Help! I'm clueless.

[ngunter2]

I took my tri-z out on 2-day trip to texas. Ran and idled perfect before I left. Ran and Idled perfect on the first day. Would not run at all! on day 2. So I put it up and rode other toys. Let it sit till now because I didn't have time to ride it. Got it out to pull carb this weekend made sure all was fine and the carb on the inside looked fine. No gunk, no blockage. Sprayed carb clener through everything. Dried it up and put it back on. Trying to tune it now. I thought it was too rich so I turned the pilot out to 2 and a half and my throttle out 1 half and heres my results. It starts first kick but doesn't idle at ALL. Just Dies. I tinker with it for about 30 minutes turning the pilot and throttle screw to see if it idles but nothing. I give up. Come back 30 minutes later. Will not even think about starting. Go back to square one pilot 2 and a half out and throttle 1 half out. After rigorous kicking its starts but, it acts like it is VERY rich. It was spraying 2-stroke gas out the back when I give its some throttle and sounded very very deep. I then pulled the plug and it was almost dry. Barely any gas on it. The white part was white as new. I have no idea where to go. I thought new jets but how did it run and idle fine before with these jets but now suck.

Im almost done with the thing. Sell it to someone else. There was a Halfway mint 85 350x on craigslist for 600 bucks... It was sold within 24 hours of the listing. I was very unhappy. I told him I'd come look at it next weekend with cash in hand....

All help is appreciated

[dougspcs]

Not much to say on the problem with your TriZ..never owned one.

But go get that X!! You're mental if you let a 'halfway mint 85 350x on craigslist for 600 bucks' go by!!

[RIDE-RED 250r]

I would check your fuel pump! Make sure the pulse line is tight, in good shape and not leaking by at all. If that is ok, it maye be time to rebuild your fuel pump. Seems like the fact that it ran fine on the jetting you had then all of the sudden not oints toward some sort of mechanical failure instead of jetting issues.

[yaegerb]

So if I can decipher what you are saying. Carb is clean, wet gas is actually coming out of the tailpipe and the spark plug looks dry??

Are you positive gas is actually in the carb and there is no blockage in the fuel line from the tank? If that is OK, then....How strong is your spark? If gas is passing through and out your tailpipe then the combustion chamber isn't burning the gas.

[barnett468]

Hello


Sorry to hear about your problem don't despair it is minor.


It starts first kick

Was the motor cold when this happened?

Do you normally need to choke it to start it?

Full choke when cold means lean to just right pilot, no choke needed when cold means rich, stuck float, sunk float or typically debris in needle/seat from stuff in tank.

xxxxx

doesn't idle at ALL. Just Dies.

Means rich or lean but float bowl has fuel

Xxxxx

I tinker with it for about 30 minutes turning the pilot and throttle screw to see if it idles but nothing. I give up. Come back 30 minutes later. Will not even think about starting. Go back to square one pilot 2 and a half out and throttle 1 half out. After rigorous kicking its starts but, it acts like it is VERY rich. It was spraying 2-stroke gas out the back when I give its some throttle and sounded very very deep. I then pulled the plug and it was almost dry. Barely any gas on it.

A plug should be 100% dry when removed from a properly running car, you are interpreting the results incorrectly. It is positively rich, caused by either bad spark, stuck float sunk float or debris in needle seat preventing gas from shutting off.

xxxxx

Ran and Idled perfect on the first day. The white part was white as new.

If your bike ran for 1 hour or more it should be sufficient to estimate jetting by plug color. The fact that it is white suggests it is jetted lean, and lean enough to possibly have had a slight hesitation upon acceleration. Did you notice anything like this?

xxxxx

I thought new jets but how did it run and idle fine before with these jets but now suck.

It ran fine, your plug says it is lean, your jetting did not change itself so according to your description your jetting is NOT the problem.

xxxxx

Im almost done with the thing. Sell it to someone else. There was a Halfway mint 85 350x on craigslist for 600 bucks... It was sold within 24 hours of the listing. I was very unhappy. I told him I'd come look at it next weekend with cash in hand....

That’s unfortunate however as my Grandma, Mom and Dad always said, “you snooze you loose”, nice used original off road bikes do not grow on trees at any price and are highly sought after!

xxxxx

Lay your plug on your head as suggested, strong blue spark is ok, pale weak yellow spark is questionable.

If spark is strong then spark is absolutely not your problem then most likely your carb has a problem or your reed cage has a broken reed or your timing slipped somehow.


Hope this info helps.

[barnett468]

correction

"your plug says it is lean,"

should be "your plug COLOR says your jetting is lean,"

[ngunter2]

Ok @dougspcs Yes... I wanted it. He posted on a sunday so i couldn't get money and trailer and get 2 hours out there and look at it so I told him I would go to look at it the following weekend. Sold the next day. I wasn't very happy. I saw it and double taked. Almost jumped out of my chair.

@Ride-red 250r I think the fuel pump is fine. I think it is getting plenty of gas and there are no leaks.

@Yaegerb Brand new fuel line to carb. Other one was rotting and splitting when i took the carb off for the first time. Spark... I am not sure. I tried it after the two day trip and i didn't have enough hands to really kick it and ground the plug at the same time. And I think the gas coming out of the tailpipe is just gas from trying to start it in the first place sitting in the header area and then catching the back pressure once I get it going. I'll look into the spark tomorrow. I think its fine because sometimes it starts first kick.

I really think it needs jetting. But yes again it ran fine and idled forever earlier and now i cannot tune it to idle at all. Only way it runs is feathering the throttle. I might just buy a new carb and not deal with this stuff. I am officially taking donations...

[ngunter2]

@ barnett468 Yes it was cold, No choke but This only happens when I keep the gas off. It runs fine and actually idles until i turn the gas on....... Does that mean the float is not set right... Is that it? would that cause the jet to give it too much fuel and run wrong even if i adjust the pilot and throttle stop. Of course it ran fine earlier...so, can the float setting get messed up in a day?

The plug had a small amount of gas on it... not drenched, not super dry
Changed spark plug after it stopped running. Has probably had 10 minutes if not less of total run time.
Yes, I need to check spark again and I have not checked the reeds since I bought it so Its on my list.

[barnett468]

Hello


I guess you missed this in my post,

It is not your jetting.


If spark is strong then spark is absolutely not your problem then most likely your CARB has a problem or your REED CAGE HAS A BROKEN REED or your timing slipped somehow.

[barnett468]

Hello


It may or may not spit back out the carb if a reed is broken, they must be visually inspected. Check floats and dirt in needle/seat as I suggested.

[ngunter2]

I was typing my post at 10:10 while you posted so I did not see you post before I posted that. I saw that it is not my jetting. sorry
Yes, I know it is my carb because of all these fuel issues and checking the reeds is on my list

[ngunter2]

I pulled the carb friday and floats were sealed and fine. Did not really check needle and seat though its on my list as well.

[barnett468]

Hello


Yes no problem swapping posts. Happens on a few occasions, lol.


@ barnett468 Yes it was cold, No choke but This only happens when I keep the gas off. It runs fine and actually idles until i turn the gas on....... Does that mean the float is not set right... Is that it?

Please re read my post again slowly your answer to this question. It dies with the gas on because there is NOTHING STOPPING the gas from running directly into your motor killing it and making your plug WET.

xxxxx


would that cause the jet to give it too much fuel and run wrong even if i adjust the pilot and throttle stop.

Answer is in my previous post which is yes.

xxxxx

Of course it ran fine earlier...so, can the float setting get messed up in a day?

It’s NOT the float SETTING, Please read my previous post.

xxxxx

The plug had a small amount of gas on it... not drenched, not super dry

The detailed explanation of this is in my previous post, gas on a plug pulled from a running motor is flooded typically due to excessive fuel. If the carb is providing the correct amount of fuel then all the gas will burn and the plug will be absolutely positively 100,000% DRY. If it is burning the gas how can the plug be wet at all. It simply doesn’t work that way.

Xxxxx

Changed spark plug after it stopped running. Has probably had 10 minutes if not less of total run time.

The answer to this is in my previous post, it needs up to one hour to get decent color 10 minutes will basically never show color in a rich motor.

xxxxx

I need to check spark again

Good but probably not your problem

xxxxx

I have not checked the reeds since I bought it so Its on my list.


Good

[ngunter2]

You said ... Please re read my post again slowly your answer to this question. It dies with the gas on because there is NOTHING STOPPING the gas from running directly into your motor killing it and making your plug WET.

What do you mean? The float stops the fuel from flowing into the bowl and i have read in other places that if the float is too high it can cause gas to flow too much causing it to be rich. So if I have the gas off it will run until it is at the right level without new gas and then run out.

Then, you said... Answer is in my previous post which is yes.... So yes to it being the float setting or needle and seat?

Then, ...It’s NOT the float SETTING, Please read my previous post... Yes the setting is probably fine but I know it isn't sunk or stuck.

Soo my list of things wrong is the reed, probably not the spark, and the needle and seat? or Timing slipped

[barnett468]

Hello


Oh my, sorry but I don’t think I can help you. Do you have a friend that knows anything about motors that can read everyone’s post and fix it for you/


You said ... Please re read my post again slowly your answer to this question. It dies with the gas on because there is NOTHING STOPPING the gas from running directly into your motor killing it and making your plug WET. What do you mean?

The answer is in my post and can’t keep writing the same answer. If you read it one word at a time you will find it 100% guaranteed

xxxxx

The float stops the fuel from flowing into the bowl

The answer is my original post. Float stuck, float sank, DEBRIS IN NEEDLE AND SEAT HOLDING GAS SHUT OFF VALVE IN CARB OPEN.

Could also be a loose jets.

xxxxx

i have read in other places that if the float is too high it can cause gas to flow too much causing it to be rich.

Yes but it ran fine so the float LEVEL was ok. Now it is flooding, WHY? The possible answer is here on this page above this line somewhere.

xxxxx

So if I have the gas off it will run until it is at the right level without new gas and then run out.

This is what you previously stated it did, now it sounds a like a question so I now have no idea whether it is a statement or a question. Which one is it?

xxxxx

Then, you said... Answer is in my previous post which is yes.... So yes to it being the float setting or needle and seat?

It is not the float SETTING the possible answer is on this page. Most of us here are NOT psychic, This is like calling your dr on the phone and telling him your side hurts how the heck is he supposed to tell EXACTLY what your problem is without being there?

xxxxx

Then, ...It’s NOT the float SETTING, Please read my previous post... Yes the setting is probably fine but I know it isn't sunk or stuck.

Well based upon YOUR assessment of the floats either something is stuck in your needle and seat as mentioned 4 times now or you have a bad reed or timing slipped but not likely, check timing mark vs piston.

xxxxx

Soo my list of things wrong is the reed, probably not the spark, and the needle and seat? or Timing slipped

Yes now go fix it, lol!