Are Water-cooler 2-strokers the king of MX or can others keep up to?

[thefox]

I guess this is a question for those that have formally raced MX on trikes, is it just the water-cooled trikes that can run at the front of the pack or can others (air R’s and 350X’s) still be competitive?

I ask because I am going to be back in W. PA next year for college (5th and final year) but since I will not be eligible for running I will have some free time and I have been debating selling the trikes I have now and getting something that I can take to race with the Ohio crew. I have always been a 4-stroke guy but I am willing to switch over to 2-strokes if needed. So would a 350x be competitive? I was also thinking of an air -cooled R, I have heard those have more low end then the water-coolers so maybe that would fit me better since I am used to 4-strokes (I have never ridden a water-cooled 2-stroke). I also like that I should be able to find a air-cooler for less then the water-cooled trikes and I am on a fixed budget. If it matters I am 6'2" and 175 lbs.

[TimSr]

This really depends on the track. The motors of either the air cooled or the 350x are more than adequate, and can even be an advantage in smaller tight tracks such as the indoors but the suspension of the liquid models are superior in the tracks with lots of air, and doubles such as the Faircross Series. For Smith Road Raceway, either would be competitive. At Sunset Rambers the liquid models have a good edge because of supension. At 6'2" you migh find the early air cooled models a little cramped. As for all the trail riding OTC does, with your size and favor of 4 strokes, youll be very happy on a 350X. If you were looking at something strictly being used for MX, a liquid 250R is probably the best suited over all.

[PWK39]

Hey,what's up

If your looking to mx I would say suspension is the most important.Hard to beat the watercooled bikes for that reason.Power wise I bet a air r or 350x would be pretty good.I have never done mx on a trike so maybe some other guys could tell you more.If it were me I wouldn't care what I was ridiig as long as I got some track time under my belt and had some fun!

[atc250rer]

my air cooled does just great in the woods , but if you start going over many mx courses with bumps and whoops its gets kinda hairy.. the H2O trikes have a lot better suspension.. i think... and i have both.

[thefox]

Thanks for the info guys, keep it coming.

How big of a step up is the suspension from the 82 250R to the 83 250R?

[Bryan Raffa]

The 350x's can keep up But man they land like Brick's! Next time your up this way I'll let ya ride my z.. Im 6'3" 190 and there's more room for me on the z than the R's. Ive allways felt cramped on R's and really cramped on the older air cooled R's, But there fun..

[Derrick Adams]

Any of the bikes you mentioned will work fine. I would definately look for a liquid cooled R though. It seems to me that the liquid R's are cheaper and easier to find than a solid 350X. I would stay away from the Air-Cooled R for the simple fact of the lacking suspension and overall size.

[Derrick Adams]

Bryan's right about the Z fitting us tall people well. The downfalls of the Z are many, but if you overcome them, it is definately a solid performer. Cheap too!

[firefirefire90]

Thanks for the info guys, keep it coming.

How big of a step up is the suspension from the 82 250R to the 83 250R?

The biggest difference was going from a Single link to a dual(pro) link. BIG difference! The front travel was changed..hell..the whole ergonomics of the trike was changed. In 1984, they even added a higher compression piston. I would not think that the 81/82 trike could keep up with any of the later year 250R's. They are just that much un-developed.

The 83/84 and the 85/86 250R's are like brothers....while the 81/82 is the eldest son who's dad fed him to much.

About the height issue. I am 6'4 220ish...and I fit on the aircooled R very nicely. I would just invest in some taller handlebars.

[350Xhilaration]

The 350x's can keep up But man they land like Brick's!

Without any suspension mods, that is definitely true.

A 350X has plenty of usable power, but like Tim said, it will depend on the track. With stock suspension, it won't matter if you have a powroll engine, you will get 0wn3d by just about every 250R out there (assuming the rider is decent).

Woods riding, a 350X is perfect. But you asked about MX.

I'd recommend getting a liquid cooled R due to the high availability of parts and out of the box better suspension and they have plenty of power stock.

[SWIGIN]

Without any suspension mods, that is definitely true.

A 350X has plenty of usable power, but like Tim said, it will depend on the track. With stock suspension, it won't matter if you have a powroll engine, you will get 0wn3d by just about every 250R out there (assuming the rider is decent).

Woods riding, a 350X is perfect. But you asked about MX.

I'd recommend getting a liquid cooled R due to the high availability of parts and out of the box better suspension and they have plenty of power stock.

mine lands soft ...lol

[thefox]

When you say the air-cooled R's lack suspension does that just mean they land hard and are not comfortable to ride because of it or will the lack of suspension actually slow down the lap times because they get uncontrollable?

I am not saying I am a great rider but I don't want to be at a huge disadvantage before the race even starts.

[Billy Golightly]

edog for the love of God please quit post whoring. Your making me reminiscent of the old days when you first joined the forum and make 10 replies to every thread. Just chill a little bit with the Quick reply button.

[thefox]

edog for the love of God please quit post whoring. Your making my reminiscent of the old days when you first joined the forum and make 10 replied to every thread. Just chill a little bit with the Quick reply button.

lol I was thinking the same thing. At least he has something other then the DX now, if this was back then he would be saying I should buy a DX and race it because they are the best, after that it was the 200x that is the best machine ever made; now it is the 250R. Ohh eDog

[Derrick Adams]

Lack of good suspension causes all sorts of issues on the track. Here's what happens. You might take a decent tabletop on an air cooled R ok (IF you clear it) most times you won't. So when you land the first thing that happens is that the suspension bottoms out or the frame bottoms out. That gives you a large Jolt in the feet and hands. Then the tires compress and the handlebars start to sway back and forth, because the suspension is already compressed and it cant absorb the bumps and ruts. Then the suspension finally decompresses and over extends, which lightens the front tire (which is already jockeying back and forth) taking away your ability to steer. THEN the rear suspension lifts the back of the bike up and shifts all your weight to the front causing you to over steer.

This is just one scenario and it's over dramatic, but true. That all happens in a split second and while you don't always wreck from it, it sure takes alot of strength from you to keep it corrected. Now multiply that time say 30. That's about how many times you will hit obsticals in 3 to 4 laps. You can see how lacking suspension can greatly slow down your lap times.

Now imagine that same suspension in a whoops section!

In all honestly the reason the 85-86 R's are so much better on the track is majorly better suspension. (Even it isn't great by todays standards) I don't consider the 350X any better than the air cooled R's. The only thing better about the 350X is that it makes enought torque to make up for the lack of suspension.

Here's an example. Last season I ran my 350X in trail trim in the small bore quad class. I absolutely got killed in the jumps, but the trike made tons of power to reel in people in the straights. In all I finished mid pack. Had I been on my R, it would have been top 3 for sure.