we went out. I had a Quadrunner 230 at one time and although it was mint, it was a heap of crap. Their snowmobile engines are a friggin abortion, that much I know. With that being said, I ride with two guys from this site (SBLT500R and 4Q2) who both have LT500's and they are both beautiful machines. They run great and move the f#$k out. Whether that is just a testament to their mechanical abilities or not I don't know.

My personal opinion, Suzuki= thumbs down.

[DixiePlowboy]

Not being a quad fan, I'm not normally giving Suzuki the time of day, but....I had a brand new '85 Quadsport, an '88 Quadracer, and a brand new '86 RM 250 that were all super reliable and fun machines relative to what I had to compare them to at their respective times. So, I don't think Suzuki is necessarily bad.....just worried specifically about the 500 engine on my budget.

I'll leave this on 4 wheels, fix it, ride it(hopefully....lol), and just snag a couple more 3-wheelers to balance my arsenal out(i.e: hide the quad behind:)).

Thanks for the opinions and input, ya'll.

[cr480r]

i really enjoyed my quadracer but none of my friends have had much luck with theirs... Mine lasted through some extreme abuse, but there is no denying that they are not build as well as the other makes...once you've had them all apart the difference is clear.. thats why my quadracer is getting a kawi powerplant... I will say the newer RM's are great bikes and are built much better than the old suzuki stuff...

[Racerguy381]

I know one weak point on the LT500 is the cylinder... The tend to crack or get warped an leek at the base of the cylinder below the reed cage. www.duncanracing.com still makes alot of go fast parts for them and there is another guy http://quadracerhq.com/catalog.htm Supposedly he makes the best pipes for them. Looks like a CPI to me without the stamp, still a CPI is an awsome pipe. If you do decide to go with the LT motor you should address some of the weak points. Have the cylinder gusseted behind the rear mounting studs. Also check the mounting surface of both cylinder and case for warpage. Last make sure the crank has good main seals I have seen a few that sucked a seal and cooked the top end from running lean. Good luck with whatever you end up doing.

[p500r]

chop the front! that would be sweet!

[DixiePlowboy]

I've been reading quadracer hq ever since I got mine, and have seen some of what needs to be fixed. Dr.Q's pipe isn't currently being made, and it's my understanding that buying one(if you can find one) is a 4-figure affair.....no pipe's worth that much to me. A Paul Turner seems to be a great pipe for a reasonable price. Dynoport doesn't look bad either.

I was thinking of going ahead and having the two rear cylinder mounts gusseted and upgrading to the bigger head studs while mine's apart. I've got to rebuild the crank for a bad bottom rod bearing, but at least my crank ends have zero wobble/play.....so even though I'll put new crank bearings and seals in, maybe my cases are still good where the bearings sit.

thanks for the info.

[3Razors]

Here's the deal on LT500's. I've dealt with them and still own a 87. The 87 was the most powerfull because of the larger intake cage. Suzuki was dealing with breakage issues so they went with a smaller intake on 88 on to lower the power output and make it more reliable but there were still a few other quirks that need to be fixed. If the bike is left completely stock with no porting you can do the following things to have a strong runner:

Crankshaft case inserts for main bearings whether be brass or steel. LT500's have a bad habit of wallowing them out
Make sure to have a 88-on "big hub" flywheel as the 87 the rivets were smaller and shear and come apart
Absolutely get rid of the stock wrist pin washers and get some billet alum ones, the stock ones grenade and tear EVERYTHING up when they go cases, crank, you name it.
Must run at least 100 octane whether avgas or race. They have very poor head design and detonation is guaranteed on pump gas with these.
87 stock carb is complete junk and will never jet right, get a 88 on one or a PWK Keihin.
Only use a Wiseco forged piston. LT500 has bad rod angle and will shatter a cast piston and destroy motor.

If you get some porting and headwork you will also need to get in addition to the above:

O-ringed head. 87 only had 6 headbolt and 88- had 7 but they still blow the headgasket.
Welded up rear cylinder ears by the mounts because the cylinder will crack in that area.

LT500's can make same power as KX and CR with some motor work but just have to get that stuff fixed before any mods get done. Also I don't bag too much on Suzuki, in the 90's and especially today there stuff is built very good.

If your looking for someone to set you up with this kind of work. Jerry Hall in phx here is a wizard with the LT500. Dr. Q highly recommends him too.

[DixiePlowboy]

10-4 3Razors. I appreciate the help.

I'll holler at you via pm later on for a few specifics.

[tripowersport]

How is your Tri-Zilla going?

[Darius1502]

I'd love to cut the front off of mine...that would be amazing...someone must do it!

161649161650

[Afrothunderkat]

I heave never been a fan of anything Suzuki, except for some of their street bikes. Pretty much anything they make for off road use is a pile of junk. I grew up with friends who had LT250's and they would break down every day we went out. I had a Quadrunner 230 at one time and although it was mint, it was a heap of crap.

Now now, that is not true fabio. Why would Carmichael, Hannah, Pastrana, and the hundreds of other zook pros ride yellow?

It's difficult to be successful in a market when you have a super force such as honda, with total market domination and manipulation, paying incentives to dealers to sell honda only, changing the sport in their favor for financial purposes to further their market control. You can argue business is business, but to call a manufacturer..... "junk" based solely on your experience with a light duty trail quad and friends owner ship is ignorant.

For how I ride I own the best bike, and the best trike. To call one of the big 4 trash because I like a certain color? Hog wash.

[pcs]

ive ran and drag raced lt 250r, lt500r, and now my ltr 450 quad. all have had withstood my abuse with no issues. i just make sure i change the oil, use correct fuel, and keep air filters clean. i agree with you afro that non of the big four make trash. the zilla can make lots of power and none of the 3 jap sport atcs stock for stock would stand a chance against a zilla in a drag race. i know zilla motors have issues but most motors start to have issue the more power you try to extract from them.

[Bryan Raffa]

Just weld a KX intake on it... then it will RIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and yea Dynoport pipe!:twisted:

[fabiodriven]

Now now, that is not true fabio. Why would Carmichael, Hannah, Pastrana, and the hundreds of other zook pros ride yellow?

It's difficult to be successful in a market when you have a super force such as honda, with total market domination and manipulation, paying incentives to dealers to sell honda only, changing the sport in their favor for financial purposes to further their market control. You can argue business is business, but to call a manufacturer..... "junk" based solely on your experience with a light duty trail quad and friends owner ship is ignorant.

For how I ride I own the best bike, and the best trike. To call one of the big 4 trash because I like a certain color? Hog wash.

My opinion is not ignorant. My opinion is based on real-world experience and the real-world experience of my older brother who has been wrenching on bikes since before I was born.

My opinion is based on the countless times I had to tow Quadracers, Quadrunners, and Quadsports out of the woods growing up. I was the kid that all my riding buddies would call when we were growing up if their top end went south or they had other issues. I would go to their house and fix their stuff for nothing just so we could keep riding. Or I'd bring it to my house and do it. I have PLENTY of time wrenching on Zooks, more than enough time to form my own opinion.

My brother wrenched on the Super Bike circuit for years. He still works on bikes in his garage and his level of professionalism in the bike/ATV department is second to none. Basically, he really knows his shite. He would tell you the same thing I am about Zuki's, and so would a lot of other people who have spent time with a wrench in their hand. With few exceptions, Zuki's are just junk. I've owned them too, so my opinion is not ignorant at all. If I didn't like them because they were yellow, that would be ignorant. So many disappointed friends growing up who just wanted to ride, so many cuss words uttered as my knuckles start to bleed, so many tow ropes having to be used. I'll never forget that stuff. I've been there and done that so please don't try to tell me how I should feel about a certain brand.

Now if ignorance is what you want to talk about, we can do that. Ignorance would be accepting ownership of a trike and promising to pay for said trike, but then never paying the person who was kind enough to front it to you. Ignorance would be pulling holeshots on your neighbors lawn while he's not home and then hiding behind your mommy and daddy when confronted. Those are things I consider to be ignorant, not an opinion based on years of experience and the experiences of your elders.

[TecateDan]

Ignorance is not respecting other people’s property!!!! Making an intelligent statement about 30 years of personal riding and wrenching experiance is not ignorant. I ride a tecate and many a people were skeptical that it would stay running. I grew up with Fabio since 87 so he's said a lot of what I would say. Some bike requires more maintenance than other. My tecate is one. It's un counterbalanced and shakes things loose but with a lot of preventative maintenance and a keen wrenching ability I have no problems running with the other guys Honda etc. The Zuki's though just came apart at the fame and the motors explode that has nothing to do with an ignorant experience it has to do with riding since before you were born and watching those things fall apart. I'd invite you on one of our rides so you could see what dependable machines are like but you've made it clear you'd rather be a pain in the butt than a true rider with camaraderie which is what 3 wheelers are supposes to be about at this point. Just look at our ride thread and you'll see what a good group of friendly people can accomplish san's Zuki

[thestud25]

None of you girls know what you speak of! My Suzuki ALT 500-450=50 is a tank and will bury all trikes! :twisted:

[Dirtcrasher]

Not really worth it imo. The LT500 is the best 500 motor for a quad because it has a counterbalancer BUT it has some factory flaws that need some attention to be a reliable runner. The CR500, KX500, YZ490 have much more power in stock form, are built stronger, and vibration isnt much of an issue in a 3 wheeler.

Absolutely; Those motors have issues as I have seen it 1st hand. I remember going riding with a guy who has great mechanical skills, maintains his stuff and the LT just decided to blow 3rd gear. Thats just one of the failures I've seen....

[Darius1502]

Just weld a KX intake on it... then it will RIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and yea Dynoport pipe!:twisted:

HOLY Moly...who did that?

[Darius1502]

Dr. Q's stock 'beater zilla' is freaking crazy fast....these motors can run like beasts:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04cOFZMRp-E

[Darius1502]

The famous beater Zilla....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3UxMK_7b00

[fabiodriven]

And they can be slayed like beasts as well-

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r275/fabiodriven/Tecate%20250/th_tecategetsjump.jpg (http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r275/fabiodriven/Tecate%20250/tecategetsjump.mp4)

[Afrothunderkat]

Now if ignorance is what you want to talk about, we can do that. Ignorance would be accepting ownership of a trike and promising to pay for said trike, but then never paying the person who was kind enough to front it to you. Ignorance would be pulling holeshots on your neighbors lawn while he's not home and then hiding behind your mommy and daddy when confronted. Those are things I consider to be ignorant, not an opinion based on years of experience and the experiences of your elders.


Ignorance is not respecting other people’s property!!!!


I do not know what this destruction of property pertains to, have yet to be confronted, as far as the trike goes, that was almost 2 years ago. I paid him in full. The original agreement was to pay it off when i could, do stuff here and there for cash, even the other neighbors helped me out by giving me work. I walked up to his door, handed him the money in an envelope. It was done then its DONE now. His issue was that i made $800 of a $160 purchase, and I road it.... even though it was mine.... he wanted control over what I did with it.

Didn't tell you about that did he? Destruction of property? Hole shots? Possibly the trucks in front of my house at 11, 12 1, 2, 3 am? The burnouts? On xmas mourning 6am? My parents both work.... Oh, don't know about those. Doesn't tell you about how I brought cord wood in his cellar, mowed his lawn, swept his floors, did dishes, snowplowed and shoveled him out when we would get hammmered with snow, using MY gas and MY snow blower, giving him oil or gas when needed, does not tell you about that does he? Everything was fine until his jealousy of my freedom to do as I please overcame him. No one can explain why or what happened other than hes a drunk. Ignorant to take one side of a story and pass judgement. Ignorant to bring up outside and personal things on this forum and ignorant to do it online, I have yet to even met you fabio. And if what he has to say bothers you so much.....next time you have a ride, come over and let's have a chat, like men do. Not internet fights like little girls.

This also applies to anyone else, I am more than willing to talking about any issues you have.

[TecateDan]

I may just take u up on that offer. I'd love to broker a piece treaty and be done with all of this.

[Afrothunderkat]

I may just take u up on that offer. I'd love to broker a piece treaty and be done with all of this.

You and me both!

[Bryan Raffa]

490 Vs 530 quadracer , 500 quadracer motor stuffed into a full 250R lagers Frame.





http://youtu.be/kpHowqLJngM

[TatTooL23]

quadzillas r great. i love mine. but i do not ride it a real lot.

they for sure have issues though. but like a lot of things as long as they r taken into consideration and u take care of the machine most of the time things r fine. i have only blown a head gasket.

love the lugging power of these things but it does come at the cost of reliability with this said quad.

its the only suzuki i own, and really the only one i would ever own.

[fabiodriven]

I do not know what this destruction of property pertains to, have yet to be confronted, as far as the trike goes, that was almost 2 years ago. I paid him in full. The original agreement was to pay it off when i could, do stuff here and there for cash, even the other neighbors helped me out by giving me work. I walked up to his door, handed him the money in an envelope. It was done then its DONE now. His issue was that i made $800 of a $160 purchase, and I road it.... even though it was mine.... he wanted control over what I did with it.

Didn't tell you about that did he? Destruction of property? Hole shots? Possibly the trucks in front of my house at 11, 12 1, 2, 3 am? The burnouts? On xmas mourning 6am? My parents both work.... Oh, don't know about those. Doesn't tell you about how I brought cord wood in his cellar, mowed his lawn, swept his floors, did dishes, snowplowed and shoveled him out when we would get hammmered with snow, using MY gas and MY snow blower, giving him oil or gas when needed, does not tell you about that does he? Everything was fine until his jealousy of my freedom to do as I please overcame him. No one can explain why or what happened other than hes a drunk. Ignorant to take one side of a story and pass judgement. Ignorant to bring up outside and personal things on this forum and ignorant to do it online, I have yet to even met you fabio. And if what he has to say bothers you so much.....next time you have a ride, come over and let's have a chat, like men do. Not internet fights like little girls.

This also applies to anyone else, I am more than willing to talking about any issues you have.

Here's the thing- It shouldn't surprise you that things are going the way they are between you and our group. You came on these boards and you were nothing but a "pain in the butt", as Dan said. We have a fantastic group of guys that we ride with. We all take care of each other and welcome newcomers into the group. As soon as you came on here, you were a pain. When your neighbor came on these boards, the first thing he did was open his home to us and invite us to come up. He didn't give us a hard time like you did. Obviously what happened before we all started coming up there is between you and your neighbor, but why would you expect us to see things from your side when you come off the way you do?

On the one hand we've got a guy who was a pain in the butt from the word go.

On the other hand we've got a guy who invited us up, welcomed us into his home, and immediately became part of our brotherhood.

Do you see why we've sided with your neighbor? It's absolutely ridiculous that our group of trikers comes right to your house and rides on your mountains and you're not able to join. But who's to blame? All things aside between you and your neighbor Afro, you are to blame for the position you are in. Not your neighbor, and not us. The way things are between you and our group are a direct result of your actions, not ours or your neighbors. You're the one who came off like an arse.

With that being said, obviously the best outcome for everybody is to sit down and sort things out. I am game for that. There are 3 sides to every story. In this case it will be yours, your neighbor's, and the truth. Whatever has happened in the past is never going to be sorted out, but it can be forgiven if the both of you want to go that route. If the two of you don't both agree to that, there's no point in even talking.

One thing you need to realize is there are repercussions for your words. Not to generalize a whole generation of people too much, but people your age seem to be surprised when you get a bad reaction to something you've said, almost like you don't deserve it. I am 33 years old Afro. I was never handed anything in my life. I was raised well. I served in the army and I do hold my head high. If someone tells me I'm ignorant for sharing my opinion based on 20+ years of experience, that someone had better expect a reaction from me. You f**k with the bull, you get the horns Afro. So if you don't like the reaction, don't prod me.

[Afrothunderkat]

Here's the thing- It shouldn't surprise you that things are going the way they are between you and our group. You came on these boards and you were nothing but a "pain in the butt", as Dan said. If someone tells me I'm ignorant for sharing my opinion based on 20+ years of experience, that someone had better expect a reaction from me. You f**k with the bull, you get the horns Afro. So if you don't like the reaction, don't prod me.

I 100% completely agree, as far as what I said on here, insulting you and the others for my idiotic brake explanation, I did it to my self. Whats done is done, I am more than willing to forget and move on if you guys are. Would love to come ridding with you guys some time. It's a bummer to watch you guys line up and leave, not being able to join. I have people to ride my RM with, not so much my trikes.

Either way if any of you are still holding a grudge from my 21 year old know it all attitude, I apologize...and if you guys want to come over and have a chat, im all for it.

[thestud25]

I 100% completely agree, as far as what I said on here, insulting you and the others for my idiotic brake explanation, I did it to my self. Whats done is done, I am more than willing to forget and move on if you guys are. Would love to come ridding with you guys some time. It's a bummer to watch you guys line up and leave, not being able to join. I have people to ride my RM with, not so much my trikes.

Either way if any of you are still holding a grudge from my 21 year old know it all attitude, I apologize...and if you guys want to come over and have a chat, im all for it.

That took balls. Make things right. John and Dan are great guys!

[TatTooL23]

how about them 'zillas ehhhhh ????

(crickets chirping) lol...

[thestud25]

I love the zillas. My buddies dad had one that I tried to buy for years. His step mom said she would sell it to me and his dad said if she did he would file for divorce. He was not kidding. He still has it and it is mint!

[Mr. Clean]

How is your Tri-Zilla going?

This deadbeat DixiePlowboy or is it "DicksPeoplePlowboy" will not be back anytime soon, at least not under this username. He stiffed me for a 250r short track gas tank back in 2010. He claimed:


"and I'm kind of on a tight schedule to get my R set up for a race."

Like every deal to sell something on this board I went on faith and sent the tank prior to payment. Dumb on my part yes, but today I just shipped a box of parts to NY without payment. I did it cause I have faith in the person.....but I am much more cautious.

He never paid, strung out the situation claimed he would ship it back and I never saw it. Amazingly the next year I went to TF and this loser actually won the raffle 350x that year. :crazy:

I never bothered to bring it out on the boards as I knew it would never amount to anything. I have all the PM's saved, not sure that it matters anyway......

[ezmoney1979]

In other news, here is a mint example from my area- http://medford.craigslist.org/mcy/3553518811.html I wish I had the cash right now, not that I am such an LT500 fan, but any quad from back in the day that is still wearing the OEM tread always impresses me.

[Darius1502]

Wow that is a nice '87!!!

[rg97]

imo, dont go with a lt 500 motor, a cr 500, or anything like that. find a nice rd400, and use it. it will actually beat a cr480