New Hampshire concealed carry

[redsox]

The Governor of New Hampshire just signed some pretty drastic changes into the gun laws up there. From what I understand, its UNRESTRICTED concealed carry now. Residents, non-residents, anyone at all. I'm a big gun-rights guy, but that seems a little bit crazy to me. On principle alone, i agree with it. Its good policy. But practical application,,, i'm not sure how things will work out in downtown Manchester. I really didn't think things would change as quickly as they seem to be changing. Thoughts?

[fabiodriven]

It's funny you post this today as we were just in NH yesterday and this was a very hot topic of discussion before the ride.

[ZacH_GrifF]

We got constitutional carry down here last year or year before that in MS and it's been fine. No problems. I just wish they would let us carry on Campus. I can also assure there were plenty of people carrying before they made it legal. People do what they want. Gun laws only hurt law abiding citizens.

[redsox]

It's funny you post this today as we were just in NH yesterday and this was a very hot topic of discussion before the ride.

i'm bummed out that i missed the ride. i had a wedding. its been a really busy jan/feb, but i think things will slow down for me a bit now. As for the gun laws, I'm not sure whats true and whats false as there is bad information everywhere. i don't understand how the new state law jives with fed law, specifically in regard to private sales. as for gun laws only hurting law abiding citizens,,, i'm not so sure of that. and, please understand, I'm a gun guy. I just can't imagine that if a cop encounters a gang member standing on main street with a gun in his waistband, that he can't identify him, nor is said gentleman compelled in any way to identify himself. i guess i'm just having trouble with where my own line is in the sand.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

I support it fully, in the city or in the sticks...All non-criminal US citizens enjoy constitutional rights no matter where they live. Deterrent systems work if the consequences are severe enough. ;)

[redsox]

agreed. but how do you determine non-criminal if there is no licensing?

[ZacH_GrifF]

In order for someone to buy a gun in general, excluding private sales, they'd have to pass a FBI background check. Reason I say it hurts law abiding citizens, is because criminals will get guns anyway they can. The more regulations you put on a law abiding person trying to get a gun, it just makes it harder and more expensive for them to access them. Again criminals will get guns anyway they can, laws don't apply to them.

[83ATC185]

agreed. but how do you determine non-criminal if there is no licensing?

That's why everyone needs a gun! The line between criminal and not a criminal can be judged by their actions in the moment.
There'd be far fewer criminals if they knew that for the one gun, they'd have 20 pointed at them, they would be a lot less bold to try any funny business that way.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

In order for someone to buy a gun in general, excluding private sales, they'd have to pass a FBI background check. Reason I say it hurts law abiding citizens, is because criminals will get guns anyway they can. The more regulations you put on a law abiding person trying to get a gun, it just makes it harder and more expensive for them to access them. Again criminals will get guns anyway they can, laws don't apply to them.

In my state, even private sales have to go through an FFL for the NICS check now.

It's all about the old trade-off between liberty and security. How much liberty are we willing to trade for security, especially when the security is usually only a "feel-good" type of thing that really isn't effective in the real world.

What NH just did is to take a step toward leveling the playing field between the good guys and the bad guys and reduced the target rich environment factor for the criminals.

[ironchop]

agreed. but how do you determine non-criminal if there is no licensing?
When I lived in Indiana, I had a CCW permit for two terms (4 yrs each). We weren't required to attend a class or be qualified outside of passing NICS check that was operated by the Indiana State Police and pay the fee.

Now you are required to keep the weapon concealed until needed and open carry was either discouraged or might have been illegal back then. I might be wrong about the latter but I do know it was highly discouraged because officers might respond in a hostile manner if they spy your weapon.

Even with a weapon permit, you still had to notify any officer you came into contact with in a law enforcement capacity that you were armed and licensed to carry concealed. They still disarmed you in alot of instances while they sort out whether your permit is current or not and I had been detained away from my carry weapon more than once while this happened. Your piece of license paper only gets you a tiny amount of leeway but basically in Indy you were treated like anyone else with a gun....Better safe than sorry. They also would not return my weapon to my hands after taking it. They lock it in your trunk and you can then drive off and retrieve it down the street some but they won't let you have it back from their hand to yours.

So that's how Indiana treats guns on citizens. Best way to not get shot is to tell them up front you're licensed and carrying but they're still going to take it away from you until they decide whether your a scumbag or not or had recently had your CCW revoked.

Now in Kentucky, open carry is legal for anyone who can legally possess a firearm. Concealed Carry is permissable with a long class and background check to obtain a license.

People near me do open carry and the police officers don't harass these ppl as long as they are not in any government facility, school, or other prohibited area while open carrying. Most people I know who carry legally do it concealed out of respect for other people's feelings and fears. Officers here seem to treat open carry (not brandishing) as if the person must be legally carrying if they are doing it openly so they give you the benefit of the doubt unless they have probable cause OUTSIDE of just openly carrying a gun to confront you at which point you get disarmed just like everyone else civilian until they sort it out.

So there's a few different examples of just my personal experiences, Redsox. I would guess that they would continue doing what they do now which is to treat everyone as potentially armed even when they don't appear to be and frisk them/ run that person's info over the radio whenever they have probable cause to do so which is virtually anytime the way these laws are written. Then they can determine what to do about the firearm possession but I don't see any way of being able to tell 'at a glance' since even permit holders don't wear the permit clipped next to their pistol.

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[Dirtcrasher]

I saw that today on OAN news; I thought to myself "this is crazy??!!" but I guess it works for them.

I still want to get my license, and or concealed carry.

When I go out for my payments of rent, I have a FAT pocket and I'm surprised no one has jumped me yet.

Now, I'm not a big GANJA smoker, but I do like it from time to time; as a sleeping aid, different strains are great!!

But, I'm told (and with the new administration it seems that it will be enforced on the Federal level) that if I have a Ganja medical card, I cannot have a firearm.

I don't like feeling like I'm not safe and I don't have a ganja card; I need to talk to the police about the whole situation.

But arming EVERYONE LEGALLY, That's CRAZY!!!! Live free or die baby!!

[RIDE-RED 250r]

I saw that today on OAN news; I thought to myself "this is crazy??!!" but I guess it works for them.

I still want to get my license, and or concealed carry.

When I go out for my payments of rent, I have a FAT pocket and I'm surprised no one has jumped me yet.

Now, I'm not a big GANJA smoker, but I do like it from time to time; as a sleeping aid, different strains are great!!

But, I'm told (and with the new administration it seems that it will be enforced on the Federal level) that if I have a Ganja medical card, I cannot have a firearm.

I don't like feeling like I'm not safe and I don't have a ganja card; I need to talk to the police about the whole situation.

But arming EVERYONE LEGALLY, That's CRAZY!!!! Live free or die baby!!

Why is that crazy Steve? The founders not only found that idea to be not crazy, but they enshrined and protected that natural tight in the constitution. And they were right to do so.

But you are putting a weird spin on the thing anyway, nobody is arming anyone. Nobody is being forced or compelled to carry. They have simply placed handguns back into the same category as long guns in many states. You have to be of age to buy and pass a NICS check. So what???

As a NY pistol license holder I can tell you the hoops you have to jump through AT YOUR OWN EXPENSE I MIGHT ADD to get a handgun license here is in fact infringement. And then you still have a hassle every time you wish to buy or sell a handgun. You see, I cannot simply go to my LGS, show my pistol license, pay for the piece and walk out the door with it, no Sir. I have to pay for said handgun, take the bill of sale to county pistol license office, have the pistol added to my license list (make, model, serial, caliber) and then he gives me a little green ticket that authorizes my dealer to turn the handgun over to me. Likewise I must have my list amended any time I sell a handgun and if it's a private sale I cannot turn the handgun over till I get his ticket from the pistol office authorizing me to hand it over... My county and state knows the details of every handgun I own and I think it is none of their business and an infringement!

Look, we can debate whether or not this is the right course of action till we are all blue in the face... Constitutionally speaking it IS the right thing to do. But beyond that, criminals who want firearms will ALWAYS find a way to acquire them. And anyone who thinks that is not the case is beyond help and not worthy of participation in an intelligent conversation on the subject....

Check this out, less than 5 minutes. The way the left attempts to slice and dice 2a, it really comes down to basic reading comprehension....
https://www.prageru.com/courses/political-science/gun-ownership-right

[redsox]

I did a little reading today. Not much, but a little. The way I understand the new law is that I can go into a gun shop in NH and buy what I like. I am not a NH resident. But i'm not required to disclose anything about myself, so residency does not matter. Its still a violation of federal law to carry into Massachusetts without the proper licensing, but that is not on New Hampshire to worry about. I think, and again, not certain, but i think this change effectivly negates the Massachusetts Attorney General's (un)banned firearm list. For those unfamiliar, the AG in Mass has a list of guns that can be sold in Massachusetts. Its a loophole disguised as consumer protection. Basically, the AG makes stipulations such as "13+ pound trigger pull", "safety", and "chamber check" requirements. Not only that, but manufacturers must submit weapons for testing and pay outrageous costs for the process. Most manufacturers have decided that the relatively small Massachusetts market is not worth the hassle. The Ruger LCP is one such gun, for example. The LIST, as it is known, severely limits what residents can buy. But, it is not illegal to own them. It is illegal for a shop to sell them. So, for those of you following along at home, if i can go into a shop in New Hampshire and buy a Ruger LCP and drive into Massachusetts, where i am licensed to own a Ruger LCP, then what law have i broken? Granted, prior to this change, I could still buy a Ruger LCP in New Hampshire. But, i'd need to have it transferred to a shop in Massachusetts because I could not carry it out of the shop in New Hampshire. it was illegal for the shop in Massachusetts to then transfer it to me because of the AG's LIST. Now, there is nothing stopping me from walking out of the shop with the LCP, or AK, or AR-15. Its pretty good in that respect for guys like me. I guess i'm just having a hard time figuring out how the cops up there are gonna handle ten armed felons on the corner in manchester. I can't wrap my mind around it.

[Bren_downe]

Maine has had the Concealed carry law for about a year. Nothing has changed. Everybody was probably carrying before anyway. Now we have the legal Herb too. We're New England trend setters. Whoddathunk it?
We also have moxie and Allens coffee brandy so we're still cooler than the rest of ya!
240225240226

[Dirtcrasher]

Hell, I'm not spinning ANYTHING!!!!!????

I'm just curious how the 2 laws will interact. (Hopefully my Methamphetamines price drops :lol:)

I see States with super strict gun laws but tons of crime....

Illegal to carry, TONS of gun related issues. It's not the guns doing it!!!!!!!

[RIDE-RED 250r]

Well, when one state moves in the direction of upholding the constitution and individual rights, frankly I don't care a rip how that states laws will or will not interact with neighboring states that infringe on those rights with draconian regulations saddled upon the honest citizen. I live in one of the top states for infringing gun regulation and I applaud states like NH for doing what they did

[ironchop]

Kentucky had a bill pass the house recently but was pulled from the agenda suddenly.

It was to legalize concealed carry in Kentucky for anyone who can legally possess a firearm rather than requiring the license and class.

Honestly I agree that it moves us in the right direction in one respect. If you can legally possess a firearm, you can get a concealed carry license. If you couldn't get a CCW, then you are already banned from buying or possessing guns so the licensing is redundant. I do, however, like the class requirements because the class ensures that you can safely operate the gun you're going to carry (you're required to bring it to class), to teach you how to clean and maintain the gun, teach you when it's OK to use deadly force legally and when it's not, and finally some live fire range instruction. I think it lasts eight hours.

Growing up in Indiana, our school taught all of us firearm safety for six weeks sponsored by the INDNR. I'm pretty sure that got discontinued in today's cater-to-the-cowardly political climate.

I like Freedom but I think some education would be a good idea too.


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[RIDE-RED 250r]

Yes I agree, a class to ensure someone is familiar with their firearm and when it is justified to use it is a good thing. No problem with that really. It's not unlike mandatory hunter education courses which I also believe to be a good thing.

[RIDE-RED 250r]

You have NH doing what they did, meanwhile here in NY the progressive anti-2a, anti-constitution, anti-liberty movement marches onward: http://www.whec.com/news/gun-owners-liability-insurance-state/4412837/


Where would you rather live???

[83ATC185]

"Having safeguards in place is just common sense. It's just common sense."

Common sense? Holding an innocent person responsible for a criminals actions after that criminal stole from the firearm owner and killed someone with said stolen item doesn't exactly scream common sense.

I gotta say if i'm looking down the barrel of a gun, i don't much give a trailprotrailprotrailprotrailpro whose name matches the number. Hold up there before you blow me away chief we gotta make sure that gun actually belongs to you or the owner of that gun is gonna be in biggg trouble.

Yes i think education is an excellent idea. It only takes one generation of people to grow up thinking guns are bad evil things, and then they multiply. Being from the sticks its hard for me to believe there are people all over this country that have never been taught gun safety or so much as held one. Pops had me out there shooting beer cans with a 12ga at 11 years old...

Its funny when you think about it, people probably own three times as many guns as they did 20 years ago. They create their own "problems".

[redsox]

https://youtu.be/_lji-LmNiVg