ATC90 is runnin with minor probs now

[IceDude]

Well it runs, BUT not sooo great. I have to keep the timing way retarded to getti to run for long. When I have it advance enough to actually get a (pretty nice) I might add kick out of it. But this lasts for only minutes. The second that any even trace of real heat starts comin off the head it starts to act like it is starving for air (due to not buring its fuel due to an increase in compression(compression due to new rings with .016 end gap instead of my old rings with a .028 end gap) is me and a few other's guess).So I plan sometime here to drain it and give it a kick of sunoco's super 94 octain and c if that'll fix er. but not gaurentees of course. with that said if anyone would care to give some input on any of the above topics please feel free to. LOL

[IceDude]

actually I kinda forgot to ask teh other question of mine which is, I heard form someone that when * do any heavy portin (which I did) * are supossed to either advance or retard your ignition or mechanical timing (person couldent remember which to either). And teh other question of porting, does anyone have any clue of what it means to use a "technique" of shotgunning your ports(w/e that means I have no clue but maybe someone else out there does happen to know). Thanks

[IceDude]

Well today I got it running GREAT(It was all in the fuel... put the super 94 in it... advanced timing.. and adjusted carb) I got over 2 hours on the over-halul I did on it. Found a few humongous oil leaks... lol(I went through the contence of the motor's oil in about 1 hour... noticed extreme heat from the head... so on my way back to the barn it stalled,not locked but stalled, and considering the distance from teh barn I decided to just wait for it to cool instead of push it... after coolong a little I got it to kick, running like crap. I rode it back....drained oil... fixed leaks... refilled with oil... and put the other hour on her. I may have picks and even videos of it quite soon :w00t:

[MTS]

if your head is getting that hot, i would check for a shitty oil pump or clogged oil passage to the head, you didnt use silicone on the head/base gaskets did you? as for the float adjustements you pm'd me about....i cant find my manuel someone has moved it....lol ill keep lookin tho, also you just put stock OEM rings on the OEM piston right? not a wiseco piston or somethin? you shouldnt have to retard/advance your timing any unless you have upped the compression/octane of the gas..

[IceDude]

Sounds good on the timing part, but as for it gettin that hot would be because of the oil leak, and it ran low on oil, only having enough to "kinda" keep the rings lubed. And I am runnin a Honda piston and Honda rings for a 1mm overbore and teh jug has been checked to make sure that the size is correct.Well today I got a bunch of crap that need done at school and wont get home till around 7 tonight and if I can get a ride over to where I ride I plan to paint the plastic and take some pics and maybe some ridin videos.

[IceDude]

Well I tried to get some videos but my bro is stupid and decide to film more of him and his Chevy Blaser. rather than me and my 90 which i asked him to film but did he, no. but w/e. What little bit I got of my 90 was crap cause I still isn't runnin quite right. Oh and by the way, My Trike Sucks I also ,if * dont mind, need to know the stock jet size for my Trike b/c it just seemes like no matter how much * give it it just isn't there. I think it is just starvin for some fuel(It runs like this and has a lil alcohol in the tank along with the super94 :D ). well the alcohol got it to run a little peppier, but for havin alcohol in the tank it dosent have near the pep it should. Well that is the current update, tell if any thing else happens. But for the moment I knida need those jet sizes if any one else might have the book and can find it off hand thanks.

[IceDude]

Well I am goin to a shop in a few here and I really would like to know the stock jet size or just a suggestion on which size jets to buy for it. It is an 1976 ATC90 that is quiet heavily ported, boared over 1mm, and I might mention that it is runnin real lean(not b y adjustment but by starvation, I think jets)with the stock jets. It is nothin fancy for a carb just your standard Kehijh or however you spell it.

[IceDude]

well it turns out that the shop went out of business about 2 weeks after they came into business and so I couldent buy bigger jets any ways but I would still love to have the size of the stock jets.

[MTS]

They had a 65 main jet.

[IceDude]

sweet thanks man. do * know the size of the piolet. Well anyways I am thinking of sellin the 90 and leavin it that way b/c my dad is a real A-hole and I cant ride where I live(trailerpark)so I keep it at a farm and the owner is a serious trike hater and so I want to ride it at a friends house but my retard dad wouldent let me take it over so w/e.

[MTS]

35 pilot, man that blows that you gota get rid o her :(

[IceDude]

Well I dont gotta but it would make life easier. I think I will have to post a few pics and vids with the new jets and a bigger rear sprocket before I sell it (that is IF I do I dont want to though so i have no clue).LOL

[IceDude]

oh and if heavily ported and boared 1mm over... what size jets do * think I should run in it now??? I was thinkin Main:85 Pilot:55

[IceDude]

oh and by the way I was also wondering if you knew the size of the gap on the floats and also if not too much troubble... do I need a 21 or 22 series pilot jet
http://www.denniskirk.com/jsp/product_catalog/Product.jsp?store=Main&catId=111&leafCatId=11101&endIndex=299&startIndex=290&currIndex=30

[IceDude]

I know * are all like aganist quads but is there a diffrerence in bottom end from ATC to TRX90

[IceDude]

ok nvm there I a huge diff I will just sell my 2 trikes when I get the other runnin(still got the half built motor sittin on work bench with no topend on it). I have almost all the parts for it but still missin a few.So if anyone is lookin I should have at least one 90 ready to go out the door soon. the one I ride now just needs a little percision tuneing, bigger jets, and some paint and it is ready to rock. It only has 2 hrs on a fresh rebuild so no need for a tear down unless * want something bigger, but there is really no reason it is boared over 1mm, ported pretty nicely, but I suppose she could use some new valve seals and the vavles need to be lapped(had them out but never did either of these things DOH!!!, but it only burns a lil oil once heated up but not enough to cause for concern...just a lil light haseing of blue smoke but that is it).

[IceDude]

Well This Sucks!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: ...Well the 90 is almost on its way to teh tear-down stage once again...sigh...out riding today and I started to notice a little bit of power loss...maybe bad gas patch I thought(i dunno)...well as I rode I noticed more and more power loss until finaly I looked back and notice a little bit of oil smoke...then after riding somemore I noticed a quite significant power loss and finally decided to park it considering that the exhaust rolled smoke out for bout 20mins after shutdown :wondering .But while still running I reved it up real high and when it came back down I could hardely breathe due to so much smoke....needless to say it is being torn down for its 3rd set of rings for the last 2 months :mad: :mad: :mad: .

[IceDude]

Maybe not rings :rolleyes:? Any suggestions for this tear-down as to what else it might be with teh ecception of valves,valve guides and seals. So if anyone has any suggestions...Feel free to imput.

[MTS]

alves,valve guides and seals check em, check the the bore size, to the piston size make sure there within spec, bore taper, ring gap, piston wear...all the standard stuff.

[IceDude]

all checks out just fine. Any suggestion on some better rings than the Honda-direct stuff??? I personally just think the honda parts are JUNK!

[MTS]

all checks out just fine. Any suggestion on some better rings than the Honda-direct stuff??? I personally just think the honda parts are JUNK!
Your on crack if you think honda OEM is junk, you obviously did something wrong if you screwed your rings that fast, you sure you put them in correctly? right side up, postive it was in spec? who measure it and what did you use? did you bore it or just throw some new rings in it?

[IceDude]

The bore was done previously. I measured it with the micrometer set along with the telescoping guages.When converted from mm to inch the stock bore is supposed to be 1.852in. and I got 2.009in. which when converted is like 1.003mm over or something like that. But when I put in the rings (1/2in. down from the top of the jug all-the-way-around) I got roughly .018in. end gap on all 3 rings. The rings were installed with the stamped in "100" facing up towards the top end of the motor. These were also installed with a ring compressor. So if I did something wrong please don't hesitate to tell me what it is for when I put in teh new set. Oh and by the way the piston is from Honda and marked directly on the top is a little 1.00 for 1mm over and also there is a .004in. gap between the piston and jug, leaving for a .002in. gap around each side so to speak.

[MTS]

Im trying in vain to find this stupid service book for this bike but its being elusive, just off the top of my head, the ring gap sounds loose, so dose the piston to bore..

[IceDude]

I know the piston to bore is right I looked that up with someone else. I didnt however get the correct end gap but I do believe it is right, oh ane the gap wasn't .018 it was .016. not too much diff but enough to make for some leakage.

[bigredhead]

I suggest you take that piston and rings... the cylinder/head with valves etc.. all to a shop and have them test it for you......

[MTS]

0.006- 0.014 for top ring and bottem ring end gap, oil ring 0.006-0.016 (btw this is all in IN)
ring side clearence (fist n second ring) 0.0004 - 0.0018

[IceDude]

well to consider ware and tear...I would say teh rings were plenty tight according to spec. So w/e I will just buy a new set of rings, valves, valve guides,valve seals(all valve parts for 2 heads), the stupid little circle clips for the rist-pin(for other motor along with one set of valve parts. But anyways I think I will order all this some time next week and give some updates and pics of teh process so that you guys can possibley tell me anything that happens to "look" wrong with the motor and if there is something wrong I will be more than happy to fix it. So I will keep you guys updated on the progress fo both of my trikes.

[MTS]

IF you can take and post pics of the motor during tear down we can better tell what went wrong.

[IceDude]

well I just got back from a buddies house and I havent even taken the motor off the thing yet so I will be a little while. But I will try to post pics as I go.

[IceDude]

well I kinda forgot bout the pics and I got it apart, I honed the jug, I laped the valves, replaced tons more seals and got it to fire up. it is like a totaly diff motor!!!!!!! (It has compression) LOL :D :D :D . Well I will post pics soon. but this time ridin pics :w00t:

[IceDude]

oh I almost forgot, if I order jets tommra they will be here by next week so I need to know quickly about what jet size to jump up to. It is heavilly ported and polished, It is bored 1mm over, so it is pretty far over stock size and needs more fuel. I know that my main jet is a 65 and a 35 for a piolet. I want to get an 80 or an 85 main.

any input would be awesome!!!!!Thanks

[MTS]

whao there,,,,jetting, start at 68 and 38 and see where that gets you, if your too rich go down a size to lean keep going up! 80 sounds way to big tho.

[IceDude]

alright alright. I'll buy a 68 and a 38 today then.