New voltage regulator (2 wire) for 350x, 250r, 200x and more.

[ps2fixer]

I'm working with a new supplier and came across this AC voltage regulator. I'm ordering a few from them to test out on my 350x. I know the terminals are wrong, but I modify wiring on parts all the time for my business.

I'll be charging $110 shipped within the USA, if you're interested, please post/pm so I can get an idea for my next order size. I'm not doing a group buy since I'm not a huge fan of them, and I'll be able to front the money for the order anyway even if I have to sell off some investments to cover it.

https://i.gyazo.com/420019b4ba56902a3f96faf53d922f6a.png

The machine it's listed for is an 91-2000 XR600R and 2000-2007 XR650R. I checked the specs on the 600R and it puts out 230w, so it will work for any 3 wheeler that needs a voltage regulator and is single phase (single coil lighting coil) generally 1 or 2 wire. The same company sells 3 phase regulator/rectifiers, and some single phase regulator/rectifiers, I'll be checking into them later. I currently do not have a price on these, but will be testing one out on my atc350x.


Replacement for stock voltage regulators by part number. I'll modify the wiring to match the stock setup. From photos, these look like a near perfect match size and shape wise.

31410-HA2-670 (W/Y Male, G Female)

1986 ATC200X
1986 ATC250R


31410-HB5-670, 31410-HB5-671, 31410-KZ1-680 (W/Y + G 2.8mm 2 pin male connector)

1987 ATC200X
1986-1989 TRX250R
1987-1992 TRX200X



31400-KE1-008,31400-KG0-008,31400-KJ2-670 (W/Y Male, G Male)

1985 ATC250R
1985-1986 ATC350X
1986-1987 TLR200
1984-1986 XL250R
1984-1985 XL350R


31400-MN1-680 (W/Y Double Female, G Double Female)

1991-2000 XR600R
2000-2007 XR650R



I'm brainstorming a bit, but I know LED's are a big thing, so these regulators would be a great key to make LED headlights closer to plug and play. Some LED's can handle AC, some might not do well with AC, but none of them that I know of can handle unregulated voltages. Here's a list of machines off the top of my head that needs atleast a voltage regulator for running LED lights. If I'm missing any, let me know. I'd like to get this data sorted out the best we can. Clearly these are designed for 12v systems, so 6v machines they wouldn't work well on unless converted to 12v. Clearly I'd have to work out a mounting point and how to add the regulator to the harness, but this should be a solid list of machines that has a potential need for this part. Added bonus, even if they aren't switched to LED, a voltage regulator on it's own would protect bulbs from blowing, like if a headlight blows, the rest of the bulbs won't blow.

Machines that don't have voltage regulators (checked atv's through 1987)

1973-1985 ATC70 - with 12v/CDI kit
1986-1987 TRX70 - not 100% sure if 6v or 12v lighting coil, 1987 wire diagram does not show a lighting coil, was it removed for this year?
1981-1985 ATC110
1980 ATC185
1981-1983 ATC185S
1981-1983 ATC200
1984-1986 ATC200S
1983-1985 ATC200X
1981-1984 ATC250R
1977-1984 FL250



I'll update this post as things progress with this voltage regulator. I'm pretty sure the testing on my machine will be good so that's why I've made this post.

[MrConcdid]

Thank you PS2Fixer,
Thanks a lot of information for sure.
That one looks very close to OE for sure.

MrC.

[Maico]

How about the '85-'86 Honda 250SX ??

[ATC King]

Is the 250SX a three phase system with a DC CDI?

If so, I'd just look at using a reg/rec from the currently produced XR650L. OEM is still available, and aftermarket for those wanting a lower price option.

https://www.partzilla.com/product/honda/31600-MY6-671?ref=d76e12c2a9235284a50838764ee36901b0358a86

There are MOSFET options, if someone would prefer that over a shunt.

A three phase system opens up more and better aftermarket choices, because that's pretty much what motorcycles and larger ATVs have been using the past several decades.

[ATC King]

Thank's ps2fixer again for the work you do fining and producing electrical components.


You mentioned the machines that don't have a regulator, like the 110,185,200S,E,M,ES series, which is why I added one to my YTM200K.

Another good reason is there are some more powerful lighting coils available for the non-regulated ATCs, like this one.
https://www.rickystator.com/product/honda/honda/honda-atc185-75-watt-lighting-coil-all-years

I haven't used one of the higher output coils and don't recall anyone on here mentioning what the open, unregulated voltage is at high RPM, and the voltage with all stock lights functioning at the same high RPM.

[ps2fixer]

Thank you PS2Fixer,
Thanks a lot of information for sure.
That one looks very close to OE for sure.

MrC.

I started a couple new columns in my specs database, stator type (phase count + ground style) and regulator type (none, voltage regulator, 1 or 3 phase regulator + full wave rectifier, etc). I ran through the Honda 3 wheeler models last night. I'll have to dig into the wire diagrams for the other brands some time too, since this is a fairly universal part, just has to be able to connect to the wiring. I've been looking for one that would 100% work with the 350x 200w alternator then use the same part for all 3 wheelers to keep things as simple as possible. Worst case, it's over speced for like an atc200s which puts out only 50w. Should make it ultra reliable vs over driving a part that who knows what it was designed to handle from China. I'm pretty excited to have found this part. The next thing after this is to find a solid voltage regulator/rectifier that can handle the 200w single phase stator like the 350x has so the power is rectified DC and is even closer to ideal for LED's. That part would be a requirement for adding batteries to machines too, that or a high amp diode to make a half wave rectifier (half capacity of the alternator too).

The hole in the unit is slightly different for the 350x/250r etc, but if it's mounted with a bolt, just a longer bolt is needed, shouldn't be a big deal. I hope the other dimensions match up to the stock unit so it fits the rubber holders well. If needed I could always look up the mounting bolt for the xr600r bikes and include that with the regulator, and if the mounting size is off, maybe I can find a holder that would fit well.




How about the '85-'86 Honda 250SX ??

The 85-87 ATC250SX had a 3 phase stator so stock it has a voltage regulator + rectifier. The device above is purely a voltage regulator, you can't use a battery with it. The supplier does sell regulator/rectifiers, but I want to tackle this more one at a time. As for LED's, the 250sx has a battery stock, so it's a DC system, basically every LED light should work fine.

[ps2fixer]

Thank's ps2fixer again for the work you do fining and producing electrical components.


You mentioned the machines that don't have a regulator, like the 110,185,200S,E,M,ES series, which is why I added one to my YTM200K.

Another good reason is there are some more powerful lighting coils available for the non-regulated ATCs, like this one.
https://www.rickystator.com/product/honda/honda/honda-atc185-75-watt-lighting-coil-all-years

I haven't used one of the higher output coils and don't recall anyone on here mentioning what the open, unregulated voltage is at high RPM, and the voltage with all stock lights functioning at the same high RPM.

Not a problem, I don't have a normal job, I'm purely self employed, so offering value is what I do as a business, the hope is that by creating value I can collect wealth (income) as well.

On the ATC250SX CDI, they are AC powered off the exciter coil in the stator. Every Honda 3 wheeler has an exciter coil, aka the CDI is AC powered. DC powered CDI's exist on later model machines, first one I can think of is either the TRX350, or TRX350D had a DC CDI, the other one had an AC one. The DC CDI's have a performance advantage, but the inverter inside them creates a lot of heat and if the key is left on they can burn up with no air flow it seems like. The AC based CDI's don't have that problem, the tiny amount of heat generated is next to nothing (a charging capacitor, few diodes, and the SCR that acts as an electrical switch).

I've been trying to add that detail in my specs database too. One column is labeled for ignition type, at first I put CDI vs Points, but lately been putting if it's AC or DC CDI since that's really good to know. The easiest way to validate DC vs AC is to look at the wires from the stator, the typical 1-3 wires for the lighting system is basically always there, then if the pulse generator is on the fly wheel, 2 wires from that generally (blue/white + green), and another wire for the exciter coil, on the 6v machines it seems to be black, on the newer machines they tend to run black/red. If the black or black/red wire isn't on the machine, fair chances it's DC CDI, atleast for the case of Honda machines.

I didn't think about the higher output stators, that's a valid point, if a higher output stator is installed but stock lights, they will blow, so a voltage regulator would protect them and allow the option to upgrade lighting later too.

I also read a nice pdf file not long ago searching for this stuff, it appeared like it was some sort of college course for atv repair. It never dawned on me that the alternator/generator is the whole assembly while the rotor (sometimes flywheel) and the stator are the individual parts of the alternator. Makes sense though, that's the same term for electric motor stators.

I also agree, the 3 phase design opens up a lot more options, biggest thing to get past is adapting the wiring to match up and mounting the regulator. The MOSFET vs Shunt is an interesting point. It's been a while since I looked at power supply design, but isn't the MOSFET design the swich mode power supply (switches on/off extremely fast to keep the voltage in range)? Shunt I know is the drain to ground design like most older machines. That same document I saw before also talked about mechanical voltage regulators, I'm not old enough to have worked on them in the 70s and older. Sounds like a pretty simple device that gave a lot of control to the owner if they wanted to adjust it. Down side is, it was a slow switch, so requires a battery to work right (smooth out the power, and to be a drain when charging system enabled).

I'm sure there must be a bunch more motorcycle models that use a similar voltage regulator too since it seems the early bikes had the voltage regulator and rectifier separate. Wish I had a better electronics lab type of setup so I could generate x voltage of AC at x amps and test these regulators to failure to see what they truly can handle.

[ps2fixer]

Found another one, looks like the same model I'm looking at but with green covers over the terminals. It's interesting that it gives actual power specs, 50amp/500w I suspect the one I'm looking at should have similar specs, maybe even the same thing. $70 isn't bad, but I think my supplier will be cheap enough for me to beat that price though. If anyone wants to mod the wiring on their own, here's something you can buy now. Not sure if this is a Chinese knock off, or if it's the same supplier I found.

Odd that the voltage specs are 14-15v, seems a bit on the high side, not that it won't work or anything, just stock specs is 13.5-14.5v if I recall correctly and I think lead acid batteries start to off gas (aka boil) at around 15v.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Voltage-Regulator-Rectifier-For-Honda-XR-600-R-1991-2000-XR-650-R-2000-2007/124276098780?hash=item1cef6ec6dc:g:GkAAAOSwZ8ZfH7h g:sc:ShippingMethodExpress!48628!US!-1


EDIT: I just got the invoice, the regulators will be over $70, I was really hoping they'd be under $50. Either case I'm still buying them. I'm unclear, but this might be the OE supplier for Honda, the few part numbers I've looked up Honda still sells. I did a quick run on the numbers, and looks like I'll have to sell them for about $110 shipped accounting for payment fees etc. Honda sells them for $120, so I'll be just barely beating their price.

[ps2fixer]

Alright, received my order. They are a Tour Max brand, made in Japan, box says RGU-170 Regu/Rectifer, however it's only a voltage regulator, no rectifier so slightly mislabeled. It is a bit smaller than the OEM ATC350X regulator. I guess that means I need to make another part ID page on my site for voltage regulators for their stock markings. The $20 one I bought used has SH557B-12 on it and the logo looks like two "K"s back to back first one being backwards. If someone knows what brand they are, I'd like to add that to this page. I'm finding Honda doesn't really make many parts in house, nearly everything is outsourced for the actual production.

Here's some measurements to compare. Dimension are based from the viewpoint of looking at the fin side with the mounting bolt hole at the top.

Stock:

Height - 56mm
Width - 39mm
Depth - 24mm

Regulator I found:

Height - 49.5mm
Width - 33mm
Depth - 25mm (26mm at the mounting point)

It basically has one less fin (2 in center vs 3) and is a bit shorter (more efficient electronics?) This suggests the rubber holder for these will be wrong on the stock machines and if they don't bolt down that could slip out. I'll have to see if I can find any machines or a suitable option for mounting them. Every machine I've looked up so far uses a bolt, I'll link it since it's a handy part number to have at hand.

https://www.partzilla.com/product/honda/96300-06028-00?ref=d72ad772ec24f8d968802202894d83543e7ab875

I'll have to do some research, but I suspect there might be bolts near the regulator that might be able to be used to mount the regulator as well.

I think everything else I've ordered from this supplier has also stated made in Japan on the packaging. Terminals, connector housings, etc and the quality feels great.

Anyway, photo time. Clearly the dirty/larger one is the stock unit. Replacement has long enough wiring that I can mod for any machine I'm pretty sure, if not i could always make a small adapter to make the wiring longer. Also, they do come in a box, yahoo for non-generic packaging =). Oh! I just pealed the sticker off... it's 100% the OE manufacturer (or a very well made clone), same logo, same model number style, and the number under I'm pretty sure is a printed spec from factory testing. I suspect this must mean the "Tour Max" brand is a rebranding company that resells whatever the source company is, yahoo more middle men in the supply chain. I checked ebay for used XR650R voltage regulators, and the number SH514-12 matches them perfectly. Have to love part researching, first try buying regulators and I end up with the same brand Honda used xD.

EDIT: I did a little more poking around, found a larger regulator that has the logo and the brand... it's Shindengen, same company that makes nearly all of the CDI's for Honda.

Looking into the numbers, looks like the SH### is the housing identification, the B,C,D etc at the end is the wiring/circuit id. Not sure what -12 is but guessing that's just the customer id (aka Honda) since they all have it. I also found another direct match for the 350x regulator assuming the circuit inside is rated for enough wattage, I put it in the info in the first post.

https://i.gyazo.com/67fcbbaa6f26be3bfc5b666594f09f5f.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/c3533df79e6f5f64c33d63810a5ee6f9.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/d5c548e542a7f4f19de0d2f40cdd4fb4.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/2f234ba853df63f3173ed7199b1ca6fa.jpg
https://i.gyazo.com/9c7e7acd32038d0f1e8b6190c055c6b3.jpg

[dirtwheels]

The company that has made the regulators/rectifiers for Honda and many others for many years is Shindengen. Probably why the codes all begin with "SH". The older regulators don't have the "Shindenhen" name on them but the regulator/rectifiers usually have a red decal on the side with their name and part number.

Most every auto and motorcycle manufacturer outsources their electronics. The big 4 use a lot of the same vendors.
Companies like:
Mitsuba (magnetos, stators)
Nippon-Denso (magnetos, stators)
Shindenhen (regulators, rectifiers, CDI's)
Nippon-Seiki (gauges)
Mitsubishi (CDI's)
Stanley (headlights, tailights)