Bombing at Boston Marathon

[Mosh]

Redsox. I had this reply typed out last week for you, but just felt no need to push the issue further until today in light of these new posts.

I can understand where my statements last week, may border the line of paranoia, to the extent they almost come off as panicked. However, I am confused by the "No martial Law" being implemented.(As you stated it was not.) I am sorry, it was by that very definition, and IMO I don't feel the situation was really warranted to the extent they took it to. Anytime you have orders to stay indoors as Swat, LEO's, and some military, are cruising the streets in heavy armored vehicles, that is Martial law. Not nonsense.
I am not discounting people were scared and asking for help, but there is tons of video and comments circulating around where people were treated less than desired. I too feel that most did their jobs to the best fo their ability.

What maybe is covered up in my rant, was the primary concern that peoples rights were technically "put aside" for this situation, and certain terms of action (martial law) were re-worded to be misperesented. It warrants questions and review, that it not become a "normal' operating procedure, just because they felt that it was needed in this situation. The "give em an inch, they take a mile" comes into play, in my and others concerns. "People" need not become complacent, that these types of actions become acceptable maintsream practices for every small event.(Not by any means was this a small event). I am fully aware of the 4th ammendment, and at the time of it's inception it was plain black and white. But recent changes to it, have basically stripped the main meaning of it, right down to being open to subjection, or interperatation. And judging by comments and internet votings on comparable topics including Ron paul's rant, many other people feel that the rights are being infrindged upon more and more.

And now, you have a California town on lockdown for the manhunt of a child murderer.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crim...icle-1.1330894

While the situation is quite different in the ways they are conducting the police business, I feel that the Boston lockdown may have set a precedence or normality to the point where these types of actions become the norm and the general "sheltered" want help citizens welcome it and even begin to call for it all too often..
You are right, I don't put that much faith in the govt to pull many things off without appearing to include some sort of confusion and dis-aray.
but to some they do blame that whole Boston mess on the the agencies. I mean when these immigrants collected section 8 housing, tax exemptions and even welfare to the tune of 100 grand by our agencies, some technically consider that whole incedent funded by our own taxe payers.

[redsox]

Mosh, a couple of things. First, please don't misconstrue my tone as offended, or offensive. i'm just musing with some debate, on a subject i feel i can speak about, due to factors such as geography, among others. Nothing you have said has offended me, as I am thick skinned, and very, very easy going. In fact, based on what i've read of your posts, here and elsewhere, i think we have a great deal of common ground between us. Politically, i consider myself a conservative constitutionalist, bordering on libertarian. I grew up Irish Catholic in Boston. I own guns, ride three wheelers, distrust the government, and drink beer (not always in that order). I voted for Romney, but i would have preferred Reagan. I dislike the direction of the Republican Party, and the size of the debt and the size of the Government. I believe people should take care of themselves, and their families. I try to keep informed on issues and in politics, but i generally stay away from heated discussion, because it usually depresses me. You see, very, very few people where i'm from even lean right, much less stand out on the wing. I am constantly towing the company line against a tide of liberalism. It has become tiresome, so i've given it up. I truly believe we are doomed, and have relegated myself to this fact. i am taxed up to my eyeballs, and i get nauseous at how every cent of those dollars are spent. but enough about me. lets talk Boston martial law. It didn't happen. As you stated, there were LEO's, SWAT, and Military assets in the streets. Correct. But, LEO's and SWAT are the same thing. SWAT is a type of LEO. What is also true is there were federal, state, and local LEO's from all over New England. And, to be clear, they were saturated in a rather small area, looking for someone. As far as the military, they played a support role. More precisely, a small number of national guard came out to help feed and fuel and give water to the police. they were not "patrolling" anywhere. They have no jurisdiction, right of arrest, or police powers, even in a state of emergency. There were also firemen from NYC cooking cheeseburgers for the police. Drove up on their own dime. They didn't arrest anybody either, but nobody complained about them. i guess red trucks are more welcome than green ones. Anyway, if that is the definition of martial law, then perhaps I misunderstand it. Because I think its something different. I stand by the Constitution. I oppose unreasonable search and seizure. But if a child murderer, (which is among the crimes this guy is guilty of) runs into a building, i believe that the police should be able to chase him before he hurts someone else. I'd want the cops to chase him if he blew me up. here's an example. if your house was on fire, should the fire department be able to enter to save your family? of course they should. It's unreasonable to think that they shouldn't. no warrant necessary. its a social contract. its part of being human, and the fabric of civilized society. same principles apply here. "Patrolling the streets in Armored vehicles"? I can't remember the last time armor hurt anyone. these maniacs were throwing bombs out at the cops. what should they have chased them in? would bicycles have been better? In closing, i don't like that this thing happened. I don't like any part of it. I don't like the terrorism, and i don't like the so-called "lock-down", and i don't like cops riding around in armored cars, and i don't like that a little kid got killed, and that people got hurt and that a cop got killed. but it happened. all of it. because of a million theoretical reasons, it happened. After it happened, if the good guys didn't catch that bad guy, he would do it again. maybe in your town. maybe not. choose to respond if you like, however you'd like. i'd like to hear your thoughts. no matter what you write, or if you refrain, i will buy you a beer someday, and i'll tell you a joke that'll offend you. i know quite a few. cheers.

[Mosh]

Yeah it is all good. There was a time on these forums when discussions like these easily got out of hand, and wound up into 30 page debates that rivaled a lot of "how to jet my carb discussions" that never seemed to go anywhere.

It seems as though we have a lot in common.
Basically with the events in Boston, I will venture to wage that the differences we see on it, are all in one's perception. It is refreshing and educational to particpate in discussions of this nature. I seem to learn something new in most cases, wheter it be about the discussion or persons involved in it.

So I don't sense any offensiveness at all, nor do I intend to be offensive.

As far as something like that (occupation/manhunt) if you will, happening where I live: We are pretty conservative around these rural areas. Far from "progressive" ideas and movements that are found in other regions of the U.S.
Fortunately, I have had the experiences of traveling most of the U.S. with my Dad, and have experienced different persona's and such in my life. There are many variances to people's attitudes and outlooks based on geography, so I understand where you are coming from in your point of view especially since you were so close to the events.
It would be interesting to see how actions like that would go over in our community, allthough I hope that we never have to face something like that, and I would like to believe that the rest of the nation will not have to experience things of these tragic natures.
I was thinking to myself a few weeks ago, that less than 100 years ago, most communities may have formed a "lynch mob" or deputize regular citizens to seek justice with incidents like Boston, and now many put their faith and calling in others to do that, which is not a bad thing as long as things are done correctly. I am not saying private lynch mobs are/were the answer, just noticing how much things have changed.

I do feel that a manhunt was warranted. However a knock on a door with the residents saying "nothing going on here officers, move along" without incident, is the way I hope it was handled, vs what I have heard and seen even though there are many factors that I am probably unaware of, and tall tales on the NET can get real out of hand.

[redsox]

Well i read all the splitting hairs about unimportant sh!t and then the ARSE licking that ensues .......and ive decided that YOU ALL ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM ! Here is a new word for your vocabulary- NULLIFICATION what does he mean ? How dare he talk to us this way ! Facefack , Twatter friggin SHEEPLE ! BAAAH nothing will ever change unless you make it change ! You need to ball up you metro sexual`s ! An example of nullification are the medical marijuana laws in some states ! EM-KAY ......oh but Ron Pauls a kook.......you`re a freakin kook , you chose a muslim or silver spoon boy ? Ya gotta be kidding me ! Lets give all the muslim immigrants amnesty so we can watch them suicide bomb the sh!t out of us on tv ! It makes for good ratings don`t you think ? NO......YOU DON`T THINK . You just keep squirming for more money every day until the federal reserve bank decides to foreclose on your assets...........and i`m an arse hole ?

hahahahaha. awesome. glad you've got it all figured out. lead the way, oh great and mighty pious political pioneer!!! i agree that as soon as we figure out this "marginally legal weed issue" that we're tangling with, everything else will take care of itself.

[Scootertrash]

Well i read all the splitting hairs about unimportant sh!t and then the ARSE licking that ensues .......and ive decided that YOU ALL ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM ! Here is a new word for your vocabulary- NULLIFICATION what does he mean ? How dare he talk to us this way ! Facefack , Twatter friggin SHEEPLE ! BAAAH nothing will ever change unless you make it change ! You need to ball up you metro sexual`s ! An example of nullification are the medical marijuana laws in some states ! EM-KAY ......oh but Ron Pauls a kook.......you`re a freakin kook , you chose a muslim or silver spoon boy ? Ya gotta be kidding me ! Lets give all the muslim immigrants amnesty so we can watch them suicide bomb the sh!t out of us on tv ! It makes for good ratings don`t you think ? NO......YOU DON`T THINK . You just keep squirming for more money every day until the federal reserve bank decides to foreclose on your assets...........and i`m an arse hole ?

Put down the pipe, chief.


Another incoherent rambling from someone in one of the most screwed up states in this country. glamy, what exactly are you doing to fix your STATE? Let alone the country? Lead a plan that straightens out your state, then I'll listen to your national plan. You post here about the immigrant overload in your state, but yet you stay there and whine about it. What are YOU doing to fix it? Can't be much, it's broke and keeps going further and further down the toilet.

No offense to other Californians here.

Ron Paul? Some of his ideas are good, but he comes off as a crackpot. His son on the other hand I could possibly vote for.

Ron Paul is just another rich politician, with a net worth of 2-5 million, with an Average Net Worth of: $3,560,018:
http://www.davemanuel.com/pols/ron-paul/

What was that you were saying about a silver spoon?

[Scootertrash]

I never said one word about Romney, you did, and what you do with Romney and what's left behind when you guys are done isn't my concern.

Politicians all suck: Democrats want to be your Mother and force you to do what they think is good for you, Republicans want to be your Father and force you to live your life like they think you should.

FWIW, they are trying to push thru a bill for "undocumented" people to have access to public funding for education and scholarships here in Minnesota. I'll be firing off another letter to my Liberal politicians, even tho it won't do any good, because they are comvinced that they know what's good for me and my state.

As far as the MA debacle goes: I agree with some of the things both Mosh and redsox said. They told people to stay in their homes and not come outside and basically locked down a town. They don't do it when a mass murderer or other dangerous criminal escapes from prison or goes on a rampage and this scenario should have been no different. There were homes that people asked to have searched and homes that were searched forcibly.

I've seen pics of the armored vehicles, pics people took out of their windows of the bombers during the first fire fight, and a pic of a cop pointing his AR at a citizen taking a picture out of his upstairs window. I'll see if I can find them and post them up here.

ETA: Here is a link to pics from the incident taken by a resident of the building where the firefight took place:
http://www.getonhand.com/blogs/news/...otout-pictures

Self reliance means being able to handle all situations you may encounter in life. The government and the police cannot and should not always be there to protect you. In a situation like this you should be smart enough to do a walk-around of your home and see if anything is out of place that would suggest your home or a shed, (or a boat? ) may have been broken into, then call the cops if needed. The bad guy was found by a citizen OUTSIDE the lockdown perimeter who noticed blood on his driveway and the cover to his boat was disturbed.

People are far too dependent on others to protect them today.

[El Camexican]

I'm loving these posts! I figure years from now when the government finally gets so big that it can’t pay itself and taxes get high enough that there is no incentive to work the whole thing will self-implode and reset. Muslims will blame infidels, Christians will blame Jews, Liberals will blame Conservatives etc. and all hell will break loose as we scamper about burnt cities like squirrels looking for a nut to sustain us till the next day.

Those left alive who’ve lived in and known better times will lament that someone should have done something sooner, but deep inside they will know that someone was them and they will have to live with that fact. Sadly it’s inevitable, Rome fell as did all the ancient civilizations before it and I’m sure they all thought their systems would last forever.

The only thing that can save America (and those of us living around it) is it’s Constitution. It is what made America great and if it is ignored, circumnavigated and changed it won’t have failed you, you will have failed it.

I just hope I don't live long enough to see it all go down in flames.

[Dirtcrasher]

We need to execute that beyatch as well!!

"My son would never do this!!"