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Thread: History Question - What did they do with all the recalled Three Wheelers

  1. #16
    Marty is offline Just Too Addicted Arm chair racerJust too addicted
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    I really do not think it was a volunteered thing.
    My reason for saying that is if it was a volunteer session why was Honda of America threatening dealerships to pull their franchises or dealer licenses if they dealerships did not relinquish ATC 250r's they had in stock or on show floors.
    I could be wrong but I heard a story Honda of America was serious about getting those trikes off floor.
    I also read a story about guy or dealership owner who originally owned crated ATC 250r did not want to disclose his name or Honda business because of waiver he signed regarding the sale of ATC 250R's.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by wonderboy View Post
    Just like 007 says, back in the day, they were voluntarily pulled from the dealer showrooms. Officially, there was no ban for several years. That was up until the Bush administration (Bush Junior). Remember when there was all the uproar about lead paint in kids toys from China? Well, there was a bill sent through congress enacting tougher laws on things like lead paint and a bunch of other kids toy related issues. But guess what? They snuck the OFFICIAL BAD of sale and manufacture of 3 wheeled ATV's into that same bill. It was right at the tail end of the Bush administration, so not that long ago.

    EDIT: in case you are really bored, check out Section 232 at the following link:
    https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bil...hr4040#summary

    This is the "Consumer Product Safety Improvement Act of 2008" in which 3 wheelers were finally (officially) restricted.
    Great info. I knew and forgot.. Not that I was gonna try and import new 3 wheelers someday ...! ?. As with any words,they can be undone. But for now, sec 232 is IT. The "ban" was mostly voluntary. Yes, they would have much rather turned back the clock to mid 85 and had the good life. But Drunks and Barbara Walters wasn't gonna let that happen. I'll never forget how amped I was to milk early the night that 3 wheelers were gonna be on 20/20 !! Little did I know.......
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  3. #18
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    Hey Marty, I think you just need to consider who the players were in the discussion and then it makes sense.

    First, the "voluntary" part of the agreement was with with the Honda corporation. They are the ones who manufacture the machines and are the ones with the big pockets. They are the ones with everything to lose if things got out of hand (lawsuits, goverment investigations, etc).

    The dealerships are independantly owned businesses who are licensed (whatever the term is you want to use) to sell machines from the various manufacturers. I thought (not 100% sure) that dealerships typically buy the machines from the OEM manufacturer. A machine on the dealership floor is owned by the dealership. Once the "Consent Decree" was put into place (between the Japanese manufacturers and the CPSC) I think Honda wanted to make sure that the dealerships didn't go off on their own and continue to sell the stock on hand.

    @ 007:
    So much of the official documentation was "weasle worded"... things like "until a mandatory consumer product safety standard ..." which implies if they were to just create a safety standard and comply with it, then they could continue. However, there is also a statement asking the CPSC to issue their final ruling. Maybe that is more precise in their banning of the machines. I need to see if they ever issued this...
    Last edited by wonderboy; 01-02-2014 at 04:04 PM.
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  4. #19
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    If I read section 232 right, is TPC trikes breaking the law ?.
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  5. #20
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    Yes ATC007 is right on that any of the old stock was cut up and sold as parts. I worked at Dealer during that time and Honda was selling us tires on rims with the hubs for 25.00 dealer cost, both front and rear ATC tires. I was at Hy-Tech while on a west coat during a sponsor visit trip and when we stopped in there there was stacks of Honda 350x fenders with all the decals and rear mud flaps still on them. Stacks of 350x headlights and shocks also. We all know that Honda does not sell fenders with the decals and 350x rear mud flap was extra also. While we there we bought NOS 350x motors, wish I would of bought more. Honda did donate a lot of motors to tech schools. I did hear there was a time when all dealers had to have new units off the floor and either sold or returned. It was never illegal to sell used units but at the time of the" Ban" value of three wheelers dropped to low no one would take them in trade. Rumors of recalls no one would take the chance. When the AMA finally dropped the sanctioning of three wheeler racing in 88 the value dropped enen more and alot were scavenged for quad parts. We pulled motors from 350x and 250r s for the quads and junked the frames. at that time a running 350x was only bring 400-500 dollars and we just bought them for the motors. And to stir the pot alittle... that is where quad conversion kits such as the 3x4 kit came in to play, a race three wheeler with a lot of money in motor and suspension work, worth nothing and you cant race it anymore... but for less then half of what a new quad cost you could convert to a quad and race it again. Yes it didnt work as well bur some people gambled on it.

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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by BOB MARLIN View Post
    If I read section 232 right, is TPC trikes breaking the law ?.
    No, because it's a conversion kit for a 4 wheeled ATV, not a factory produced and imported trike. Notice, it says ban on imported. If there was a US factory that built then, they would be legal. What idiots.

    Regardless, seeing that pissed me off.


    As far as the OP, I've heard all sorts of crap. They were pulled, cut up and parted out, some were converted to quads etc. We will never really know.

  7. #22
    Outlaw #24's Avatar
    Outlaw #24 is offline At The Back Of The Pack Arm chair racerAt the back of the pack
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    I think at this point in history , should reflect on what had occurred to prompt the consent decree in the first place. I for 1 can tell all of you , it was not the responsible users. Remember the sheer numbers of 3 wheeler that were being or had already been produced by 1985 , when it all started to go down!

  8. #23
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    I'm just fascinated by the history of stuff in general.
    I met 2 ladies from Canada that went to souther Calif to start a dress shop, and wound up with the first Honda motorcycle dealership in So Cal.
    Sold TONS of trike to farmers south of the border.
    Naturally, people started racing each other 'cause it was fun.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by tri again View Post
    Naturally, people started racing each other 'cause it was fun.
    It's in our genes
    Click image for larger version. 

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  10. #25
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    Many 86 + 87 Kawasaki Tecates went to the Mediterranean states (Greece + Spain being the largest lions share of that market).
    Honda's ATC 250ES (Bigred) 86 + 87 went to Canada and Australia
    Europe it seems got their fair share of a mixture of Honda trikes.

    At least that is the way I see it,,, john

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by afdfirefighter View Post
    So people say some of these were dumped into the ocean? I have never heard that before. That is very interesting.
    Yes, right next to the Titanic
    All our government does is distract us while they steal from us, misspend our tax $ and ruin our country

  12. #27
    barnett468 is offline FACT ! I have no edit button Arm chair racerThe day begins with 3WW
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    Quote Originally Posted by afdfirefighter View Post
    I am aware of the ban and that it has expired but I am curious to some of the details.
    I love this topic.

    I worked at Kawi at the time. The government was on a witch hunt and made an appointment to come in and interview whoever was in charge of the ATV dept. Well, Kawi told me to go on vacation that day and they took the watercraft supervisor [Gary B.] who was actually an electrical engineer that originally worked in the snow mobile dept in Kawi’s Nebraska plant before it closed down, and who knew nothing about watercraft, much less ATV’s, and threw him under the bus. Our legal dept prepped him for several days on what, and what not to say, and to never mention my name and just play stupid.


    The grossly misleading, one sided, TV program in the link below that was on worldwide TV, was the first time any of us at Kawi had heard publicly about any sort of big brew ha ha over injuries incurred while riding 3 wheelers, and the show was that beginning of the end for 3 wheelers. If my old brain remembers correctly, there was no interest by the gov to do anything about 3 wheelers prior to the show but the show brought the issue to their attention and they pursued it only after the show was aired.

    60 MINUTES, part 1.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1I5DweHlnQ


    60 MINUTES part 2.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbptQDcLo-E


    Enjoy hearing comments on the show from people that want to blame everyone and everything other then themselves, for injuries they or others might have incurred while riding a 3 wheeler.


    Hear grown people [adults if you want to call them that] NOT assume responsibility for their own actions and imply things like, “Hey, even though I was required to be at least 16 years old [18 in some places now], and take 6 months of driving lessons in High School, then a written and driving test at DMV before they felt I was competent enough to drive a car on a SMOOTH flat road that is extremely UNLIKELY to tip over in a turn at ANY speed, and where I can see for MILES around AND which I "shouldn't" be suckin back a pint of Jack Daniels blue label or E85 corn gas while I drive it, I still don’t think I, or even my kids, need any training to ride an ATV simply because I and they can ride a bicycle, and an ATV has 3 wheels which is one more than a bicycle...I think, and I used to have a tricycle when I was 12…uh…I mean 5, that I rode with no problem, and even though this new ATC250R model tricycle has a 40 hp engine attached to it, it still couldn’t be that hard to run it wide open in a turn or blindly over a dune not knowing what is on the other side like maybe a cliff or another happy rider heading right at me at full throttle or maybe a truck or an ambulance that is picking up a rider that that used to think the same way I do before he went into a coma after smashing his head on his handlebars landing off a 30 foot jump while not wearing a helmet, and, because it is an off highway vehicle with no drivers license required to operate it I can pound back all the Jack I want before and during my ride.".


    My favorite part of the program is where dad [who looks a bit unstable on his feet imo], while holding a beverage of some kind [must be a soda because goodness knows he is WAY to responsible to be getting H A M M A R E D in front of his kids [ESPECIALLY when he has to drive back home with them in the car in a few hours], sends his tiny kid out for what I think was their FIRST ride, UNSUPERVISED, with no USEFUL instructions whatsoever, BLINDLY, from the side of his van into oncoming traffic WITHOUT A HELMET, where the kid INSTANTLY gets mowed down by another rider. Then you hear the announcer say how dangerous 3 wheelers are and NOT that dad is a blithering idiot. It’s absolutely hilarious…I think. I must have replayed that part a dozen times in total disbelief.


    Most of you here have probably gotten your foot off the peg at one time or another for some reason or another and ran your foot over and possibly got sucked off the bike in the process. Well the same thing happens with a quad also, and imo, this is one of the most common occurrences and causes of injuries on either of these bikes, at least for beginner riders, yet they still make quads. Last time I looked there seemed to be plenty of injuries from motorcycles too but they still make those too, hmmm.


    I’m sure no one has EVER seen a quad or any kind of motorcycle on it’s side or upside down or has crashed on one themselves, yet I don’t remember if there is even any mention or footage of a quad or a motorcycle in the program.


    Obviously riding a 3 wheeler is not as safe as sitting on ones couch, but at some point, imo, at least SOME of the responsibility for ANYTHING that happens to someone while riding, driving, flying, fishing, walking, drinking and so on, should be assumed by the person performing that particular activity.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeswinehart View Post
    Many 86 + 87 Kawasaki Tecates went to the Mediterranean states (Greece + Spain being the largest lions share of that market).
    Honda's ATC 250ES (Bigred) 86 + 87 went to Canada and Australia
    Europe it seems got their fair share of a mixture of Honda trikes.

    At least that is the way I see it,,, john
    Could some have also gone to Mexico?
    Makes a lot more sense than wasting them.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by barnett468 View Post
    I love this topic.

    I worked at Kawi at the time. The government was on a witch hunt and made an appointment to come in and interview whoever was in charge of the ATV dept. Well, Kawi told me to go on vacation that day and they took the watercraft supervisor [Gary B.] who was actually an electrical engineer that originally worked in the snow mobile dept in Kawi’s Nebraska plant before it closed down, and who knew nothing about watercraft, much less ATV’s, and threw him under the bus. Our legal dept prepped him for several days on what, and what not to say, and to never mention my name and just play stupid.


    The grossly misleading, one sided, TV program in the link below that was on worldwide TV, was the first time any of us at Kawi had heard publicly about any sort of big brew ha ha over injuries incurred while riding 3 wheelers, and the show was that beginning of the end for 3 wheelers. If my old brain remembers correctly, there was no interest by the gov to do anything about 3 wheelers prior to the show but the show brought the issue to their attention and they pursued it only after the show was aired.

    60 MINUTES, part 1.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H1I5DweHlnQ


    60 MINUTES part 2.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbptQDcLo-E


    Enjoy hearing comments on the show from people that want to blame everyone and everything other then themselves, for injuries they or others might have incurred while riding a 3 wheeler.


    Hear grown people [adults if you want to call them that] NOT assume responsibility for their own actions and imply things like, “Hey, even though I was required to be at least 16 years old [18 in some places now], and take 6 months of driving lessons in High School, then a written and driving test at DMV before they felt I was competent enough to drive a car on a SMOOTH flat road that is extremely UNLIKELY to tip over in a turn at ANY speed, and where I can see for MILES around AND which I "shouldn't" be suckin back a pint of Jack Daniels blue label or E85 corn gas while I drive it, I still don’t think I, or even my kids, need any training to ride an ATV simply because I and they can ride a bicycle, and an ATV has 3 wheels which is one more than a bicycle...I think, and I used to have a tricycle when I was 12…uh…I mean 5, that I rode with no problem, and even though this new ATC250R model tricycle has a 40 hp engine attached to it, it still couldn’t be that hard to run it wide open in a turn or blindly over a dune not knowing what is on the other side like maybe a cliff or another happy rider heading right at me at full throttle or maybe a truck or an ambulance that is picking up a rider that that used to think the same way I do before he went into a coma after smashing his head on his handlebars landing off a 30 foot jump while not wearing a helmet, and, because it is an off highway vehicle with no drivers license required to operate it I can pound back all the Jack I want before and during my ride.".


    My favorite part of the program is where dad [who looks a bit unstable on his feet imo], while holding a beverage of some kind [must be a soda because goodness knows he is WAY to responsible to be getting H A M M A R E D in front of his kids [ESPECIALLY when he has to drive back home with them in the car in a few hours], sends his tiny kid out for what I think was their FIRST ride, UNSUPERVISED, with no USEFUL instructions whatsoever, BLINDLY, from the side of his van into oncoming traffic WITHOUT A HELMET, where the kid INSTANTLY gets mowed down by another rider. Then you hear the announcer say how dangerous 3 wheelers are and NOT that dad is a blithering idiot. It’s absolutely hilarious…I think. I must have replayed that part a dozen times in total disbelief.


    Most of you here have probably gotten your foot off the peg at one time or another for some reason or another and ran your foot over and possibly got sucked off the bike in the process. Well the same thing happens with a quad also, and imo, this is one of the most common occurrences and causes of injuries on either of these bikes, at least for beginner riders, yet they still make quads. Last time I looked there seemed to be plenty of injuries from motorcycles too but they still make those too, hmmm.


    I’m sure no one has EVER seen a quad or any kind of motorcycle on it’s side or upside down or has crashed on one themselves, yet I don’t remember if there is even any mention or footage of a quad or a motorcycle in the program.


    Obviously riding a 3 wheeler is not as safe as sitting on ones couch, but at some point, imo, at least SOME of the responsibility for ANYTHING that happens to someone while riding, driving, flying, fishing, walking, drinking and so on, should be assumed by the person performing that particular activity.
    I think we should ban all coffee sales because some smart person burnt themselves at mcdonalds lol. But seriously if you respect the machine, know its capabilities and non capabilities (taking a corner in 5th gear through a woods like an idiot) then you anyone with common sense should be able to ride one. But like anything safe, accidents do happen. I see them every day.

    Thank you everyone for your input and responses. I hope this thread keeps going for a while. I enjoy hearing everyones stories and information!!!! Interesting stuff!!!

  15. #30
    barnett468 is offline FACT ! I have no edit button Arm chair racerThe day begins with 3WW
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    Quote Originally Posted by afdfirefighter View Post
    I think we should ban all coffee sales because some smart person burnt themselves at mcdonalds
    Yeah, not to mention the accident one might get into when they spill a steaming hot, flesh removing cup of that stuff on their lap.

    Oh what about banning lipstick so people can't put it on in the car while they are driving.

    Don't forget, they banned the sale of, or upsizing to, Supersize drinks in New York temporarily because kids were turning into obese, diabetic, sugar addicts.

    The the gov also banned the use of trans fats by all big name fast food stores because junior turned into a blimp and had 50% blocked arteries and high cholesterol by the age of 12 because it ate cheese burgers and fries every day and never got up of its fat lard backside to do anything but turn on Nntendo or X Box etc.

    Now thanks to PIGGY, all the french fries we buy from places like that taste like tofu or a wet sponge. I can't even put real salt on them because the gov makes them give away salt substitute along with sugar substitute instead of the real stuff because the gov does not want me to have a stroke or die because they would loose income from another tax payer if I did.

    Did someone mention Honey Boo Boo and its Mom?




    Quote Originally Posted by afdfirefighter View Post
    Thank you everyone for your input and responses. I hope this thread keeps going for a while. I enjoy hearing everyones stories and information!!!! Interesting stuff!!!
    Did you look at the videos yet? You won't believe what you see and hear.

    Let us know what you think of the show.

    I'll post a couple more things not already mentioned by others that you might find interesting when I get some time.

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