carb question

[captain2207]

On a 200s is the slide supposed to go almost down to the carb?mine is about 1/4"away from it.and if it is how do I adjust it,ive bout tore my hair out on this.I've looked in online manual and didn't find this or missed it.one more question,manual says 2turns out on pilot jet but my plug is bone dry,once again I'm losing my mind.thanks all

[El Camexican]

You are a little unclear here.

If you are asking if the vertical slide in your carb should go all the way down to the bottom of the carburator throat the answer is no, it has to be open a little to allow air in at idle. What looks like a 1/4" from the front is actualy a lot less on the other side of the slide as it has a cutout on the intake side. It stops on the tip of a tappered screw which can be turned in or out to raise or lower it to adjust your idle speed. I think it is #8 in this fiche
http://www.bikebandit.com/houseofmotorcycles/1984-honda-atc200s/o/m1894#sch11214

Usualy a pilot jet, or slow jet as some call them is just that, a jet, not a screw (#23 on the fiche). The screw which I suspect you are refering to is either an air screw, or a fuel screw depending on which side of the carb it is located on (before the slide is usualy and air screw and after the slide is usualy a fuel screw). 2 turns is a base line setting which you may have to adjust. Yours looks to be a fuel screw (#5 in the fiche), so turning it in makes it run leaner and out makes it richer. Start with 2 turns as suggested and it should run fine at no more than a 1/4 turn eitherway if it is a stock engine and the carb is clean.

You plug should not be wet if your engine is running properly, so what is your problem that is making you lose your mind?

[captain2207]

Thanks for the reply.I figured out the slide.now,I had it running but it ran like crap.the thumb only went from half way to wide open,(didn't relize right away).when at idle its was kinda ruff,wide open real ruff and to me it sounded like choke was on,flipped choke lever and same thing.so took back apart,rechecked carb guts blew out with air.I was thinking that if fuel goes to cylinder and it doesn't fire off in 8-10 pulls plug should be wet?I'm not totally sure about this assumption.any other help much appreciated

[El Camexican]

Did you take the jets out (especialy the slow jet) and make sure all the little holes were clean? Any obstructions will cause problems, a simple shot of air with the float bowl off won't do anything.

[captain2207]

Yes took jets out soaked in berrymans,hit with carb clean then air.I'm going to recheck valves,see what that does

[oscarmayer]

did you visuall yinspect each jet and each hole? also the carb itself has passages that have to be cleaned. did you clean each of thsie tiny holes out as well as the big holes? it is easy to miss the small holes. so check that. there is even one near the slide opening area so ensure you get than 1 too.

[captain2207]

When It cools down here I'm headed to recheck carb and valves.small hole next to slide I guess I missed that one.

[captain2207]

Still nothing.I did notice that when I lined up "f"mark to case,the lines on black box and pulse generater were a 1/16 off.the line on black box was to the right a 1/16.in the on line manual it doesn't say how to refine it perfect.I'm taking that I take nut off and move counterclockwise untill it lined perfectly?

[kb0nly]

Loosen the two phillips screws holding the plate that the pickup coil is on so you can turn it to line them up.

[captain2207]

I just did that.nothing.plug still dry.won't fire off with starter fluid.I'm glad I only have $25 in gas in this project.

[kb0nly]

If the plug is dry, you got a carb or fuel problem at the least... Without reading back through the posts, does it have good compression?

Also, stop using that damn starting fluid. That crap has one place, in a diesel engine on a cold day. Using it in a 4 stroke gas engine is just asking for trouble. I have seen a lot of damage to 4 stroke and 2 stroke engines from people trying to force them to run with starting fluid.

Your best friend is a $.50-$1.00 spray bottle from your local hardware store or grocery store, look in the cleaning supplies isle. I bought a little spray bottle, holds probably 12 ounces of liquid, you can set the nozzle to stream to pump it into a plug hole or through a carb, or set it to mist to give a finer spray into a carb for priming in place of the choke. Its not going to hurt the motor like starting fluid will, and its damn handy to have around for troubleshooting stubborn motors, and its a lot cheaper than a can of starting fluid! If it won't start on gas sprayed into it then you got other issues besides the carb.

[captain2207]

Kb...I only put a squirt or to in there.I was hoping it fire off and start sucking gas threw,and to get everything moving.I was wrong.anyways,I heard it run after my no spark issue and Itvran like crap.so I took carb off for 2 nd time and now nothing.it has good compression,it'll suck thumb in and blow it back out.ill keep tinkering with it,anything thing else you can think of??oh,someone had mentioed being 180 out.are the lobes on cams up or down on compression stroke to check this?thanks again for your advice.

[kb0nly]

These carbs can be a real pain, but if the plug isn't getting wet then your problem is most definitely the carb, even if you have had it off twice... LOL

The lobes should be down on the cam for compression stroke, if they were up they would push the lifters and open the valves. Have you tried opening the carbs bowl drain and see if there is actually fuel in the carb? It could be dry from a stuck float or needle valve.

[oldskool83]

sounds like same issues I am having right now. carbs full of fuel but nothing going into cylinder. By any chance did you stuff anying into the intake cylinder? stupid but people do it all the time.

[captain2207]

Bowl is full with fresh gas.I'm going to recheck the timing.if it is 180 out,ill have to take the pulse generater?off end of cam to get it back to spot on?or will it move in such way that ill just have to adjust the pick-up?oldskool...I felt nothing down the intake.I'm no mechanic by any means,I can usally figure stuff out,but this has got me stumped,since I have heard it run.ill report back with my findings.

[redsox]

i'm no expert, but before you start checking the big things, check the small things. plug is dry, you're not getting gas. if it ran before, and the only thing you changed was the carb, how could you land on the timing being off now? it can definitely get frustrating, but check everything again, with an open mind. its gonna be a carb issue. something simple is simple to overlook.

[captain2207]

Original carb.it started with no/weak spark,that's resolved.it ran for a min I shut it off cause it ran like crap.took carb apart cleaned it and never started since.soaked it in berrymans,aerosol carb cleaner and compressed air.carb clean coming out holes opissit of where I'm spraying.pilot hey 2 turns out.I'm stumped.yes bowl is still full

[captain2207]

I also tried few squirts of gas in plug hole and nothing.

[redsox]

jets are clean and in the right place? where is the clip on your needle? did you say you had an issue with the slide? is that resolved? how about your idle adjust screw? is your throttle cable free? not binding? is the exhaust free and clear? no mouse nests. did you do a rebuild with a carb kit or are you using all the original stuff?

[captain2207]

All original stuff.first time I took apart it was pretty clean but I dipped carb clean then air to make sure.did this 5-6 times now.slide is good,no binding on cable etc.I'm thinking of timing because if its off intake cable be closed when it should be open?I smelled oil and smelled gas but I've squirted gas in plug hole.ill re smell with clean hands.oil doesn't look to thin as you would think if fuel is present.

[kb0nly]

As a quick check of the timing, and also to make sure things are working, pull off the valve cover caps and watch the valves while turning it over, are both valves moving on the intake and exhaust strokes?? If so then bring the flywheel around to the F mark so its on the compression stroke are both valves now closed? Its easy to tell because the springs won't be compressed.

[oscarmayer]

all he did was take carb off. so if he did not touch the rest of the motor, timing will be still good.
carb is not flowing properly. i have seem some old worn out carbs just not properly work anymore even with rebuild kits. also does the intake boot have any cracks? is the o-ring on the bottom of the intake and also on the bottom of the carb where it bolts to the intake? it could be sucking too much air if that o-ring fell off and not enough suction to pull fuel in.

[captain2207]

all he did was take carb off. so if he did not touch the rest of the motor, timing will be still good.
carb is not flowing properly. i have seem some old worn out carbs just not properly work anymore even with rebuild kits. also does the intake boot have any cracks? is the o-ring on the bottom of the intake and also on the bottom of the carb where it bolts to the intake? it could be sucking too much air if that o-ring fell off and not enough suction to pull fuel in.yup my rubber intake has got 2cracks right by the bolt holes.not sure if that's the problem or not.I looked in plug hole valve is opening.took intake off stuck finger and its moist.I'm thinking maybe a dirt dobbler/or some nest.I'm going to tear into it farther.

[captain2207]

First off big thank you for your guys input and experience with these machines.I walked away for couple of days and this morning it fired up on 3 pulls.I rechecked my timing and that was the culprit.being tired of screwing with it I defently over looked something.anyways it goes threw all gears like it should and absoultly no smoke.I'm proud of my $25 investment.thanks again every one