500 motor hard starts

[JasonB]

I realize this is a bike motor but its in an ATC frame so i figure trikesylvania is fine for this post. if not please move it, i just need some help here. I have had this motor in my ATC500 project running and riding around tuesday night. Ran great! was able to pull start the bike and make it run too, fires up quick. Yesterday I go to kick it over and it wont start for anything. I kick and kick and kick. I got the trick down finally too with where to kick it the hardest. Anyways, last night after pulling the reeds for inspection and rebuilding the carb again it will fire up for just over one second and then die. Like it runs on its own and then dies quickly. I gapped the stator and pick up coil to 8 thousandths, pulled the plug to check spark 3 times, said a few prayers. nothing :lol: Starting to get frustrated, I was able to kick it over tuesday night after I got the trick down for kicking it; rode it around tuesday night a little bit and was able to fire it over first kick after that on tuesday. Yesterday i go to start it up and nothing. after tinkering for 2 hours it starts for like 20 rotations of firing on its own (about one second) and dies right away.



88 motor with decomp head
39pwk with 55 pilot and 175 main and dgn needle, middle clip on needle. airscrew was a 1.5 turns but ran it in to 1/4 turn out right now for starting.
40:1 klotz premix, 93+ octane
br8es plug at .020
500 ft elevation

what would cause this to fire over and then die right away?

[jb104]

You said you got it running and it ran fine, then the next morning it started on the first kick. If it was running good one day then the next it won't fire up it sounds like an issue with the ignition system. If it was a fuel problem it probably would not have run good the day earlier. I could be wrong but that is my guess

[JasonB]

ya im baffled. I pull the plug out and flip the motor with the kicker and it makes a nice blue spark when i spin the motor as fast as I kick it. I just dont get why it will fire over and run for a solid second and shut right off. no sense i tell ya!

[Dave8338]

Plugged passage in the idle circuit? If it were a coil issue, it should take longer than 20sec for the problem to show up and then wouldn't create spark until the coil cooled down again.

Have you traced your fuel system all the way from the petcock and through the carb? My thought is that it may just be the float is either stuck in the up position OR possibly in upside down. I've done it myself so I know it can happen.

Is there a drain screw on the float bowl? If so, pull the screw and see what if anything runs out. Other than that or an inline filter in backwards, it sure sounds fuel related to me.

[LastFoolerInVA]

check the decomp thing on the head too... maybe do a compression test... something could be sticking or keeping it open after your first few rides

[JasonB]

would the coil be hot after it ran if it was bad? like real hot?

I am considering looking at the woodruff key now; several people suggested that. now i need to source a flywheel puller

[JasonB]

check the decomp thing on the head too... maybe do a compression test... something could be sticking or keeping it open after your first few rides

even after a SOLID kick and good rotation of the motor it shuts itself and i have to reach down to open it again before another kick. This bike has some serious compression to it as well, i can barely roll it over without the decomp on.

[Dave8338]

would the coil be hot after it ran if it was bad? like real hot?

I am considering looking at the woodruff key now; several people suggested that. now i need to source a flywheel puller

Jason... the coil should not get HOT. It may be slightly warm to the touch but NOT hot.

[JasonB]

i havent felt it to know if its warm/hot. I assumed it would be warm from use, but i havent touched it or anything so far to know if its malfunctioning lol

Petcock is flowing great, tank lid is not clogged at all, tank is now full of 40:1. I swapped back over to a 45 pilot from the 55 per the people on cr500 websites suggestions. I am planning to pick up a flywheel puller tomorrow from a local shop to check the woodruff key next. Tonight i am setting the float level in the carb to make sure that's not the issue im having here. Really odd!

I got it to fire up on my lunch break for about 2 seconds multiple times. I mean i kick it just right and it will fire up and right back off. Like it wants to run but its not getting spark or fuel just right to keep it going. I think I can rule out spark, i have tested that 3 times. Maybe just the timing if the key is sheared on the flywheel, or maybe the float flange is bent and its only letting enough fuel in to start the bike not keep it running. GRRRRRRRRRRRR

[barnett468]

Hekllo JasonB


You have lot's of good input so far.


I apologize in advance if these questions seem dumb because I realize you already know a bit about bikes. 500’s are ”bleepin” finicky. You can try the following.

Do you leave the gas on after riding? The float might be high or the needle/seat might weep slowly filling engine after a while and subsequently flooding it.

INSPECT CARB BOWL GAS - Drain float bowl as dave8338 suggested but drain it into a narrow clear glass. What color is the gas, any sediment, is there a small clear bubble in the bottom of the glass? You can get sediment and water from the gas at the station.

GAS LEVEL TEST – Take a clear 10” plastic tube, connect it to the bottom of bowl drain. Hold it next to carb with open end even with carb top. Open drain valve. Gas level should be from even with bottom edge of carb body to 1/8” below it.

PRELIMINARY TIMING CHECK – Even it does not run you can hook a timing lite to it check timing. Mark the flywheel timing mark and the timing mark on eng case with white out. This makes marks highly visible. Remove spark plug and ground it somewhere. Some victim kicks it over while some lucky person gets to hold the button down on the lite and check the timing. Do this in a dimly lit area. Obviously if it’s on the mark your flywheel did not spin on the crank so that’s ok but retighten nut anyway.

COIL AND STATOR CHECK – Ohm coil and stator per manual. See manual link below. If they ohm in range then they are 99% going to be good. If it’s the 500 cc stator then the stator spec should be near the same.

http://www.kb0nly.info/ATC/index.php?dir=ATC250R%2F

STATOR VOLTAGE OUTPUT – Put volt meter on 50, disconnect stator wire, connect red lead to stator and ground the black lead to eng. If stator has 2 wires connect one lead to one wire and the other lead to the other. Voltage should be 30 – 50 while kicking. A digital volt meter that has a peak reading setting is best otherwise it may or may not work. Watch meter while kicking if it does not have this feature.

SPARK PLUG COLOR – It should be a strong pale to bright blue as it is now on that set up. Check it AFTER trying to start it.

PLUG WET OR DRY - Remove after kicking 4 times and see if it is bone dry, damp or dripping wet. Bone dry speaks for itself.

IGNITION PARTS – What exactly is the CDI, Coil and stator off of?

HOT COIL – Try your other bike and see how hot it gets then compare it to your other bike[unless this is your other bike, lol]. It MAY be remotely possible the stator in the 500 eng is putting out too much voltage for your system therefore causing you coil to get hot. I actually don’t know if this is possible with your particular system, perhaps someone else will. Guessing won’t help.

COMPRESSION RELEASE - Does your compression release take a cable or is it designed to be manually operated? If it’s factory or your compression is higher than stock then it MUST work properly to start this pig. If it is closing while you are kicking it, it will likely never start.

COMPRESSION TEST – Do one if you want as lastfooler in VA suggested, but it has no effect on your problem [providing your compression release is working properly] since it ran fine once already but it won’t hurt to know what it is. You might need race gas to reduce detonation potential if you don’t use it already.

[JasonB]

Hekllo JasonB


You have lot's of good input so far.


I apologize in advance if these questions seem dumb because I realize you already know a bit about bikes. 500’s are ”bleepin” finicky. You can try the following.

Do you leave the gas on after riding? The float might be high or the needle/seat might weep slowly filling engine after a while and subsequently flooding it.

INSPECT CARB BOWL GAS - Drain float bowl as dave8338 suggested but drain it into a narrow clear glass. What color is the gas, any sediment, is there a small clear bubble in the bottom of the glass? You can get sediment and water from the gas at the station.

GAS LEVEL TEST – Take a clear 10” plastic tube, connect it to the bottom of bowl drain. Hold it next to carb with open end even with carb top. Open drain valve. Gas level should be from even with bottom edge of carb body to 1/8” below it.

PRELIMINARY TIMING CHECK – Even it does not run you can hook a timing lite to it check timing. Mark the flywheel timing mark and the timing mark on eng case with white out. This makes marks highly visible. Remove spark plug and ground it somewhere. Some victim kicks it over while some lucky person gets to hold the button down on the lite and check the timing. Do this in a dimly lit area. Obviously if it’s on the mark your flywheel did not spin on the crank so that’s ok but retighten nut anyway.

COIL AND STATOR CHECK – Ohm coil and stator per manual. See manual link below. If they ohm in range then they are 99% going to be good. If it’s the 500 cc stator then the stator spec should be near the same.

http://www.kb0nly.info/ATC/index.php?dir=ATC250R%2F

STATOR VOLTAGE OUTPUT – Put volt meter on 50, disconnect stator wire, connect red lead to stator and ground the black lead to eng. If stator has 2 wires connect one lead to one wire and the other lead to the other. Voltage should be 30 – 50 while kicking. A digital volt meter that has a peak reading setting is best otherwise it may or may not work. Watch meter while kicking if it does not have this feature.

SPARK PLUG COLOR – It should be a strong pale to bright blue as it is now on that set up. Check it AFTER trying to start it.

PLUG WET OR DRY - Remove after kicking 4 times and see if it is bone dry, damp or dripping wet. Bone dry speaks for itself.

IGNITION PARTS – What exactly is the CDI, Coil and stator off of?

HOT COIL – Try your other bike and see how hot it gets then compare it to your other bike[unless this is your other bike, lol]. It MAY be remotely possible the stator in the 500 eng is putting out too much voltage for your system therefore causing you coil to get hot. I actually don’t know if this is possible with your particular system, perhaps someone else will. Guessing won’t help.

COMPRESSION RELEASE - Does your compression release take a cable or is it designed to be manually operated? If it’s factory or your compression is higher than stock then it MUST work properly to start this pig. If it is closing while you are kicking it, it will likely never start.

COMPRESSION TEST – Do one if you want as lastfooler in VA suggested, but it has no effect on your problem [providing your compression release is working properly] since it ran fine once already but it won’t hurt to know what it is. You might need race gas to reduce detonation potential if you don’t use it already.


First off thanks for the lengthy response! Wish more people had this volume of input lmao! OK first things first. I usually shut the petcock when done riding, but this bike hasn’t been out really so far since i put the motor in the frame 3 or so weeks ago. I have had the carb off just over a dozen times as of my lunch break today, I keep pulling pilot jets and playing with the floats. I will get the float level correct tonight I just learned online how to set it! Seems easy enough. But the fuel is clean and i do run an inline filter. I removed it Tuesday night to eliminate it as a blockage. Gas has come out clean and clear every time though. Gas flow freely cfrom the carb to; I tip the bike over to let a little gas flow out the overflow lines before trying to start; its part of the procedure outlined everywhere by cr5 riders.

Timing is on my list for tomorrow night; if a fresh plug doesn’t fix this tonight than I plan to grab a flywheel puller tomorrow and check the woodruff key isn’t sheared etc and check timing too. I will also check specs on the cdi and coil tomorrow.

Spark plug doesn’t really have a color to it yet lol, bike has been around the neighborhood twice now and shut off. I don’t think it has a consecutive 5 minutes of run time yet in my hands. Plug still looks new! I am replacing it tonight as someone suggested it may be bad. It has been consistently wet though so I know gas is flowing.

All ignition parts on this bike belonged to the cr500 dirtbike that was torn apart for this build.

Coil wasn’t hot, It was mentioned and I don’t know if its an item that gets warm or hot lol or anything.

Compression release is manual, I have to reach down to open it. As soon as the bike kicks over and gets any kind of fire, even a solid kick that should have made it fire up, the valve closes itself. When the bike has started in the past it has shut itself too. I reached down to play with it after getting the bike started the first time and it makes farting noises but takes a little bit of pressure to keep it open while the motor is firing normally so it is working right.

Head has a custom cut squish band to raise compression and allow me to run 93 octane. I just put 3 gallons of 93 in the tank on my lunch break at 40:1 klotz techniplate. I have been kicking it with the left over race gas 110 mix from the 310 that was in the tank from the last ride a few weeks ago.

I am hoping that a fresh plug will do the trick now, start cheap and smiple I guess!

[barnett468]

Hello JasonB



First oFirst off thanks for the lengthy response! Wish more people had this volume of input lmao!

Thanks for the compliment but you’ve seen my posts before another similar one shouldn’t surprise you, lol.



I raced big bore pigs in MX for many years including the second hardest bike in the world to start which is a 450 Maico. My friends 501 “square” bore might have been a bit harder, lol.

I just have a minute so this may be sloppy.



SPARK PLUG – Yes a new one is a good idea, if you are running a fancy narrow electrode one I would buy a regular electrode one too and try that. If you are running a 9 buy an 8 but not in Champion. It will start easier for now. Once it's running you may need a 9 if your compression is too high and/or you ride it where it is over 70 degrees outside etc. Big bores do NOT like to start with a 9, lol.

TIMING - Check the timing with lite irregardless but again I would do this first. Why pull the flywheel if you do not need to.

COMPRESSION RELEASE – Original or no. On an original one or on a big bore with high compression it is common to run the bike for a few seconds with it OPEN. If it is closing half way thru the stroke or right after it fires it is not functioning the way one should and is either faulty or a less than practical design.

COIL HEAT – Yes dave already answered that. It should get fairly warm at best but the engine heat may heat it above it’s normal operating level while riding, giving you a “false” reading.

GAS LEVEL IN FLOAT BOWL – The ONLY way to know positively 100% guaranteed whether your float/gas level is correct is to do the test I mentioned. I can’t stress the importance of this enough.

KICK 4 TIMES AND CHECK PLUG – I also can’t stress the importance of doing this enough. Try it before and after checking timing.

TIPPING BIKE TO START – I would NOT do that in your case. It’s a long explanation. I don’t care what the cr5 guys say at the moment. It depends on the set up, even if it is ultimately helpful to use this technique on yours [which I think is highly unlikely] don’t you think it is prudent and practical to eliminate the possibility that you are simply flooding your engine doing this and that’s why it won’t start? You yourself said that every time you pull your plug out it is wet. If it is wet after only 4 kicks you certainly don’t need to flood it with more gas. There is a rhyme and reason [sometimes, lol] I do things the way I do.

[barnett468]

Did I mention, factory big bores are pigs, yes PIGS...LOL?

[El Camexican]

One way I’ve found to check ignition problems when the carb is unproven is to run it on WD-40.

Pull the air filter, open the throttle and give it decent shot of WD and kick it, should fire right up. You can work the choke and try to keep it running on the carb, but if it won’t run on its own have a buddy on hand to give it a little more WD-40 once it fires and if all is well electrically it should keep running on a little spray and you will have eliminated an electrical problem.

If it runs on WD-40 you need to take a good look at that carb and beside that float height make sure that all your vent lines are open.

[barnett468]

Hello JasonB


We used to sit on the starting line and when we got the 2 minute sign, TRY and start our bikes. Most would start, but there was ALWAYS at least 1 guy whose PIG wouldn’t start so one of us would help him push it or change the plug and go back to our bike, then someone else’s PIG would die and had to be pushed etc. This went on EVERY start of every race without fail, lol. PIG’S.

If you watch an old 2 stroke big bore AMA National or World Championship MX race on youtube, you will see many mechanics starting the PIG'S for the riders so the rider wouldn’t get tired or hurt trying to start his PIG. I saw a PIG actually snap a guy’s ankle when it kicked back on him.

Oh I like PIG’S, they’re fast and fun if you can get one started and not be to tired or ambulatory to ride it afterwards, lol. P...I...G...S

[Swinger]

Hope you get this figured out soon. I rolled mine down a hillclimb over the weekend, causing a little damage but mainly pride is hurt more than anything. Mine is kinda running like yours except it will idle but when I give it gas it dies out. Thinking mine is definatley fuel related. Tumbled pretty hard about 200 ft down the steepest climb in Pa...whoops. Keep us posted as this may help me out also. TF is coming upfast. I would love to run against you to see how my 310 holds up to the 500. Good luck brutha and see you soon

[nstyle73]

I have heard the deal about tipping the bikes over on its side for the fuel deal and the previous owner of my 500 engine tried to sell me on that, but I only adhered to a couple slow kicks to get things lined up and one or two good kicks and it starts. Mine is a kx5 though, but does have the manual decompression in the head.

[bkm]

Did you try pull starting it again to see if it would run?

[zmpolaristech]

make sure the crankcase isn't full of fuel....kinda sounds like what your chasing. An engine with a flooded crankcase will fire for a second, but then the fire gets put out from a big gulp of fuel from the bottom end. Ive seen it in sleds DOZENS of times.

[JasonB]

It's late and been a long night but thought i would throw this up real quick; Started and ran after the first kick when I swapped to a new plug. Rode around the block and a coolant hose popped off pretty violently and the engine revved up simultaneously. So I ended up pulling the head and sure enough there was a leak. I reinstalled everything and will see how it does tomorrow. Hopefully this explains the issues I've been having

[barnett468]

Hello JasonB


Cool, start simple. I strongly suggest a compression test at this point once you fix it. As long as the head was properly assembled it never should have started to leak, something is not right then.

Just curious, did you tip it on it's side to flood it first like you have been and like the C5 guys do or did you try it my way?

[JasonB]

Ya i actually put a new plug in and kicked it over, 2nd kick it fired right up so i rode it lol. after the line popped off and sprayed me with scalding hot coolant I went and fixed what i thought was a bad connection/clamp and tossed a new plug in and gave it 4 wacks before pulling the plug. It was wet. I am guessing that for some reason the head didnt seal up well when i installed the decomp head so I hit it was some copper gasket maker, greased the threads, and torqued it all back together. I could see where it had leaked into the coolant passages. And when it was running before the coolant line came off it was smoking white more than i thought it should but contributed that to excessive oil/gas mix build up in the cases from kicking it so much. Gary heard me tell him what happened and went straight for the head, it makes sense now lol. I would assume that this major leak would have some effect on starting as well.

[just ben]

uggh. I think I may be having a similar issue with my 500. I have another gasket but the engine has to come out to get the head off. I'm glad your getting it all sorted out TF is just around the corner!

[JasonB]

ya that wasnt fun at all, but its better than having to get to the crank seals! i was worried it was going to be some serious issues to deal with. hopefully she purrs now. And I was struggling to get this together for a bachelor party ride we are doing for ATC-Eric this weekend and wanted to take this out for some shake down rides!

[ATC-Eric]

Was the head surfaced after that guy put the compression fitting in it?

[JasonB]

yes the head has had the squish band modified and the head surfaced along with the decomp being installed. It is supposed to be a bolt on and go mod, I dont know if I just messed up with the head install or what but it should be fine now. I am going to start it when i get home for lunch in 30 minutes and see how it responds. The more I think about it the more I should have realized this was an area to look at. Theres just so many things to consider with a used motor and adding other parts to the equation like a different carb and pipe etc. Hoping she fires right up and runs right finally.

[Mr. Clean]

Glad I sent you these parts when I did to give you time to get everything sorted out. That motor ran strong with no issues when I had the CR500.

Hope this is the last of your troubles and its ready for this weekend and beyond.


http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/miked1957_photo/DSC_6593.jpg

http://i280.photobucket.com/albums/kk179/miked1957_photo/DSC_6594.jpg

[JasonB]

Thanks again Mike! I really appreciate everything you did here, I need to PM you about some other stuff too. Cant wait to ride this thing around and finally open it up!

[El Camexican]

Pretty good looking bike to have parted out.

[JasonB]

i love that style of procircuit pipe too

[barnett468]

Hello JasonB




Ya i actually put a new plug in and kicked it over, 2nd kick it fired right up so i rode it lol.

OK, no tipping of bike necessary, good. Those C5 guys [as you call them] obviously don’t have their bikes set up right or are just unnecessarily going off an old school technique that was rarely used and rarely worked.

How much choke is needed to start?

How cold is it there when you are starting?

If you start with little or no choke and it is around 60 degrees out or less, than providing you float level is correct, your pilot and/or fuel mix screw are off. I would install 1 size smaller pilot then adjust mix screw. You do NOT want your PIG loading up during starting in 80 plus, degree weather, believe me. That ice chest can be a LONG ways back when getting towed through the Dunes, lol.






the line popped off and sprayed me with scalding hot coolant

The water should not typically get scalding hot just riding around if the air temp is over 80 degrees. The hot combustion gasses were probably leaking into the water system thereby overheating the coolant. I would check it with an infrared gun once it is repaired to know what you are dealing with. It may be bored out far enough to promote overheating and/or have too much compression for the size of your radiators. I know others run their “big bore” bikes with these radiators and you can’t easily do anything to install larger ones but it still doesn’t mean there’s nothing you can do to reduce the coolant temp if need be or so desired. Reducing compression is one way to do that.


Just curious was it hot outside when this occurred?

How far is it bored over?

What is the compression?






it was smoking white more than i thought it should but contributed that to excessive oil/gas mix build up in the cases from kicking it so much.

The following is simply “FYI” and something you will hopefully never need to know.

EXHAUST SMOKE COLOR ID.

1. White that dissipates quickly is water in the combustion chamber.

2. Lite blue/gray is burning oil.

3. Very dark gray or black is too much gas and possibly some oil. The black color commonly “hides” any lite gray smoke you might have from burning oil so never assume it is a rich condition only.






I would assume that this major leak would have some effect on starting as well.

Yeah, I’ve always found it difficult to get a gas powered engine to run well on water but I still have hope, lol.






PS - Anyway, glad it it was a simple fix, and hope you enjoy it with no further problems!

[TecateDan]

You know when the decomp is open you can hear it. ALso Mine runs fine at idle with the decomp on


check the decomp thing on the head too... maybe do a compression test... something could be sticking or keeping it open after your first few rides

[TecateDan]

I had to pour out over half a liter of gass from mine after having to pull start it a lot
make sure the crankcase isn't full of fuel....kinda sounds like what your chasing. An engine with a flooded crankcase will fire for a second, but then the fire gets put out from a big gulp of fuel from the bottom end. Ive seen it in sleds DOZENS of times.

[TecateDan]

ONe last thing. Does your gas cap vent?? I had one that didn't and with a full tank it would pull vacuum and die.. This is a wierd one but just throwing it out there. Fuel, compression, and spark. You got spark, you got sompression, I'd strip the carb and rebuild it.

[JasonB]

Thanks for your coments everyone! i can actually breath through the vent line into the gas cap, its healthy lol

and i can hold the decomp open with it running, only done it once but it makes farting noise.

and the coolant was scalding because the motor was breathing into the coolant system lol got a minor burn on my hand from the steam that came out! I will jump back on here and give a more thorough answer to some of your questions but im about to leave work and go play with the bike some more! so stoked it actually seems like it wants to run right now!

[Louis Mielke]

Dude, after looking at the pic of that head your bought and the little bit of back story that came to light on banned500riders, i would be highly suspect of the weld job on that head. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a crack or pin hole that allowing compression pressure into the coolant system

[just ben]

If you do find the decompression to be the culprit find another head and send it to the guy who did mine. I hope it is just the gasket though,Good luck.

[TecateDan]

I was thinking the same thing. There should be NO Way the coolant ever touches the exhaust unless there is a leak


Dude, after looking at the pic of that head your bought and the little bit of back story that came to light on banned500riders, i would be highly suspect of the weld job on that head. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a crack or pin hole that allowing compression pressure into the coolant system

[El Camexican]

i can actually breath through the vent line into the gas cap, its healthy lol

It might seem that way now, but your brain cells are dying!:lol:

[JasonB]

Dude, after looking at the pic of that head your bought and the little bit of back story that came to light on banned500riders, i would be highly suspect of the weld job on that head. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a crack or pin hole that allowing compression pressure into the coolant system

ya i have been in touch with Roostius Maximus who did the squish mod and planed the head but Seanmx57 did the decompe install and the more I think about it the more you might be right. I installed the head gasket for the THIRD time friday night. bike ran for another 5 minutes bfore coolant started to pressurize and find a weak spot to overflow from around a clamp. I just want this damn thing to run, I have spent too much time just on the head lol

[Louis Mielke]

ya i have been in touch with Roostius Maximus who did the squish mod and planed the head but Seanmx57 did the decompe install and the more I think about it the more you might be right. I installed the head gasket for the THIRD time friday night. bike ran for another 5 minutes bfore coolant started to pressurize and find a weak spot to overflow from around a clamp. I just want this damn thing to run, I have spent too much time just on the head lol

Did you sell that stock head? Put the stock one back on it, it's not impossible to start without the decomp, just not easy, worst case you can pull start it for the drags. If I was you I'd be trying to put your 310 back togehter as a rider and leave the 500 as drags only. You just don't have the time to straighten out the 500 enough to make it reliable for a daily rider for trikefest.

Really doesn't matter, you're going to cry when you get wooped by a 330 anyway. It's a known fact the 330's are just as fast if not faster than stock 500s, unless the 330 is tuned poorly.

[JasonB]

ya I didnt put the 500 together to be a drag bike, or with the idea that they are the fastest thing around either. I just wanted a bike with more power to it and from just the 10 minutes of combined riding i have done between the three head gasket leaks it feels like what I want. Again i didnt put this bike together as a drag bike, more so an all around rider with solid power :D Not tryign to be the fastest or I would have built a puma lol

I just reached out to Sean about a refund on the head. Roostius is putting one together for me now and should be able to get it to me in the next week.

[barnett468]

Hello JasonB




I installed the head gasket for the THIRD time friday night.

Are you reusing the same head gasket?

If you are using the same head gasket it is not helping your situation no matter whether you put sealer on it or not. Others do it and get away with it. I have done it also out of necessity but I did not have a leak prior. One can get away with that all day long on a 125 but were talkin about a 500 cc PIG, lol.




Here’s what I would do,


Place some 600 grit sandpaper on a granite counter top when your girlfriend is not home, lol.

Mark the head and cylinder sealing surfaces with a felt pen

Put water or wd40 on paper

Using light force spin head and cylinder on paper 4 rotations. If all the felt pen black is not removed you must surface until it is. You can start with 320 finishing with 600.

Once surface is flat either install a new gasket and try again or proceed to the steps below.



CRACK DYE TEST - If you want to check your head for cracks and/or pinholes as Louis Mielke suggested it might have you can buy the stuff to do it yourself or take it to virtually any quality engine or transmission rebuilding shop and they can do it for you. The fluorescent technique is better at finding small cracks than the non fluorescent method. See video below for crack test info. See video below for general info.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=npgoUHq3X4k&NR=1&feature=endscreen



CRACK VISUAL TEST – This is my own modified version of a std automotive engine head leak test I used to do. If you want to visibly see what is going on with your head you can do the following, it may or not may work in your particular case.


Get a 3/4” thick piece of clear lexan, bullet proof is best.

Tape lexan with masking tape 1 layer thick.

Place head on lexan and mark bolt holes

Drill bolt holes

Remove tape

Counter sink holes slightly just enough to deburr them etc.

Bolt head dry with gskt or o ring to lexan using approximately 15 ft lbs torque. More might crack the lexan, this is why bullet proof is better.

Get a compression gauge that has a removable hose and remove it from gauge then install it on head.

Fill chamber with dark colored water

Install safety glasses

Connect compression hose to controlled air source with air off

Hold air hose/comp hose junction above head so water does not flow back into hose

Tip head up so you can see the bottom clearly but do not turn it all the way over.

Open air hose and apply approx 10 psi pressure slowly increasing to 60 stopping whenever it leaks. You should clearly see your leak if you are lucky, lol.

Mark outside of head with felt pen to locate it

Take photo of leak with cell phone.

Get it fixed.




Keep it clean and on topic!!
Howdy

[just ben]

ya i have been in touch with Roostius Maximus who did the squish mod and planed the head but Seanmx57 did the decompe install and the more I think about it the more you might be right. I installed the head gasket for the THIRD time friday night. bike ran for another 5 minutes bfore coolant started to pressurize and find a weak spot to overflow from around a clamp. I just want this damn thing to run, I have spent too much time just on the head lolhopefully they can get the head right this time. Just curious how much did you put into having it modified?

[JasonB]

I picked it up outright but the guy that did the work actually sold me one that had been repaired from a previous decomp install through the dome. and the repair from that original decomp was botched. Anyways, the head had the squish band modified, was supposedly checked for flatness, and is an 85 head (supposed to be desired for power reasons), and had the decomp valve welded on. I got ripped off and AFTER the partial refund for not disclosing damage from the previous repair I still came out of pocket for everything outright shipped to me 375$. I am working on getting every penny of that back now. The bigger name that does them over on the 500 boards is Adam Millar (roostius maximus) and he doesnt charge near that. anyways, i got ripped off price-wise in the first place and the product was shoddy as hell.

[JasonB]

but ya, overall the reason i had hard starts was related to the leak. The bike had constant issues related to the leak so I was chasing all the wrong things. I will be sticking the stock head on tonight if i get time so i can atleast confirm the bike runs like it should

[JasonB]

Alright Sean is sending me another head to install, he is backing up his work and im pretty happy about everything. I am praying this is what is really wrong with everything but given the extensive work done to repair the head it is more than likely related. Should have the new decomp head by the weekend, fingers crossed

[El Camexican]

Alright Sean is sending me another head to install, he is backing up his work and im pretty happy about everything. I am praying this is what is really wrong with everything but given the extensive work done to repair the head it is more than likely related. Should have the new decomp head by the weekend, fingers crossed

What's happening with your trike Buddy? Haven't seen or heard boo for 5 weeks. Did you get a head?

[JasonB]

Wow ya hadnt done any updates! It runs great, I made the mistake of swapping jets at the TRIKEFEST drags and the result was a losing race and elimination. Rear suspension is out at suspension101 for revalve rebuild and custom made spring for my specifications. Made a new set of top motor mounts tonight out of 5052 3/16" aluminum plate becase the last set of mounts ripped in half at TRIKEFEST. Installed an X-33 extended durablue axle Monday this week as wel. Looks slick ;)

I am purchasing a 38mm cast preorder APT Smartcarb on Friday. Big developments here, just not updating the boards about them. Bike needs some love and attention, thanks for asking about it! New deck w decomp head is installed and it fixes my cool ant leaking issues.

[El Camexican]

Sounds like you've been too busy to post! We need pics and video when you get a chance!