WHY does every body want frame's with title's????

[big specht]

It isn't hard to get a title for a bike in ohio! Is that much of a pain in other states ?? I was just woundering cause I see every body asking for titles when they are selling frames.

[3 Wheel Drive]

I'm pretty sure in most states, if you do not have the title in your name... Legally you do not own it.
I could be wrong, both of my Z's are titled and registered in the state of WA. :beer

[hoosierlogger]

I'm pretty sure in most states, if you do not have the title in your name... Legally you do not own it.


I hope not, because if that's true in Indiana I only own 1 of the 7 trikes in my shed. And technically I dont even own it, the guy's uncle that I bought it from still does.


I think it is more of a comfort thing for most folks. We can register ATV's with the Department of Natural Resources and ride them on secondary roads. If you have a title, there is a little assurance that it is not stolen and is legit. The 200X I still have has a title. I got rid of the other one for a reason, it didn't have a title. I would have hated to try and register it and it turn up stolen. Then I would have to give it up to the cops after I dumped a bunch of money in it to get it running again.

[dougspcs]

In Michigan possession is ownership..a title means nothing!!

They didn't issue ATVs a title at the time 3 wheelers were being sold..this started in 1994ish??

Anyway, if you want title for a machine all you have to do is go to the Secretary of State office with a bill of sale from the person you purchased it..super easy!!

You don't even have to reside in Michigan to hold a title.

Now Ontario..that is a different matter. Lots of rules, but sneaky ways around those also!!

[hoosierlogger]

Now Ontario..that is a different matter. Lots of rules, but sneaky ways around those also!!

What do you have to do, go to Michigan to go riding and stop by the secretary of states office instead?

[Jon Boy]

well, probibly for legality reasons. here in IL you have pretty much have to have a title. you can get by with a bill of sale, but as far as the DMV, State Police and such you must have a title to show proper legal ownership (went through this when my 125 got stolen).

[dougspcs]

What do you have to do, go to Michigan to go riding and stop by the secretary of states office instead?

No if they were sold in Canada then they are all registered..problem is over the years everyone sold them and didn't bother transferring.

I got my 350x last year that had been thru 4 owners since the registered owner..

Since I wanted an ownership I had to track him down and get him to sign the bill of sale..he hadn't owned it in near 20 years.

The trikes I buy in Michigan are a breeze to title compared to most of them I get in Ontario! Once I have a Michigan title it's easy to transfer to an Ontario ownership.

[Jon Boy]

They didn't issue ATVs a title at the time 3 wheelers were being sold..this started in 1994ish??

Anyway, if you want title for a machine all you have to do is go to the Secretary of State office with a bill of sale from the person you purchased it..super easy!!

you sure about this? i've seen early 80's atc's with titles and i thought if it motorized, over 50cc and has a Vin# it has a title issued with it. i very well could be wrong on this though too. :beer

[Dirtcrasher]

I like one so I can prove it's never been stolen.

Many of us have countless hours and thousands into used trikes that could be stolen and could be confiscated......

[dougspcs]

you sure about this? i've seen early 80's atc's with titles and i thought if it motorized, over 50cc and has a Vin# it has a title issued with it. i very well could be wrong on this though too. :beer

Not sure about the exact year that they started to title them somewhere around 1994 as I meantioned..I'm sure someone from Michigan might be able to straighten my dates up on that. But I'm sure that they weren't titled pre-1987 at the time they were selling 3 wheelers..

Buyers were issued a Bill of Sale by the dealer they bought from and since they weren't legally required to go get it titled by the state, most didn't. You don't have to prove ownership to ride in the state parks, just have a trail permit.

The majority of ATC/ATVs from that time in Michigan are to this day untitled.

Of about 10-12 trikes I've bought in Michigan over the last couple years only 2-3 had title paperwork..the rest I had to apply for myself. I've done it many times..just a couple weeks ago I did this for the trike I sold to Rosco, another Ontario 3WW member.

[RapidRick]

Is that much of a pain in other states ??

Living in California a title is the document of ownership.

If you don't have a title you'd probably better have a bill-of-sale.

IF you don't have a title and want one then:

You start the paperwork at DMV, Then
You make an appointment with the CHP to Verify the VIN. IF there is no VIN (ie., custom frames) then you have to have paperwork for all of the parts/components.
IF, any parts are questionable in the officers' mind the entire vehicle is impounded immediately until the question is resolved.
IF, any of the parts are stolen, the vehicle is impounded, vehicle is destroyed, you don't get back any legitimately owned parts.
Once the VIN or New VIN is verified/attached back to DMV
DMV reviews the paperwork and takes your money.

BTW if the trike doesn't run don't bother taking it to the CHP. They insist on a running vehicle.

Now, someone will probably tell you that there are exceptions to this because they know someone some place. However, this is the process I've gone through 2x in the last 2 years. :(

That's why I won't buy a frame with out a title, or a trike/bike without the numbers matching up with the paperwork.

[hublake]

In Michigan possession is ownership..a title means nothing!!

They didn't issue ATVs a title at the time 3 wheelers were being sold..this started in 1994ish??

Anyway, if you want title for a machine all you have to do is go to the Secretary of State office with a bill of sale from the person you purchased it..super easy!!

You don't even have to reside in Michigan to hold a title.

Now Ontario..that is a different matter. Lots of rules, but sneaky ways around those also!!


I don't know if the first statement is true or not. I always check with the sec. of state office before I buy one. I take the Vin number to the sec. of states office and they will run it and see if it has ever been stolen. It it comes back that it was stolen sometime I would not buy it. This process takes a couple of days. I like to have titles for the ones I have. Getting a title after the sec. of states office tells me it has not been stolen sometimes in it life is not a problem, all you need is a bill of sale with the Vin and what you paid for it.

[dougspcs]

I don't know if the first statement is true or not. I always check with the sec. of state office before I buy one. I take the Vin number to the sec. of states office and they will run it and see if it has ever been stolen. It it comes back that it was stolen sometime I would not buy it. This process takes a couple of days. I like to have titles for the ones I have. Getting a title after the sec. of states office tells me it has not been stolen sometimes in it life is not a problem, all you need is a bill of sale with the Vin and what you paid for it.

Going to the Secretary's office will only find a stolen titled trike..if it was never titled it will not be on the system to flag as stolen. You may have bought a stolen trike and never known the difference!! So may I!!

Without title the person who lost it had nothing to report when it was taken..this is the big hole in that system in Michigan's early ATV years.

Since corrected by mandatory registration.

Believe me, I've had this converation with Canadian Customs officers many times..but this is the system as it was set up at the time. They can't restrict me from bringing a trike into Canada as long as I have the Bill of Sale from the seller showing previous owners name..just without it being titled there is no double check to be sure. I have to buy in good faith..

So far I've been lucky! Hope it continues..

[ebaccm26]

Not sure about the exact year that they started to title them somewhere around 1994 as I meantioned..I'm sure someone from Michigan might be able to straighten my dates up on that. But I'm sure that they weren't titled pre-1987 at the time they were selling 3 wheelers..

Buyers were issued a Bill of Sale by the dealer they bought from and since they weren't legally required to go get it titled by the state, most didn't. You don't have to prove ownership to ride in the state parks, just have a trail permit.

The majority of ATC/ATVs from that time in Michigan are to this day untitled.

Of about 10-12 trikes I've bought in Michigan over the last couple years only 2-3 had title paperwork..the rest I had to apply for myself. I've done it many times..just a couple weeks ago I did this for the trike I sold to Rosco, another Ontario 3WW member.

I don't recall the year but you are correct about them not being titled until the mid to late 90's. I am not sure about the exact date but I know that I have the title to my 200x in my name and the title I had been given from the previous owner was issued in 1997.

The only reason I went about getting the bike registered to me was because I ride the back roads alot, which isn't exactly legal although I have never had a problem as of yet. We have been stopped before but after pointing out our ORV stickers and being respectful they have always let us be on our way. Anyways though if I were to ever have an encounter with an unfriendly police officer the last thing I would want is for the bike to not me in my name when he runs it and then having him arrest me under the assumption that it is stolen, thus why I went through the process of getting the title in my name.

It is pretty simple though, if you have the title and they sign it over to you and you take it to the Secretary of State you are done. Most people I know though do not even bother with getting it in their name as there is really no reason to as of now in Michigan. Last I knew though they were working on making it harder to get a title here, not sure on the specifics.

[hublake]

That is right that when ATCs were first sold they were not titled in Michigan If I would have had one that was stolen and I reported it to the police and gave them the VIN number, it would be in the files. Just because they were orginally sold without a title does not mean they will not show up as stolen if reported as such.

[dougspcs]

That is right that when ATCs were first sold they were not titled in Michigan If I would have had one that was stolen and I reported it to the police and gave them the VIN number, it would be in the files. Just because they were orginally sold without a title does not mean they will not show up as stolen if reported as such.

Sorry, I didn't explain what I meant properly..what I meant is the people who never bothered to title probably didn't have any record of the VIN of their ATV/ATC. Especially if they bought it used..

When they were stolen they would have nothing to report to police except that they had their trike stolen..no VIN registered would give the police nothing to follow up on or record..

A friend of mine had her kids dirtbike stolen from their shed a few months back, she didn't bother recording any information when she bought it..hell, it's just a kids dirtbike. Why bother..now it's gone, she had nothing to show the cops. So this Honda dirtbike is out there in the open and the person who has it has absolutely not worries about being caught with a stolen bike..

I bet money it's happened a thousand times in a system that didn't require people to record or register what they bought!!

So a stolen trike, could conceivably in 25 years have just bounced around until landing in our hands with no record of ever being stolen..we run the VIN thru SOS and it comes up clean..

We hold the title and our conscience is clean right..??? But what can you do??

[Howdy]

Do to the tittle being so hard to get in Ohio I have started just scrapping good frames. It's not worth at least 10 hrs work plus $50+ to get a title on a frame that you might get $100 on a good day.
Howdy

[Jon Boy]

If I would have had one that was stolen and I reported it to the police and gave them the VIN number, it would be in the files.

not bashing on ya hub, just making a point. :beer
now, if your machine got stolen and they were to ask you for some sort of legal ownership what would you do? show a piece of paper with a vin# scribbled on it? last i knew this was no proof of ownership. also if i wanted to be a butt and happened to know your Vin# what would keep me from saying you had my stolen machine? all i would need to do is make up my own forged bill of sale and report it from the looks of it. i know it's not as easy and basic as that, but i'm sure you see what i mean though. :beer

the guy who stole my 125 got caught again with another stolen atv about a year later and the police found a second one in his garage with a fake bill of sale. only thing that got him busted on the second one is the actual owner had a title for it. otherwise he (original owner) would've be up the creek without a paddle.

IMO, only thing that got my 125 back is that basicly the guy i got it off of is the ex-sheriff and a friend of the family, plus he knows the trooper at our local state police post. 125 came from his dads estate sale auction when his father passed away. they couldn't find the title and sold it with a bill of sale even though he knew better. :rolleyes:

[big specht]

Do to the tittle being so hard to get in Ohio I have started just scrapping good frames. It's not worth at least 10 hrs work plus $50+ to get a title on a frame that you might get $100 on a good day.
Howdy

TEN HOURS?????? the last time I had one titled I just had a out of state inspection and went to the dmv and got a title it . It was easy. Thats why i started this thread cause the last time I had one titled it was easy. And for helping when/if they get stolen I really don't see it helping at least around here . Its just more money for the state

[teamboaty]

Im in IOWA and I MISS WISCONSIN. IOWA SUCKS. Ive lived here for 6 years and Ive been thru the same scenario many times. My latest purchase was a 94 CR250 and unfortunately NO TITLE. I use to be able to go to Walmart and get a sticker for the offroad parks but the frickin DNR shut em down. Now I have to go the recorders office. When I 1st got the bike the 1st thing I did was go to the Police Dept and have them run the VIN. Came back NOT STOLEN and they filled out an affadavit and signed it over to me. I took that to the recorders office and they ran the VIN and tell me that its been registered in the state of IOWA trailprotrailpro and unless I get the title I cant get a sticker to ride at the parks. (OH DID I MENTION THAT IOWA DOESNT HAVE ANY TRAILS ANYWHERE) What I usually do is register my 3 and 4 wheelers thru Wisconsin over the internet and than transfer them to iowa. Well, Wisconsin doesnt issue titles for dirtbikes so IM SCREWED unless I track down the last titled owner of the bike that I have. Ive been thru the process of bonding a title for a streetbike before and managed to accomplish it but they tell me that this is different because its an OFFROAD bike so I cant get a bonded title either. You would think being I have documentation from the PD stating its not stolen that the F'n DNR would be glad to take my money but NOOOOOOOO. THIS PISSES ME OFF. Im gonna ride my bike with or without your stinkin sticker. As far as Wisconsin goes, they have atv REGISTRATION cards. Its not really a title but kinda shows ownership. However, even if you dont have the card all you gotta do to register in Wisconsin, is do it online and pay the dues and in a few weeks you will have a registration card in your name.

[Jon Boy]

When I 1st got the bike the 1st thing I did was go to the Police Dept and have them run the VIN. Came back NOT STOLEN...

...unless I track down the last titled owner of the bike that I have...

it's "not in their records that it was reported stolen" is what they were saying. doesn't necessarily mean it couldn't of been stolen. as for the rest of what you said, it does seem a little funny. :wondering

as for having to track down the previous owner, unfortunatly that's normally the case. i got lucky IMO, if i would've had to do this i imagine my 125 would still be sitting in police impound.

[Howdy]

TEN HOURS?????? the last time I had one titled I just had a out of state inspection and went to the dmv and got a title it . It was easy. Thats why i started this thread cause the last time I had one titled it was easy. And for helping when/if they get stolen I really don't see it helping at least around here . Its just more money for the state
The Local Title place told me that to in order to get a title for the frame ( in Ohio ) I had to have a complete running machine. They said they don't issue titles for bare frames. They told me in order to get a frame titled I basically had to build the machine to running condition, and then go get the title. The one time they told me I would have to then haul the machine to Toledo 2 hrs away ( closest place ) to get it inspected and then if it checks out a title would be issued.
That is a lot of work to do if I'm going to just sell the frame.
Is our local Title office wrong or is it correct?
Howdy

[oldskool83]

i wanted a title for mine because where i want to rides you need to run a plate and to run a plate you need a title so i need it registered in my name. though i went around the system alittle, my 1985 atc200x is a 1986 350x....merged frames lol

[dougspcs]

i wanted a title for mine because where i want to rides you need to run a plate and to run a plate you need a title so i need it registered in my name. though i went around the system alittle, my 1985 atc200x is a 1986 350x....merged frames lol

Ontario is the same..got to by plated to ride public trails, and insured!

Every machine sold here since the 60s has been registered and titled. Nothing escapes this..even trailers!

But still people often don't bother transferring ATVs from the last owner to themselves when they buy..even though they are supposed to.

Makes it a pain when you are the 5th owner of a machine and the last 3 didn't register..you need to find that last register guy and get him to sign a bill of sale.

The bill of sale you get from the guy who sold it to you is nothing to the Ministry of Transportation..

As I said, Michigan, even with it's flawed system is still easier to become a titled owner of these older machines.

[rttuck21]

Anyone ever tittled one in Alabama or tennessee? I would really like all of mine to have a tittle just in case something was to happen, like get impounded for being on the roads or somebody running off with one of them.

[pcs]

here in az you need a to purchase an insurance bond for the title, pay for an inspection of the atc to have it evaluated to see if it was stolen, and mail certified letter to any previouse owner who has registered it letting them know that you are attmpting to register a vehical that they have prevously own. other PITA part comes from the purchase of the bond, can cost more than what you pay for the atc. Plus having to deal with the lazy people at the dmv, big hassle.

[dougspcs]

here in az you need a to purchase an insurance bond for the title, pay for an inspection of the atc to have it evaluated to see if it was stolen, and mail certified letter to any previouse owner who has registered it letting them know that you are attmpting to register a vehical that they have prevously own. other PITA part comes from the purchase of the bond, can cost more than what you pay for the atc. Plus having to deal with the lazy people at the dmv, big hassle.

B..RUTAL!!!

Arizona takes the cake..I thought Ontario had the monopoly on BS!!

[fla 2-stroke]

I love the title procedure in florida.they started issuing titles in 2002.anything older than that can be tagged with just a bill of sale.just as long as it was never titled before.you get a sticker that is good for a lifetime.total cost about 50 bucks.sticker is good for ocala,plus counts in states that recognize out of state regi.like cali.It is always nice to have that title when you sell the bike.great state to wash bikes through.they dont want to see the bike.just a scrawled vin on a hand written bill of sale.

[ctk]

I have an original honda title for my 1984 honda 200x. Law did not require them so hardley any dealer used them, at lease in ohio. Mine was sold new in wauseon ohio. Ill post a pic tomorrow.

Howdy it should be easy to get a title in ohio, sounds like the dmv people you talked to are dumb or lazy.

[diesel]

AZ sucks for these. No title means no owing it or riding it. Get caught...big fine.

I have a 110, took it to the DMV, waited for 2 hours, got paperwork, told to bring it to side of building for inspection. After inspection, another hour, back inside, new number, get bond information. Find a place that will sell reasonably priced bond. Go to bond place, pay them, get bond, back to dmv, wait two hours, pay fee and get plate.

Total pain in the ass. I won't buy one without a clear title ever again.

If you don't have the plate and sticker, you can get a big fine, have to go to court, pay fine, etc.... then have to do the above process anyway.

If the machine is stolen (may be ok in AZ system, they do a nationwide check), the machine is confiscated on sight. most likely never to see the light of day again.

[4x4van]

Wow, what a lot of hassle. Born & raised in California, every motorcycle (including dirt bikes) and ATV I've ever owned (I'm 50) has required a title/registration through the DMV. The thought of any "vehicle" not needing a title/registration is really foriegn to me.

I've never bought a vehicle without a title, don't think I ever would, especially after reading some of the headaches involved. Even a custom built trailer must be inspected, licensed, and titled through the DMV here. A friend who restored an old Honda mini-trail 70, purchased without a title, had to jump through hoops for months to finally get it registered.

[Mosh]

WOW...Arizona sucks..That much hoopla for a ATV title? Dang....But when the sun goes down, they (them people), climb the gates in droves and are in UTAH before sunrise purchasing a MAXI-MART with GOVT subsidies...WTF

[badass350x]

Just before Thanksgiving I had the title for two trikes in my hand with ohv tags and plate in two hours in AZ!! No big deal.

[bannedbrraap]

8 years ago i bought a 250r from a guy, i asked if he had the ownership and he said no, claimed he bought the trike from a Honda dealer that no longer existed. I wanted and ownership so i could cross the boarder into mi and check out Silver Lake. I did a full custom resto on the trike ( if any of you guys know me, you know i always make my bikes MINT before i go out to play:). While the frame was out getting powder coat, took the vin# to ministry to see about getting an ownership. All i could do was pay 20$ to get the name of the last registerd owner. So i looked up his name and found a phone # for the guy. This bike was only registerd once back in 1987. I called the guy and told him i bought this trike and i want to get a title for it, he said ohh yeah i haven't had that thing since 1990. He said he still had the ownership for it somewhere and he would mail it to me...SWEET! So he asks for my name and address, so i give it to him and then he says....Thanks...that trike was stolen from me back in 1990 and i want it back....i was like WTF! He asked me if i had his tool box too....hahaha..dick....i was 11 years old back in 1990....anyways he calls the cops and sure enough they want the trike....i told them all i had was a frame and they took it. 2 weeks later i get a call from this dick and he said he will sell me the frame and ownership for 500$....I ended up getting it back for 100$......NEVER again will i buy anything without papers!