Need Input from MX Expert Classes, 4 Strokes Expert, Hybrids

[TimSr]

If you are running in an Expert Class, or running a Hybrid or custom build in the MX races, I need to hear from you ASAP. It was brought to my attention that we may have several hybrids this year entering MX. A hybrid is usually a trike chassis with a dirt bike motor, or more modern ATV motor that significantly increases displacement, or possibly even something totally fabricated from scratch.

Under the current guidelines, this obviously presents a problem that we did not have in the past, with only Virgil having one of them. For those wishing to also run a big 2 stroke, it presents a problem as they would be in the same class.

Hi Performance – Expert - For 250cc two stroke riders with MX experience and certain custom built 4 strokes that would be competitive with them.

4 Stroke Open – Expert - Basically 350X riders who do not belong in a novice class with their skill level and have inadequate suspension for Hi-Performance class.

I need accurrate data from this poll so I can address this. If you are bringing a hybrid for MOTOCROSS, or are running in 4 Stroke Expert, or Hi Performance Expert, I need you to particiapte in this poll.

[Bryan Raffa]

hybrid 2 stroke yes... hybrid 4 stroke diffrent class..looks like ya might need a high perf.4stroke class,,just my 2 cents

[3leggeddog]

i want to see some more thought put into the amount of laps,as well as the sixe of the track for our so called"Expert" class.if we are going as far as calling it an expert class,i like advanced alot better,i think we should look into extending the track,and amount of laps.this could only apply to the advanced classes.i know the track at haspin is cool,but we only use 3/4 of it.for the advanced classes i think we should run the whole track,and run 5-6 laps.in a short moto you don't have time to make up for mistake.i have learned this from the faircross series.one little slip,and your done,unless you are way faster then everyone else.if we are puttin a title like expert,or advanced on these classes,then they should be represented by the best,of the best riders,and show every aspect of the sport.not just skill,but endurance.that way someone with a way faster bike,like a big bore hybrid,can't get out in front on the holeshot,and block for 3 laps and win.remember this is why we run it on the small track,so it's about skill,not motor.just my thoughts.i have no problem runnin against the hybrids in a open class,but think the 2 stroke advanced should be just that,2 stroke-250cc bikes.run the 350x in one class,and designate a 4 stroke advanced,open to all 350x's,aswell as hybrids.then a "open" class for run what ya brung battle royal.just my thoughts.

[Bryan Raffa]

Totaly agreeable brandon!

[TimSr]

hybrid 2 stroke yes... hybrid 4 stroke diffrent class..looks like ya might need a high perf.4stroke class,,just my 2 cents

I dont understand what this means. Are you running a hybrid?

[TimSr]

i want to see some more thought put into the amount of laps,as well as the sixe of the track for our so called"Expert" class.if we are going as far as calling it an expert class,i like advanced alot better,i think we should look into extending the track,and amount of laps.this could only apply to the advanced classes.i know the track at haspin is cool,but we only use 3/4 of it.for the advanced classes i think we should run the whole track,and run 5-6 laps.in a short moto you don't have time to make up for mistake.i have learned this from the faircross series.one little slip,and your done,unless you are way faster then everyone else.if we are puttin a title like expert,or advanced on these classes,then they should be represented by the best,of the best riders,and show every aspect of the sport.not just skill,but endurance.that way someone with a way faster bike,like a big bore hybrid,can't get out in front on the holeshot,and block for 3 laps and win.remember this is why we run it on the small track,so it's about skill,not motor.just my thoughts.i have no problem runnin against the hybrids in a open class,but think the 2 stroke advanced should be just that,2 stroke-250cc bikes.run the 350x in one class,and designate a 4 stroke advanced,open to all 350x's,aswell as hybrids.then a "open" class for run what ya brung battle royal.just my thoughts.

Expert classes will be running more laps this year. Track extension will be used if its practical. If youll remember, last year it was under water, but we've used it whenever possible in the past and will continue. Thats not what this thread is about, though. I cant make any decisions on restructuring classes until I know what is coming.

[SWIGIN]

i know at the national races a hybrid has to run the open class since its not a production bike

[Bryan Raffa]

I dont understand what this means. Are you running a hybrid?

IF it's a hybrid 2 stroke then yes put it in the expert class

IF its a hybrid 4 stroke then it should be in a diffrent class

thats what i ment

[3leggeddog]

oops,sorry.i thought this was a thread n suggestions,i see know you just want to know what we are ridin,and ideas on classes,sorry!!

[TimSr]

oops,sorry.i thought this was a thread n suggestions,i see know you just want to know what we are ridin,and ideas on classes,sorry!!

No problem Brandon. Im always willing to entertain suggestions and comments, but Im looking at addressing a specific potential problem in this thread.

[TimSr]

IF it's a hybrid 2 stroke then yes put it in the expert class

IF its a hybrid 4 stroke then it should be in a diffrent class

thats what i ment

Are you running a hybrid, either 2 stroke or 4 stroke? I need this poll to accurately reflect what you have, not how you think they should be classified. Its a data poll, not an opinion poll, so I just want to make sure your poll entry is correct.

[Derrick Adams]

If we are puttin a title like expert,or advanced on these classes,then they should be represented by the best,of the best riders,and show every aspect of the sport.not just skill,but endurance.that way someone with a way faster bike,like a big bore hybrid,can't get out in front on the holeshot,and block for 3 laps and win.remember this is why we run it on the small track,so it's about skill,not motor.

Am I reading this right? Are you suggesting that anyone that is in the expert class on a hybrid 4 stroke does not have the skills to take the holeshot and ride in front? This is called Expert class for a reason. No-one that would be running a Hybrid would even be in the class if they didn't have SKILL.

Furthermore, if you can't pass because your bike is not as fast as the other guy then wouldn't you be the one blocking if you got the holeshot? And also, isn't that the point of racing, to win?

To answer the question, I think that any 4 stroke should stay in the 4 stroke advanced class, not the 2 stroke advanced class. Not for any other reason than the size of the expert 2 stroke class will be fairly large this year anyhow and if all the hybrids run in that class there will be no-one in 4 stroke advanced.

[Bryan Raffa]

well no im not runnin a hybrid... I saw this and thought you wanted our thought's on the subject..

(I need accurrate data from this poll so I can address this. If you are bringing a hybrid for MOTOCROSS, or are running in 4 Stroke Expert, or Hi Performance Expert, I need you to particiapte in this poll.)

(If you are running in an Expert Class, or running a Hybrid or custom build in the MX races,)

yes Im running in the High performance Expert..with a tri z 250.

Do you want just input from the people who are runnin hybrids?????

[3leggeddog]

Am I reading this right? Are you suggesting that anyone that is in the expert class on a hybrid 4 stroke does not have the skills to take the holeshot and ride in front? This is called Expert class for a reason. No-one that would be running a Hybrid would even be in the class if they didn't have SKILL.

Furthermore, if you can't pass because your bike is not as fast as the other guy then wouldn't you be the one blocking if you got the holeshot? And also, isn't that the point of racing, to win?

To answer the question, I think that any 4 stroke should stay in the 4 stroke advanced class, not the 2 stroke advanced class. Not for any other reason than the size of the expert 2 stroke class will be fairly large this year anyhow and if all the hybrids run in that class there will be no-one in 4 stroke advanced.

i am not doubtin the skill of anyone here,but big motors equal great holeshots.with that in mind i see a big disadvantage to the lil 2 strokes.in a short moto someone with a faster bike,and less talent could hold on just long enough to win,when the rider behind them posses more skill.thats why i want to see more laps.to give the underpowered bikes a better chance to play ketch up.we both know that if we line up the trikes,your guys 450's will walk away from my r.thats not your fault for building a competitive bike,but leaves me,and the rest of us 2 stroke guys at a huge disadvantage.your right,if i can't pass you because my bikes not fast enough,thats my problem.i don't want this to turn into the drag race b-i-t-c-h-n thread either.all i am sayin is there should be a "OPEN" class for these big bores,and still a 2 stroke advanced class.



i never shoulda said anything,i wasn't trin to offend.i'll run whatever class you guys tell me to.

[TimSr]

well no im not runnin a hybrid... I saw this and thought you wanted our thought's on the subject..

yes Im running in the High performance Expert..with a tri z 250.

Do you want just input from the people who are runnin hybrids?????

From your first post I got the impression you had a hybrid, but voted 2 stroke in the poll because you felt a hybrid 2 stroke didnt count as a hybrid. I understand now, and just wanted clarification.

Any comments from anyone are fine, but to be honest, Im not paying much attention to recommendations right now, because I dont logically see how anyone can have an opinion on classing anything without knowing what we have coming. That is the reason for this poll. My decision will be based on:

How many 4 Stroke Expert Class riders we have on 350x's as class is currently defined, how many riders on Hybrids, and how many riders wanting to run both 2 Stroke Expert with one trike and run another class on a Hybrid. Im looking at overall class sizes, and whether additional splits are necessary.

Im looking at competitiveness in matchup. (Putting Virgil's 426 with the 2 strokes as opposed to 350x's in prior racing was a no brainer.)

Im also looking at preserving the integrity of true vintage class racing, while at the same time giving the innovative and inventive a chance to showcase their creations.

My final decision will be a logical and practical one based on the actual numbers and what is most competitive.