Billet 250R clutch baskets question

[Dammit!]

I know the Hinson billet clutch baskets require a minor modification to install on a 250R. Something about grinding or beveling the gear on the crankshaft if I remember right. My question is, are there any billet clutch baskets out there that drop right in with no mods needed?

The mod needed for the Hinson is minor and not that big a deal but, if I can find a drop in part for close to the same price, that's kind of a no brainer.

[SWIGIN]

i instaled a wiseco basket in an R A a few years ago and it needed no mods

[Dammit!]

What year R was it?

[Billy Golightly]

If you install a Hinson basket, you need to use the 89 only TRX crankshaft drive gear. Its narrower then the earlier models, the wider ones will drag and rub on the edge of the basket if you try and use them.

[SWIGIN]

What year R was it?

86 trx .......

[TeamGeek6]

would a shim fix that? There are a couple on the clutch pack, arent they?

[deathman53]

I put them on 85 and 86 motor with no mods. You need a grinder to grind down the rivets in the stock basket, how much harder will it be to grind a small bevel in the gear???? I never grinded a bevel, nor did the shop I used to use. He did 2 baskets for me, no case damage.

[Billy Golightly]

Mine didn't suffer any case damage but the inside edge of the basket where it hooks onto the back gear clearly rubbed the crank gear until I bought the newer 89 gear.

[Mosh]

I have a pic of this same problem right now 85 250r engine on the bench.Hang on......
Ok in the first pic,you can see the scalloping of the basket.This is a aftermarket basket from a 85 250 R.The basket was made to fit later TRX 250r's
In the second pic,you can see that he ground down(or beveled) his primary gear to clear,but it was not enough.
However it was close and after running it awhile,the interferrence(sp) stoped.He will be fine now.
I do suggest doing what others have said and go with the later primary gear from the quads to avoid this.
He is not having issues anymore,I just posted thes pics for your reference.Dammit,I will call you this weekend.Been busy lately.Sorry.

http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m40/cosmicquads/rbasketissue800-1.jpg


http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m40/cosmicquads/Rbasketissues800.jpg

[Billy Golightly]

Yup Rob thats pretty much exactly how mine looked.

[Dammit!]

I've never taken the tranny apart before. How much of a PITA is it to replace that gear?

Gotta weigh the savings of the cheaper basket against the added expense of the new gear and see if it's worth the trouble over just buying a Wiseco basket or something that needs no mods.

[tecat-z]

Tranny doesn't have to come apart. Only clutch cover removed.

[TeamGeek6]

Two things:

1.) that engine in the second picture is seriously dirty inside, looks like major sludge inside.

2.) with any chance of metal to metal rubbing, put a magnet inside to catch the shavings, theyll wreck ball bearings in a hurry.

[Dammit!]

I just looked at my spare bottom end so I see where that gear is now. NM the previous stupid question. :lol:

Edit: If I'm looking at the right gear on service honda, the 1989 gear is not available. Anybody know if 13615-HB9-770 is the right number?

[Dammit!]

Is the Hinson the only one of the billet clutch baskets that has this problem?

[Billy Golightly]

Doug I dont know if thats the right part # or not but I know I just bought mine new probably a year ago and it was available then?

[Dammit!]

Service Honda says Unavailable on that part number. I might not be looking at the right one though (kinda hard to tell on the parts fische). I'll call them tomorrow but if anybody can verify the part number that would be real helpful.

[250rRoostmaster]

Bringing back an oldie. So i replaced my clutch basket with a new/used hinson basket. I bought it used off ebay so it came with no instructions. I installed and it seemly turned over easily as usual without any binding. Cool, i put it all back together. So i went out to ride 2 weeks ago, got 5 mins in and the piston gave way. Fast forward to now. I decided to check the clutch basket since it's the only thing that has changed and since the previous ride. I drain the oil and notice metal!! WTF? Took side cover off and discover this apparently well known problem that's now new to me.. So my question here is, can i get away with just flushing out the trans area real well or should i split the cases? I know the BEST way is to split them but i literally only rode maybe 5 mins before the top end popped so the aluminum shavings didn't have a lot of time to move around and most of the shavings looked to have stayed in the clutch cover side. All the bearings have about 25 hours on them and are all OEM. Looking for some advise from people that have went through this before. I just read a thread the motor builder forgot the bevel the gear when he did work, and they just suggested to flush and drain the oil 4 or 5 times within a short amount of time and your good to go. What do you guys think?

[Billy Golightly]

You have a few needle bearings in the cases but most are ball bearings. You can probably get away with just flushing good. The bright side is that its aluminum that peeled off and net steel, so the bearings are a bit more tolerant of that.

[250rRoostmaster]

That's my train of thought right now too. The aluminum bits are tiny and would most likely just get passed through the ball bearings. Thanks for your input Billy.

[yaegerb]

Bringing back an oldie. So i replaced my clutch basket with a new/used hinson basket. I bought it used off ebay so it came with no instructions. I installed and it seemly turned over easily as usual without any binding. Cool, i put it all back together. So i went out to ride 2 weeks ago, got 5 mins in and the piston gave way. Fast forward to now. I decided to check the clutch basket since it's the only thing that has changed and since the previous ride. I drain the oil and notice metal!! WTF? Took side cover off and discover this apparently well known problem that's now new to me.. So my question here is, can i get away with just flushing out the trans area real well or should i split the cases? I know the BEST way is to split them but i literally only rode maybe 5 mins before the top end popped so the aluminum shavings didn't have a lot of time to move around and most of the shavings looked to have stayed in the clutch cover side. All the bearings have about 25 hours on them and are all OEM. Looking for some advise from people that have went through this before. I just read a thread the motor builder forgot the bevel the gear when he did work, and they just suggested to flush and drain the oil 4 or 5 times within a short amount of time and your good to go. What do you guys think?

Agree with Billy, I would flush really well to start, then after 2-3 rides I would flush again and see if flakes are still present. The last thing you want is to ruin a new set of bearings.

Also, I WOULD bevel that gear. Any reputable machine shop can do that for you.

[250rRoostmaster]

Agree with Billy, I would flush really well to start, then after 2-3 rides I would flush again and see if flakes are still present. The last thing you want is to ruin a new set of bearings.

Also, I WOULD bevel that gear. Any reputable machine shop can do that for you.

I plan on beveling it, i would have done so in the first place if i had the damn instructions haha. Crazy thing is that it spun freely when i first put it in, but under a load i guess it flexes and makes contact with the primary. Learn something new everyday.

[250rRoostmaster]

Looks like i have to split the cases anyways... I was flushing and noticed the residual oil leaking from the crank seal area when i flipped the motor on it's side. So i took off the stator cover and notice a small amount of oil in there as well. started playing with the crank and i can feel that the bearings are most likely loose in the cases.. Time for new bearings and seals..

[yaegerb]

Looks like i have to split the cases anyways... I was flushing and noticed the residual oil leaking from the crank seal area when i flipped the motor on it's side. So i took off the stator cover and notice a small amount of oil in there as well. started playing with the crank and i can feel that the bearings are most likely loose in the cases.. Time for new bearings and seals..

Well that sucks....how many hours on those since the LED work?...just curious

[250rRoostmaster]

25 hours roughly since complete top and bottom rebuild with all new OEM bearings and seals. I'm thinking that the flexing of the basket putting pressure on the main bearings could have caused this. Not quite sure yet. I know the seals are bad. The bearings seem smooth but you can feel them moving a bit up and down.. Not the greatest of discoveries...

[250rRoostmaster]

25 hour OEM Main bearings and seals are shot, the pressure on the primary made the seals go bad in a hurry.

[Ed200x]

Any time you find metal particles in your gearcase on a 2-stroke, blown piston or not, your crankcase seals (at the VERY least!) can be written off. Aluminum is a soft metal, but your bearings failed because the balls were jamming on the races, in effect the bearings instead of being two seperate races seperated by steel balls, became a solid steel disc(s) intermitantly as the engine turned. Sure the particles were small they were ground down in what effectively was a ball mill for crushing ore! The that fine (and sharp) aluminum dust cut your mainnseals . Next time you drill a hole in aluminum pick up one of the chips. They are sharp as heck. I realize that money is tight but fella's, your talking about a 250cc (or larger) high revving, highly stressed race engine! You see anything but oil and maybe a bit of dirt or carbonized oil in your gearcase. Tear it down and clean it out!!!! It's more expensive in time and money to keep replacing seals time after time because you thought to save a dollar or two. There is NO sure way to "Flush" all the particles out by filling and draining oil or anything else a bunch of times. Oil ain't cheap either!

[250rRoostmaster]

I've never had this happen before but I'm going to agree with you 100% on this after what i found once i split the cases last night. I flushed and flushed and flushed with diesel then seen that i had to split the cases anyways since i saw the seals where bad. Boy am i glad i did because the amount of aluminum flakes that where still present was unbelievable. It was everywhere and in every single bearing in a bad way. I cleaned all the bearings and they are good now but there is no way that flushing would ever get that out. I'd say i only got about 60% out after about 3 gallons of diesel flushing. SPLIT YOUR CASES IF THIS HAPPENS. Your bearings and seals will thank you.