It's going to be a bumpy ride America

[atc007]

The one thing that bothers me is, as far as I know, these were the first planes to ever strike the buildings in this manner, so we have no other instances to go off of on how they would react to the planes hitting them. How do we know beyond a shadow of a doubt this couldn't happen as described? It has never happened before, yet we have lots of people who are dealing in absolutes. Just because something is supposed to be xyz "proof" doesn't mean it's going to be unless it's tested against xyz in the exact same conditions. John, I admit I haven't watched the video yet, so please bear with me here, I'm truly trying to look at this from all angles. What I'm getting at is we can theorize all day long about what should have happened, but unless these two buildings are built again the exact same way and two fully fueled passenger planes are flown into them in the exact same manner, you can't say beyond a shadow of a doubt, this is what will or should happen. The science has to be questioned just like authority should be.

Remember, the guys who built the Titanic said it couldn't sink, yet didn't make it across the ocean.

We've all seen an f5 tornado rip through a town and level every structure a mile wide, but there's that one concrete slab where a house used to be and something crazy like the dining room table is sitting there with the table cloth and candles untouched. Physics will say that is impossible, but reality says otherwise.

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For whatever reason ,, Fab and I have watched,,,A LOT. Myself,,for both sides. You clearly have not,or......At this point ,it is mute around here for me. I simply care. I care that the people here are awake,open,and questioning stupid,ridiculous stories told to them. Like Vegas sunday night 2 weeks ago. I thought you had posted a couple times that you have watched all of the 911 videos showing what went on and how. It is a lot...and that there were videos refuting each one of them. It seems to me you have not

The buildings were pulled. Those that don't know what that means, would have to learn that,and the magnitude of work that entails. The evidence is 100% there in front of anyones eyes that wishes to learn. If you are into motorsports,welding or anything else mechanical,,it is blinding. My fear is,, good people,really good people, simply showing up for their shift,can be thrown straight into a situation that MANY many LVPD officers were 2 weeks ago... 1 story, 1 narrative. What you saw and dealt with,,, DID NOT HAPPEN. There was ONE shooter on the 32nd floor of MB. That's it, that is the story,and you will never tell it any other way. That just happened. And it will keep happening. I simply hope for people from 3ww to be a little more awake. Ask Thorpe how wrong I am.

[Red Rider]

Know the truth and spread the word. Realize the lie that is supposedly our freedom. Stand up for what is right.

I don't like the way our government is run anymore than you do, but some people just can't be reached, which is the way they wants it. Well, they gets it...

[bkm]

John, I'm being lazy here. I tried going back through the thread and finding the scientific video, but don't know which one it is. Help a brother out and repost that for me please. I have some down time at work to watch it tonight.

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[redsox]

John, I'm being lazy here. I tried going back through the thread and finding the scientific video, but don't know which one it is. Help a brother out and repost that for me please. I have some down time at work to watch it tonight.

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Here it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddz2mw2vaEg&t=1100s

[bkm]

Here it is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddz2mw2vaEg&t=1100s

Thanks Dan!

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[atc007]

You also do not learn about that days unfoldings in one night. Just saying. There is probably 200 hours of evidence to watch.Some downright quacky,,most jawdropping if you're not in a coma.

For short attention spans lol,,,Youtube will auto shuffle them for ya. All you have to do is watch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHHghW4Pg5k

Never saw this one before,,detonations going off on every other floor.. Virtually every survivor of that day was injured by the explosions in the lobby,and outside the ground floors. 50 seconds in.. There is SO MUCH new evidence on there since I have looked .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yli-if4F0DY

[fabiodriven]

I wanted to look into what Nico was talking about before commenting on it to brush up. It had been a while since I'd seen these videos but I remembered seeing them once I watched them. This phenomenon certainly is worth consideration as well. It certainly seems very fishy to me at the very least, and I do tend to sway more towards agreeing with what these videos are presenting, however I would naturally sway that way so that must be taken into account.

By comparison, Bryan's Pentagon video is similar. Evaluation of fairly grainy footage, which does leave a lot to the imagination as well as perception. Certainly worth looking at and as I said, seems very fishy to me.

I have been concentrating a lot on what I find to be irrefutable, and I try to stay focused. One subject at a time. This is a very interesting point Nico! One of a whole slew!

EDIT- This is making a lot more sense as I watch.

The first video is short. The second one almost an hour.

https://youtu.be/uUxpCt8emFg

https://youtu.be/2c5_g7UTuGM

[86T3]

I was going to stay out of this one, i had two novels typed out and deleted them both. Why would I enter an argument where a friend is personally attacking and insulting another friend, and where the "open minded" ones won't even accept truth or logic. Well, here I am.

Here's what im not going to do. I watched the video John posted. My first two novels that I deleted pointed out all the inaccuracies and contradictions in it. I'm not going to address them. Why? Because you theorists don't want to hear it and you'll just deny them. More likely you'll just ignore them, like you did to Redsox.

What I am going to do is talk about the hypocracy shown in this thread. I used to think 9/11 was staged. I also used to be very liberal. Those 2 are unrelated but it shows how I've changed as I've grown older. The biggest thing that drives me nuts about liberals is their snobby attitude. It's been spreading to all sides lately, and it's prevalent here. Conspiracy theorists think they are smarter than everyone and it's on full display in this thread. Has it ever once occurred to you guys that you're wrong? Have you actually looked objectively at the evidence you post as "fact"? Have you ever looked at why evidence supports the official explanation of what happened? Have you thought that maybe some of us have looked at this evidence for both sides, and decided that we believe that what was said happened actually happened? I know this country is responsible for some terrible things, some much worse than the terrorist attacks on 9/11 but I believe, and the facts support that this wasn't one of them.

So go ahead John, call me a sheep. Call me stupid or a liar. I guess you can say anything you want, save for calling me a fvcking idiot because that's somehow different. But I want you and Bill to know that I do respect yours, and you are free to have and express them, a little reciprocity would be nice.

[atc007]

I know I come off as an ass Joe, probably because I am,hopefully because I'm passionate. I do not intend to cram anything down anyones throat,nor do I want or need anyone to agree with me. I certainly see a lot of facts that I cannot possibly explain away. I sure as hell went into this thinking Fab was nuts. I have seen SO much new,slowed down looked at evidence tonight that I have never seen before. I know all about typing a novel and erasing it !! It sucks! It is a time killer ! I apologize for my presentation,because I SUCK. I do not mean to try and talk down to anyone,,except maybe redsox.. I do not understand ,at all, what he is talking about. But, that is my problem.

[fabiodriven]

You are free to think and perceive what you want to Joe. I disagree with your perception of things.

Sox is insulting his own intelligence as well as everyone else's by ignoring the laws of physics. I have said he either doesn't understand the laws of physics or chooses to ignore them. I don't think he doesn't understand them at all, I think he's pretending he hasn't seen what he has. To me that shows a lack of integrity, assuming I am correct. I am not saying what I'm saying to offend Sox, I'm speaking for truth on something I believe to the core of my being, and I am speaking on behalf of people who are no longer here to speak. Sox fired this whole thing off by making a mockery of my beliefs, so here we are discussing them.

I am passionate about this as are countless people across the globe. This incident not only killed tons of people right off the bat, but it has shaped our country and planet and touched us all in one way or another. I don't care if you or anyone else likes what I and the others who think like me have to say because hurting someone's feelings is of little concern to me as compared to these atrocities that have taken place. Joe, science has proven that the story we're given is false, and you must have one hell of a story to tell if you're going to pick apart the video as well. Dan's attempt to pick it apart was a disgrace, that is truly how I feel.

I ask myself these questions a lot, how anyone can overlook this, how anyone could not see how ridiculous this farce all is, how it could mean so little to other people that an investigation isn't even warranted. The "investigation" that took place is a joke, plain and simple, and it's been ripped to pieces. Not by hearsay, not by guessing, but by the very simple fundamentals of physics and countless years of experience worldwide. I wonder why I still care and why so few others do, and I make a habit of examining all aspects of my own behavior because I've surprised myself in the past when I don't pay attention to exactly what it is I'm doing. I know I am right here, and Dan is wrong, and if being wrong is insulting to him or anyone else then you must have gotten the "everyone gets a trophy" deal growing up, because sometimes people are wrong. I'm farking wrong all the time! But this time, I am not. If I were, I wouldn't be insulted. If you or Dan or anyone else is offended by this then my suggestion to you is to grow up, because sometimes in life you're going to be wrong. In this instance, I take it to heart. I have examined why it is that I take this so personally, and I don't consciously think this in the front of my mind, but all I can gather is subconsciously my experience with war and then what has happened in my life since most likely associates this whole event with what my life, and this planet, are now. It hurts me. It hurts me deeply, and I take this very serious. If I have to hurt your feelings in the meantime that's fine but I will not lose focus on my ideals and the ideals that so many people share each day. You're a flag waver which is great, but do not carry it without question. I carried that flag with me to the other side of the planet and back because of my ideals. I couldn't wait to load up and kick ass or die trying, and I did a great job. I even volunteered to stay late when the call came down, and if you think it was any easy task to get 14 volunteers to stay in a combat zone after we'd been out in that sand as long as we were you have another thing coming my friend. I dare say I have more into this than you do, but the truth is we are all in this very deep, but my physical investment will not allow me to let this issue rest until I see the truth come out. I am a patriot, and not you nor anyone else is going to tell me otherwise. It takes controversial people to do controversial things, and it is my aim to help make doing the right thing not so controversial. I am not a liberal and I don't know what that is, nor do I care. I know the difference between right and wrong, I have a knack for science and physics, and I have an eye for bullshit. I have a very clear drive inside of me to do good, always have, and it has never led me wrong. I have done wrong before, sure, but I knew it full well. I wasn't unaware I was doing wrong, and I know I am right here.

If I'm upsetting you that's unfortunate. You should be upset, we should all be upset about this subject.

[86T3]

You don't get it John. You insult him and call him a liar, but his point wasn't stupid and it wasn't a lie. There is plenty of science that proves he his right and that you are wrong but you won't hear it. You want to be right, not get it right. If you spent 1/100th of the time researching why the towers fell instead of theories you would understand there are very valid, scientificly proven answers. But you that's not what you want to believe so you choose to call Dan a liar.

[fabiodriven]

No, no actually you're completely wrong Joe. I'm not looking for the outcome I choose and then backing it blindly, I'm looking for the truth and I don't like what I'm finding. It's quite simple.

[86T3]

Actual science that proves the truth.

https://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/911NutPhysics.HTM

http://www.popularmechanics.com/mili...-trade-center/


https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11

[Dirtcrasher]

It's too bad because a person can review a couple hours or dozens of hours and be swayed one way or the other.

With both being great presentations with THEIR facts/Timelines etc etc.

Either way, it just falls along with it that there are certain things you make you question them. And points well made....

There was 1 particular 911 video done by an intelligent woman using photographs and common sense has allot to say about that day; And she's smart and interesting....; Just an interesting presentation/view she had.

I think John had originally put up the link or it was a subset thereof.

Scary times guys. I feel for your kids and grandkids growing up in this INSANE world!! Everyday you survive counts as a great day!!

[fabiodriven]

Actual science that proves the truth.

https://www.uwgb.edu/dutchs/PSEUDOSC/911NutPhysics.HTM

http://www.popularmechanics.com/mili...-trade-center/


https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/9-11

Again you're incorrect Joe. Just stating something is science doesn't make it science. In the first article that one person states his opinion but doesn't perform any science. I don't understand how people can continue to dismiss the laws of physics.

I appreciate the links and I'm sure this might insult you but it shouldn't. I am far beyond what you just showed me there.

When this subject first caught my attention, I didn't decide which side I should be on and then start looking for evidence to back the way I feel. I followed the best evidence which led me to the conclusion that the buildings did not come down the way it has been explained. The first link is one man's take, I'm not positive about the other two, but the video I posted is an entire army of people with some very serious qualifications, backed by thousands of signatures of other qualified persons as as well. You and I cannot sign their petition, you have to be a licensed architect or above.

You can't just tell me it's science and poof! It's magically science. It's the opinion of one person, who granted seems to have some credentials, however he's not presented any hypothesis other than he disagrees with what it is I believe. There simply is no science there. I really wish you or someone else could present something that is actual true science or physics, not guesses and theories or coincidence on top of coincidence, and one time only ever circumstances.