CRF 450x trike

[socs28]

So I picked up this bike today. 241558241559

It's going to become a trike. I've been wanting to do this a long time. I'd love to have input on my thoughts. I'd like to know before I head down a road someone else has that hits a dead end.

I'm looking at VTX 1800 triples, atc 250r front hub/tire. Wondering what works for a brake setup.

Custom swingarm that fits the CRF shock and pivot and then trx rear end. Suggestions on where to get that done welcome.

Modify the trx subframe to fit, does the yfz fit better?

Obviously just getting started, so hoping for some thoughts.

[Dirtcrasher]

You change your front end to new clamps with a couple adapters in the front end. Try the VTX, can't hurt; Might work great!

The rear requires a custom length swingarm and shock mount location that result in the correct seat height....

[Shawn Powell]

You can get a ton of that done or parts from TPC trikes now that you have a donor. They sell everything from conversions to full on chrome alloy frames. Looking forward to see the results.


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[plevib]

I've heard many many bad things about tpc recently...... just a warning. Look into it before you buy from them. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/d45b46e42e6a2d0338cce50afed599cd.jpg
Here's a set of vtx triples with yz450 forks that I've been working on for a conversion. I had to bore out the bottom and make an adapter for the top clamps. They look really good and I think they'll work really well. I haven't tackled the front hub yet. I had an extra 200x hub for a test fit but it won't fit without some modification. I may make a new hub instead. You will need access to a lathe to do your front axle and hub

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[plevib]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/09d828c06243804b376e5130af3c789a.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/3b1e9d2d1a561bc2348a49d3a7c3664d.jpg
Here's a couple pictures of Richards hub setup on one of his yz conversions. Best I can tell he modified a 350x hub and made a brake adapter. But again I may just make a new hub to save the headache

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[plevib]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/43ac76becae1b2aca09069562d28d030.jpg
I just had this idea! It looks like a yfz front hub could easily be used for a 3 wheeler hub! You'd just have to make an axle and brake caliper bracket. You'd have readily available bearings and brake parts, and you would use the 10 inch yfz front wheel which would give you plenty of tire options!

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[Dirtcrasher]

^ Probably cannot center the wheel due to the offset.....

[socs28]

I'm also looking at yfz year ends, supposedly they are easier, so I am going to get a used one from my local shop to check out. I have an 85 atc 250r front hub so I am going to work from that for the front end.

[big specht]

And with the quad hub I wounded if the bearing spacing is as wide as the atc frt hubs cause that would be a lot of stress on the axle. It would be more likely to bend. But if it works it be easier to make one of those fit than the atc hubs. I would see if you could borrow one to at least mock it up to know for sure

[OZQUAD44]

^ Probably cannot center the wheel due to the offset.....

That would just be a matter of shimming the hub on the axle to centralise the tyre.

I've been thinking of using a quad hub for my mini trike project. I think the challenge will be getting the calliper to sit correctly


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[socs28]

So I found out a friend has an extra trx 450 swingarm, so I am going to have the front of the crf swingarm grafted to the back of the trx swingarm. I'll keep the crf shock and linkage. It'll end up a +4 from the stock trx. The next difficulty on that will be sprocket alignment. Any input from someone us used the trx swingarm on this would be great. It looks like it is about 1/2 an inch off.

[plevib]

And with the quad hub I wounded if the bearing spacing is as wide as the atc frt hubs cause that would be a lot of stress on the axle. It would be more likely to bend. But if it works it be easier to make one of those fit than the atc hubs. I would see if you could borrow one to at least mock it up to know for sure
Well, they're about 15 bucks on ebay with the rotor so I'll just take the plunge haha.... I think with some good spacers to help the axle it could be just as strong as the stock atc stuff. I would have go I imagine the modern alloys are stronger than 30 year old atc hubs too

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[big specht]

Well keep us posted on how it comes out. 15 isn't bad I've pissed more and that way lol

[pervO]

Kasey already did that in http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php/151234-new-dune-edition-3-wheeler he took two hubs and butted them together, and with the magic and power of a lathe got everything to work. Ive also been trying to do the inverts on a TRI Z im waiting on my 250R hub to come in the mail. With the VTX triples everything is really tight hub wise. Most custom triple tree set ups guys are going 11.5 inches center to center. With the VTX triples its 10 inches and some change. (I cant remember) I used 1989 Honda CR250 forks on mine. They are shorter than newer forks at 36 3/8 in length and the bottoms fit the VTX triples the tops are a little big. Forks measure 55mm on the upper and 57mm on the lower.

EDIT: I used Valkyrie triples.

[plevib]

Kasey already did that in http://www.3wheelerworld.com/showthread.php/151234-new-dune-edition-3-wheeler he took two hubs and butted them together, and with the magic and power of a lathe got everything to work. Ive also been trying to do the inverts on a TRI Z im waiting on my 250R hub to come in the mail. With the VTX triples everything is really tight hub wise. Most custom triple tree set ups guys are going 11.5 inches center to center. With the VTX triples its 10 inches and some change. (I cant remember) I used 1989 Honda CR250 forks on mine. They are shorter than newer forks at 36 3/8 in length and the bottoms fit the VTX triples the tops are a little big. Forks measure 55mm on the upper and 57mm on the lower.
No, I'm saying just use the front hub without cutting it down, I know he used two hubs for one of his conversions. But the space issue is why I'm going to try it with a stock yfz hub. It'll be significantly easier to make a custom caliper bracket than to make a custom disc adapter and modify the hub. Plus the biggest advantage, 10 inch front wheel! :D

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[Dirtcrasher]

That would just be a matter of shimming the hub on the axle to centralise the tyre.

I've been thinking of using a quad hub for my mini trike project. I think the challenge will be getting the calliper to sit correctly


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shimming the hub on the axle to centralise

That's the thing, if you move things , like sprockets and or rotors, You have to space or take material off everything.

And long spacers don't like being on brakes. They do not work.... IMHO

[OZQUAD44]

shimming the hub on the axle to centralise

That's the thing, if you move things , like sprockets and or rotors, You have to space or take material off everything.

And long spacers don't like being on brakes. They do not work.... IMHO

Yes that is the challenge, positioning the rotor.

But I don't think it's impossible, especially given the offset of the wheel. Flipping the rim over from its normal position will place the rotor closer to the fork leg.

So in effect, the hub will not be central on the axle, but this will not be an issue as long as the the tyre tread is central to the axle.

I'm so looking forward to completing my mini trike conversion to test this theory.


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[Dirtcrasher]

All you can do is try.....

[plevib]

All you can do is try.....
That's my philosophy haha.....

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[KASEY]

No, I'm saying just use the front hub without cutting it down, I know he used two hubs for one of his conversions. But the space issue is why I'm going to try it with a stock yfz hub. It'll be significantly easier to make a custom caliper bracket than to make a custom disc adapter and modify the hub. Plus the biggest advantage, 10 inch front wheel! :D

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the dual quad hubs i used is on a set of vtx clamps a single hub will never work,, to narrow,,,, there is room it just takes work to get it right ,,, all of these have vtx clamps some with 250r hubs too but you have to do a little machine work to them

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[joefixit0]

Here's my front brake setup using vtx triples and yz forks. I used a late 200x front hub and rotor and kx80 front caliper. I machined the hub so I could run the wheel on the other side in order to get it centered. Also made an adapter to attach kx caliper to yz forks. So far works great. Yamaha xs 1100 rear axle with slight modification is almost perfect for front axle when using yz forks.
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[plevib]

Here's my front brake setup using vtx triples and yz forks. I used a late 200x front hub and rotor and kx80 front caliper. I machined the hub so I could run the wheel on the other side in order to get it centered. Also made an adapter to attach kx caliper to yz forks. So far works great. Yamaha xs 1100 rear axle with slight modification is almost perfect for front axle when using yz forks.
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Hey! That xs 1100 axle, what work did you have to do to make it fit? That's a very helpful post!

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[joefixit0]

Plevib, the xs axle is the correct length and diameter for the yz forks, I had to turn down the big end of it slightly so that it would clamp in the forks. Also had to change the bearing in the hub to a 42x20x12mm bearing to fit the larger axle.

[socs28]

Kasey, is there any chance you could describe the machine work you had to do with the 250r hub? That is the route I am planning on trying first. I've changed my direction on the swingarm. I am going the yfz route, trying to figure out how to use the bushing that is on the outside of the crf bearings to help preserve the frame. With the dust seal it's bigger than the yfz tube. Someone please tell me if I'm crazy, but I'm considering cutting the front of the crf swingarm off, just the tubes that the bolt goes through and then welding it to the yfz after cutting the front tubes off of that and trimming it to the same width. Is that going to cause strength problems?

[socs28]

So, progress, I'm having Tyson Racing do a custom swingarm crf holes for the pivot bolt to go through, +2 of a yfz from there to the bearing carrier housing, and trx housing. That should be here this week. Working on the front end, pressing the steering stem out of the crf was a bear, but it's now in the lower vtx triple. ground off the vtx steering stop and the key lock. Will have to put steering stops back on once it's more together. The top triple is a mm too big, so I've got shim stock to fill that. Better ideas welcome. The bottom triple is a mm too small and won't spread that far. It is getting bored. On the axle, I'm having a busing made 2 1/2 inches long the inside diameter of a 250r axle and the outside diameter of the fat end of the crf axle. the fat end of the 250r axle is the same diameter as the small side of the crf fork hole, so no it'll just be a matter of cutting bushings and spacers to center everything. I'm using the 250r brake disk and cutting it down for my adapter to fit the crf brake disk. Looks like it should work well. My other option was to have a new plate made that was the diameter of the crf with the center of the 250r, but I thought having an extra little bit of room for the brake caliper would be a good thing. I am using a Douglas 11" rim. Definitely feeling the pain of not having my own machine shop, and the ability to weld aluminum.

[Matt85'350x]

So, progress, I'm having Tyson Racing do a custom swingarm crf holes for the pivot bolt to go through, +2 of a yfz from there to the bearing carrier housing, and trx housing. That should be here this week. Working on the front end, pressing the steering stem out of the crf was a bear, but it's now in the lower vtx triple. ground off the vtx steering stop and the key lock. Will have to put steering stops back on once it's more together. The top triple is a mm too big, so I've got shim stock to fill that. Better ideas welcome. The bottom triple is a mm too small and won't spread that far. It is getting bored. On the axle, I'm having a busing made 2 1/2 inches long the inside diameter of a 250r axle and the outside diameter of the fat end of the crf axle. the fat end of the 250r axle is the same diameter as the small side of the crf fork hole, so no it'll just be a matter of cutting bushings and spacers to center everything. I'm using the 250r brake disk and cutting it down for my adapter to fit the crf brake disk. Looks like it should work well. My other option was to have a new plate made that was the diameter of the crf with the center of the 250r, but I thought having an extra little bit of room for the brake caliper would be a good thing. I am using a Douglas 11" rim. Definitely feeling the pain of not having my own machine shop, and the ability to weld aluminum.
Thanks for sharing. I'm very interested in how you're going to setup the axle, hub, and brakes.

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[Bottomland4x4]

Here in my 2008 450x trike front end. I had triples made instead of using vtx triples. It does cost a but more but you end up with a nice setup. 10 inch wheel and 250r hub. Waiting on a custom swingarm for the rear.

[Dirtcrasher]

So, progress, I'm having Tyson Racing do a custom swingarm crf holes for the pivot bolt to go through, +2 of a yfz from there to the bearing carrier housing, and trx housing. That should be here this week. Working on the front end, pressing the steering stem out of the crf was a bear, but it's now in the lower vtx triple. ground off the vtx steering stop and the key lock. Will have to put steering stops back on once it's more together. The top triple is a mm too big, so I've got shim stock to fill that. Better ideas welcome. The bottom triple is a mm too small and won't spread that far. It is getting bored. On the axle, I'm having a busing made 2 1/2 inches long the inside diameter of a 250r axle and the outside diameter of the fat end of the crf axle. the fat end of the 250r axle is the same diameter as the small side of the crf fork hole, so no it'll just be a matter of cutting bushings and spacers to center everything. I'm using the 250r brake disk and cutting it down for my adapter to fit the crf brake disk. Looks like it should work well. My other option was to have a new plate made that was the diameter of the crf with the center of the 250r, but I thought having an extra little bit of room for the brake caliper would be a good thing. I am using a Douglas 11" rim. Definitely feeling the pain of not having my own machine shop, and the ability to weld aluminum.

Here in my 2008 450x trike front end. I had triples made instead of using vtx triples. It does cost a but more but you end up with a nice setup. 10 inch wheel and 250r hub. Waiting on a custom swingarm for the rear.

I'm glad you just decided to buy new clamps. Most cast fork clamps are difficult at best to clamp down and set up for boring.

And if you buy a TIG for aluminum, try to take a class or get lots of 6061 scraps to practice on. I still wouldn't do any critical aluminum welding; I'm just not great at it yet and I need more practice....

[socs28]

Update, my swingarm arrived yesterday, so I will be starting the assembly tonight hopefully. I have to figure out my bearing situation, because it doesn't have the wider outer section of the front tubes like the crf does, it's more straight like the yfz, so I am hoping that a combination of the crf and yfz parts will fit together. I'll be stopping by the local Yamaha shop this afternoon to look things over.

[socs28]

So, the only things that are the same diameter between the yfz and crf are the inside of the bearings/outside of the collars. The crf bearings outside are a mm larger than the yfz and the crf pivot bolt is larger than the yfz pivot bolt. So, Since my swingarm is based on the yfz front, just the width of the crf, I'm going to use the whole yfz setup. I don't have the yfz pivot bolt yet, so I'll let you know what will need to be modified there when I get one.

[socs28]

Updates, I'll get pictures as I take it apart and put it back together. We ended up shaving 1/4" off the front brake support to center the front wheel, still have to trim the spacers to finish the front up. Waiting on my bar risers so I can run the forks a little high through the triples. I'm going to try to hookup the quad switches this weekend. We finished the subframe today by grafting the front of the crf subframe into the rear of the trx subframe. I think it came out really well. I ride sand so we will be doing a no airbox kit. I am now struggling with the exhaust. It seems with fitting the quad seat where looks right on the crf tank, it shortens the overall length and it looks like I need to cut about 3 inches out of the pipe. I'm not liking that idea. Also, the space to fit the pipe between the spring and the frame is very tight and is limiting my options. Did people that have done this with a yfz spring or the crf spring use an 06 up pipe or the 04-05? I also still need to mount the front fender. I am going to put everything together with the stock crf pipe this weekend so I can test ride it. Honestly, I am a little concerned about my rake angle. It feels a little stretched.

[socs28]

Update, it is pretty much together, the exhaust turned out to be way more of a pain than I had expected. I haven't seen anyone mention anything about it, but an aftermarket trx pipe, just does not fit without modification, so modify we did. I also went to a fox yfz shock with remote reservoir, that helped a lot. It needs a refill, which I should be getting done today. I think I'll be moving to an R frame instead of the X to steepen the rake angle a bit.

[socs28]

Uploading a couple photos. I am going to restart a thread as a build thread and go in as much detail as I can. Probably next week. When I move to the R frame this winter, I'll post pictures of modified parts. I had to go back to the crf shock because the yfz spring was too soft so especially with the X frame it was too raked out.244766244767

[Poco Loco]

Nice to see people making custom builds...What are your plans for the kick starter? You gonna cut out the rear fender or make the plastics hinge up and back? Would be cool to install a TRX 450 motor into the frame and have it kick forward. The gearing would be much better for a trike too. Just courious over here.

[Matt85'350x]

Uploading a couple photos. I am going to restart a thread as a build thread and go in as much detail as I can. Probably next week. When I move to the R frame this winter, I'll post pictures of modified parts. I had to go back to the crf shock because the yfz spring was too soft so especially with the X frame it was too raked out.244766244767

Anxiously waiting the more detailed pics.

[socs28]

I'm sorry I haven't gotten more pics out yet...life, you know. They will come. Poco Loco, on the kick start I was really excited about having it as a backup, and if I turned my foot just right it actually cleared. My plan was to cut it and rebend like another member had done. However, at some point putting things together I had loaded the bike into the truck and couldn't get it out of first gear. Come to find out, one of the nubs inside the case that the inside parts of the kick start screw into had broken off and lodged under the shift lever. So, at this point, it has no kick start. My understanding is the trx motor is wider and won't fit in this frame, but the X gearing works well anyway. 1st gear is the same as the quad and then it slowly widens out from there. At this point my only complaint would be the motor doesn't quite have enough to pull the top of 5th hard going into a stiff wind or on soft sand, so all that means is more power right? :) I plan on putting the R valves/Cam in it and see where it is then. If that's enough I'll probably leave it there. It already has a DASA pipe and air box eliminated. If I still need more than I'll have it ported.

[socs28]

OK, going to do my best to line out what went into the build. I'll start with the swingarm, I had Tyson Racing build it. He used the diameter of the yfz for the front tube, but I sent him these dimensions to set it up. Sprocket side tube is 49.85mm, 94.85mm gap in the middle, and 50.75mm tube on the side opposite the sprocket. These were with my digital micrometer, I'm guessing it's really supposed to be 50, 95, and 51, but what I used worked. I also had him make the gap for the knuckle attachment be 42mm to match the crf knuckle. If I use the yfz knuckle then it will need to be shimmed. I did end up using the YFZ dogbone part of the linkage because the offset wasn't right for the CRF. It bolted right on, but I am shimming (for now with washers) between it and the back knuckle mount.

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He then did the main part of the swingarm with +2 yfz dimensions, then used the trx bearing carrier housing. I got the chain guide mounted locally and had to move the brake stay nub forward a bit. He got the sprocket alignment right on. For the bearings, I ended up getting a blaster/banshee kit, including the bolt, because the yfz dust covers on the end are too big for the chromalloy tubing. I lathed down the collars to the proper length, this was done through the guess and check method after getting as close a measurement as I could. Make sure you get a thin dirt bike chain, a standard chain will rub on your case. We also ended up with a banshee front chain rub that we had to dremel out to fit around the swingarm, it's just a doughnut. Lastly on the bolt, we ground a washer to fit the CRF frame and welded it to the end of the bolt because you can't get a socket in to hold it in to tighten it down. It's meant to use the frame as the stop. I believe that's it for the swingarm.

The triples are VTX, we had to move the steering stem over from the CRF, then used the CRF bearings. The bottom fork holes has to be bored 1mm and the top has to be shimmed. I used 3 wraps of .5mm aluminum It should only have to go 1mm, but that is what worked. We had to grind off the VTX steering stop and put our own on.

The front hub is 86 250R, we ground off the nub for the odometer. We used the 250R axle and then had a spacer made to fit around the threaded end to fit the hole in the CRF fork. The stock atc spacers on the axle were lathed to the proper length and we found a nut that fit the threading to lock it on. We ended up having to take a 1/4" off the mount for the front brake caliper to fit with the centered wheel and then welded the ATC front brake disk to the CRF disk to make that work. We used the original ATC front tire/wheel dimensions, which are an 11 x 8 inch wheel. This made fitting very tight. going with the new quad 10x7 would give much better clearance, but I wanted the size of the ATC for riding reasons. You can see in the last picture that the tire rubs slightly on the fork when you bottom out, centering is very important.

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I used the trx front brake lever/reservoir, because the crf won't fit around a thumb throttle. I have setup the quad start button/kill/light switches, which was a challenge, because the wiring is quite different. I can detail that later if anyone wants it.

All my welding was done by John's Custom Fabrication in Coos Bay, Oregon. I mention it here because the most involved part was the subframe, they did a great job. We ended up measuring the height of a trx and working for that. We took the TRX and CRF subframes and grafted them together. I'm not sure this would be durable enough for dirt, but we ride sand all the time and I believe it will be OK. I'm attaching pictures to try to show this as best as we can. The most difficult part was clearing the shock reservoir. If/When I get a stiffer spring for the YFZ remote reservoir shock, this wouldn't be a problem.

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The pipe was a problem, I don't know if an 04/05 would fit better. Maybe using a CRF header with a trx muffler, I don't know, but it was a problem, so we ended up cutting, bending and rewelding the header. With the CRF shock reservoir it is actually touching, but it does make it through. I will be wrapping it, but haven't gotten to that yet.

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For pegs, we merged the CRF plate to a YFZ blingstar peg. I like them quite well so far. I wanted to maintain the breakaway feature of the CRF/ATC.

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I have added the trailtech fan because it didn't like the treeshots too well without it, it's done fine since. I am waiting on an IMS 3.2 gallon tank, but I'm concerned it's not going to fit with the fan.

Hopefully that helps some people as there was a good amount of trial and error, I am sure I could have saved well over $500 if I had known some of these things up front, as now I have a number of useless parts lying around, but I guess that's the way it goes.

[socs28]

Updated pic, the only think I've done since this is switch to the IMS 3.2Gal tank which fits...just barely with the TT fan and just bumps on the left side fork, but I think once I switch the R frame the rake change may fix it.
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[Dirtcrasher]

I'm sure you said it before, but what are those forks made for?? Just the dirt bike??

[socs28]

Yes, the forks are off the dirt bike.